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World Restructuring Update 2

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  • Jugglemonkey.8741Jugglemonkey.8741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ubi.4136 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Spurnshadow.3678 said:
    First off, thanks for communicating that there's some work going on. I just wanted to let you know I appreciate that and the communication, 'cause I'm gonna rag on your post.

    Everything I read is saying that you just got on the job, you're trying to figure out whats going on, you're making improvements to the existing system that was only supposed to be temporary and implemented @ 3 years ago, and you're just starting on the alliance foundation. I think that's pretty disappointing (not in you or your work, but Anet), but as I, and most others were expecting exactly that, no big deal. At least someone has started on it. I guess we'll see something in 2021. All of the info is mostly stuff we already were expecting from 2 year old posts.

    A big warning:

    "Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it."

    YOU CAN NOT IMPLEMENT ALLIANCES WITHOUT ADDRESSING THIS. If you do, all your work and all the faith the WvW community has in you will be lost. This is one of the biggest issues and one of the main reasons why alliance system is being built. I honestly don't see what is so hard about this. If you have OCX guilds, you put them on different worlds. SEA guilds, different worlds. Odd number that not divisible by 3, then you try to space them out as evenly as possible acrross worlds. It's the same kitten thing you're doing for NA.

    For the love of god, don't put out something that is half assed and stop using us a beta testers. We can tell you exactly what's going to happen. It will be a big fail, and people will leave and the people you were hoping to come back, won't. Test it. Test it again. Polish it, beta test it, and LISTEN to the feedback and make changes. Then test it again. Seriously.

    You do realize their last entry was over... 11 months ago right? We are about 28 days away from the 1 year anniversary of any official update.

    Yes, but now they are preparing to actually start work on it...and they have told us that's progress. I mean, Rome wasn't built in a day (so I'm told), so this seems like a good thing. We just have to overlook that it took them almost 2 years to prepare to start working on the thing they announced.

    They really should stop announcing stuff they're not currently/only just started working on. I mean, I know no news is just as bad sometimes, but hype turns sour fast if you're not careful.

    Critical Kit, Deadeye.
    “If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.” - John Steinbeck

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jugglemonkey.8741 said:

    @Ubi.4136 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Spurnshadow.3678 said:
    First off, thanks for communicating that there's some work going on. I just wanted to let you know I appreciate that and the communication, 'cause I'm gonna rag on your post.

    Everything I read is saying that you just got on the job, you're trying to figure out whats going on, you're making improvements to the existing system that was only supposed to be temporary and implemented @ 3 years ago, and you're just starting on the alliance foundation. I think that's pretty disappointing (not in you or your work, but Anet), but as I, and most others were expecting exactly that, no big deal. At least someone has started on it. I guess we'll see something in 2021. All of the info is mostly stuff we already were expecting from 2 year old posts.

    A big warning:

    "Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it."

    YOU CAN NOT IMPLEMENT ALLIANCES WITHOUT ADDRESSING THIS. If you do, all your work and all the faith the WvW community has in you will be lost. This is one of the biggest issues and one of the main reasons why alliance system is being built. I honestly don't see what is so hard about this. If you have OCX guilds, you put them on different worlds. SEA guilds, different worlds. Odd number that not divisible by 3, then you try to space them out as evenly as possible acrross worlds. It's the same kitten thing you're doing for NA.

    For the love of god, don't put out something that is half assed and stop using us a beta testers. We can tell you exactly what's going to happen. It will be a big fail, and people will leave and the people you were hoping to come back, won't. Test it. Test it again. Polish it, beta test it, and LISTEN to the feedback and make changes. Then test it again. Seriously.

    You do realize their last entry was over... 11 months ago right? We are about 28 days away from the 1 year anniversary of any official update.

    Yes, but now they are preparing to actually start work on it...and they have told us that's progress. I mean, Rome wasn't built in a day (so I'm told), so this seems like a good thing. We just have to overlook that it took them almost 2 years to prepare to start working on the thing they announced.

    They really should stop announcing stuff they're not currently/only just started working on. I mean, I know no news is just as bad sometimes, but hype turns sour fast if you're not careful.

    At this point you can’t even call it hype... Maybe for the first year...

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Jugglemonkey.8741Jugglemonkey.8741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Jugglemonkey.8741 said:

    @Ubi.4136 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Spurnshadow.3678 said:
    First off, thanks for communicating that there's some work going on. I just wanted to let you know I appreciate that and the communication, 'cause I'm gonna rag on your post.

    Everything I read is saying that you just got on the job, you're trying to figure out whats going on, you're making improvements to the existing system that was only supposed to be temporary and implemented @ 3 years ago, and you're just starting on the alliance foundation. I think that's pretty disappointing (not in you or your work, but Anet), but as I, and most others were expecting exactly that, no big deal. At least someone has started on it. I guess we'll see something in 2021. All of the info is mostly stuff we already were expecting from 2 year old posts.

    A big warning:

    "Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it."

    YOU CAN NOT IMPLEMENT ALLIANCES WITHOUT ADDRESSING THIS. If you do, all your work and all the faith the WvW community has in you will be lost. This is one of the biggest issues and one of the main reasons why alliance system is being built. I honestly don't see what is so hard about this. If you have OCX guilds, you put them on different worlds. SEA guilds, different worlds. Odd number that not divisible by 3, then you try to space them out as evenly as possible acrross worlds. It's the same kitten thing you're doing for NA.

    For the love of god, don't put out something that is half assed and stop using us a beta testers. We can tell you exactly what's going to happen. It will be a big fail, and people will leave and the people you were hoping to come back, won't. Test it. Test it again. Polish it, beta test it, and LISTEN to the feedback and make changes. Then test it again. Seriously.

    You do realize their last entry was over... 11 months ago right? We are about 28 days away from the 1 year anniversary of any official update.

    Yes, but now they are preparing to actually start work on it...and they have told us that's progress. I mean, Rome wasn't built in a day (so I'm told), so this seems like a good thing. We just have to overlook that it took them almost 2 years to prepare to start working on the thing they announced.

    They really should stop announcing stuff they're not currently/only just started working on. I mean, I know no news is just as bad sometimes, but hype turns sour fast if you're not careful.

    At this point you can’t even call it hype... Maybe for the first year...

    Oh yeah, in not defending the timescale at all here, whatever damage might have been done has been done by this point.

    Critical Kit, Deadeye.
    “If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.” - John Steinbeck

  • joneirikb.7506joneirikb.7506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Counter-point to that, people also complain when ANet doesn't tell them anything at all, and spring a surprise at them 3 months before they release it, and by then too late for input :p

    In that regard, I think it was a good thing they announced it as early as possible, as it gives us at least a (imagined?) window of time to deliver input and feedback before it gets locked down in development.

  • Diku.2546Diku.2546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2019

    @joneirikb.7506 said:
    Counter-point to that, people also complain when ANet doesn't tell them anything at all, and spring a surprise at them 3 months before they release it, and by then too late for input :p

    In that regard, I think it was a good thing they announced it as early as possible, as it gives us at least a (imagined?) window of time to deliver input and feedback before it gets locked down in development.


    Whatever that gets "locked down in development" needs to address 3 Major Problems:

    1. Reduce the direct impact of Server stacking to Match-Ups
    2. Allow friends & family to play together from many different Worlds
    3. Allow Off-peak capping, but let players to work out a solution themselves

    As far as feedback...I'd like to point developers to these comprehensive threads for them to study:

    Sorted by Posted Date - Proposed Solutions to Fixing WvW:

    WvG - World vs Globes
    2019.10.05
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

    Alliance Design That Stops the QQ
    2018.12.09 <--- 1 Year Anniversary coming up
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/62658/alliance-design-that-stops-the-qq/p1

    World Restructuring
    2018.01.31 <--- 2 Year Anniversary coming up
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/26547/world-restructuring/p1


    We should seriously be asking the developers & the community:

    1. How effective are these proposals in addressing the 3 Major Problems?
    2. Does the proposal offer clarity & concise steps on How To Get it Done?
    3. Does the proposal offer a way on How To Guide & Implement Future Changes based on Community Feedback?

    WvW is floundering & sitting around with no clear & solid plan will just lead to endless discussion that gets us nowhere.

    Anet's financial future depends on having a good solid game mode that consistently attracts customers to their Gem Stores.

    Do something - Give Us Feedback - Please stop ignoring the WvW Community.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Diku.2546 i figured your self bumping thread was enough for you to get your point out.

    Why continue to add that noise elsewhere.

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Diku.2546Diku.2546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2019

    Clear Leadership, Concise Knowledge, & Personal Accountability...is somewhat lacking...imho

    Discussions just go in circles while nothing gets done...unless that's what this community wants.

    When are we going to get an update & feedback? Aren't folks curious How we're going to fix WvW?

    Why are we arguing...we have the same goal...I hope...for WvW to get better.

    Don't you want Fun & Healthy Competitive Match-Ups?

    Don't you want ANet to benefit financially by your patronage...and thus keep improving WvW for your enjoyment?

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

  • len.7809len.7809 Member ✭✭✭

    It's really been two years? I mean in 2years, you released wings,new maps,a lot of WvW players left the game. And here we are, waiting for the alliance to happen. Remember Zodin and the guild Zen? They left this game two years ago, and since then nothing has changed in this game mode.

  • @Raymond Lukes.6305 said:
    Hey everyone,

    Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it.

    I realize this is a necro from last year but just going to say i think this bit is a mistake. addressing the time zone imbalance should be an integral part of restructuring not an afterthought

  • @retconned.9358 said:

    @Raymond Lukes.6305 said:
    Hey everyone,

    Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it.

    I realize this is a necro from last year but just going to say i think this bit is a mistake. addressing the time zone imbalance should be an integral part of restructuring not an afterthought

    I would forgive the imbalance after thought... If they would only actually add/change something positively. Give me a reason to fight my kitten off, something to win for. Some competitive gameplay for a competitive game mode, ya know? I like the game well enough, but my favorite game mode is...well, kitten

    Here's to 2 more years!

  • @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Spurnshadow.3678 said:
    First off, thanks for communicating that there's some work going on. I just wanted to let you know I appreciate that and the communication, 'cause I'm gonna rag on your post.

    Everything I read is saying that you just got on the job, you're trying to figure out whats going on, you're making improvements to the existing system that was only supposed to be temporary and implemented @ 3 years ago, and you're just starting on the alliance foundation. I think that's pretty disappointing (not in you or your work, but Anet), but as I, and most others were expecting exactly that, no big deal. At least someone has started on it. I guess we'll see something in 2021. All of the info is mostly stuff we already were expecting from 2 year old posts.

    A big warning:

    "Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it."

    YOU CAN NOT IMPLEMENT ALLIANCES WITHOUT ADDRESSING THIS. If you do, all your work and all the faith the WvW community has in you will be lost. This is one of the biggest issues and one of the main reasons why alliance system is being built. I honestly don't see what is so hard about this. If you have OCX guilds, you put them on different worlds. SEA guilds, different worlds. Odd number that not divisible by 3, then you try to space them out as evenly as possible acrross worlds. It's the same kitten thing you're doing for NA.

    For the love of god, don't put out something that is half assed and stop using us a beta testers. We can tell you exactly what's going to happen. It will be a big fail, and people will leave and the people you were hoping to come back, won't. Test it. Test it again. Polish it, beta test it, and LISTEN to the feedback and make changes. Then test it again. Seriously.

    You do realize their last entry was over... 11 months ago right? We are about 28 days away from the 1 year anniversary of any official update.

    No, I didn't realize this. Someone else bumped the thread up so it was near the top of the first page when I read it.

    The thing is, as the original post is a year old, that just makes it worse.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Spurnshadow.3678 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Spurnshadow.3678 said:
    First off, thanks for communicating that there's some work going on. I just wanted to let you know I appreciate that and the communication, 'cause I'm gonna rag on your post.

    Everything I read is saying that you just got on the job, you're trying to figure out whats going on, you're making improvements to the existing system that was only supposed to be temporary and implemented @ 3 years ago, and you're just starting on the alliance foundation. I think that's pretty disappointing (not in you or your work, but Anet), but as I, and most others were expecting exactly that, no big deal. At least someone has started on it. I guess we'll see something in 2021. All of the info is mostly stuff we already were expecting from 2 year old posts.

    A big warning:

    "Will time zone imbalance still be an issue
    It is true that in the initial release of World Restructuring we are not planning to consider time zone distribution when creating worlds. Part of that is so we can get the primary aspects of the system in and gather data about how the system works given the metrics we are using for balance. We want to compare apples to apples to give us the clearest information. This also will allow us to have a new baseline to compare against modifications to the metrics used for balancing the teams. We also are discussing some other ways to address “off hours” play, so stay tuned for more info as we can share it."

    YOU CAN NOT IMPLEMENT ALLIANCES WITHOUT ADDRESSING THIS. If you do, all your work and all the faith the WvW community has in you will be lost. This is one of the biggest issues and one of the main reasons why alliance system is being built. I honestly don't see what is so hard about this. If you have OCX guilds, you put them on different worlds. SEA guilds, different worlds. Odd number that not divisible by 3, then you try to space them out as evenly as possible acrross worlds. It's the same kitten thing you're doing for NA.

    For the love of god, don't put out something that is half assed and stop using us a beta testers. We can tell you exactly what's going to happen. It will be a big fail, and people will leave and the people you were hoping to come back, won't. Test it. Test it again. Polish it, beta test it, and LISTEN to the feedback and make changes. Then test it again. Seriously.

    You do realize their last entry was over... 11 months ago right? We are about 28 days away from the 1 year anniversary of any official update.

    No, I didn't realize this. Someone else bumped the thread up so it was near the top of the first page when I read it.

    The thing is, as the original post is a year old, that just makes it worse.

    I brought it back specifically to raise awareness that it’s been a year since the last formal update on this. Also, maybe to keep it in the general consciousness.

    And yes, it does make it worse,,

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • wont happen... they are busy nerfing classes with balance updates.... alliance = no transfers = no money. So we have to stick with stupid linkings, an overstacked spanish server and unbalanced matches every week.

  • sostronk.8167sostronk.8167 Member ✭✭✭

    So alliances isn't going to happen at all?

    _We must secure the existence of our Quaggans and a future for Quaggan children. _

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sostronk.8167 said:
    So alliances isn't going to happen at all?

    We have had alliances since launch.
    It's called stacking a server and that's pretty much all it will be in practice anyhow.

    Good players like playing with good players and there are not enough good players to make an even opposition.

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • Gop.8713Gop.8713 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Justine.6351 said:

    @sostronk.8167 said:
    So alliances isn't going to happen at all?

    We have had alliances since launch.
    It's called stacking a server and that's pretty much all it will be in practice anyhow.

    Good players like playing with good players and there are not enough good players to make an even opposition.

    Nothing personal but that's just laughable. Good players like a good gameplay experience, which is defined by quality teammates and quality opposition. Lazy players like playing in the stack, good players run from it . . .

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    May I ask where the WvW player suggestion thread "What do WvW'ers want?" went? Why was it deleted?

  • @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    But given that the initial word came out almost 22 months ago... I figure keeping the home fires lit for the torches is good.

    😁

    22 Months... almost 2 years and they still don't do something about it? I mean usually if you announce something it will be applied like within a year right? Oh my...

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Gop.8713 said:

    @Justine.6351 said:

    @sostronk.8167 said:
    So alliances isn't going to happen at all?

    We have had alliances since launch.
    It's called stacking a server and that's pretty much all it will be in practice anyhow.

    Good players like playing with good players and there are not enough good players to make an even opposition.

    Nothing personal but that's just laughable. Good players like a good gameplay experience, which is defined by quality teammates and quality opposition. Lazy players like playing in the stack, good players run from it . . .

    And yet it's exactly what we have, soooo....

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:
    May I ask where the WvW player suggestion thread "What do WvW'ers want?" went? Why was it deleted?

    That was my thread. To say why would be commenting on moderation and would be against the forum rules.

    Ah, intersting. I didn't check it out myself but was incorrectly told that it was an official thread created by the head developer responsible for WvW content now. What a shame.

  • Kunzaito.8169Kunzaito.8169 Member ✭✭✭

    I have to phrase this carefully because I don't want this to get removed as a "matchup" comment... but the current state of the pairings is IMO worse than it's ever been. Restructuring can't come soon enough and it's well past time for them to update us again on just what the heck is going on.

    If the pieces they have to join are so misshapen that it seems reasonable to pair the two servers with the biggest off-hours coverage to create a PPT juggernaut, and the smallest host with the smallest link with no coverage outside of NA prime to just get rolled every matchup... again, help can't come soon enough. This is beyond boring for everyone who doesn't think karma training empty objectives is fun.

    I've stuck with WvW devotedly for 5+ years now, through all kinds of changes, good times and dark times and no matter what always managed to find something fun to do, which kept me coming back. I'm finally, sadly finding that fun all but snuffed out. We NEED some hope on the horizon, because this... this just can't continue this way. Really never thought I'd join the gloom and doom crew but I'm ready to hang it up with the current state of things.

    Give us something guys.

  • Acheron.4731Acheron.4731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kunzaito.8169 said:
    I have to phrase this carefully because I don't want this to get removed as a "matchup" comment... but the current state of the pairings is IMO worse than it's ever been. Restructuring can't come soon enough and it's well past time for them to update us again on just what the heck is going on.

    If the pieces they have to join are so misshapen that it seems reasonable to pair the two servers with the biggest off-hours coverage to create a PPT juggernaut, and the smallest host with the smallest link with no coverage outside of NA prime to just get rolled every matchup... again, help can't come soon enough. This is beyond boring for everyone who doesn't think karma training empty objectives is fun.

    I've stuck with WvW devotedly for 5+ years now, through all kinds of changes, good times and dark times and no matter what always managed to find something fun to do, which kept me coming back. I'm finally, sadly finding that fun all but snuffed out. We NEED some hope on the horizon, because this... this just can't continue this way. Really never thought I'd join the gloom and doom crew but I'm ready to hang it up with the current state of things.

    Give us something guys.

    Pit of Misery
    Dilly Dilly

    Don't Worry, My Dutch is OK

  • Diku.2546Diku.2546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2019

    @Kunzaito.8169 said:
    Snip 8<
    I've stuck with WvW devotedly for 5+ years now, through all kinds of changes, good times and dark times and no matter what always managed to find something fun to do, which kept me coming back. I'm finally, sadly finding that fun all but snuffed out. We NEED some hope on the horizon, because this... this just can't continue this way. Really never thought I'd join the gloom and doom crew but I'm ready to hang it up with the current state of things.

    Give us something guys.


    sigh

    NA Long-Term Communities that were 5+ years old...gutted by Server Linking.

    EU Long-Term Language Communities that are 5+ years old...now being gutted by Language Linking.

    Bad decisions continue to be followed by more bad decisions.


    Told you so
    https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Poll-6-June-World-Linking-Schedule-CLOSED/page/5#post6197744

    Running dry
    https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Poll-6-June-World-Linking-Schedule-CLOSED/page/4#post6197165

    Self proclaimed Forum experts seem to enjoy arguing with me, but my predictions are coming true.

    Look back over the many years that I've participated here...and my message hasn't changed. I admit that I'm a broken record, but the message & fix remains the same because what's needed to fix things hasn't changed based on my observation & personal insight into this game mode.

    I'll continue to offer feedback that is intended to help constructively to build up this game mode so players can personally enjoy it while ANet is financially rewarded by their patronage.

    Over 2 years ago I could see what World Linking would do & I still firmly believe Alliance Linking will end in the same result of Un-Healthy & Non-Competitive Match-Ups that only encourages a toxic game mode.

    Hope you can hear the message that there's a better Road Map & Vision. We have a wonderful opportunity to create something incredible within the gaming industry with this WvW game mode.

    Don't just Give us something...Give us something better guys.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

  • subversiontwo.7501subversiontwo.7501 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This one was at least posted in as recently as late 2019. I guess the promises about "talking about Alliances in the comming months" after Aug 30th sparked some discussion in this thread. It's funny to see how those comming months are creeping up on 7 now and that half a year has passed in total silence.

  • Ubi.4136Ubi.4136 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Holy thread necro. But seriously, this is what we DO know. The hurdles talked about in the original post are NOT related to actual development of wvw (or alliances), it was server related stuff. They have now told us the stuff they are working on both through Q1 and Q2 of 2020, none of it includes alliances. So, in the 2.5 years since alliances were announced, we have 0 work done on it.

    Even if they do manage to get us alliances when the next expansion comes out, which seems like the earliest it could happen, it's not going to solve any of the issues that plague wvw, from mass transfers to the timezone imbalances of blobs making sure they never have to face other blobs in their play time. People are still going to game the system so that they can win every fight by sheer numbers and continue the endless challenge of hitting doors of houses where no one is home.

    Lost in the Maguuma (TC)
    For the geographically challenged, yes, Tarnished Coast is located IN the Maguuma Jungle.

  • Yuffi.2430Yuffi.2430 Member ✭✭

    I agree that some players will continue to try to game the system whatever that may be, but if Alliances is what ANET originally put forward WvW matches will be different. There won't be any world servers. Just stop and think about that. Guilds will become the building blocks for each match-up and that has several advantages from a balancing point of view:
    1. Guild max population is lower than server max population, so even if players bandwagon to one guild this will have less effect.
    2. Guilds are controlled by players and can admin their population in a way that servers can't. This puts population under OUR control as players.
    3. Smaller building blocks means more opportunity to spread off-peak guilds/players across matches to get a more even population at any one time, so everyone gets someone to fight.
    4. Players in a guild may have regular raid times, and ANET has the chance to include this factor in the match making algorithm to spread the total population more evenly.

    The Alliances (of guilds) system as ANET has proposed should be a powerful step towards fixing some of the key issues that have long existed in WvW. The fact that it should be so useful makes me very puzzled about why it's not more of a priority.

  • tanachiouz.7628tanachiouz.7628 Member
    edited April 3, 2020

    Well I feel it's important to start with the fact I'm so happy to see you take the problems in WvW seriously and are avidly seeking to address it. I'm not writing this post to be over critical or ungrateful but merely to express my point of view and feelings on this. Since day one of WvW I've fought for FA and all along expessed my disgust at the weekly transfer system that occurs every time a team gets hit with a match-up that will be testing or even leave you fighting in a lost cause for that week. For years I've seen people transfer out of these match ups and stack fights elsewhere in what can only be described as a pay to win system THAT is the problem and always is in any game that has pay to win systems. In saying that I know you guys didn't design the transfer system to be abused to used as a pay to win system it's your customers who've created this and it's actually a small percentage of players who are ruining this for all of us. The transfer system must die Sir not matter what you decide or players will transfer. I love my FA I won't fight for anyone else it won't happen but I also wont transfer every 8 weeks just to get back to FA and in so become in game what I truly despise a weak mutt with a win only requirement. I'll leave GW2 . I can clearly see that your idea will create much more balance but I lose the team I've fought for since day 1. I fight for FA because it is FA my guild is even called Fort Aspenwood Vanguard [FA]. I mean what do I do with that now lol. I go fight for a new team every 8 weeks with my Fort Aspenwood Vanguard buddies . It doesn't compute. All servers have players like me who've sat firm even in kitten times in honour of their team. Yeah I don't disagree a lot of players will come back but that type of player base are the same guys who come back ever ex-pack or every major change and then their gone once they get the new shiny and dance in lions arch for a week this will be no different expect for the fact you'll also be losing all server loyalists in that wave and there are a kitten ton or us we far outweight the number or players who are causing this with there weak assed pay to win attitudes . Perhaps you should consider losing them by closing all transfers from tomorrow and for GOOD . Choose a server and suck it up cause sometimes your gunna lose and get steam-rolled. This will be WvW's death knell . It gunna leave players changing teams every 8 weeks and others creating a spider web of guilds they jump between so they can always justify transferring to stack fights cause their in THAT guild that only works if you only ever can be in 1 guild on 1 server 1 member ship only to only 1 guild. Ive been in guilds before where we had members still in guild that where plying on others servers being able to have member ship with multiple guilds and rep your choice allows a web to be created across servers where players can still leave hard match up's to create stacked ones cause their in a guild over there. I can already see holes in this system for those who are not loyalists to exploit. I just don't think this system is the answer. It would actually make more sense honestly is you if you identified all players who have transferred lets say more than 5 times in the last 12 months and perm banned them for exploiting the transfer system and being a sock kitten. You don't turn a game upside down because a small percentage of limp gerbals are exploiting it you ban those that are ruining it or cap transfers per year you transfer once bingo see ya next year or even better scrap the transfers .Personally I'd prefer if you perm banned the lot of these plastic players. Why should players stay who've openly exploited and refused to play the game as you intended . If you've transferred more than 5 times in last 12 months lets face it YOU are the problem YOU did this and YOU should go. Your game should be thrown upside down with a sorry you've been perm banned for being a weak gutted mutt bag so heres a kick in the nuts as thank you for giving us more work as coders to do cause you exploit our structure thanks have a nice day don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya. Thats how you deal with exploiters you don't screw everyone sideways to fix a problem that was broken by exploits you remove the exploit (transfer system) and those that are exploiting it (blank shooting wankers throbbing with pay to win desire). Peoples inability to play in tough match-ups did this it's been going on for years been openly known for years and allowed to continue for years without any mitigation what so ever then this WOW. This is how you fix it you don't close transfers years ago when this crystal clear problem presented itself. No you watch it go on for years while you pocket the 1800 gem transfer profits you line your pockets with the taint of money gained from this exploit and yes ive seen the maths you don't make a lot of transfers which by the way isn't a positive note guys the fact that not a lot of money is made by the exploiting of WvW doesn't make me happier makes me even more angry to hear you've allowed my game to decend into kitten town for very little profit. I always assumed while I watched wvw slide down the kitten shoot you where making a lot of money from transfers . I mitigated my anger that these times by justifying the fact you guys need to turn a profit to provide a service and it's not your fault players are exploiting it for selfish reasons but then I see the maths your not making a lot of profit from transfers so that just leaves me saying wow. You've allowed my WvW to decend to kitten for less cash that my corner store takeaway down the road makes and your a global company ................. wow ............… nice...…….. Certainly doesn't make me feel any better to hear profiteering wasn't the cause that negligence was. You guys have known for a LOOOOONG time that the transferring system was broken you could've capped it YEARS ago and ended it I always assumed profit and the fact a business has to survive to provide a service to us was the cause here so I understood but that's not the case is it. A 12 month cap of 1-2 transfers would.ve thrown this problem into an old tin hat YEARS ago.. You cant expect players to police their own policies that's your job, your job years and years and years ago was to close the transfer exploit loop hole it's not hard the fix is really really simple. 1 free transfer out now to go where you wanna be as long as the servers not full just in case you not where u want to be then BANG transfers close for good and then we got suck it up. All new players go to low servers if the pops not coming close servers and redistribute if that means I lose my beloved FA or we lose a few tiers and you decide to transfer me somewhere else permanently then ill have to just suck it up and be a loyalist on my new permanent server. It's also been obvious for a long time that the stream of new players needed to populate the low servers isn't coming servers should've been merged together along time ago. The expansion you guys where building for in player additions isn't going to happen while things are broken. There's no reason why a game as good as this shouldn't be growing rapidly the fact it's not should mean questions need to be asked of your employees responsible for said growth cause im not seeing a lot of guild wars 2 out there in the world trying to pull players and I get around. What is area net's policy on pulling new players and what are you doing to achieve this these are the questions that also help fix wvw balance along with closing transfers and banning those whove exploited it in the past. It's not hard mate for you in your position to click a few buttons and clearly see who these players are. If they've transferred more than 5 times in the last 12 months they've been abusing the transfer system thats pretty clear ban them close transfers build your population continue adding new player to low servers locking players in full servers and BINGO no coding just tears for anyones who exploited 5 times or more in the last 12 months 5 tranfers from players who heavily play wvw in 12 months would be viewed as exploiting you haven't cleaned the kitchen man till you've put out the trash. That's what this post is about buddy ive been waiting for years for you guys to PUT OUT THE DAM TRASH and its been known for YEARS what's causing it you know it I know it and every single person on this thread knows it. The people who broke it and cause this nightmare to sit before you MUST go weather you change things or not. All gaming companies have a responsibility to permanently removed exploiters. Why has areanet completely dropped the ball here and allowed this transfer exploiting to go on for years and years and years. If you matey only answer 1 question ive asked here that last question is the 1 you should answer for ever person who plays wvw. Why have you at anet allowed this problem to go on for years and years and years and left the cause (transfers) remain open. You've coded to mitigate it you've linked to mitigate it but all long you've left the item being exploited open and the exploiting has continued unmitigated and unresolved. These plastic players would never have transferred if after transfer you had to wait a week or two to play wvw and SNAP problem solved.

  • LetoII.3782LetoII.3782 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Epic paragraph

    [HUNT] the predatory instinct

  • Strider.7849Strider.7849 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 3, 2020

    nevermind.

  • kamikharzeeh.8016kamikharzeeh.8016 Member ✭✭✭

    Alliances when

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Calisanna.8732 said:

    @kamikharzeeh.8016 said:
    Alliances when

    Stardate 45652.1 Cali’s log
    Gw2 alliances have finally been released. Excited, I rush to my holosuite to update my patch. Soon my heart feels heavy and I fill with dread. Alliances, much like the long awaited build templates, cost real life money. Waiting so long has left me lacking faith. I decide to forgo alliances. I’ll use my latinum at the Dabo tables instead.

    The holosuite would have broken down and killed you because the safeties failed anyway. The safeties always fail.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 4, 2020

    Could be considered expansion level content, and now they have announced an expansion, so..

  • Waffler.1257Waffler.1257 Member ✭✭✭

    Chronicles of Elyria had more development than GW2 WvW.

  • HardRider.2980HardRider.2980 Member ✭✭✭

    @tanachiouz.7628 said:
    Well I feel it's important to start with the fact I'm so happy to see you take the problems in WvW seriously and are avidly seeking to address it. I'm not writing this post to be over critical or ungrateful but merely to express my point of view and feelings on this. Since day one of WvW I've fought for FA and all along expessed my disgust at the weekly transfer system that occurs every time a team gets hit with a match-up that will be testing or even leave you fighting in a lost cause for that week. For years I've seen people transfer out of these match ups and stack fights elsewhere in what can only be described as a pay to win system THAT is the problem and always is in any game that has pay to win systems. In saying that I know you guys didn't design the transfer system to be abused to used as a pay to win system it's your customers who've created this and it's actually a small percentage of players who are ruining this for all of us. The transfer system must die Sir not matter what you decide or players will transfer. I love my FA I won't fight for anyone else it won't happen but I also wont transfer every 8 weeks just to get back to FA and in so become in game what I truly despise a weak mutt with a win only requirement. I'll leave GW2 . I can clearly see that your idea will create much more balance but I lose the team I've fought for since day 1. I fight for FA because it is FA my guild is even called Fort Aspenwood Vanguard [FA]. I mean what do I do with that now lol. I go fight for a new team every 8 weeks with my Fort Aspenwood Vanguard buddies . It doesn't compute. All servers have players like me who've sat firm even in kitten times in honour of their team. Yeah I don't disagree a lot of players will come back but that type of player base are the same guys who come back ever ex-pack or every major change and then their gone once they get the new shiny and dance in lions arch for a week this will be no different expect for the fact you'll also be losing all server loyalists in that wave and there are a kitten ton or us we far outweight the number or players who are causing this with there weak assed pay to win attitudes . Perhaps you should consider losing them by closing all transfers from tomorrow and for GOOD . Choose a server and suck it up cause sometimes your gunna lose and get steam-rolled. This will be WvW's death knell . It gunna leave players changing teams every 8 weeks and others creating a spider web of guilds they jump between so they can always justify transferring to stack fights cause their in THAT guild that only works if you only ever can be in 1 guild on 1 server 1 member ship only to only 1 guild. Ive been in guilds before where we had members still in guild that where plying on others servers being able to have member ship with multiple guilds and rep your choice allows a web to be created across servers where players can still leave hard match up's to create stacked ones cause their in a guild over there. I can already see holes in this system for those who are not loyalists to exploit. I just don't think this system is the answer. It would actually make more sense honestly is you if you identified all players who have transferred lets say more than 5 times in the last 12 months and perm banned them for exploiting the transfer system and being a sock kitten. You don't turn a game upside down because a small percentage of limp gerbals are exploiting it you ban those that are ruining it or cap transfers per year you transfer once bingo see ya next year or even better scrap the transfers .Personally I'd prefer if you perm banned the lot of these plastic players. Why should players stay who've openly exploited and refused to play the game as you intended . If you've transferred more than 5 times in last 12 months lets face it YOU are the problem YOU did this and YOU should go. Your game should be thrown upside down with a sorry you've been perm banned for being a weak gutted mutt bag so heres a kick in the nuts as thank you for giving us more work as coders to do cause you exploit our structure thanks have a nice day don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya. Thats how you deal with exploiters you don't screw everyone sideways to fix a problem that was broken by exploits you remove the exploit (transfer system) and those that are exploiting it (blank shooting wankers throbbing with pay to win desire). Peoples inability to play in tough match-ups did this it's been going on for years been openly known for years and allowed to continue for years without any mitigation what so ever then this WOW. This is how you fix it you don't close transfers years ago when this crystal clear problem presented itself. No you watch it go on for years while you pocket the 1800 gem transfer profits you line your pockets with the taint of money gained from this exploit and yes ive seen the maths you don't make a lot of transfers which by the way isn't a positive note guys the fact that not a lot of money is made by the exploiting of WvW doesn't make me happier makes me even more angry to hear you've allowed my game to decend into kitten town for very little profit. I always assumed while I watched wvw slide down the kitten shoot you where making a lot of money from transfers . I mitigated my anger that these times by justifying the fact you guys need to turn a profit to provide a service and it's not your fault players are exploiting it for selfish reasons but then I see the maths your not making a lot of profit from transfers so that just leaves me saying wow. You've allowed my WvW to decend to kitten for less cash that my corner store takeaway down the road makes and your a global company ................. wow ............… nice...…….. Certainly doesn't make me feel any better to hear profiteering wasn't the cause that negligence was. You guys have known for a LOOOOONG time that the transferring system was broken you could've capped it YEARS ago and ended it I always assumed profit and the fact a business has to survive to provide a service to us was the cause here so I understood but that's not the case is it. A 12 month cap of 1-2 transfers would.ve thrown this problem into an old tin hat YEARS ago.. You cant expect players to police their own policies that's your job, your job years and years and years ago was to close the transfer exploit loop hole it's not hard the fix is really really simple. 1 free transfer out now to go where you wanna be as long as the servers not full just in case you not where u want to be then BANG transfers close for good and then we got suck it up. All new players go to low servers if the pops not coming close servers and redistribute if that means I lose my beloved FA or we lose a few tiers and you decide to transfer me somewhere else permanently then ill have to just suck it up and be a loyalist on my new permanent server. It's also been obvious for a long time that the stream of new players needed to populate the low servers isn't coming servers should've been merged together along time ago. The expansion you guys where building for in player additions isn't going to happen while things are broken. There's no reason why a game as good as this shouldn't be growing rapidly the fact it's not should mean questions need to be asked of your employees responsible for said growth cause im not seeing a lot of guild wars 2 out there in the world trying to pull players and I get around. What is area net's policy on pulling new players and what are you doing to achieve this these are the questions that also help fix wvw balance along with closing transfers and banning those whove exploited it in the past. It's not hard mate for you in your position to click a few buttons and clearly see who these players are. If they've transferred more than 5 times in the last 12 months they've been abusing the transfer system thats pretty clear ban them close transfers build your population continue adding new player to low servers locking players in full servers and BINGO no coding just tears for anyones who exploited 5 times or more in the last 12 months 5 tranfers from players who heavily play wvw in 12 months would be viewed as exploiting you haven't cleaned the kitchen man till you've put out the trash. That's what this post is about buddy ive been waiting for years for you guys to PUT OUT THE DAM TRASH and its been known for YEARS what's causing it you know it I know it and every single person on this thread knows it. The people who broke it and cause this nightmare to sit before you MUST go weather you change things or not. All gaming companies have a responsibility to permanently removed exploiters. Why has areanet completely dropped the ball here and allowed this transfer exploiting to go on for years and years and years. If you matey only answer 1 question ive asked here that last question is the 1 you should answer for ever person who plays wvw. Why have you at anet allowed this problem to go on for years and years and years and left the cause (transfers) remain open. You've coded to mitigate it you've linked to mitigate it but all long you've left the item being exploited open and the exploiting has continued unmitigated and unresolved. These plastic players would never have transferred if after transfer you had to wait a week or two to play wvw and SNAP problem solved.

    Next time please learn how to break up what you say so it's not an eye numbing wall of text. :) Just helps everyone else

    A City of Heroes never die... A City of Villains will never surrender... Neither City will be forgotten.

  • Sviel.7493Sviel.7493 Member ✭✭✭

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:
    Could be considered expansion level content, and now they have announced an expansion, so..

    Aw, don't do that to yourself...you know that's not going to happen...

  • Inoki.6048Inoki.6048 Member ✭✭✭

    2+ years, not a single preview, tangible hint or clue, apart from "we're working on it". Sure you are...

    For some time they've been exploiting people's addiction. And most recently Coronavirus, since most are stuck at home.

  • primatos.5413primatos.5413 Member ✭✭✭

    Need more input bibibiblibeeep

  • Super Hayes.6890Super Hayes.6890 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Time to bump this again and ask that tired old question. Any update on this Anet?

    The next time you get angry at someone try walking a mile in their shoes. After that, who cares! You're a mile away and you have their shoes! -Someone with more awesome quotes than me

  • Where are we on this?

  • Vash.2386Vash.2386 Member ✭✭✭

    Any news on alliances yet? cough cough

  • Super Hayes.6890Super Hayes.6890 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Keep at it! There's only five players left in WvW so it's getting harder to keep this thread alive.

    The next time you get angry at someone try walking a mile in their shoes. After that, who cares! You're a mile away and you have their shoes! -Someone with more awesome quotes than me

  • Brutal Augus.5917Brutal Augus.5917 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 10, 2020

    I'm impressed that no matter how many breaks I take from this game you guys have managed to keep this thread on the front page. That's dedication.

    Err...I mean;

    Where alliance patch be???

  • Doug.4930Doug.4930 Member ✭✭✭

    @Brutal Augus.5917 said:
    I'm impressed that no matter how many breaks I take from this game you guys have managed to keep this thread on the front page. That's dedication.

    Err...I mean;

    Where alliance patch be???

    Thats because the true alliance patch was getting us all on the forums to ally together and bump this thread.

    Alliances was never about proper game balance and providing a positive experience for the players who took part in WvW.
    It was about the friends we made along the way.
    -Anet probably