To all the "git gud" players out there

[Matthius.9104]

How exactly do you suggest to get better? From someone who broke into gold it seems nigh impossible to know whats going on when you run onto a point and there are particle effects, minions, clones, pets, stealthed players, traps, necro aoe and aoe in general on a point and dodge "key abilities" from other players. How do you suggest you position?

 

As for 1v1s (a personal anecdote) I was in the arena playing against a thief as a protection holosmith. No matter how many times I dodged his damaging abilities i could not kite him or melee him. He took no damage from me. What would you suggest in a scenario like that?

 

If you could boil it down to a few general rules of thumb in pvp combat for 1v1s what would they be? Could you also give some general rules for SPvP?

 

Thanks

[Shrapnel.7249]

I can most definitely sympathize with you when it comes to the particle effects. I contribute to the particle effect pollution, but I’d definitely say it makes it harder to really read the screen, especially when there’s minions afoot.

as for thief fights, I don’t have any advice when using  prot holo, as I haven’t really played it myself. But that is a usual complaint against thief. They get to pick and choose which fights they don’t want to lose and just leave them, or kite away to reset. Hopefully somebody better suited in holo can give you some pointers. I’ll read em too lol.

[Khalisto.5780]

in general to lower your learning curves
 

you read/watch tutorials about your build

 

reread all your skills and traits until you know what everything does

 

find a streamer and watch him play and try to understand what is behind his decision making, what match he's avoiding

 

try to record/stream your  matches  and watch it to see what you could have done better

 

spam your kitten playing the build

 

try to duel the builds you struggle the most in ffa  area or and in a open duel server

 

that's the best way i think if you don't have a person that is better than you willing to teach you

 

 

[Kuma.1503]

I'm in the process of learning how to play thief because I struggle vs them too. 

 

In general, it helps to know how the class works so you can understand what windows to abuse and when you need to play safe. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

2 hours ago, Kuma.1503 said:

I'm in the process of learning how to play thief because I struggle vs them too. 

 

In general, it helps to know how the class works so you can understand what windows to abuse and when you need to play safe. 

This is always the best thing to do. It's the original reason I made a mesmer, in order to figure out wtf was going on on my screen back at release fighting them in WvW.

 

So play each class, each espec, with each weapon they have. Learn their traitlines. Learn their utilities. It sounds like a tall order, but it gives you the breadth of experience you'll need in competitive play.

[voltaicbore.8012]

2 hours ago, Kuma.1503 said:

I'm in the process of learning how to play thief because I struggle vs them too. 

 

In general, it helps to know how the class works so you can understand what windows to abuse and when you need to play safe. 

I third this opinion. Nothing teaches you how to fight against a class quite like playing that class yourself. You learn what you are most afraid of, and what sorts of opportunities you can most make use of on the class that gives you trouble.

As for thief, I'm an awful thief so I can't give much advice. All I can say is what someone else already mentioned - the great strength of thief (or any build that incorporates useful amounts of stealth and escape) is the ability to simply choose not to fight and do something disruptive elsewhere.

[Zagerus.8675]

1) Pace your play. Be deliberate. Invest as much effort as you can.

2) Use everything possible to avoid enemy actions. Use kite spots when it makes sense. Walls, poles, ledges, fencing, boxes.

3) Use the initial match roster card to hypothesize ways a match might flow. Doing this will become more beneficial and accurate as you learn and improve. They have a lot of mobility so home might get decapped frequently, they have strong duelists, we're more likely to overcome mid-fights, ect.

4) Refine your keybinds. This should probably be one of the first things you do but it's something that I adjusted as needed as I learned the game. You don't know you need something until you need it lol. There are several theorycrafting videos on YouTube about it, might check those out. Ultimately it comes down to your own personal muscle memory and practice.

5) Believe in yourself. Don't expect stuff to be guaranteed. Start at impossible and build out from there.

[Cynz.9437]

Play the class you struggle against. It makes if anything easier to read your opponents. As far as thief goes: what kind of build did he run? Was he playing DrD, core (which i doubt tbh) or DE? Ask people for their builds, some may be nice enough to give it to you so you can look what it is build upon and its strength and weakness.

 

There are few rotation videos on youtube explaining general idea of conquest and what do and what not.

 

Play many matches, maybe record them and rewatch them and look what you could have done better (not your teammates because you can rarely control what they do in soloq), if you want to invest time and effort into getting better. Players that are better than you usually also have thousands of matches under their belt. Nobody started to play this game and was instantly good.

 

Particle effects are sadly a plague of expansions (lets make everything shiney and AOE weeeee) and tbh most of the MMORPGs. Can't do much there but deal with it. I have to say though it is not as bad in GW2 as in some other games.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Cynz.9437

[Ragnar.4257]

8 hours ago, Matthius.9104 said:

How exactly do you suggest to get better? From someone who broke into gold it seems nigh impossible to know whats going on when you run onto a point and there are particle effects, minions, clones, pets, stealthed players, traps, necro aoe and aoe in general on a point and dodge "key abilities" from other players. How do you suggest you position?

If there's too much stuff going on on the point, then don't go onto the point.

 

It's a common mistake lower-ranked players make to think that they MUST be standing on the point at all times. This isn't true at all. Sure, you want to be playing around NEAR a point and not pointlessly fighting in the middle of nowhere, but that doesn't mean you have to be literally stood in the middle of the point at all times. If being on the point will get you killed, then don't be on the point.

9 hours ago, Matthius.9104 said:

As for 1v1s (a personal anecdote) I was in the arena playing against a thief as a protection holosmith. No matter how many times I dodged his damaging abilities i could not kite him or melee him. He took no damage from me. What would you suggest in a scenario like that?

Against thieves, the key is counter-pressure. Attempting to "survive" and out-last a thief is the wrong mind-set. They will output more damage than you can sustain through. But, they are squishy. Once they have to start dodging and using defensive cooldowns, that also means the pressure on you will reduce. Assuming it was a typical d/p power daredevil, remember that just because they're in stealth doesn't mean they aren't there. Just start splurging out damage around yourself, and you'll be doing damage as soon as he comes close to you.

 

9 hours ago, Matthius.9104 said:

If you could boil it down to a few general rules of thumb in pvp combat for 1v1s what would they be? Could you also give some general rules for SPvP?

The most important thing in sPvP is the minimap, not combat or 1v1s. Always be thinking "where am I going, why am I going there, could I be using my time more efficiently somewhere else, do I still need to be here". A mistake of newer players is to think "I'm fighting an enemy, therefore I am doing my part". NOPE. If you're in a fight you can't win, or is taking too long, or isn't going to secure you a point, or isn't supporting your team, then that fight is not efficient. Efficiency is the name of the game.

[GuriGashi.5617]

Just dodge by pressing V

Edited September 3, 2021 by snoow.1694

[Disney.7826]

The rules u are asking for are:

1. U cant lose 1v1 to thief

2. Prot holo cant die

3. How are u not plat with prot holo?

[Matthius.9104]

4 hours ago, Filip.7463 said:

The rules u are asking for are:

1. U cant lose 1v1 to thief

2. Prot holo cant die

3. How are u not plat with prot holo?

Idk man. I get tossed around like a ragdoll before I can do anything. More interrupts in the game than i can deal with and so i get put on the defensive backpedal before i can start trying to put out damage

[Fueki.4753]

Just don't bother trying to get better.

The result isn't worth the effort when 90% of the matches are overwhelmingly lopsided anyway.

The outcome of most matches has already been decided by the match maker before the match even started.

 

The low population of PvP often causes platinum players to be in the same matches as silver (and sometimes even bronze players), which isn't helpful for getting better either.

Your opponents are usually far better or far worse than you, so you won't learn much from fighting them 1 vs 1.

Encountering an opponent on a similar skill level is quite rare.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Fueki.4753

[Goettel.4389]

 

[Scolix.4879]

13 hours ago, voltaicbore.8012 said:

I third this opinion. Nothing teaches you how to fight against a class quite like playing that class yourself. You learn what you are most afraid of, and what sorts of opportunities you can most make use of on the class that gives you trouble.

I tried that. I hate thieves/rogues and similar classes in any game and went to try one so i could atleast understand them but the problem is i just cant get into a mindset of lurking in stealth waiting to kill someone when their CD's are used or their HP is low my patience is too low to play something as boring as that same goes to ranger/hunter type classes where i just cannot for the life of me learn how to play one even at mediocre level before my eyes glasses over from boredom and i just log off to play something more interesting profession.

 

1 hour ago, Fueki.4753 said:

The low population of PvP often causes platinum players to be in the same matches as silver (and sometimes even bronze players), which isn't helpful for getting better either.

This is my pet peeve in this game and many other games that i have played and i wish there something to be done for this problem as i do not find any fun at all on pvp when the setting is already a new player against someone who has played the game for thousands of hours.

Normally when i am matched against teams where in less than a minute you see that there is no chance at all and all i can do is be in downstate i just alt-f4 because there is literally nothing to learn when my character gets blown up to downstate in less than second or worse killed instantly.

[Exile.8160]

21 hours ago, Matthius.9104 said:

How exactly do you suggest to get better? From someone who broke into gold it seems nigh impossible to know whats going on when you run onto a point and there are particle effects, minions, clones, pets, stealthed players, traps, necro aoe and aoe in general on a point and dodge "key abilities" from other players. How do you suggest you position?

 

As for 1v1s (a personal anecdote) I was in the arena playing against a thief as a protection holosmith. No matter how many times I dodged his damaging abilities i could not kite him or melee him. He took no damage from me. What would you suggest in a scenario like that?

 

If you could boil it down to a few general rules of thumb in pvp combat for 1v1s what would they be? Could you also give some general rules for SPvP?

 

Thanks

 

Most of those things you mention can be solve by having better map awearness and rotations. These are one of the most important skill people should master when playing gw2 conquest.

 

I suggest looking at AT videos and look at how the teams rotate its a huge help and its gotten me to plat easy. 

 

Things like if your team wipe and you jus spawn wait for them before leaving spawn/home point or you are in a team fight of 4v2 (you being the 4 ) leave the fight and start rotating to some of the other points because your other teammate most likely is or will be outnumbered.

 

Things like kitting the enemy or just running away to another point if the fight is taking too long and the point is capped by the enemy.

 

There so much more that you can learn and practice in you matches from watching AT videso cuz sadly Anet doesnt teach any of that ingame. 

Edited September 3, 2021 by Exile.8160

[Leonidrex.5649]

22 hours ago, Matthius.9104 said:

How exactly do you suggest to get better? From someone who broke into gold it seems nigh impossible to know whats going on when you run onto a point and there are particle effects, minions, clones, pets, stealthed players, traps, necro aoe and aoe in general on a point and dodge "key abilities" from other players. How do you suggest you position?

 

As for 1v1s (a personal anecdote) I was in the arena playing against a thief as a protection holosmith. No matter how many times I dodged his damaging abilities i could not kite him or melee him. He took no damage from me. What would you suggest in a scenario like that?

 

If you could boil it down to a few general rules of thumb in pvp combat for 1v1s what would they be? Could you also give some general rules for SPvP?

 

Thanks

First of all, in an open space, its impossible to lose 1v1 as thief, as you can always disengage. In a PvP match there is a node, and by standing there you win the " 1v1 " by default as he gives up cap/decap and if you SOMEHOW managed to get pressured, you can just kite around ( unlike arena there are places for it ) for most classes, thief is not an issue 1v1.

Sec of all, you wont learn anything if you do the same things repeatedly, change your playstyle, from season to season if you have to.
Play 1 season as prot holo, learn about 1v1 and what other side-noders do.
Next time play nades holo, and roam. And use what you learn from prot holo and 1v1 match ups to end 1v2 fast.
THEN as prot holo you learned from your nades holo, what gives you trouble where good players kite, how long does it take for roamer to rotate ETC.
TLDR
experiment, try new builds and playstyles and through that you will improve in ALL aspects of PVP.

[Silverpoopoo.1476]

The #1 way to "get better" is to play a strong build.

 

I used to play a "just for fun" build that was just something I threw together and I stayed in Gold 1-2 most of the time.

 

Then I switched to a build from metabattle.com and immediately my rank rose to Plat 1.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Silverpoopoo.1476

[bLind.6278]

FotM builds and duo queues to reduce the chance of getting bots/other players not playing FotM builds.

 

They're generally fotm because they're exceptionally strong builds. Having one less player playing sidenode shout warrior every match goes a long way.

Edited September 4, 2021 by bLind.6278

[Disney.7826]

On 9/3/2021 at 4:04 PM, Matthius.9104 said:

Idk man. I get tossed around like a ragdoll before I can do anything. More interrupts in the game than i can deal with and so i get put on the defensive backpedal before i can start trying to put out damage

Sidenode

[Leonidrex.5649]

On 9/3/2021 at 10:17 PM, Silverpoopoo.1476 said:

The #1 way to "get better" is to play a strong build.

 

I used to play a "just for fun" build that was just something I threw together and I stayed in Gold 1-2 most of the time.

 

Then I switched to a build from metabattle.com and immediately my rank rose to Plat 1.

nah thats just gonna make you remain bad, playing overpowered necro spec wont make you better at kiting, peeling, dodging,
It will just make you not die for your mistakes, you will climb but you will remain bad. 
Then you get to high ranks, die, complain that your team doesnt " fight on node " or some other stupid kitten, go on the forum and whine to nerf " insert any mechanic that I dont know how to deal with that my class happens to not have "

[Goettel.4389]

 

[saerni.2584]

Well to the OP's question I think the easiest answer is:

 

You die. A lot. And then you learn how to not die. 
 

You learn the animations. You learn when the prickle on the back of your neck means you are about to die. You learn how to land your damage without over extending. 
 

And you learn how to pick yourself up when you get slammed into the floor repeatedly by someone with a lot more experience (or at least a lot more cooldowns than you at the moment).

 

When someone comes at you, and you can predict what they will do and you know how you want to respond to counter them, that is what you should aim for. In the meantime have fun and enjoy.

It's a game. And nothing matters more than your enjoyment.

[Stallic.2397]

On 9/3/2021 at 2:17 PM, Silverpoopoo.1476 said:

The #1 way to "get better" is to play a strong build.

 

I used to play a "just for fun" build that was just something I threw together and I stayed in Gold 1-2 most of the time.

 

Then I switched to a build from metabattle.com and immediately my rank rose to Plat 1.

That's the spirit! In Gw2, why play for fun when you can pay to win?! 

[Genesis.5169]

Play every class in the game for atleast 25-50 games, use that time to figure out mains its okay if you don't but figure out what your best with, combine that with all the first hand knowledge of the classes you play and that will follow you should armed with the new knowledge to build a traitline and statline that is most conducive to the meta and and since you've played all the classes you have a basic understanding to what to do and not to do when facing them.

 

The rest is a grind.

There will come a point where you become so good you can only improve in small area's and only make small strides like for me, these small things like like stomping and using my clones to disrupt people who are about to disrupt me, using an ambush skill to change my clone targets right before the target dies shatter timing stun timing interrupting time etc.

 

Rome wasn't built in a day no cant you get gud in a day i've been playing for years and i'm prolly just average or slightly above it.

Edited September 5, 2021 by Genesis.5169