Zekent.3652 Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 (edited) Because these 2 didn't were there when that balance patch happened. Willbender and Harbinger are just the strongest roamers right now, both specs are on almost the same status as they were launched in PvP and everybody and their nan was playing willy + harb in pvp, but since devs keeps ignoring the roaming part of WvW, these 2 specs are still really strong roamers. "But thief" yeah, thief is really annoying and unfun to face, but now you got a boon heavy stab spam assassin that hits like a truck with insane mobility and a necro that REALLY abuses cele stats. I'm not saying that they should do roam oriented balances, but put a stop to the abuse of certain builds that makes the experience bad for everybody that isn't playing SA thief, Willy or Harb. Roaming is ALSO an important part of WvW. That thing that zerg-only players do to reach their zerg is also roaming, WvW is not just zergs. Edited July 13 by Zekent.3652 Typos 16 1 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawdler.8521 Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 Harbinger isn’t that common it’s fairly spread out with reapers and even core necros. Thieves beat them in numbers by far. Willbenders however… they’re the cockroaches of WvW. 15 2 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrHome.1920 Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 Harbinger numbers dropped when players realized all it takes to beat it is baiting and then kiting the elite elixir. Since every class now has plenty of mobility that's very easy. Harbinger had its moment in roaming when everyone facetanked the elixier. Willbender is still common because hit and run is a playstyle that the average skill level player can't deal with. The spec is really just a skill level test for its opponent. It is not that good. Some well known gank squads here in EU already switched back to teef recently. I am suprised how few axe thieves there are in WvW. This build is the new kitten. Guess it takes a few more weeks until everyone noticed. 8 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaoslordlol.3165 Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 The majority of willbenders ( the average joes) are funny in WvW. They go in unload their combo the target doesnt die then try to get away and well PHASE TRAVERSAL and they be like im in danger. A good willbender tho... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felincyriac.5981 Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 harb becomes quickly useless in small scale, its only good in 1v1s, even then it has matchups that it looses. 2 1 2 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyBat.9034 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 deadeye... 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedievalThings.5417 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 17 hours ago, KrHome.1920 said: Harbinger numbers dropped when players realized all it takes to beat it is baiting and then kiting the elite elixir. Since every class now has plenty of mobility that's very easy. Harbinger had its moment in roaming when everyone facetanked the elixier. Willbender is still common because hit and run is a playstyle that the average skill level player can't deal with. The spec is really just a skill level test for its opponent. It is not that good. Some well known gank squads here in EU already switched back to teef recently. I am suprised how few axe thieves there are in WvW. This build is the new kitten. Guess it takes a few more weeks until everyone noticed. I see plenty of, and play, the axe build, both as condition and power. It's more like the thief version of willbender, kills people who don't know what it is, but not skilled players. There is a reason you don't see most good thieves switching to it, cause they don't need to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename T.2847 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 7 hours ago, chaoslordlol.3165 said: The majority of willbenders ( the average joes) are funny in WvW. They go in unload their combo the target doesnt die then try to get away and well PHASE TRAVERSAL and they be like im in danger. A good willbender tho... I admit, I'm one of those willbenders XD 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cryorion.9532 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 Balance in WvW pre-february 2020 was so much better than today, change my mind. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawdler.8521 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 9 minutes ago, cryorion.9532 said: Balance in WvW pre-february 2020 was so much better than today, change my mind. Conditions had double the DPS 👍 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manu.7539 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 Willbenders, unless they surprise me with their 1st burst are rarely an issue for me. Thieves and mesmers are much more annoying. Harbs hit hard and are very tanky but its ez to run away from them 😛 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manu.7539 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 10 minutes ago, Dawdler.8521 said: Conditions had double the DPS 👍 Yeah, condi builds are ruined, I just went back to a power build, so much more efficient Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CafPow.1542 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 1 hour ago, manu.7539 said: Yeah, condi builds are ruined, I just went back to a power build, so much more efficient Okay but in the end, where is the issue. if you get deleted, unable to counter, it doesn’t matter if you get cheesed by X or Y. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DivineDreaming.7206 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 strongest roaming specs are ones that simply put cele gear on lol 4 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DivineDreaming.7206 Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 20 hours ago, MedievalThings.5417 said: There is a reason you don't see most good thieves switching to it, cause they don't need to. lol na they to busy playing shadow arts perma stealth deadeye builds, you never see really skilled thiefs anymore period, none can pull off dagger/pistol or sword/dagger dd anymore, its 90% cheese. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeolus.3615 Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 (edited) 11 hours ago, DivineDreaming.7206 said: lol na they to busy playing shadow arts perma stealth deadeye builds, you never see really skilled thiefs anymore period, none can pull off dagger/pistol or sword/dagger dd anymore, its 90% cheese. Cheese working as intended, maybe game is meant for players to focus on cheese? And everything else is just cannon fodder. Edited July 16 by Aeolus.3615 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobber.6348 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 On 7/16/2024 at 6:52 AM, DivineDreaming.7206 said: lol na they to busy playing shadow arts perma stealth deadeye builds, you never see really skilled thiefs anymore period, none can pull off dagger/pistol or sword/dagger dd anymore, its 90% cheese. Most degenerate thing I have the displeasure of meeting are Cele Specters and Cele Deadeye. Just makes me change map or take a break for a few hours cos I'm not interested in playing against this sort of build which already has difficult counterplay but now backs it up with degenerate levels of Condition and soft CC spam. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kozumi.5816 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 (edited) Harbringer is bad in outnumbered fights due no invuls. Roaming is dead due to balancing around 100 vs 100 only. On 7/15/2024 at 7:46 AM, cryorion.9532 said: Balance in WvW pre-february 2020 was so much better than today, change my mind. It wasn't, you were either invul or dead. Edited July 23 by Kozumi.5816 4 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cryorion.9532 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 (edited) 5 hours ago, Kozumi.5816 said: Harbringer is bad in outnumbered fights due no invuls. Roaming is dead due to balancing around 100 vs 100 only. It wasn't, you were either invul or dead. It was more skill based than today. Everyone could do insane damages and evading/dodging it was really important. Now people can tank full zerker double gunflame in celestial builds and pretend they are good at the game. Roaming was better than today. Boonballs weren't as kittenous as today. Of course there were disgusting things like trailblazer/dire builds and more, but I did not say that the balance pre-february 2020 was perfect. To add: The powercreep nowadays is undoubtedly higher, both offensive and defensive wise than pre-feb 2020. With exception that nowadays not everyone can do insane damages while having overtuned defensive kit available to them, like e.g. virtuoso with their invulnerabilities, willbender with their absurdly protected engage and mobility, harbinger having every boon on elite skill (how the kitten is having every boon on elite skill considered ok in competetive mode is beyond my comprehension) and so on. Plus celestial builds are simply too potent and "low risk/high reward". Isn't this all obvious, though? Do people really think that current fotm/celestial builds are good in competetive environment and healthy for the gameplay? Edited July 24 by cryorion.9532 3 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameirus.8407 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 Anet just dont seem to understand that actions have to have consequences if you fail at them. take Willbender, it can jump in an burst people....thats fine. I have no issue with that. The problem comes in when that burst fails to kill someone, what good design would have would be a willbender at a disadvantage now, exposed, and vulnerable....what we actually have is an almost invulnerable willbender who just jumps away and is uncatchable..... again, that may be fine if that involved a time sink, burning big CDs, so now they can to anything for a couple of mins...but no, the willbender we have can immediately re-engage and try again.....endlessly. the willbender has minimal risk and a lot of reward, the person they are jumping has to respond well each time...or die. the risk/reward balance is totally out of whack. now put 5 willbenders together as a ganking squad and you see why roaming is dead on matches with organised teams playing. 3 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felincyriac.5981 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 15 hours ago, Kozumi.5816 said: Harbringer is bad in outnumbered fights due no invuls. Roaming is dead due to balancing around 100 vs 100 only. It wasn't, you were either invul or dead. yh no extra evades, no blocks. Also you'll get more projectile hate in bigger fights, not a great time for a harb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RlyOsim.2497 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) That WB has not been adjusted is absolute nonsense. It way overperforms in small scale and this isn't news to anyone. Edited July 24 by RlyOsim.2497 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lan Deathrider.5910 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 On 7/15/2024 at 7:57 AM, Dawdler.8521 said: Conditions had double the DPS 👍 Cleared condis still do zero dps 👍 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lan Deathrider.5910 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 17 hours ago, Kozumi.5816 said: Harbringer is bad in outnumbered fights due no invuls. Roaming is dead due to balancing around 100 vs 100 only. It wasn't, you were either invul or dead. NGL, I refused to run double Endure Pain back then and was more successful then when I did run double EP. Turned out nuking kitten faster and harder was the better way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawdler.8521 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said: Cleared condis still do zero dps 👍 Resolution didn’t exist 👌 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now