Patch from 9.4.19

I have been playing WvW for years and I must honestly say that what you did with walls / gates in WvW is the biggest nonsense you've done in the past few years. You are thereby making the whole siege system that in the WvW of Guild Wars 2 is an essential content (or now was) broken! With this patch you can take the WvW right out of the game. You have developed a wonderful game from the setup, etc. that also offered smaller servers a good content, but this patch is worth neither defending nor expanding, but that does not seem to matter because the main thing is that something has changed in the game.

It does feel a bit like it's made out of paper all the time now. Anet seems to forget they do not use one or 2 catas/rams. Usually 4 or 5 go up. And of course why not use golems also.

In reality, it means that zergs need to put up 3 less catapults. Your structure was going to be lost anyways as long as people were not too cheap to save 20 silver.

It's 2013 again. You gotta split up :3

Well the logic I believe they applied was that they want to see more fights inside contested keeps. That only works if said keep cant be ninjad before defenders can arrive.

This change would work better with a buff to the lord or the ring timer to make sure defense can arrive and we actually get those fights.

can we delete this thread? there's already like 3 or 4 of them. The changes are great i wouldn't listen to these guys

So trying to take T3 garrison the other day, we breached the outer door then EWP popped and 70+ enemies descended on our 35 man squad. Guess the outcome. Then we tried a wall and was faced with 4+ arrowcarts not to mention trebs draining everyone of supply. Only got the wall to 50 before they wrecked all siege.

Same old same old.

And then we had almost an hour of fighting with all 3 servers inside another T0 keep.

Good times.

If you think this patch broke the game, you clearly havent paid attention to WvW. Because its working exactly like before, except smaller squads can be more effective (not that they necessarily are) and the tiers are overall lower. If you think this makes objectives "not worth defending", how did you even get T3 before? Or did you just went into already existing T3 keeps that some nightcrew made, dumped down 5 AC and went "aaaaah... now this is WvW worthy of my presence!". Objectives by definition is always worth defending because guess what - they give you points no matter the tier.

@"Dawdler.8521" said:So trying to take T3 garrison the other day, we breached the outer door then EWP popped and 70+ enemies descended on our 35 man squad. Guess the outcome. Then we tried a wall and was faced with 4+ arrowcarts not to mention trebs draining everyone of supply. Only got the wall to 50 before they wrecked all siege.

Same old same old.

And then we had almost an hour of fighting with all 3 servers inside another T0 keep.

Good times.

If you think this patch broke the game, you clearly havent paid attention to WvW. Because its working exactly like before, except smaller squads can be more effective (not that they necessarily are) and the tiers are overall lower. If you think this makes objectives "not worth defending", how did you even get T3 before? Or did you just went into already existing T3 keeps that some nightcrew made, dumped down 5 AC and went "aaaaah... now this is WvW worthy of my presence!". Objectives by definition is always worth defending because guess what - they give you points no matter the tier.

I have not seen a single smaller squad. So in fact I have seen separate guild groups grouping up like crazy because they can ruin a structure in seconds.not sure why someone would keep crying about AC fire, I have never ever died to that tickle fire, and I am a shit player.

If Anet's data analysis shows that more fights are happening in and around objectives, then the patch is a success.

I've seen it plenty of times both defending and attacking where an entire zerg is kept from taking something by just a few players on arrow carts/and or other siege. The reason being is because it use to take too long to get through and your zerg's siege got destroyed before you could break through.

And that is why some players are upset about the change to walls and gates. They want to defend objectives with the least amount of players. Now they actually have to put effort into defending by getting more players to help.

Really though, it doesn't matter if the walls are paper or Fort Knox. If an objective is defended well you won't lose it.

And to be perfectly honest, I haven't noticed any change at all with the update. Servers that don't want to lose something will still defend it to their last breath. It's just easier for a small group to take objectives that are not being defended.

IMHO: If your server is unwilling to put in the needed effort to defend an objective, you deserve to lose it.

Why did the op made the same thread in the german forums I wonder.

@Goodandly.2435 said:I have been playing WvW for years and I must honestly say that what you did with walls / gates in WvW is the biggest nonsense you've done in the past few years. You are thereby making the whole siege system that in the WvW of Guild Wars 2 is an essential content (or now was) broken! With this patch you can take the WvW right out of the game. You have developed a wonderful game from the setup, etc. that also offered smaller servers a good content, but this patch is worth neither defending nor expanding, but that does not seem to matter because the main thing is that something has changed in the game.

well now its not only u guys kickin in t3 walls with exploit dune rollers within seconds :3

You need to keep in mind that many commanders and groups without commanders would avoid attacking the T3 structure all together due to the length of time it would take down a gate or wall (especially under arrow cart fire).

Prior to the patch, I don't recall the last time a fight even occurred in a keep in EBG, now it happens nearly every day. Also noticed more fights going on in T3 towers. If Anet's intention was to create more fights in and around fortified structures, then the patch was a success.

I like the changes. It means Watchtower isn't 100% auto pilot scouting anymore because even if you see the red dots you can still lose the objective.

There's more to WvW than zerging and AFK farming. I hope this change gives people a reason to participate in the various other roles like; scouting, roaming, havoc, floating, picking and borderland moms.

@aspirine.5839 said:

@"Dawdler.8521" said:So trying to take T3 garrison the other day, we breached the outer door then EWP popped and 70+ enemies descended on our 35 man squad. Guess the outcome. Then we tried a wall and was faced with 4+ arrowcarts not to mention trebs draining everyone of supply. Only got the wall to 50 before they wrecked all siege.

Same old same old.

And then we had almost an hour of fighting with all 3 servers inside another T0 keep.

Good times.

If you think this patch broke the game, you clearly havent paid attention to WvW. Because its working exactly like before, except smaller squads can be more effective (not that they necessarily are) and the tiers are overall lower. If you think this makes objectives "not worth defending", how did you even get T3 before? Or did you just went into already existing T3 keeps that some nightcrew made, dumped down 5 AC and went "aaaaah... now this is WvW worthy of my presence!". Objectives by definition is

always

worth defending because guess what - they give you points no matter the tier.

Either way if guilds are grouping up like crazy now and ruin a structure in seconds, that just means they could ruin the same structure in a few more seconds before (and maybe would have spent another 40-80 supps). Whoopdiedoo what a difference.

@aspirine.5839 said:

@"Dawdler.8521" said:So trying to take T3 garrison the other day, we breached the outer door then EWP popped and 70+ enemies descended on our 35 man squad. Guess the outcome. Then we tried a wall and was faced with 4+ arrowcarts not to mention trebs draining everyone of supply. Only got the wall to 50 before they wrecked all siege.pSame old same old.

And then we had almost an hour of fighting with all 3 servers inside another T0 keep.

Good times.

If you think this patch broke the game, you clearly havent paid attention to WvW. Because its working exactly like before, except smaller squads can be more effective (not that they necessarily are) and the tiers are overall lower. If you think this makes objectives "not worth defending", how did you even get T3 before? Or did you just went into already existing T3 keeps that some nightcrew made, dumped down 5 AC and went "aaaaah... now this is WvW worthy of my presence!". Objectives by definition is

always

worth defending because guess what - they give you points no matter the tier.

What has surviving Ac fire to do with skill?

Its all a question of outhealing the dmg.

If you are a firebrand, then ofc you survive.

If you are anything else, thank your healer next to you for it.

Must be cool to play on a server with people who use arrowcarts and/or survive arrowcart fire. Guess I need to bandwagon harder cuz anet ain't never fixin population

The Problem is when you play on a server with not much people (elona, riverside etc) and you play with a server with a lot more peoples you cant def a t3 keep because the wall ist open to fast for deffend. this update makes the stronger server stronger too and the weak server weakly too.

it was not too dificault to change t3 keep we make this vor this update with 4-5 peoples every day. this update makes only easyer for the big server the small servers suffer on this patch.

@Goodandly.2435 said:The Problem is when you play on a server with not much people (elona, riverside etc) and you play with a server with a lot more peoples you cant def a t3 keep because the wall ist open to fast for deffend. this update makes the stronger server stronger too and the weak server weakly too.The strong server always win. Thats why it is called the stronger. Thats not a problem, its called winning.

But quite the contrary, the change makes siege more efficient for smaller amount of players so they can help keep tiers lower more frequently, instead of waiting for large zergs to get to work.

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@aspirine.5839 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:So trying to take T3 garrison the other day, we breached the outer door then EWP popped and 70+ enemies descended on our 35 man squad. Guess the outcome. Then we tried a wall and was faced with 4+ arrowcarts not to mention trebs draining everyone of supply. Only got the wall to 50 before they wrecked all siege.

Same old same old.

And then we had almost an hour of fighting with all 3 servers inside another T0 keep.

Good times.

If you think this patch broke the game, you clearly havent paid attention to WvW. Because its working exactly like before, except smaller squads can be more effective (not that they necessarily are) and the tiers are overall lower. If you think this makes objectives "not worth defending", how did you even get T3 before? Or did you just went into already existing T3 keeps that some nightcrew made, dumped down 5 AC and went "aaaaah... now this is WvW worthy of my presence!". Objectives by definition is

always

worth defending because guess what - they give you points no matter the tier.

Nice work on healing the siege

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Goodandly.2435 said:The Problem is when you play on a server with not much people (elona, riverside etc) and you play with a server with a lot more peoples you cant def a t3 keep because the wall ist open to fast for deffend. this update makes the stronger server stronger too and the weak server weakly too.The strong server always win. Thats why it is called the stronger. Thats not a problem, its called winning.

Would like to see some kind of buff for weaker servers, w/e it might be, in the same way as outnumbered works.

Siege disabled.

@yorick.1305 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Goodandly.2435 said:The Problem is when you play on a server with not much people (elona, riverside etc) and you play with a server with a lot more peoples you cant def a t3 keep because the wall ist open to fast for deffend. this update makes the stronger server stronger too and the weak server weakly too.The strong server always win. Thats why it is called the stronger. Thats not a problem, its called winning.

But this is the buff for weaker servers. Get a cata or two or a dune roller and no one would even notice you taking objective behind enemy's back while they are attacking your towers.

Everyone that played in the tournaments and before HoT knows that the most memorable and epic fights happened in and around objectives.

Automatic upgrading, guild upgrades and shield generators made defending too easy and it discouraged smaller groups to try and take a T3 objective. With this change they're trying to rectify these issues. I personally like it because it generates more fights and that's what I hope most of us are here for.

The lingering problem here is that there is no incentive to split up and attack or defend in small groups. In short, to actually win the matchup.

So while I think this is a good change, it's only the first step of many ANet needs to take to make WvW a more enjoyable experience again.

Now you can split an send a havoc group after one thing, while the zerg keeps the other teams busy on something else. AS to the stronger server / weaker server argument. You would rarely see the stronger server T3s go poof before this. Now you do, and they were always able to paper the weaker servers things anyway.

@Luranni.9470 said:Well the logic I believe they applied was that they want to see more fights inside contested keeps. That only works if said keep cant be ninjad before defenders can arrive.

This change would work better with a buff to the lord or the ring timer to make sure defense can arrive and we actually get those fights.

^ This. Powerful lords should be the leveller that weaker sides need - it should be a challenge to capture a keep and a strong Lord should be a significant factor in that fight. On Desert map we get some epic battles because the Lords in the Air and Fire keep are so strong, so I think the other Lords should be buffed to be similarly dangerous. Perhaps his power could improve with Keep tiers?

The walls being weaker leads to more interesting gameplay because there are fights inside keeps again instead of everybody holding a T3 EB keep for a whole week. This said, there are issues around whether it's worth bothering to TRY defending anymore - so I'd probably take another look at the change, and perhaps buff higher tier wall HPs.

@Goodandly.2435 said:this update makes the stronger server stronger too and the weak server weakly too.

That's the most disappointing factor. Arenanet always does that.