Please dont release unfinished patch notes

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

On the infinitesimal chance that the devs at anet actually reads this, dont release unfinished patch notes. If your intention is to "allow theorycrafting" and to prepare people for the update, why would you ever release incomplete and false information? Thief isnt touched on at all, and i'm hearing rumors that a lot of the listed changes are incomplete or incorrect. All this does is cause more mass hysteria and prove that communication coming from anet is worthless.

[Konrad Curze.5130]

I suppose they only release the ones they want to hear feedback on. The rest are either still up in the air too early to reveal, or set in stone and dont need to hear an endless QQ

[Solanum.6983]

I'd much rather they not go into details if they want to do a preview, Just let us know which classes are getting changes and in what game modes as well as anything else but no specifics until the full list is ready.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

@"Konrad Curze.5130" said:I suppose they only release the ones they want to hear feedback on. The rest are either still up in the air too early to reveal, or set in stone and dont need to hear an endless QQ

I would be fine with them asking for feedback, but they specifically said "We've prepared a Balance Update that is slated for next week and in keeping with our push to get the Release Notes to you early so that you can theorycraft, discuss and prepare" Anet has always released patch notes without any intent of listening to player feedback.

[Jilora.9524]

I prefer the preview which could change with feedback and add stuff they missed then just a bad patch dropped with no preview. There will be changes from this one by the time the actual patch drops

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

Perhaps, the rumors are incomplete or incorrect.

One never knows with rumors.

[GummyBearSummoner.7941]

That’s how rumors get started

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:Perhaps, the rumors are incomplete or incorrect.

One never knows with rumors.

The rumors are from the dev stream, specifically with cmc who is one of the devs working on balance.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

If a Dev stated it, it's not a rumor.

Also, the post itself stated:
Quick comment, these release notes are not complete and in particular thief has more changes that we weren’t able to get localized for this early posting.

I think many would prefer a head's up, even if incomplete, rather than nothing at all.
As for incorrect, I didn't see/hear the stream, so I've no idea whether that's a rumor or a statement by a Dev.

[Zephire.8049]

And then people will complain about Anet not communicating large changes with players before the change goes live. Again.

The heads up lets people prepare for changes, theorycraft, or hold off on gearing up a character for a week. Usually (all the time?) the preview has a disclaimer about how the changes could change and not all the changes are mentioned. It's not the devs' fault players take a preview and treat it as concrete after being told it's not concrete.

[Shiyo.3578]

No point in communicating patch notes where you completely ignore any complaint or feedback given for the past x months and don't do a single change anyone wanted.You're setting yourself up for failure.

[Astralporing.1957]

@Jilora.9524 said:I prefer the preview which could change with feedback and add stuff they missed then just a bad patch dropped with no preview. There will be changes from this one by the time the actual patch dropsThere may be some, but none will be based on player feedback. In all the previous cases they released balance patchnotes early, it was always only as preview, never for feedback. I don't expect them to change their behaviour this time either.

[JohnWater.5760]

Balance patches should be made every 3 months. Not to happen the same thing that happened with the Chronos and Scourges, they changed for their reasons and now, half a year later, they are coming back with what they took. What's the point?If Anet listened to the community, they would not change the problem, they would solve the problem.Here on the forum and on reddit there are wonderful feedbacks that could save the game, but they keep "inventing" other ways to solve and that ends up having the same problems.If Anet does not change this form of communication, unfortunately, GW2 has a maximum of two more years to live.Have you seen the new MMORPGs coming out in 2020/2021?GW2 without listening to the players will be left behind.

[Astralporing.1957]

@"JohnWater.5760" said:Balance patches should be made every 3 months.Small tweaks should be made on constant basis, actually. Making big balance patches every 3 months (and waiting for the next 3 months to fix inevitable consequences of them) is never going to result in a good balance state. It will just keep moving the meta from one unbalanced state into another.

Not to happen the same thing that happened with the Chronos and Scourges, they changed for their reasons and now, half a year later, they are coming back with what they took. What's the point?You do realize that changes they make don't always work, and usually bring with them some unplanned consequences that need to be dealt with. Sometimes it means, that eventually they decide that a change might have brought soo many negative unintended sideeffects, that it's better just to revert it and try a different approach.When making a big impact changes, it is very easy to misread something or run into unanticipated problems, so the chance of it eventually being reverted is greater.And the point of it is that they now know that their original idea doesn't work the way they hoped it will.

If Anet listened to the community, they would not change the problem, they would solve the problem.Yes, they could use listening to the feedback at least a bit, but you kid yourself if you think this would solve all the problems. It would only help to eliminate the most obvious issues. For anything else, the community does not (and never will) have a solution. What it does have is many, often contradictory solutions, of very uneven quality. Most of whose you would never want to see implemented in this game.

Here on the forum and on reddit there are wonderful feedbacks that could save the gameSome of them could possibly improve the game, but expecting any of those to have a significant impact on this game's future is naive. Well, excluding those that would have a massive impact if implemented. Massive negative impact, that is. Killing a game is relatively simple. Fixing it is a much more complex problem. Way more complex than you think it is.So, please, let's just stop with the "this solution will save the game" hyperboles. They just make said suggestion be treated less seriously than it might have been treated otherwise.

If Anet does not change this form of communication, unfortunately, GW2 has a maximum of two more years to live.While i agree with the premise of Anet needing a better communication, again, making dramatic statements like that only make the argument seem weaker, not stronger.

Have you seen the new MMORPGs coming out in 2020/2021?They haven't come out yet. And my experience with MMORPGs tells me, that any such game is way, way better before launch than after it. Personally i'm not expecting any major changes to the MMORPG market in the near future.

GW2 without listening to the players will be left behind.That i can agree on.

[KryTiKaL.3125]

@"JohnWater.5760" said:Balance patches should be made every 3 months. Not to happen the same thing that happened with the Chronos and Scourges, they changed for their reasons and now, half a year later, they are coming back with what they took. What's the point?If Anet listened to the community, they would not change the problem, they would solve the problem.Here on the forum and on reddit there are wonderful feedbacks that could save the game, but they keep "inventing" other ways to solve and that ends up having the same problems.If Anet does not change this form of communication, unfortunately, GW2 has a maximum of two more years to live.Have you seen the new MMORPGs coming out in 2020/2021?GW2 without listening to the players will be left behind.

It isn't even just in the MMORPG genre, ANet is way behind in regards to communication just in a general sense in the industry. At this point companies like Bungie, 343 Industries, and even Gearbox Software all communicate better than ANet and they are larger companies than ANet. Just the fact that Bungie does a "This week at Bungie" update every week is already better communication, even if thats their only form of communicaiton, than ANet has. Not to mention the devs for MHW, Warframe, and Path of Exile all have better community relations than ANet has had in years. The latter two especially. Blizzard at this point has a better relationship with its community for WoW than ANet does for GW2, and we all know some of the blunders in PR they've had over the last few years and the stupid mistakes they've made. "Do you guys not have phones?"

Take Warframe for example. Those devs have a devstream nearly every Friday to inform players on current works in progress and information on new systems or reworked mechanics unless some other circumstance prevents them from doing so, every week they have streams where they showcase art, and also just play their game and do giveaways. They also have an actual functional relationship with their content creators; just recently two devs from Digital Extremes (creators of Warframe) had done separate interviews, rather candid ones, with some of their content creators and it further showed that a company of their size (which is similar in size to ANet) can humanize itself to its community, and they had actually done that rather spectacularly in being honest and forthright about issues in their game. One of them in particular even talked about how harshly criticism is voiced can effect the devs who read it or hear it, however they also said that they are entirely receptive of criticism and have actively sought it out because it helps give them perspective.

That is how you relate to your community, that is how you interact with them. The Warframe devs aren't perfect, by no means, because no one is perfect, however the fact that they acknowledge that and even take responsibility for their mistakes, publicly on streams and elsewhere, and then actively at least try to do better...that goes a long way to fostering a healthier community and a better relationship with their players.

To ANet, don't be victims of your own ego. Don't get carried away by your own hype. You have a good game here, one that you have been drilling into the ground with neglect, poor decisions, and by not taking advantage of the very things that make MMORPGs what they are and what makes people love them. This isn't a call to ditch any and all adherence to giving things for casuals to do in the game or whatever else people might misconstrue the intention to be, its a call to get better perspective and to stop trying to skirt around the issues and just throw in some new shiny thing to "fix" the problems when you already have the tools you need to make what you have better rather than abandon it like you usually do. Take responsibility, acknowledge that you've made mistakes, and try to do better rather than remain silent.

[Cuks.8241]

@"JohnWater.5760" said:Here on the forum and on reddit there are wonderful feedbacks that could save the game, but they keep "inventing" other ways to solve and that ends up having the same problems.If Anet does not change this form of communication, unfortunately, GW2 has a maximum of two more years to live.Have you seen the new MMORPGs coming out in 2020/2021?GW2 without listening to the players will be left behind.

Wonderful contradicting, subjective and often selfish feedback.Especially when we talk balance, the last thing that developers should listen is reddit and forums. Regarding future additions to the game, yes I would agree that player feedback can be useful but balance, no way.

[GummyBearSummoner.7941]

When is the patch suppose to drop?

[Lumikki.1725]

If GW2 developers want to balance someting in this game, they should play they own game with all different classes in many different samekind of situations. Not just look some statics as what players have done. Then think, players don't use that how we where design or use something too much or too little. Game developers need to understand more deeply why players do what they do. Only way to do it, is actually play the game.

[Josiah.2967]

@GummyBearSummoner.7941 said:When is the patch suppose to drop?

Tuesday

[Trise.2865]

...and this is why they don't talk to you people.

[GummyBearSummoner.7941]

@Josiah.2967 said:

@GummyBearSummoner.7941 said:When is the patch suppose to drop?

Tuesday

Thank you!

[Donutdude.9582]

@Lumikki.1725 said:If GW2 developers want to balance someting in this game, they should play they own game with all different classes in many different samekind of situations. Not just look some statics as what players have done. Then think, players don't use that how we where design or use something too much or too little. Game developers need to understand more deeply why players do what they do. Only way to do it, is actually play the game.

Whilst you do have a point, they cannot be solely responsible for balance. Asking for input from your playerbase opens up the opportunity for a lot more feedback than any in-house testing could possibly grant.

In my opinion, ArenaNet have always balance well. I have been affected by it since the early Guild Wars days and have always found it to be as fair as possible, though I am not ignorant to difficulties that come with balance.

[Bunny.9834]

You don't see thief notes because they are being deleted from the game finally.

[DanAlcedo.3281]

@DragonSlayer.1087 said:You don't see thief notes because they are being deleted from the game finally.

But we asked for mesmer to be deleted... smh

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

Something may...and should...happen with that.