Weaponmaster Training Beta Feedback: Guardian

[Rubi Bayer.8493]

The Weaponmaster Training beta event for Secrets of the Obscure is open to all Guild Wars 2 players from June 29 until July 2! Try out the combat changes that are coming with SotO on August 22 and let us know what you think. You can leave your feedback for the guardian in this thread.

[Woop S.7851]

• Mainhand Axe might not be viable since Guardians + Firebrands are the main healers in WvW and PvP
• Though Mainhand Axe might be viable for glass Willbender builds spamming burning/immobilize/high DPS at the detriment of defense/armor/heal. The teleport from main hand sword will be missing in the burst combination chain, might work for burn stack or DPS spike builds (hit & leap away)
• Offhand sword has mobility, might be good for healers to escape, however the 'target' is an enemy, not an ally, could result in unpredictable shadow step/teleport in real WvW/PvP combat
• Lastly: Longbow, the damage rate per second is slower compared to bursts from other guardian melee weapons, might not be viable for DPS nor healers, unless bullet speed is faster for DPS, or it heals an area? or if range is increased? (need some sort of perk/tinkering)
• Guardian/Firebrand healer builds likely will still be the norm in WvW unless the above are somehow tweaked (examples: off-hand sword ports to ally instead of enemy, maybe longbow gives some sort of area healing effect, or if axe has a higher DPS rate and stacks more burning/conditions in a single swing)

Edited June 29, 2023 by Woop S.7851

[Solstice.5790]

No.
Did that on earlier Firebrand and Specter changes, hundreds of people did that before the last balance patch(es).

My feedback is: I chose not to participate.
 

[frostbyte.9074]

Personally, I can't wait to try the new "Weaponmaster Training" feature, not to mention all the other upcoming additions to be added to what is arguably one of the greatest MMO  in history! I'm so excited for the new expansion I actually broke down and pre-purchased it yesterday (the day it was officially announced), something, I might add, I literally haven't done even ONCE since I started playing them*, waaaay back in '86 at the age of 7.

Granted, GW2 is not your average game—MMORPG or otherwise—being innovative and even revolutionary in so many ways. Paired with ArenaNet, a company that could be said to exist for gamers, by gamers. I mean, in my vast experience as a hardcore gamer (some thirty-six years—I'm not bragging, just saying,) I feel I can accurately state that we GW2 players are spoiled beyond belief when compared to players of other MMO, and ArenaNet has been absolutely outstanding with regards to addressing issues and responding to players' wishes, all while continually maintaining to a huge degree a good balance with the various professions and other aspects!

Doing so, by the way, is something nigh-impossible to accomplish in my experience. As a professional software engineer and fellow developer, I can fully appreciate just how hard it is to try pleasing EVERY user/player ALL the time—there is always at least some people who end up being upset (to put it mildly) who seem to find joy in arguing about which category a mechanic change or game update belongs: "bug", "feature", "fix", etc.

Yet ArenaNet has pulled off this amazing feat continually for over a decade, which has sadly produced a batch of excellent players, but players who nonetheless have no clue how fortunate they are. Evidence of our spoiled nature (as players) is rife in the forums and elsewhere, including Discord servers and in-game chat channels.

Many people complain about changes before they've even had a chance to test them; some players going so far as threatening to "stop playing" or abandon the game altogether, a particularly virulent form of SGS (Selfish Gamer Syndrome), which has always reminded me of, for example, a seven-year-old little boy or girl screaming "That's not fair! It's supposed to be the way I want it to!" while stomping off the playground.

Naturally, being a human being and therefore imperfect, I have fallen victim to this disease as well, and occasionally "rant" over certain re-balancing changes that I object to. We seem to almost take it personally when our profession or spec is changed in such a way that we must adapt or modify our play-style or rotations, even though this is something that veteran gamers should be able to easily do, and that actually enhances our game-play over time and hones our reflexes and creativity. Thus, lately if I see a change I don't like, I try to maintain the mindset instilled in me as a former Marine, that of adapting and overcoming any challenge by sheer force of will and innovation instead of allowing it to ruin me and behave like a juvenile colocal.

Please bear in mind if you read this post, that I am not singling anyone out or attempting to admonish my fellow players. As stated above, I too have at times succumbed to my spoiled nature as a GW2 player. I am simply pointing out that, compared to other games and game developers, at least, we should be happy and welcome any changes that may come, rather than fly into a blind rage and lash out at ArenaNet, whose job is really only to entertain and please us. There are just so many of us that it's literally impossible to please everyone, and no matter what changes, fixes or other alterations are made, there will be those of us who disagree with them. But instead of reacting immaturely and griping, I personally see more benefit in trying to adapt our style of play to the changes. After all, if a change truly is unhelpful or degrading to the game and its community, history has shown time and again that ArenaNet will fix it in some manner.

For those of you who read this admittedly novel-length post, thank you for your patience. I hope you will benefit from it and perhaps step back a bit to ask yourself whether complaining about some change is truly beneficial or worthwhile. I mean, it is my humblest opinion that we should all remember GW2 is only a game, and as a hardcore, lifelong gamer, I have to admit I have forgotten that many times, but when I remember, things seem better. Change is exciting, even challenging changes. They are only opportunities to grow and to become better gamers.

Happy travels, everyone, and happy beta testing! 👍😎

P.S. And a very sincere thank you to ArenaNet for your never-ending, heroic and epic struggle to please your gamers and fans. We love you, even if it doesn't always seem like it. I'm excited to try your new expansion, and grateful for the opportunity at a "sneak-peek" at it!

*With the notable exception of The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past came out in 1992, the Zelda series being my all-time favorite traditional video game series.

Edited June 29, 2023 by frostbyte.9074
Added a postscript thank you to ArenaNet.

[Kirevey.5079]

So far Axe, Longbow and off hand Sword feel really nice to play with the other specs at least in WvW. I'd apreciate if maybe the daze from the FB trait Unrelenting Criticism was baseline for axe.

Edited June 29, 2023 by Kirevey.5079

[Balsa.3951]

the true question is will u even listen?

how many years we telling u guys about offhand sword feels bad or hammer aa feels slow.

or fb and pvp?

maybe give us feedback that u have investment in balance pvp.

what makes u believe we can feel our feedback matters?

 

[DeathPanel.8362]

The Axe is a very effective option for Condi Willbenders.  In fact, I would say it's the best weapon.  

[allshallperish.4620]

willbender with longbow ❤️

[FtoPScrub.5476]

Offhand sword is really weak in terms of PvE damage. Worse than focus, and when paired with MH sword worse than longbow. Could really use some tuning up otherwise I don't see any power guardian elite specs using it in PvE outside of mobility. It already sees very little use in PvE and nothing changes by unbinding it from WB

Edited June 29, 2023 by FtoPScrub.5476

[otto.5684]

OH sword: PvE wise, it is a bad weapon, even for WB. No difference under any setup. In PvP it is used for the gap closer. If guardian dps builds (excluding WB), are any good, it could see some play.

LB: sPvP, core LB is better than DH. No surprise here, since radiance provides far more damage than over DH. I still would not play it (or DH) in spvp. It is a heavily neutered weapon. I have not tried it with WB, but leaping to a target to hit them with a ranged weapon is silly.

Axe: PvE, it will definitely be the go to weapon for condi WB. In sPvP it has some solid uses, due to CC, pull and cripple. I used it instead of sword. I missed the mobility, but the utility it offers is nice.

Axe is definitely the winner. LB could see some play, especially if it is fixed in pvp. OH sword is obsolete, outside of WB in spvp.

Edited June 30, 2023 by otto.5684

[ArchonWing.9480]

Went with Firebrand in WvW with longbow  certainly different since normally you have zero reach on that spec. I had scepter/sword on the other side for the 2 immoblizes with the trait that gives you resistance when you immobilize someone.  Too bad I didn't have speed runes on beta.

Was it good? I have no idea but it seemed to confuse the hell out of a lot of people.

And yea, I think now that other specs can use LB, DH doesn't seem that great outside of trapper runes.

Axe willbender sounds cool.

Edited June 30, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[Saiyan.1704]

[sPvP]

• There's 0 reason to pick DH now that Core & WB can use LB. DH needs at least 1s worth of trap quickness outside of trapper runes to retain that unique side-node kiting spec.
• Firebrand is in the same trashy state because almost every single class's damage has improved while FB's self-sustains hasn't.

 

[Lawton.4250]

My feedback: after 5000+ gaming hours with my guardian main, this beta was enough to make my decision to leave the game easy.  Goodbye Anet. You have ruined the PvE game for me and skewed the imbalance in PvP even more.😭

[yLoon.5289]

I appreciate it greatly if someone able to tell me the fun in this.
But I'm really sorry, wtf is this? In what way does this "Wetpun Mustard" does to enhance the "gaming" experience?
Adding more dps? Nope
Adding more healing? Nope
Adding more supportive trait? Nope
Adding more movement skills? Nope

Really Anet, what have you done expecting people to buy this?
Sad!

Edited June 30, 2023 by yLoon.5289

[JDub.1530]

19 hours ago, DeathPanel.8362 said:

The Axe is a very effective option for Condi Willbenders.  In fact, I would say it's the best weapon.  

Agreed. I couldn't give it a full workout as I had no access to the Runes I needed, but it felt pretty good.

[JDub.1530]

13 hours ago, otto.5684 said:

I have not tried it with WB, but leaping to a target to hit them with a ranged weapon is silly.

I haven't tried it, but I would think LB WB would be best for kiting. Hitting at range and using Virtues to maintain distance.

Whether it's effective at that is an entirely different story. I'd imagine you only have a short window before you're forced into closer combat.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

When I thought of cool weapon/spec combos dual sword/lb dh, lb willbender,  bow fb, dual sword fb and bow core seemed to sound really cool. Judging by the far more activity on the other classes sub forums and judging by reddit activity it seems guardian didn't really gain much from the weapon unlocks, to bad as they sounded cool lol, hopefully dual pistol shines.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Psycoprophet.8107

[Ferus.3165]

lb willbender is terrible. It's such a low hit rate weapon that (even if 90% of the projectiles would not be reflected) you won't even be able to proc the passives of your virtues when they are active.

[Sonork.2916]

The only idea I had for pvp/wvw was some kind of CC DH.  using scepter/Sword + axe/shield.  Then using traps and what not to pull/push/root people.  but traps have been so nerfed, and other classes have such good sustain/avoidance that i dunno if it would work at all.

[divinexill.5019]

WB + Axe main hand is a fabulous idea, I can hear them crying "nerf the Willbenders" already. 🤣

[Brokensunday.4098]

dh with double swords and axe shield is nice, lb on willy is ok ish 

[MagicBot.1570]

Well there isn't much to say is there?

- Axe is bad on Dragonhunter, because Dragonhunter is not viable as condi

- Axe is bad on Willbender, because it's a slow weapon and the latter is overly dependent on rapid hitting

- Longbow ok on Willbender, but not better than Sword/Focus because Focus is incredibly busted on this spec. Longbow Willbender has potential both on condi and power.

- Longbow is not good on Firebrand because Firebrand is bad

- Off-hand Sword is absolute trash in itself

[Temo.2341]

Honestly its quite horrible in pvp - For axe the CDs are way too high so that when you swap back to axe from the other set youre left with auto attack, no other option since you cant just go into tomes like FB used be able to. Longbow isnt much use on other specs since you either highly lack mobility and the 2 most important skills still root you in place likes its 2014, or youre forced into playing willbender a neglected spec that cannot sustain and even worse so when youre not even able to trigger a single aegis for defense because longbow doesnt have enough hits. Only decent thing to come out of this is that you can now pick offhand sword to try and run away from catalyst cause youre not gonna kill it anyway.
Instead of boosting catalyst which has been on top of the meta game for a year or so the game mode could actually use some unbiased design and have other classes get the same treatment that ele has been getting.

For example, as guardian player- Protectors strike has been bugged for years allowing players to just hit through the block without the use of unblockable abilities

-Reversal of Fortune doesnt heal, gets hit through or keeps casting after being struck aka its a unreliable disaster

-cast times on mace and especially hammer3 and hammer4 on guardian are a joke for abilities that do so little

Specs that see little to no play in competitive or even uncompetitve games are left in the dust after overnerfing prematurely while buffs are being handed out like free samples to specs  that makes half the playerbase quit the game.

Ive never made a forum post before, however balance patches are resembling a clown show more and more on the pvp side of things. I hope theres gonna be some drastic changes in terms of balance because wvw and pvp are on lifesupport already

 

[Balsa.3951]

delete

Edited July 2, 2023 by Balsa.3951

[Sonork.2916]

After playing other classes like necro/rev/warrior, that all have traits or class abilities that give them great sustain or boons for simply existing by using things they would be using anyways.  Feels like guardian is just stuck in the past in terms of traits/weapons.   Many other classes just kitten out evades/barrier/blocks/heals passively through traits.  While guardian is stuck in 2012, still having to use utility skills to get any sort of actual sustain or defense, cause their weapon skills are garbage.  Being pretty much a melee only class with weapon skills that still root you in 2023 is pathetic.  The other elites weapons just don't do enough or are bad in of themselves that it doesn't matter that they're usable across the board.