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To recap, we went from: 

- Hot, Pof, eod : a lot of elite spe with new gameplay, new weapon for all classes. 

- Soto : just one new different weapon for all classes (most of which are currently useless)

- Jw : a new similar (recycled) weapon for all classes.

And now I see everyone says Arena are geniuses. Is it me or has the community become less demanding over the years?

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There's definitely a downward trend when you look at the feature set of each expansion, and now Anet is gonna try to do the 3 maps thing AGAIN after it didn't work with IBS, then SotO...

A reminder that Season 3 had 6 maps each with map specific gameplay, like the vines in Draconis Mons which was seriously cool before the Skyscale ruined everything.

While on Season 4 although the maps didn't introduce new gameplay it at least brought two brand new mounts.

JW: "hey you know the mount the mount you NEVER use in PvE because it's slow and sluggish and you have much better options, were giving that a new ability to move around hard terrain... after we basically gave everyone that could be bother to lift a finger a Skyscale... yeah..."

I was really hoping Anet would go back to the 6 map release schedule, that would actually give the company time and room to flesh out what ever story they wanna tell, but nope, a cynical person would look at this and say they're just trying to fine tune the minimum amount of work they can get away with while charging the maximum amount of money for it, I highly doubt the current team could bring is something like HoT today.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, PixeLpics.8017 said:

To recap, we went from: 

- Hot, Pof, eod : a lot of elite spe with new gameplay, new weapon for all classes. 

- Soto : just one new different weapon for all classes (most of which are currently useless)

- Jw : a new similar (recycled) weapon for all classes.

And now I see everyone says Arena are geniuses. Is it me or has the community become less demanding over the years?

 

People see what they want to see... If u want to find faults with anet, u will, if u want to see what they did good, u will...

I don't like housing unless I get what I want from housing, 

I want a new cute Ranger pet and some don't even acknowledge the existence of Ranger class

Some like new legendaries, some don't even care and prefer to live with exotics and ascended

Some like new raid,PvP ... To some , the sentence won't even register in their minds

Some like story and rpg elements, some hate it

Refreshed warclaw mounts, new map, new weapon for landbased combat meaning new set of weapon skills obviously different for all classes(imagine you got what weapon u expected for the classes since they do have diff skills)weapon is just a placeholder imo... Skills, animations ,flashiness, stylish,  gameplay impact, fluid combat is what matters most

New enemies probably with interesting mechanics...

Are u one of the players who don't want anything from new expansion?

All this for 25$ and probably they will release tons of weapon skins every season... Some mount skins, Armor skin pieces that worth more gems, infusions, legy starter kits,... So on in WV

Edited by Crystal Paladin.3871
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If this low amount of new content is paired with a lot of bugfixes (please fix the kitten mech signets so that they don't go on cooldown with no effect, it's been over 2 years now), I'd be ok with this, because it's not like we're not getting any content at all, and the price is approaching a reasonable point for what we do get.

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3 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

hey you know the mount the mount you NEVER use in PvE because it's slow and sluggish and you have much better options, were giving that a new ability to move around hard terrain... after we basically gave everyone that could be bother to lift a finger a Skyscale... yeah...

They must have been racking their brain really hard to come up with a way to sell warclaw skins more consistently since only WvWvW regulars use that mount.

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Posted (edited)

I wouldn't mind paying double the standard expansion price if the content was similar to hot or pof. But yea, no new elite specializations, a tonne of padding out of content with fill up the green bar story progressions, very basic storyline that is spread over a year, no new legendary weapons, and the copy paste Aurene weapons do not count. Its as if that magic gw2 had ages ago has been lost. I just don't know, maybe they are focusing on upcoming stuff (gw3?) and gw2 is now a side project. I still pre-ordered the new expansion though, just purely because I have been wanting player housing and land spear (although no doubt the balance team will make it useless in wvw and pvp, lookin at the weapons proficiency for soto 😅)

Edited by asterix.9614
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5 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

I was really hoping Anet would go back to the 6 map release schedule, that would actually give the company time and room to flesh out what ever story they wanna tell

There is no chance they will do this; their entire release schedule is designed around using as few Anet resources as possible while still delivering a minimum viable product.

5 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

I highly doubt the current team could bring is something like HoT today.

No, they couldn't. Heart of Thorns was done by the entire studio; these season packs are probably done by fewer than 15 people.

The key for me to become okay with this new content cadence was to adjust my expectations, not to have Anet revert back to their previous state, which wasn't going to happen.

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Posted (edited)

It's called shrinkflation. They kept the price the same, but deliver smaller content. 

As much as I want to complain. In this economy, they needed to change the way they sell.

I will judge it based on the content itself. So far for me, the result has been okay-ish, but please no more downgrade.

Edited by phandaria.4891
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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, PixeLpics.8017 said:

To recap, we went from: 

- Hot, Pof, eod : a lot of elite spe with new gameplay, new weapon for all classes. 

- Soto : just one new different weapon for all classes (most of which are currently useless)

- Jw : a new similar (recycled) weapon for all classes.

And now I see everyone says Arena are geniuses. Is it me or has the community become less demanding over the years?

 

GW2 has a very strong foundation it it's systems.
Every new weapon isn't one option more, but several more because of possible mix and matching with older weapons and new builds that may result from that.
And once it becomes "old one" it enlarges that pool of combination for the next new thing, so yeah - that's why they can get away with it.

Also do I detect engi/ele player here?
A lot of SotO new weapons are far from useless.

At least two thirds of classes are eating good with their new weapons.
I can understand above two and revs feeling sour, but that's not "most".

 

Edited by StraightPath.3972
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We are really looking at a bare minimum standard for this expansion, just to maintain the revenue that is now being used to develop GW3 :

The artistic direction is plummeting and no longer keeping up with the age of the graphics engine. The trailers for HoT  and PoF  were far superior visually. The rest is just rehashed/recycled content.

Housing is nothing more than the Guild Hall decoration system adapted to a personal instance for a single player. This is what will keep the shop running at full speed and make players farm for a year as quarterly updates roll out.

The spear for all classes is to save on animation work and duplicate skills. Besides the visual effects, it's not much work.

The new raid has already been announced as a compilation of three events from the new maps, recalibrated in an instance for 10 players. It's a far cry from the first raids, which offered new environments and boss models with unique and novel mechanics. Ultimately, it's just content that will replace strikes and fractals, which are disappearing from the schedule. It's content we will have already experienced on the expansion maps.

The mount is the same as the one in WvW, but with a few added skills to make it useful in PvE. Along the way, it might also encourage players to buy Razziafelis skins from the store.

Ultimately, the only unpredictable novelty is the announcement of a new PvP mode that came out of nowhere but without any concrete information, photos, or videos to showcase it. There’s also no date or format details, so it might even be for 2025. We’re not even sure it will ever reach a beta release (just like the 15v15 mode planned years ago in the GvG style that never made it past the alpha stage).

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1 hour ago, Sinsear.5068 said:

We are really looking at a bare minimum standard for this expansion, just to maintain the revenue that is now being used to develop GW3 :

The artistic direction is plummeting and no longer keeping up with the age of the graphics engine. The trailers for HoT  and PoF  were far superior visually. The rest is just rehashed/recycled content.

Housing is nothing more than the Guild Hall decoration system adapted to a personal instance for a single player. This is what will keep the shop running at full speed and make players farm for a year as quarterly updates roll out.

The spear for all classes is to save on animation work and duplicate skills. Besides the visual effects, it's not much work.

The new raid has already been announced as a compilation of three events from the new maps, recalibrated in an instance for 10 players. It's a far cry from the first raids, which offered new environments and boss models with unique and novel mechanics. Ultimately, it's just content that will replace strikes and fractals, which are disappearing from the schedule. It's content we will have already experienced on the expansion maps.

The mount is the same as the one in WvW, but with a few added skills to make it useful in PvE. Along the way, it might also encourage players to buy Razziafelis skins from the store.

Ultimately, the only unpredictable novelty is the announcement of a new PvP mode that came out of nowhere but without any concrete information, photos, or videos to showcase it. There’s also no date or format details, so it might even be for 2025. We’re not even sure it will ever reach a beta release (just like the 15v15 mode planned years ago in the GvG style that never made it past the alpha stage).

First of all, developing Gw3 will be a mistake. I think NCsoft made a market research by checking people’s reaction. Let’s put out our head from the sand and lets be realistic.  People’s expectations will be too high. If they release Gw3 with the same content or less content than core Gw2, Gw3 will born dead. People will buy, play couple months and come back to continue Gw2. People will expect to have more content than core gw2 + some features of HoT+PoF expansion. That requires minimum 6-8 years. I believe Anet thinks the same. 

2nd, they are doing marketing strategy, they sold that idea to community like great thing and most of ppl bought that. Less innovation and content than Living Stories, name it as expansion and ask minimum double price. If they succeeded, I wouldnt say anything but it didn’t. 

3rd, I want to save you from huge disappointment. Please lower your expectations to minimum. I told my friends before SotO release about that, even I didn’t expect such a mess. Now, maps are populated, ppl dont realize but lets think couple years later from now. Many people will deal newer contents and too few people will be in SotO maps. With this condition, who will do events and metas. Even with full squad, killing boss is true pain because of insane HP pool. (Today inner nayos meta failed even there were much more people than 1 full squad.) Dragon’s End meta is at least required full organization and needs to follow mechanics not to fail and fun. 
 

Lets take Janthir Wilds. 

* Housing: I dont expect too difference than home instance. Maybe better visuals, a little feature to keep community silent. That will be all.

* Raids: Just 1 wing, with normal mode, challenge mode (more HP), legendary challenge mode (insane HP)? Who is asking more HP by the way. Anet should stop increasing HP pool, that is annoying. Killing SotO elites takes more time than old content’s champion, killing SotO champions is worse than killing old content’s legendaries, killing SotO legendaries is like undead dummies. Please lower HP pools, put more mechanics. And the most important thing is organic storyline. Pushing hard stories are not fun. 
 

* Land Spears: I would like to see Polearm but I cannot comment before beta. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, illuminati.8453 said:

There is no chance they will do this; their entire release schedule is designed around using as few Anet resources as possible while still delivering a minimum viable product.

No, they couldn't. Heart of Thorns was done by the entire studio; these season packs are probably done by fewer than 15 people.

The key for me to become okay with this new content cadence was to adjust my expectations, not to have Anet revert back to their previous state, which wasn't going to happen.

Did you even finish the last SotO chapter (19?), they even had this super long credits that you are given 2 achievement points to watch (or was it 3?) That was a heck of a lot more people than 15, but I think 20-33% were outsourced. For the topic at hand, I have reasonable expectations... each expansion has exceeded those expectations and while I probably won't ever do the instanced raid content (I think I've done 1 strike mission the past 18 months I've played GW2) I have enjoyed my time with this game and I will happily buy the new expansion. I am playing less, but that doesn't mean the time I do play has been worse off than prior to SotO.

I know what I'm looking for in an MMO, and ArenaNet is the closest company of the last 5 I've tried to give me what I want out of an MMO. Elder Scrolls and New World are probably the next few that are close, but I don't like the SP Elder Scrolls games and my PC might not give me the experience I want out of New World.

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So far all anyone has to go on is a promotional trailer and a few short blog posts. As more information about the expansion features gets released you're bound to see more feedback, good and bad. I think I viewed this more positively than I thought I might because this is more inline with what I expected a smaller, annual expansion to be, rather than what we got in SotO. But can't really form an opinion without more information.

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At the moment I have no intention of buying it because the quality of the last 6 months coupled with (in my view) terrible balance decisions has shown me that there's just not much thought going into the game anymore. I'd love to be swayed back but it's a wait and see on this expansion. It's definitely very bare bones and following the trend of reusing what they already have but I will say that since this one seems less reaching for the stars that maybe they stick the landing better. I know a lot of people are hung up on the price but it seems like plenty of content for $25, it's just that the quality is so glaringly bad that you wonder how some of it made it out the door.

If it was clearer that they listen to feedback and communicated that they understand what the pain points in the game are I'd be more inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt but they ask and then ignore and steam ahead with their original intention or fix the problem in a single instance only to repeat it again later. So not buying seems like the only way to be heard and I gotta say, it sucks. I hope they crush it this time around and I eat my hat but we'll see.

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12 hours ago, PixeLpics.8017 said:

To recap, we went from: 

- Hot, Pof, eod : a lot of elite spe with new gameplay, new weapon for all classes. 

- Soto : just one new different weapon for all classes (most of which are currently useless)

- Jw : a new similar (recycled) weapon for all classes.

And now I see everyone says Arena are geniuses. Is it me or has the community become less demanding over the years?

 

People have demanding for player housing (i was against it btw), new legendary underwater weapon and new weapon types for years... thats why people are so happy about it. For now i only see new features the community has been asking for. Although they are carefull on how it will be implemented. 

I would saythe community has been more demanding then ever. 

 

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Posted (edited)
47 minutes ago, Edibleghost.5631 said:

I hope they crush it this time around and I eat my hat but we'll see.

Im in a same boat with you. Im like fool me once shame on you...fool me twice shame on me...

Edited by Gendalfs.7521
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10 hours ago, Sindust.7059 said:

If this low amount of new content is paired with a lot of bugfixes (please fix the kitten mech signets so that they don't go on cooldown with no effect, it's been over 2 years now), I'd be ok with this, because it's not like we're not getting any content at all, and the price is approaching a reasonable point for what we do get.

It will be paired with new bugs no one will fix because there's no time to fix them because there's a new patch to release with new content and new bugs no one will fix because there's no time to fix them because there's a new patch to release with new content and new bugs no one will fix because there's no time to fix them because there's a new patch to release with new content and new bugs no one will fix because...

But on topic, "the community" is a hard to describe beast, as always and I'm not going to do a proper statistic on forum/reddit posts, fell free to do so and share your findings.

Land-spears are definitely a further downgrade. We went from "Each class gets an elite spec with a new spin on the class, new abilities AND a new weapon" to "we get an account wide Weapon Mastery wich adds a new weapon to each class" and now we get "all classes get the same new weapon". It's a spear because that's an easy way to make people happy who can't see beyond cosmetics.
Weapons in GW2 are only skins, more than in any other game I've ever played. It matters little what my char is actually holding, animation and "real life" functionality of say a greatsword has nothing to do with what weapon skills get tied to it. So if they wanted to give each class a new set of five weapon skills, they could just as well have given us a second Weapon Mastery and a new round of new weapons.
It did only need to be a spear to please the "this game needs landspears!!! landspears when?!?!?!?!"-crowd. What shows me, that this wasn't thought through is that you need two spears to be fully equipped for exampled. Makes me think that it peobably was originally a new Weapon Mastery, but then Steve from marketing decided that something needed to be more "HyPe!!" than that.

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6 hours ago, Hsanrb.1570 said:

Did you even finish the last SotO chapter (19?), they even had this super long credits that you are given 2 achievement points to watch (or was it 3?) That was a heck of a lot more people than 15, but I think 20-33% were outsourced. 

It is common practice to list people who have worked on the series, not necessarily a particular release. This is especially true for SotO since it reused so many assets.  Every game that my studio has released includes every person who has worked on the assets, even if they were currently on a different project.

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21 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

There's definitely a downward trend when you look at the feature set of each expansion, and now Anet is gonna try to do the 3 maps thing AGAIN after it didn't work with IBS, then SotO...

A reminder that Season 3 had 6 maps each with map specific gameplay, like the vines in Draconis Mons which was seriously cool before the Skyscale ruined everything.

While on Season 4 although the maps didn't introduce new gameplay it at least brought two brand new mounts.

JW: "hey you know the mount the mount you NEVER use in PvE because it's slow and sluggish and you have much better options, were giving that a new ability to move around hard terrain... after we basically gave everyone that could be bother to lift a finger a Skyscale... yeah..."

I was really hoping Anet would go back to the 6 map release schedule, that would actually give the company time and room to flesh out what ever story they wanna tell, but nope, a cynical person would look at this and say they're just trying to fine tune the minimum amount of work they can get away with while charging the maximum amount of money for it, I highly doubt the current team could bring is something like HoT today.

So don’t play the game, simple.

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23 hours ago, PixeLpics.8017 said:

To recap, we went from: 

- Hot, Pof, eod : a lot of elite spe with new gameplay, new weapon for all classes. 

- Soto : just one new different weapon for all classes (most of which are currently useless)

HoT/PoF/EoD had one weapon bound to a certain spec.

Soto made all three of these weapons available for all specs, even if you don't own the other specs.
Additionally we got a whole new weapon per class, which in fact are useful or even meta for all classes.

So yeah, not sure what you are talking about.

Not to mention that post EoD expansions were clearly announced as smaller ones multiple times.
So what are you actually complaining about? That the smaller expansions turn out to be smaller?

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