I'm lost - what do people want from GW2?

[Astralporing.1957]

8 minutes ago, Dibit.6259 said:

I understand the want and need to implement legendary armour into pve as alternative game mode but yeah the idea was that it would come with a greater material and time cost. 

That itself is not what is being questioned. It's the Rifts (instead of normal OW content) being the core grind that is the primary issue. An OW Legendary armor that is not being based around variety of OW content (and variety of choices how to proceed, like WvW players have for their armor), but around massive grinding a specific narrow content that is created solely for that purpose, and, as such, is something OW players would not otherwise do is against the very core of original idea.

Again, it's like if Envoy armor required not LI from raid bosses, but depended on farming thousands of DRMs. I'm sure raiders would have exploded if that were the case.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Astralporing.1957

[Dibit.6259]

1 minute ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

That itself is not what is being questioned. It's the Rifts (instead of normal OW content) being the core grind that is the primary issue. An OW Legendary armor that is not being based around variety of OW content (and variety of choices how to proceed, like WvW players have for their armor), but around massive grinding a specific narrow content that is created solely for that purpose, and, as such, is something OW players would not otherwise do is against the very core of original idea.

Aren't most legendary items beyond g1 weapons require grinding specific content in order to obtain it?

[peperoncino.2516]

Just now, Dibit.6259 said:

Aren't most legendary items beyond g1 weapons require grinding specific content in order to obtain it?

the new ow one certainly is the most mind numbing kind of a grind, its like doing a default pof bounty about a thousand times. i cant see how someone might genuinely like the challenge be not of mastering games combat or your knowledge of games mechanics, but of literally just pumping dozens of hours into an activity like a drone.... tho i guess it does add to supposed "variety" .

[Dibit.6259]

10 minutes ago, peperoncino.2516 said:

the new ow one certainly is the most mind numbing kind of a grind, its like doing a default pof bounty about a thousand times. i cant see how someone might genuinely like the challenge be not of mastering games combat or your knowledge of games mechanics, but of literally just pumping dozens of hours into an activity like a drone.... tho i guess it does add to supposed "variety" .

I won't argue that its not mind numbing, most grinds are, think people just need to take this at a slower pace. I rushed Aurora and felt little to no satisfaction from it with how tiring it was. When I did vision I worked on it at a much relaxed pace and felt much better when I finished it. Wanting instant gratification or reward tends to be where people get impatient and start to ask for changes. Not a lot of content for legendaries are difficult and for those that are more challenging a lot of the community are willing to offer help if people ask for it.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Dibit.6259
Typos

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

5 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

That itself is not what is being questioned. It's the Rifts (instead of normal OW content) being the core grind that is the primary issue. An OW Legendary armor that is not being based around variety of OW content (and variety of choices how to proceed, like WvW players have for their armor), but around massive grinding a specific narrow content that is created solely for that purpose, and, as such, is something OW players would not otherwise do is against the very core of original idea.

Again, it's like if Envoy armor required not LI from raid bosses, but depended on farming thousands of DRMs. I'm sure raiders would have exploded if that were the case.

For as far as there is grind in this game (which I'd argue there isn't, just people's extremely low threshold for what constitutes as grind) it's merited for legendary items. They should be the most expensive and time-consuming to get. Just like ultimate weapons in the Final Fantasy games require lots of time and effort, to name but one example.

Comparing this to WvW is also unfair. First of all there isn't anything new to do in WvW since release. What we had then, we have now, and nothing more (except one new map, but the content on said map remains the same as on the others). Second, in WvW players can muck things up for you, so requiring very specific things to do wouldn't work as well. It's part of the reason why ANet removed WvW maps from world completion. It could take weeks to complete all 4 maps if you're unlucky (being on a bad/low population server or being pitted against servers who are doing much better). Though, with all the complaining that's going on I almost wish they would implement that again. The entitlement is at such a degree that part of me would actually be very amused by this.

By the way, what is this original idea you're referring to?

Edited September 20, 2023 by TheNecrosanct.4028
Spelling

[Krzysztof.5973]

What I personally want from ANet is:

- having a spine and not dumbing down the game by making it easy for the cry babies and stop pumping the power creep 
- encourage their audience to actually socialize not to keep going down the road of an MMO design of "playing together alone" 
- stop ostracizing most dedicated audience with either lack of updates or mind numbing activities just to keep them busy
- and many more but that's maybe for another time...
- bonus meme: https://i.imgur.com/WqJfqlb.png

Edited September 20, 2023 by Krzysztof.5973

[peperoncino.2516]

56 minutes ago, Dibit.6259 said:

I won't argue that its not mind numbing, most grinds are, think people just need to take this at a slower pace. I rushed Aurora and felt little to no satisfaction from it with how tiring it was. When I did vision I worked on it at a much relaxed pace and felt much better when I finished it. Wanting instant gratification or reward tends to be where people get impatient and start to ask for changes. Not a lot of content for legendaries are difficult and for those that are more challenging a lot of the community are willing to offer help if people ask for it.

thing is, there is no reason, aside laziness ofc, it has to be as mindless. none of the grinds should be. regardless, gw2s open world is one of the most expansive and immersive out there in video games, not just mmorpgs, there is so much quality stuff to find and enjoy in every zone... yet a supposed "open world" legendary armor is literally obtained by doing a single activity in a handful of zones to your liking. its a shame.

[Dibit.6259]

11 minutes ago, peperoncino.2516 said:

thing is, there is no reason, aside laziness ofc, it has to be as mindless. none of the grinds should be. regardless, gw2s open world is one of the most expansive and immersive out there in video games, not just mmorpgs, there is so much quality stuff to find and enjoy in every zone... yet a supposed "open world" legendary armor is literally obtained by doing a single activity in a handful of zones to your liking. its a shame.

Based on anet's past announcement on June 27th, crafting components for the legendary armour will be obtained in open world gameplay in Soto. Based on this information it makes sense that some materials required is restricted to Soto maps. This also isn't unusual as a lot of legendary items require materials from certain zones in order to craft. 

In regards to it being a single activity, this is a bit more unusual in regards to obtain certain material but it's not much different in regards to event grinding in order to get items or materials needed.  Take dragon's stand for example, you obtains machetes by doing various events or by spending currency from different maps but ultimately you only have certain amount of chests you could plunder per meta. You'd have to repeat the meta several times to get the currency needed to craft the weapon you were trying to get.

[Cyninja.2954]

2 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

That itself is not what is being questioned. It's the Rifts (instead of normal OW content) being the core grind that is the primary issue. An OW Legendary armor that is not being based around variety of OW content (and variety of choices how to proceed, like WvW players have for their armor), but around massive grinding a specific narrow content that is created solely for that purpose, and, as such, is something OW players would not otherwise do is against the very core of original idea.

Again, it's like if Envoy armor required not LI from raid bosses, but depended on farming thousands of DRMs. I'm sure raiders would have exploded if that were the case.

Aren't you forgetting the significant amount of other materials besides LI for Envoy Armor here though?

- chack eggs and similar across all zones

- provisioner tokens (which for a long time where severely time gated and expensive)

- map completion

- specific masteries leveled to both be able to complete certain raids as well as have access to specific vendors

- a lengthy weekly time gate (back in the day, sure this has shrunk at the top end now) to even acquire the LI

Sure the developers could have added more requirements to open world legendary armor but it should have been clear to any one that the base grind required would be large and the only way to assure this grind is present is via new materials.

Those materials in turn need to ideally be acquired outside of to many expansions as to not require more than SotO (or face complaints yet again).

Seems to me the developers delivered exactly that.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Cyninja.2954

[Lucy.3728]

6 hours ago, Hesione.9412 said:

The warclaw is too much effort.

I think you meant the Skyscale, the classic Skyscale unlock system.

The warclaw is no effort.

[Lucy.3728]

4 hours ago, Tiamat.8254 said:

this is obtainable only through WvW. Now a player like myself who is terrible in any form of PvP goes in and starts ruining it for people who actually are good and want to do well in WvW.

As a wvw player I say you don't ruin it for other people.
There have always been all kind of "suboptimal" people in wvw.

Thus WvW has always been high drama.

One minute everything is doomed and everyone sucks and it must be elaborated why exactly, and the other minute... well there is no other minute.

You can kind of pve your way to the GoB. Just do the camps. You see another human that's hostile to you? Port back and go to another camp. Someone catches you nonetheless and kill you? Happens to every wvw player too. Port back and go elsewhere, like another map.

If you're lucky you'll find a ppt zerg (means they try to only do pve content). But even without you can pve 2x GoB faster than 1 GoE.

Gankers ruin wvw for other players.

[jason.1083]

4 hours ago, costepj.5120 said:

What is it you think you would do in WvW that would ruin anyone else's experience?
Is there a risk that when I play PvE I will ruin it for you?

For roamers It's actually the opposite, easy kills.

[Westenev.5289]

Some people genuinely hate wvw (usually because they play it wrong, I think), so naturally GoB has been a talking point for a long time.

 

This is a game, a recreational activity, and maybe people have enough L's in their daily grind that they just want something to complain about.

[Tiamat.8254]

12 minutes ago, Lucy.3728 said:

As a wvw player I say you don't ruin it for other people.
There have always been all kind of "suboptimal" people in wvw.

 

The kindest words I have ever had in regards to my wvw ability ❤️

[QueenKeriti.5176]

"I want it all,

I want it all,

I want it all,

And I want it now."

[Ashantara.8731]

7 hours ago, Hesione.9412 said:

Reading the forums, it's:

1. The Gift of Battle is too much effort.
2. The new SotO legendary armour is too much effort.
3. The warclaw is too much effort.

That is a very simplified (and thus partially inaccurate) summary.

Example: The complaints you mention on behalf of the Obsidian Armor are not about the effort and time investment but about the very dumbed down, monotonous way of acquisition. People would gladly put in all the effort if the task didn't bore them to death.

"Grind" in games can describe a lot of repetition, but also a sh*tload of work put into something. Nowhere, though, does the definition of grind state that the repetitive or otherwise demanding/exhausting tasks must be limited to only one.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Ashantara.8731

[Holmindeboks.3490]

My biggest problem is THE LOOT. There is no loot. The only loot = super rare. So basically there is no loot. No matter what meta you do. Its wasting time. No skins nothing. Fishing is useless, no mini’s, no mount skins. In WoW you can fish up mounts. But this game is pure greed. They only want our money. ONE mount skin is already too much asked. They dont design mounts to put on fishing loot table. They only add mounts behind rng that you have to pay for. Bl chest keys. Gold or cash. This greed is crazy. Their earnings are high. But their team dont even think about design a skin for a loot table. The only loot are infusions that never drop. Its only a gold sink. And yes precursors but thats also a low droprate. The most come from the mystic forge. 

[Widebody.5071]

There may be some newer players driving this mess but it's mostly it's a bunch of the old timers feeling entitled and trying to have everything their way, it's been like this way before TikTok was launched. Nobody remember the E-Sports mode associated with the game? The players screwed that up.

All we can do is play the game and enjoy it the best we can, when it get too poopy change game modes and let them have that part they cry so much for. I'm sure they'll be happy with each other.

[Dibit.6259]

11 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

That is a very simplified (and thus partially inaccurate) summary.

Example: The complaints you mention on behalf of the Obsidian Armor are not about the effort and time investment but about the very dumbed down, monotonous way of acquisition. People would gladly put in all the effort if the task didn't bore them to death.

"Grind" in games can describe a lot of repetition, but also a sh*tload of work put into something. Nowhere, though, does the definition of grind state that the repetitive or otherwise demanding/exhausting tasks must be limited to only one.

It's does not necessarily mean various tasks either. Wiki even states "Grinding is a term used in video culture, referring to the act of repeating an action or set of actions, including non-repetitive tasks to achieve a desired result at a level of certain difficulty, typically for an extended period of time." Grind is repetition, whether that's via one event or several.

[Grouwdi.6279]

I want this game to get new graphic engine updates  and play smoother like all the other games on the market. 11 years is too long to wait on game improvements

I want more content that lasts longer (story, ect) because I hate getting to the end of story and waiting for technology to come long and wipe my memory of the story so I can go replay it all again like I've never seen it before (staff does a great job with their story telling in the game)

I would like some RNG drops in the game that don't take 2-5 years of game play

I prefer there be more than just mastery's and legendary items to farm for

[Astralporing.1957]

3 hours ago, Dibit.6259 said:

Aren't most legendary items beyond g1 weapons require grinding specific content in order to obtain it?

To that degree as in this armor's case? No. There's no equivalent. There's nothing else so far that would require you to run the same narrow content thousands of times. And definitely nothing that would require you to run even hundreds repats of otherwise unrewarding content.

[Dibit.6259]

3 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

My biggest problem is THE LOOT. There is no loot. The only loot = super rare. So basically there is no loot. No matter what meta you do. Its wasting time. No skins nothing. Fishing is useless, no mini’s, no mount skins. In WoW you can fish up mounts. But this game is pure greed. They only want our money. ONE mount skin is already too much asked. They dont design mounts to put on fishing loot table. They only add mounts behind rng that you have to pay for. Bl chest keys. Gold or cash. This greed is crazy. Their earnings are high. But their team dont even think about design a skin for a loot table. The only loot are infusions that never drop. Its only a gold sink. And yes precursors but thats also a low droprate. The most come from the mystic forge. 

Other than the expansions, nothing in game requires the need to spend money. You can earn gold to convert to gems to buy stuff in store or do achievements/tasks in game to obtain. In regards to loot, if anet allowed everyone to obtain high end loot it would loose it value and no longer be high end loot.

[Holmindeboks.3490]

I just gave up already on this game. And it feels good i am relax now. If i want to make a rewarding progress for time spend i go to the gym. There i always leave with a good feeling. In guildwars 2 after every boss run i feel disappointed for time spend and bags full junk. 

[yoni.7015]

1 minute ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

There's nothing else so far that would require you to run the same narrow content thousands of time

Tell that to the people who got their legendary armor in sPvP

[Grouwdi.6279]

2 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

I just gave up already on this game. And it feels good i am relax now. If i want to make a rewarding progress for time spend i go to the gym. There i always leave with a good feeling. In guildwars 2 after every boss run i feel disappointed for time spend and bags full junk. 

/facepalm...
you're supposed to go to the gym or work out regularly anyway....