WvW commanders/guilds kicking non-meta classes.

Voltekka.2375 · March 14, 2019

@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.

Run 50 ranger squad, pinsnipe everyone, win. How have people not thought of this? Engies can pull comms too, maybe throw some of them in the mix? (a certain eu guild comes to mind)Lemme apply that logic of yours : a good scourge will boonrip and bomb 10 people into oblivion, a good FB will heal reflect and keep his party alive, a good weaver will do huge dps, a good herald wi pressure scourges so his squad will have an easy time to push the enemy, and so on. "barrage on push". This is a joke. Barrage is good only for bombing enemy siege on walls.Also, keep in mind that pinsniping comms is frowned upon, as it shows that you know your squad is bad and cant win otherwise. I know people like ranger class, but in its current state it really offers less than other classes. It excels at roaming.

Dawdler.8521 · March 14, 2019

@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.Though here is still the point:

you dont need to be in squad and on commander to do that

.

Infusion.7149 · March 14, 2019

It is easier to run herald or even dragonhunter in WvW than ranger (which needs marksmanship to hit multiple targets with bow) due to projectile hate.CoR isn't a projectile, Phase smash isn't a projectile, drop the hammer isn't a projectile , they also hit 5 targets. If you're using barrage you're better off with Hunter's ward on DH , True Shot does damage in one hit instead of eating a bunch of retal. If you've ever been caught in Hunter's ward you'll know why.

If you mean greatsword ranger, then you're better off with spellbreaker , herald with staff, daredevil with staff, or melee firebrand with axe+shield with more DPS-oriented stats.

The only real non-spirit support you can run is stanceshare which isn't amazing (since you apply relatively short duration in 360 radius). I've seen people that have played ranger all the time in PvE / PvP transition to scourge, reaper, or herald for WvW. Maybe if Moa stance and dolyak stance stood up to Rite of the Great Dwarf and such, but in its current state it isn't that amazing when you factor in weapon skills.

Zephyra.4709 · March 14, 2019

Sorry but this is simply pure negligence on your behalf since you've stated "played WvW before" especially considering the time it takes to acquire GoB so you would've gotten a taste for what meta classes were required/accepted for organised squad zerging yet you still decided to, upon the introduction of a new feature in WvW (Warclaw) whereby there would be evident queues - hopped on a non-zerg class and expected to be wanted in that squad as a soulbeast.

You also stated that you are "plat" in PvP so it only makes sense that there are high chances you would be using metabattle or some other outlier source for a meta build required to be efficient in such a game mode. Metabattle being a common outlier source for builds, includes a WvW section.

Always do your research, no matter the game, patch or content update.

Yes it is common to kick non-meta classes from squads.

Don't think to yourself Soulbeast doesn't have a place in WvW, it does. They're excellent roamers/gankers, great in small-scale and can be used to pin-snipe commanders/targets. Back in the day squads never existed, players were either in a 5 man party or left alone. You can do just fine outside of squad, but requires more situational awareness + positioning.

I recommend to bring a meta zerging class next time if you wish to secure a place in squad (organised or not) that is obviously going to encounter enemy zergs as there is a meta for a reason - some classes do the job better than others.

Hope that helps answer your question.

sephiroth.4217 · March 14, 2019

@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.

Run 50 ranger squad, pinsnipe everyone, win. How have people not thought of this? Engies can pull comms too, maybe throw some of them in the mix? (a certain eu guild comes to mind)Lemme apply that logic of yours : a good scourge will boonrip and bomb 10 people into oblivion, a good FB will heal reflect and keep his party alive, a good weaver will do huge dps, a good herald wi pressure scourges so his squad will have an easy time to push the enemy, and so on. "barrage on push". This is a joke. Barrage is good only for bombing enemy siege on walls.Also, keep in mind that pinsniping comms is frowned upon, as it shows that you know your squad is bad and cant win otherwise. I know people like ranger class, but in its current state it really offers less than other classes. It excels at roaming.

It doesn't matter to me if valid and effective tactics are frowned upon, its a war zone after all.In fact many used to tell me that baiting enemy zergs onto mendon bridge or pang tunnels then fast building ballistas for spreadshot was cheap and frowned upon, but I'll use what ever advantage I can take.

@Dawdler.8521 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.Though here is still the point:

you dont need to be in squad and on commander to do that

.

nerp, you do not. Just follow comm regardless of his preferences.A good person will make do and a better comm will make it work.

Voltekka.2375 · March 14, 2019

@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.

Run 50 ranger squad, pinsnipe everyone, win. How have people not thought of this? Engies can pull comms too, maybe throw some of them in the mix? (a certain eu guild comes to mind)Lemme apply that logic of yours : a good scourge will boonrip and bomb 10 people into oblivion, a good FB will heal reflect and keep his party alive, a good weaver will do huge dps, a good herald wi pressure scourges so his squad will have an easy time to push the enemy, and so on. "barrage on push". This is a joke. Barrage is good only for bombing enemy siege on walls.Also, keep in mind that pinsniping comms is frowned upon, as it shows that you know your squad is bad and cant win otherwise. I know people like ranger class, but in its current state it really offers less than other classes. It excels at roaming.

It doesn't matter to me if valid and effective tactics are frowned upon, its a war zone after all.In fact many used to tell me that baiting enemy zergs onto mendon bridge or pang tunnels then fast building ballistas for spreadshot was cheap and frowned upon, but I'll use what ever advantage I can take.

@Dawdler.8521 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.Though here is still the point:

you dont need to be in squad and on commander to do that

.

nerp, you do not. Just follow comm regardless of his preferences.A good person will make do and a better comm will make it work.

Still, doesnt really explain WHY the ranger should be in squad. And take boons while giving nothing in return.

sephiroth.4217 · March 14, 2019

@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.

Run 50 ranger squad, pinsnipe everyone, win. How have people not thought of this? Engies can pull comms too, maybe throw some of them in the mix? (a certain eu guild comes to mind)Lemme apply that logic of yours : a good scourge will boonrip and bomb 10 people into oblivion, a good FB will heal reflect and keep his party alive, a good weaver will do huge dps, a good herald wi pressure scourges so his squad will have an easy time to push the enemy, and so on. "barrage on push". This is a joke. Barrage is good only for bombing enemy siege on walls.Also, keep in mind that pinsniping comms is frowned upon, as it shows that you know your squad is bad and cant win otherwise. I know people like ranger class, but in its current state it really offers less than other classes. It excels at roaming.

It doesn't matter to me if valid and effective tactics are frowned upon, its a war zone after all.In fact many used to tell me that baiting enemy zergs onto mendon bridge or pang tunnels then fast building ballistas for spreadshot was cheap and frowned upon, but I'll use what ever advantage I can take.

@Dawdler.8521 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.Though here is still the point:

you dont need to be in squad and on commander to do that

.

nerp, you do not. Just follow comm regardless of his preferences.A good person will make do and a better comm will make it work.

Still, doesnt really explain WHY the ranger should be in squad. And take boons while giving nothing in return.

I would laugh my butt off if someone actually said "our squad wiped because that ranger stole our boons"... And believed it.

"oh man a 50 man zerg just wiped 25 of us, we would have won too if that ranger didnt steal our boons".... like, cmon.

Voltekka.2375 · March 14, 2019

@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.

Run 50 ranger squad, pinsnipe everyone, win. How have people not thought of this? Engies can pull comms too, maybe throw some of them in the mix? (a certain eu guild comes to mind)Lemme apply that logic of yours : a good scourge will boonrip and bomb 10 people into oblivion, a good FB will heal reflect and keep his party alive, a good weaver will do huge dps, a good herald wi pressure scourges so his squad will have an easy time to push the enemy, and so on. "barrage on push". This is a joke. Barrage is good only for bombing enemy siege on walls.Also, keep in mind that pinsniping comms is frowned upon, as it shows that you know your squad is bad and cant win otherwise. I know people like ranger class, but in its current state it really offers less than other classes. It excels at roaming.

It doesn't matter to me if valid and effective tactics are frowned upon, its a war zone after all.In fact many used to tell me that baiting enemy zergs onto mendon bridge or pang tunnels then fast building ballistas for spreadshot was cheap and frowned upon, but I'll use what ever advantage I can take.

@Dawdler.8521 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.Though here is still the point:

you dont need to be in squad and on commander to do that

.

nerp, you do not. Just follow comm regardless of his preferences.A good person will make do and a better comm will make it work.

Still, doesnt really explain WHY the ranger should be in squad. And take boons while giving nothing in return.

I would laugh my butt off if someone actually said "our squad wiped because that ranger stole our boons"... And believed it.

"oh man a 50 man zerg just wiped 25 of us, we would have won too if that ranger didnt steal our boons".... like, cmon.

There are much better classes than ranger in a zerg. Ranger offers pretty much nothing of value in a zerg, unlike other classes. You may try to dodge the "what does the ranger bring to the zerg to justify a spot in it?" question again and again, like you do. It wont make the ranger useful.

sephiroth.4217 · March 14, 2019

@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.

Run 50 ranger squad, pinsnipe everyone, win. How have people not thought of this? Engies can pull comms too, maybe throw some of them in the mix? (a certain eu guild comes to mind)Lemme apply that logic of yours : a good scourge will boonrip and bomb 10 people into oblivion, a good FB will heal reflect and keep his party alive, a good weaver will do huge dps, a good herald wi pressure scourges so his squad will have an easy time to push the enemy, and so on. "barrage on push". This is a joke. Barrage is good only for bombing enemy siege on walls.Also, keep in mind that pinsniping comms is frowned upon, as it shows that you know your squad is bad and cant win otherwise. I know people like ranger class, but in its current state it really offers less than other classes. It excels at roaming.

It doesn't matter to me if valid and effective tactics are frowned upon, its a war zone after all.In fact many used to tell me that baiting enemy zergs onto mendon bridge or pang tunnels then fast building ballistas for spreadshot was cheap and frowned upon, but I'll use what ever advantage I can take.

@Dawdler.8521 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.

Strangely enough, Vabbi build site had an "omegalul" on ranger section on builds. Now it explains why you shouldnt play ranger. If you were top dps as ranger, your weavers, necros and heralds sucked horribly, sorry. There is nothing a ranger can do in zergs that another class cant do better. Also do not compare bad players with proper build classes against great players with no blobclasses. When speaking of players at the same skill level, ranger will be always outdpssed, outhealed, outcced. The fact that YOU know how to play a ranger well, speaks for a tiny minority of the class. A mediocre scourge is still more useful than a good ranger.And ranger being top 4 blobclass,i am not buying it. Firebrand, scourge, herald, weaver, fl dd, spellbreaker, healengi, healtemp do stuff better than a ranger. That is objective.

And yet a decent ranger could pinsnipe the tag and make the enemy zerg crumble..99% of rangers are bad at blobbing but there are a few good ones out there that know what to bring and what to do at keytimes such as barrage on the push or knockback shot on the enemy commander or even just tanking up with stone on the push and dropping a maul to WI to instantly down everyone around you for a bag cleann up.Though here is still the point:

you dont need to be in squad and on commander to do that

.

nerp, you do not. Just follow comm regardless of his preferences.A good person will make do and a better comm will make it work.

Still, doesnt really explain WHY the ranger should be in squad. And take boons while giving nothing in return.

I would laugh my butt off if someone actually said "our squad wiped because that ranger stole our boons"... And believed it.

"oh man a 50 man zerg just wiped 25 of us, we would have won too if that ranger didnt steal our boons".... like, cmon.

There are much better classes than ranger in a zerg. Ranger offers pretty much nothing of value in a zerg, unlike other classes. You may try to dodge the "what does the ranger bring to the zerg to justify a spot in it?" question again and again, like you do. It wont make the ranger useful.

Its useful to those who know how to play it. If people are ungrateful for it, then so be it.

Im not the sort of person that dictates what others should be doing based off my own personal opinions, which is essentially what people are arguing over now."play my way or dont plat at all" isn't a philosophy I follow.

A ranger is very helpful to me, I place more value onto those players who are skilled enough to pull it off and encourage those who cant to keep trying.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493 · March 14, 2019

I woudn't worry about it too much. Unless you're built incompetently, you'll still meaningfully contribute to WvW. Having bodies is still really important, and there's a not of niche skills that aren't on the Meta but are still useful.. Besides, it's not like they can kick you off the server, so just run along anyway and ignore all the people who complain. All of the people who complain are just ungrateful.

Voltekka.2375 · March 14, 2019

@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@sephiroth.4217 said:
@Voltekka.2375 said:
@"hobotnicax.7918" said:I see people still don't know how to play soulbeast properly in WvW.Soulbeast is fantastic in a zerg, top 3 class for melee damage in a zerg.I saw someone say in this thread that with a dps meter you'd be bottom? What, the, f? What are you people playing?Melee soulbeast outputs upper mid table damage while still being tanky af and also offering some support, cc, reflects.When I played pure glass backline ranger GS/LB I've been top dps in blob fights so many times I stopped counting.Positioning is key.
Honestly all this ranger hate in WvW is because terrible players come to the game mode and play badly. Yet I've seen more bad rallybot necros, revs and eles in WvW than rangers. But somehow they go unnoticed cause they play meta builds... or are they? How would you know? You assume they're using it, you assume they know how to play their role in a zerg.
Core ranger, I agree, no place in a zerg unfortunately. Druid can be useful with hard cc and heal. Soulbeast is imo top 4 classes for WvW zerg. Again, if built and played right.
Don't believe me? Come to Vabbi, get on my tag and join the revolution.