[POLL] So who's gonna try this out this week....

[XenesisII.1540]

NCSoft's newest free to play game, Throne & Liberty, that features 1000 player pvp castle sieges. Class building is done from using two different weapon from seven available weapons, and surprisingly stealth is not a huge part of game play.

They had some interesting thoughts about the castle sieges and sides being taken over by large guilds. https://www.pcgamesn.com/throne-and-liberty/large-scale-pvp-balance

Quote

Our focus has been on refining the underlying systems to prevent exploitation, while still enabling the dynamic, player-driven experiences that make these battles so exhilarating. We are focused on preventing any abuse of game systems that could over-allocate power to specific groups. We will continue monitoring and iterating to ensure a fair, compelling massive-scale PvP environment that caters to our players’ needs. 

Quote

Another aspect that could be a cause for concern regards multi-guild battles, with the potential for big guilds to team up in order to steamroll over smaller ones, becoming utterly unassailable. “At launch, we’ll have caps on the maximum allied guilds that can formally join forces for events like Castle Sieges. This prevents the formation of unbeatable mega-alliances,” he says. “While we can’t discuss all the changes currently, we are actively exploring further improvements. Our goal is to encourage healthy rivalries by promoting intended gameplay, rather than allowing systems to be abused for outsized power gains by certain groups.”

Quote

Preventing any single group from dominating is a complex challenge we’re addressing from multiple angles. We’ve designed a variety of events that allow guilds of all sizes to find success. For example, during Castle Sieges, while the largest guilds battle for castle ownership, there are adjacent Pillage Zones that smaller guilds can capture to earn Lucent and Sollant,

Quote

 Additionally, free server transfers will be available from launch, allowing players to find the right home as they settle into Solisium. Lastly, something we’ll share more details on later (as we’re still iterating), is that we’re also working on cross-server guild vs guild systems to provide ongoing fresh challenges.

Of course can't fully compare both games, castle sieges is a little different than wvw. But I like that they are being mindful about power being shifted too much to specific groups. Too bad that same point of view isn't shared in GW2 where it's really the opposite, just stack moar of everything. 😕

Edited September 29 by XenesisII.1540

[MercurialKuroSludge.8974]

Ppl can like Durian without calling it sweet.
Most of the time its savory when made into dessert form.

Also, no.
Never trust a modern KR MMO, Lost Ark was the first and last.

[Knighthonor.4061]

wow I forgot this was releasing soon. I just purchased this for Xbox. Will try it out

[EDOTDOT.9265]

I lost my sense of smell but durian tastes great to me.  As for gaming, I've actually been starting to get an itch for some more ESO.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

I've learned never to be a company fanboy.  Anet has built up enough bad blood with me already.  

Edited September 29 by Blood Red Arachnid.2493

[Dawdler.8521]

9 hours ago, MercurialKuroSludge.8974 said:

Never trust a modern KR MMO

Most likely scenario: TnL releasing to great reviews but income is mediocre, 3 months later another publisher buys the rights and ram it into the ground with p2w.

I haven’t really kept track on it though.

For GW2 I took a break first with Archeage and then with ESO.

The first was nice at first (loved the boats haha) and turned into a disaster. ”WvW” never materialized because open world PvP and castles was really, really kitten implementation and big battles was just a bad experience. Then another publisher comes in and promises to love and care for it because of course they do… then they destroy it.

ESO was so fumbled by its developers at launch it was a disgrace. The ”EU” server they promised was in NA and they hid that from the community, alliance wars was a laggy broken mess with many features missing and once people got into it proper within the first month it also turned out to be an unbalanced broken mess on top that the developers straight up refused to acknowledge. When population had dropped by like 90% it was like ”oh yeah we might fix all balancing and make an EU server… maybe… sometime after summer… if we feel like it”. And we all know what happened. First 3 months of the game is up, no one renews subscription. Game eventually go f2p but for me personally I already lost interest.

Of course it is all fairly irrelevant since this forum proclaimed GW2 dead when Camelot Unchained was released. I think. 

Sidenote: this pretty much indicated that their ”WvW” will be fundamentally flawed, they’re crippling it at launch just because it’s designed for domination. This is what ruined New World I believe, once large alliances take everything no one can challenge them and the persistent world doesn’t ”reset” in order to correct for this.

“At launch, we’ll have caps on the maximum allied guilds that can formally join forces for events like Castle Sieges. This prevents the formation of unbeatable mega-alliances,” he says

Edit addtion: I looked at some of the newer castle siege videos.... If people like the organized 50 man zergs or 20-30 man groups in WvW I dont see them liking TnL. Combat is just complete chaos where you see absolutely nothing about what's going on because effects fill the screen (if you thought GW2 was bad, it's nothing in comparison). I also now understand why the devs will cripple it, lol.

Edited September 29 by Dawdler.8521

[Anekto.8391]

I am curious about this MMO though i looked at the trailer and i can not play a CHARR so i think gw2 is already winning out. Charrs are simply cool and i like how GW2 lets me do light rp. GW2 combat is really good too. If they fix maybe alliances some more(lower amount of players per alliance basically make it 50ppl max or 100). Then we good.

[TheGrimm.5624]

lol. See this is why I call you friend you maniac.

I keep being tempted to try Durian but all the reaction to it...I submit my pups and kitties to enough abuse as I make crispy chili oils and watch the house tear up. Not sure I could submit them to Durian though I know markets that carry it lol. Now I want a spicy soup, too late for that. 

[Cyninja.2954]

 

Kanon has a pretty good and comprehensive review on the game. He is one of the few content creators which actually has a significant amount of time in the game and endgame experience.

As far as pay to win:"It's a bit less pay to win than BDO and Lost Ark, but it's pretty close"

Considering BDO and Lost Ark are for me personally insanely pay to win, only beat out by the most insane mobile junk, that is all I need to know personally.

[XenesisII.1540]

10 hours ago, Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

I've learned never to be a company fanboy.  Anet has built up enough bad blood with me already.  

I wasn't fanboying, I just like the fact that they seem to be aware of the player made problems of large scale combat and thinking of solutions to tackle it, unlike anet who are the polar opposite and either ignoring it, or willingly promoting it. I wish the views were the same.

Personally I don't think this game has legs and will end up being the same as Lost Ark and New World. The pay to win element always comes back to bite them, gw2 at least managed to survive this long by keeping the p2w elements away from gear and strictly on cosmetics and account upgrades.

Plus there's no mesmer or necro types so that kinda sucks. 🤭

[Dawdler.8521]

3 hours ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

 

Kanon has a pretty good and comprehensive review on the game. He is one of the few content creators which actually has a significant amount of time in the game and endgame experience.

As far as pay to win:"It's a bit less pay to win than BDO and Lost Ark, but it's pretty close"

Considering BDO and Lost Ark are for me personally insanely pay to win, only beat out by the most insane mobile junk, that is all I need to know personally.

"It should cost you anywhere roughly from $1000 to $4000 to get a fully maxed out full power character"

Yeah... 

[XenesisII.1540]

5 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

lol. See this is why I call you friend you maniac.

I keep being tempted to try Durian but all the reaction to it...I submit my pups and kitties to enough abuse as I make crispy chili oils and watch the house tear up. Not sure I could submit them to Durian though I know markets that carry it lol. Now I want a spicy soup, too late for that. 

haha you'd have to get them past the smell, although dogs like sniffing behinds so I guess wouldn't be much of a problem. Had a friend who use to buy durian shakes every time we went out for Pho, I couldn't stand the smell, but supposedly it tastes nice.

☕

[Gendalfs.7521]

Definitely going to play T&L when it comes out to GeforceNOW. Already know that that game will be awesome p2w experience and so on but exploring world hurts nothing and graphics are awesome there.

[MedievalThings.5417]

I've been watching people stream on twitch, it's a train wreck.  In the handful of hours I've watched, 100 people stand around waiting for a boss to spawn, it spawns, everyone attacks once and the server crashes.  Rinse and repeat.  Roughly 4 hours of watch time, cause I don't have cable, and I have yet to see the 100+ people from several streams do anything but disconnect or respawn (and I've watched streams from multiple regions).  People paid money for early access and it's embarrassing.  I guess it opens up for free to play on Monday, and the servers can't even handle the people that paid.

[ArchonWing.9480]

I don't think I could survive 2 KMMOs at the same time.

Will wait for Guenia pigs beta testers

Incidentially, most of my forum posts are posted when I'm doing something nonsensical in Lost Ark or the servers fell apart, or maybe both. Like this one.

  

20 hours ago, MercurialKuroSludge.8974 said:

Never trust a modern KR MMO, Lost Ark was the first and last.

 

The sad part is Lost Ark PvP could have been super fun too; though granted it was destined to be a pve game. I still thought that open world pvp map was funny though people being able to one shot 20 people from offscreen was a bit much. There was also massive salt because for some reason the developers thought fighting over a world boss wouldn't lead to toxic gameplay at all. But what can I expect from the game where people flame each other over gathering nodes.

It seems like Kmmos tend to have great combat systems, but then designed with itemization and progression of people that despise humanity.

Oh, also nerf Durians.

 

Edited September 29 by ArchonWing.9480

[Riba.3271]

I watched some PvE gameplay briefly this week, and it seemed exactly like other MMORPGs so nothing special. Albeit the promising part is that for the streamer the game at release seemed smooth in towns than other recent P2W MMORPGs, so it wasn't only low-quality money grab like Bless Online.

I will probably try it out, but mostly interested in skill system to see if does it use modern eastern complex skill system where you can mix several skills together to create new spells, gameplay lag,  amount of P2W and how must is PvE for the Large-Scale content. If it is just another MMORPG that forces PvE grind offering very little build creativity, not interested. MMORPG skill systems these days should be something similar to Path of Exile where you can spend an hour looking at the skill tree to figure out what to do.

For example since playing Path of Exile GW2 skill system feels quite outdated since you can't change the size of fields, cast range, behaviour of projectiles (outside piercing) or sacrifice something significant for benefits elsewhere (for example -75% max hp but +50% total healing or you can't deal damage yourself but your minions do significantly more)

Edited September 29 by Riba.3271

[XenesisII.1540]

5 minutes ago, Riba.3271 said:

I watched some PvE gameplay briefly this week, and it seemed exactly like other MMORPGs so nothing special. Albeit the promising part is that for the streamer the game at release seemed smooth in towns than other recent P2W MMORPGs, so it wasn't only low-quality money grab like Bless Online.

I will probably try it out, but mostly interested in skill system to see if does it use modern eastern complex skill system where you can mix several skills together to create new spells, gameplay lag,  amount of P2W and how must is PvE for the Large-Scale content. If it is just another MMORPG that forces PvE grind offering very little build creativity, not interested. MMORPG skill systems these days should be something similar to Path of Exile where you can spend an hour looking at the skill tree to figure out what to do.

For example since playing Path of Exile GW2 skill system feels quite outdated since you can't change the size of fields, cast range, behaviour of projectiles (outside piercing) or sacrifice something significant for benefits elsewhere (for example -75% max hp but +50% total healing or you can't deal damage yourself but your minions do significantly more)

It actually would have been interesting if anet had developed some kind of infusion/relic system for specific skills. I had mentioned something like this years ago where maybe you could change a skill from being a single target to a cleave but it did less damage, or change an aoe from ground target to a pbaoe for bonus damage. The relic system sort of plays on that, not on skills specifically but proc on their usage, like using the elite or heal skills, so they are kinda on that track.

T&L looked interesting with the weapons matching for your skills, so you don't really pick a class, you're picking the combination of two weapons sets to make a class, and you still need to choose the skills and passive to use, you don't get them all at once, so there is that customization, but I'm sure there will be a "meta" eventually.

[MercurialKuroSludge.8974]

3 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

I don't think I could survive 2 KMMOs at the same time.

Will wait for Guenia pigs beta testers

Incidentially, most of my forum posts are posted when I'm doing something nonsensical in Lost Ark or the servers fell apart, or maybe both. Like this one.

  

 

The sad part is Lost Ark PvP could have been super fun too; though granted it was destined to be a pve game. I still thought that open world pvp map was funny though people being able to one shot 20 people from offscreen was a bit much. There was also massive salt because for some reason the developers thought fighting over a world boss wouldn't lead to toxic gameplay at all. But what can I expect from the game where people flame each other over gathering nodes.

It seems like Kmmos tend to have great combat systems, but then designed with itemization and progression of people that despise humanity.

Oh, also nerf Durians.

 

Dont you love the Bleed Rune spam from offscreen, but those AoEs are almost as big as the screen itself, from range?

Absolute Condi Fiesta on OW Island PvPs, and its ironically more balanced than the Instanced Arena PvPs lmao

[Gop.8713]

My next game will not be an mmo, my next fruit will not be durian . . .

[ArchonWing.9480]

3 hours ago, MercurialKuroSludge.8974 said:

Dont you love the Bleed Rune spam from offscreen, but those AoEs are almost as big as the screen itself, from range?

Absolute Condi Fiesta on OW Island PvPs, and its ironically more balanced than the Instanced Arena PvPs lmao

lol, bleed rune having no cooldown and being able to crit (so limited to the skill itself) was pretty dumb.

It's basically frozen around a version of the game from a year ago when they stopped caring.  I never acutally played Arena but I guess people can't p2w there so no interest from the player base.

[Junkpile.7439]

Seems just too much work. Build/gearing system looks annoying too. Not flexible at all.

[Dawdler.8521]

3 hours ago, Junkpile.7439 said:

Seems just too much work. Build/gearing system looks annoying too. Not flexible at all.

One of the videos I looked at was basically make a mistake and you’re screwed.

Saw some ”first ever” 50vs50 NA guild PvP thing that just looked… boring. Hold some stone on a hill and just wait for the enemy to attack with more or less chaos. Could literally not see anything what was actually going on, there is no ebb and flow to the fight.

Still haven’t decided whether to bother even giving it a try, lol.

[Ashen.2907]

I expect that I will give it a shot, but not right away.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

From what I heard, it hasn't done well in the Korean market, so I do not have high hopes for it.

[MedievalThings.5417]

8 hours ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

One of the videos I looked at was basically make a mistake and you’re screwed.

Saw some ”first ever” 50vs50 NA guild PvP thing that just looked… boring. Hold some stone on a hill and just wait for the enemy to attack with more or less chaos. Could literally not see anything what was actually going on, there is no ebb and flow to the fight.

Still haven’t decided whether to bother even giving it a try, lol.

I'm sure the gameplay will get better once you finish spending $2500-$3500 maxing out your character. (*laughs at how horribly p2w it is)

Edit: For the confused, there are several reviews up, and the one thing mentioned by each is that getting a character maxed out will cost roughly 1 to 4 thousand dollars.  My comment is relating to that.

Edited September 30 by MedievalThings.5417
For the confused