Boonball meta is bad

[geist.4126]

Which would be less of an issue, if they wouldn't have protect, stability, quickness, regeneration, resolution, resistance and aegis up for 30+ seconds. The healing suddenly gets less of an issue when your boons are gone for the next 15-30 seconds because you ran through two fields that boon strip

There is no thing such as skill in the current meta. It's pressing a button rotation you could automate and still your zerg survives standing in three mortar, treb and enemy aoe fields.

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by geist.4126

[Ferus.3165]

16 minutes ago, geist.4126 said:

Which would be less of an issue, if they wouldn't have protect, stability, quickness, regeneration, resolution, resistance and aegis up for 30+ seconds. The healing suddenly gets less of an issue when your boons are gone for the next 15-30 seconds because you ran through two fields that boon strip

There is no thing such as skill in the current meta. It's pressing a button rotation you could automate and still your zerg survives standing in three mortar, treb and enemy aoe fields.

 

if boon strips would work like that then pugs would not play the game anymore. Because pugs normally don't have a lot of healers around and are relying on their own boons most of the time. If it would be that easy to take those boons away for that long then you would either play in a zerg with a mandatory healer or you would not play anymore.

If you think there is no skill involved in the current meta then your group either gets one pushed every time or you don't have a group to play with. That is a very ignorant thing to say and shows your lack of experience.

And that pugs have a problem punching through dedicated guild zergs is the fault of the healers. Ofc healing would be less potent if protection wasn't a thing but everyone has access to boons and not everyone has always access to their personal healer. Healers in this game are busted because they heal themselves and everyone around them for ludicrous amounts and they are the last people standing when their zerg did take losses because they are so tanky.

When you burst an enemy dps because he was not stacking properly at the commander and that left him open to an attack and that player is at 10%-20% hp or even goes down instantly it's not the boons that save him. If he is still alive he just runs to the rest of his zerg again and is at 100% hp again in less then a second. Or if he went down some necro will pull him inside the zerg and he will be rezzed in one or two seconds as well. And who is responsible for that? Healers.

Those zergs can stand in aoes and be attacked by pugs all day long because of their sustain. And the primary source of that are the healers. Those few hundred hp you get from regen and some protection won't safe you there.

[Auragen.4162]

On 11/10/2023 at 12:19 PM, dead.7638 said:

No one seemed to care a year ago or more when boon rips were being nerfed from necro and Mesmer.   Everyone was heralding in boon meta like it was a good thing.   Having fun, yet?

This is CMCs dream though. His main class is able to jump in and literally stop the entire fight, no skill required, just by existing on an OP support build? And anyone that can press buttons can do this?

Let's be real, other supports can be annoying but Tempest is by far the worst offender. Too much projectile hate, too much unstrippable/uninterruptible effects via auras, and better instant resurrection utility than any other class. It's clear what the problem is, but it will never be fixed until someone/people are fired.

People crutching on Tempest and pretending like they have any skill because they run over other people who are not using organized comps are scum. They always turn out to be literally the worst mechanical players when you put them on anything that's not an unkillable healbot. This kitten where the least skilled players can just "build" and comp their way to win needs to end. Supports should have never existed, the trinity should never have existed in GW2, everything after 2015 has been a new low (mounts LOL). I'm convinced they've crapped the pants off this game to bank on GW2 Classic one day.

Edited November 12, 2023 by Auragen.4162

[Rezzet.3614]

this boonball meta is raw concentrated toxicity  and breaks the whole game loop 

players shouldnt be able to facetank dozens of siege fire at once  to begin with , then theres the insane stability stacking everytime i target an enemy they have a permanent 5 stability minimum constantly refreshing  ontop of 12 other boons , theres literally no counterplay other than  running Boonball  and pray your boonball has more boon strip 

 

at this rate siege weapon's are gonna have to deal % damage and stability is gonna have to be gutted and reverted to its 1 boon  with fixed max  duration  per interval

[mohdhm.8627]

1 hour ago, Rezzet.3614 said:

this boonball meta is raw concentrated toxicity  and breaks the whole game loop 

players shouldnt be able to facetank dozens of siege fire at once  to begin with , then theres the insane stability stacking everytime i target an enemy they have a permanent 5 stability minimum constantly refreshing  ontop of 12 other boons , theres literally no counterplay other than  running Boonball  and pray your boonball has more boon strip 

 

at this rate siege weapon's are gonna have to deal % damage and stability is gonna have to be gutted and reverted to its 1 boon  with fixed max  duration  per interval

they are nerfing 2 of the mesmer's boonstrips next patch by a solid 50% in effectiveness. boonball is going to get even stronger. now sure how the boon strip/corruption of other classes are going to get effected.

Edited November 13, 2023 by mohdhm.8627

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

I just discovered that boonball guilds have nothing against coordinate high dps spike attacks. They refuse to change their "hurr durr muh tanky ball" gameplay and just sit there, taking all damage and dying instantly while waiting for healing.

[VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.]

boons aren't even that much of a problem. 

But barrier is.

Remove barrier from wvw and boonballs will suddenly be much more vulnerable. At the moment as a smaller group it is almost impossible to cut through all that barrier generation. 

[dead.7638]

Honestly boon support chrono was abolished because it could carry any pug group because it was bad game design.   Fast forward two expansions and let’s not kid ourselves this last one wasn’t even a complete expansion and we’re still waiting for it to be completed, fast forward two expansions with a dev high on copium and what do we get.   It’s a thousand times worse and not only that extremely booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooring.    Thanks for nothing.    No one that I know asked for this kitten.   We all know who to thank.

[Aeolus.3615]

2 hours ago, VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig. said:

boons aren't even that much of a problem. 

But barrier is.

Remove barrier from wvw and boonballs will suddenly be much more vulnerable. At the moment as a smaller group it is almost impossible to cut through all that barrier generation. 

Perma quickness and perma alacrity are  a problem, reason I would love skills that would target those boons alone.

Spellbreaker dome could also target quickness in 1st place, there are skills in the game that target certain boons.

Edited November 13, 2023 by Aeolus.3615

[Kuya.6495]

2 hours ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

I just discovered that boonball guilds have nothing against coordinate high dps spike attacks. They refuse to change their "hurr durr muh tanky ball" gameplay and just sit there, taking all damage and dying instantly while waiting for healing.

Yea, this is also why boonballs want wb nerfed.

[Rezzet.3614]

guess a simple solution could be to make an  AC#5 that strip a boon with each pulse 

[XenesisII.1540]

2 hours ago, Rezzet.3614 said:

guess a simple solution could be to make an  AC#5 that strip a boon with each pulse 

I suggested putting boon strip on ac like cannons a while ago, but considering how much they're nerfing boon strips I doubt that would happen, in fact I expect they will nerf cannon boon strip at some point too.

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

3 hours ago, Rezzet.3614 said:

guess a simple solution could be to make an  AC#5 that strip a boon with each pulse 

50 minutes ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

I suggested putting boon strip on ac like cannons a while ago, but considering how much they're nerfing boon strips I doubt that would happen, in fact I expect they will nerf cannon boon strip at some point too.

gosh, I can already hear the screeches those boonball kittens would make if the devs did anything against their precious boonball...

[Tythan.2936]

Among all the people whining in here I wonder how many play builds that actually strips + use pulls and cc instead of just spamming ranged projectiles/longbow 5/meteor shower/necro staff spells from the top of their wall.

Most "boonball" squads support players are half asleep, barely bothering to heal up their teammates when they stand in front of a door. 4 arrow carts and a canon or two is enough to put them in trouble, yet some dude above mentionned boonball being able to easily tank "dozens of siege fire" 😵‍💫
 

On 11/12/2023 at 7:37 PM, Auragen.4162 said:

Let's be real, other supports can be annoying but Tempest is by far the worst offender. Too much projectile hate, too much unstrippable/uninterruptible effects via auras, and better instant resurrection utility than any other class. It's clear what the problem is, but it will never be fixed until someone/people are fired.

Thanks for the laugh man. I see there are still some people coping about Ele in 2023. Hvindi will heal way much more and block projectiles all day with ventari tablet. The only thing Tempest does better is cleansing condis, which isn't really an issue when you get perma resistance (no one will die from your tiny 5 stacks of bleeding, but they will die to being immob alone in the back while the squad advances).
Also, unfortunately, most tempest players don't even run the rez glyph. Nowadays we got this thing called Scourge support that will also port the downed back to the flock, multiple ones instead of 1, with much shorter cd (and put a LOT of barrier, and alac, and power, and a bit of aegis, and strip the ennemies,...). But ye, Tempest is the issue 🫠

[geist.4126]

1 hour ago, Tythan.2936 said:

Among all the people whining in here I wonder how many play builds that actually strips + use pulls and cc instead of just spamming ranged projectiles/longbow 5/meteor shower/necro staff spells from the top of their wall.

Most "boonball" squads support players are half asleep, barely bothering to heal up their teammates when they stand in front of a door. 4 arrow carts and a canon or two is enough to put them in trouble, yet some dude above mentionned boonball being able to easily tank "dozens of siege fire" 😵‍💫
 

Thanks for the laugh man. I see there are still some people coping about Ele in 2023. Hvindi will heal way much more and block projectiles all day with ventari tablet. The only thing Tempest does better is cleansing condis, which isn't really an issue when you get perma resistance (no one will die from your tiny 5 stacks of bleeding, but they will die to being immob alone in the back while the squad advances).
Also, unfortunately, most tempest players don't even run the rez glyph. Nowadays we got this thing called Scourge support that will also port the downed back to the flock, multiple ones instead of 1, with much shorter cd (and put a LOT of barrier, and alac, and power, and a bit of aegis, and strip the ennemies,...). But ye, Tempest is the issue 🫠

I wonder how you can strip and pull when after the boon strip there are still 6 stacks of stability left on the blob.

The whole meta greatly favors group size over any skill level. More people means more boons and less effective boon strips vs that group and the advantage is on big groups anyway due to more access to pulls and spike rez.

Edited November 14, 2023 by geist.4126

[Sahfur.5612]

In small scale and roaming it IS pretty hand holdy and I would argue ele to be stronger than the others vs good players. The amount of reflects shut down like half the other team which means not only are they healing, instantly removing stuff like immob and other boons even if the enemy comp isn't condi (and yes, how fast the removal is matters in small scale) and providing boons but they are also making people immune to a large % of damage they would be getting in the first place, passively in their rotations and without having to focus on particular skills or need to time stuff much, like the other classes would have to. Now pop lyhr relic on there (as an example of one of the relics, many of which seem to be great choices for ele, yes it is more effective on some other classes in some situations) and you have dramatically reduced what people can do to your group and predictability opens up many opportunities in small scale.

Yes, maybe they won't teleport the downed player to you, but the enemy warrior using their ranged interrupt boulder juggernaut 4 to stop your rez? He hit himself with the boulder. The immob thief had to waste precious seconds using scepter 3 a nearby moa to avoid bopping itself with the immob projectile so it could even cleave with slow beam at all. Many things that offer more than just damage, and much of the damage too.. also become harder to use when everyone has reflects on them every few seconds, even vs many "melee" builds.

Rev and necro meanwhile in those situations will offer the other group more counterplay or take more effort and they are a little more predictable/ less flexible (your reflects and such are either static or must persist in one location at a time and your allies will make effective use of this a struggle by running from your heals or moving out of your reflects) so in small scale with good players they will have less of an impact on the outcome I'd say. Not to say rev and necro won't make things more difficult.

(I play both rev and ele sometimes, though I play most classes)

Edited November 14, 2023 by Sahfur.5612

[MysteryDude.1572]

1 hour ago, geist.4126 said:

I wonder how you can strip and pull when after the boon strip there are still 6 stacks of stability left on the blob.

The whole meta greatly favors group size over any skill level. More people means more boons and less effective boon strips vs that group and the advantage is on big groups anyway due to more access to pulls and spike rez.

Which strips skills did you use btw?

Because of how the mechanic of "last boon applied is the first boon stripped"works,  FBS can pre stab parties before push/facing enemies, allowing secondary boons to cover the stability.

In that way, you can't insta strip stability just by throwing random strips at the enemy.

There needs to be consecutive strips pilled up to fully strip enemies ensuring their lock before even moving to cc part.

Sometimes tho , parties can over stab , meaning if there's a course of stab on top of FB stab , it prioritizes strips to rip stab

Lastly there is brutality which directly targets stab strip.

Edited November 14, 2023 by MysteryDude.1572

[Tythan.2936]

1 hour ago, geist.4126 said:

I wonder how you can strip and pull when after the boon strip there are still 6 stacks of stability left on the blob.

The whole meta greatly favors group size over any skill level. More people means more boons and less effective boon strips vs that group and the advantage is on big groups anyway due to more access to pulls and spike rez.

Yes a lonely player won't be able to fully strip a whole group of people (it used to be possible at Scourge release and it was hella broken). 20 people playing together, using classes that completes each other and coordinating on vocal is better than 20 guys doing their own stuff. Sounds legit to me. But imagine if multiple players understanding how the game works would do it kinda at the same time and bomb strip wherever the enemy squad stands. WSR and FoW players do that all the time, they cloud around enemy "boonball" squads, they harass them from all sides, and eventually they break them/make them run away.

I don't get what you mean by "more access to pulls". Mesmer pull has always been there and its range has been reduced some months ago. Dh pull has also been there since the spec exists and the class isnt really meta nowadays. Firebrand pull has also not changed. The only new thing since Soto is that Scourge can now equip gs like Reaper and use skill 5 for 900 range pull.

In another thread, people were complaining about pulls being "a toxic mechanic". Time to learn how it works to better avoid/use it 🤓

[Auragen.4162]

54 minutes ago, Tythan.2936 said:

20 people playing together, using classes that completes each other and coordinating on vocal is better than 20 guys doing their own stuff.

This is such cope lmao. Tell me, how hard is it to play support/comp builds again? You just press button and 5 people get heals and boons, all while you are on max HP/toughness to rez downs faster (i.e. braindead tactics). If you're DPS, you just sit in the blob and pull/bomb whoever gets too close while you're being babysitted by healers and rezzers.

You can go off and pretend you're using extreme precision and cunning when you press your buttons to do what the commander says, but it's delusional 🤪

No, I don't think "20 people playing together" in this romanticized way you've described deserve jack kitten. Cheesing with comp builds IS THE EASY THING TO DO LOL. There was a time when my roaming guild would drop the power builds and comp for serious fights, BECAUSE IT WAS REALLY THAT MUCH EASIER.

Braindead comp squadding vs roamer builds (these guys asked for it, transferred like 10-15 people from EU to come after us) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dTpTUixzss

 

Edited November 14, 2023 by Auragen.4162

[Burnfall.9573]

I look at Boonball as being Toxic Game Design-Bullying. There is nothing more to describe how Anet designed the game arround Hostile Gaming Environments and Experiences.

Anet design Guild Wars 2 where all mechanics, skills, conditions, behaviors, designs, elements, environment, experiences...gravitated around Toxicty 

Like other Toxic Game Designs allowed, tolerated and promoted by Anet; Boonball encourages and prmotes; Bullying, Griefing, Discrimination, Flaming, Hate Speech, Racism, Abuse, Online Chat Abuse, Intimidation, Name-Calling, Hurling-Insults, Favoritism, Bias, Sexism, Homophobia...

In other word; Anet designed and created Guild Wars 2 to be a breeding Gaming Culture of Toxicity

Everything about Guild Wars 2 breeds Toxicity and Anet profits from it. The worse part of it is; Anet does not care one bit, by us suffering from the emotional abuse that it has created throughout the years including present day. 

Being mentally stable or not stable of playing this Toxic Gaming Culture Game, is the last of Anet worries. 

 

Just for the record; any players complaining about Game Fatigue, Burnout is not what really happening. What is really happening is Emotional Abuse by Anet

Edited November 14, 2023 by Burnfall.9573

[Nabbut.7480]

Every multiplayer PvP promotes toxicity. Haves nothing to do with Anet and Guild Wars 2.

I play Open World PvE and people there are helpful and nice, maybe because they are not forced to slaughter each other.

[Mabi black.1824]

7 minutes ago, Nabbut.7480 said:

Every multiplayer PvP promotes toxicity. Haves nothing to do with Anet and Guild Wars 2.

I play Open World PvE and people there are helpful and nice, maybe because they are not forced to slaughter each other.

This is also true. But what are you going to do about it the PvP player is made that way, he wants competition, but wait a minute, is WVW a competitive game mode? or not? 😉

[MysteryDude.1572]

1 hour ago, Auragen.4162 said:

This is such cope lmao. Tell me, how hard is it to play support/comp builds again? You just press button and 5 people get heals and boons, all while you are on max HP/toughness to rez downs faster (i.e. braindead tactics). If you're DPS, you just sit in the blob and pull/bomb whoever gets too close while you're being babysitted by healers and rezzers.

You can go off and pretend you're using extreme precision and cunning when you press your buttons to do what the commander says, but it's delusional 🤪

No, I don't think "20 people playing together" in this romanticized way you've described deserve jack kitten. Cheesing with comp builds IS THE EASY THING TO DO LOL. There was a time when my roaming guild would drop the power builds and comp for serious fights, BECAUSE IT WAS REALLY THAT MUCH EASIER.

Braindead comp squadding vs roamer builds (these guys asked for it, transferred like 10-15 people from EU to come after us) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dTpTUixzss

 

Like ... what did you try to showcase with this video??
you literally proved tythans point, coordinating with suports gave advantage. Since its so ez,  you coudn't have done it with dpsers alone like you bragged?

and so much for beeing immortal cheese, when you got downies from your side in 2.50 and 3.14 on enemy opening. Plus using SA as an example , cause they really are the pinacle guild for coordinated 10s-15s.  Any half decent 15s EU guild could stomp you judging from this footage.

Edited November 14, 2023 by MysteryDude.1572

[Dopamine.6324]

seems like missed 3 years ago the good old cloud vs cloud gvg's

[MysteryDude.1572]

well, from footage both sides were clouding equally , but whats tha have to do with anything