A message from a veteran player to the devs: I don't feel like buying EoD

[Obtena.7952]

Weird thread ... like, somehow the devs are influenced not just by people who don't by EoD ... but that ONE person that doesn't. 

[Izzy.2951]

3 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Gw2 started out as a casual game, fractals and raids weren't even in the game just dungeons. It's not surprising it's open world is more casual based, while they've increased the difficulty in the instances for those that want that higher challenge. But if you don't even want to do that content, then that's kinda your problem, not the game, or other players.

I think people confuse this a lot. Gw2 started as a hardcore PvP game, like its predecesor, not as a casual mmo, maybe friendly in PvE, they stated multiples times challenges and hard content will came same as there was before. Dungeons intended to be that hard content from the 1st game, but failed, the mechanics were weird, the team fights were weird upon a point that every1 was running Berseker (at the start they were kinda hard), at this point not even Arenanet knew what to do with their instanced content, so they abandonned Dungeons ( they dont know how to fix them either) and started Fractals, kinda the same but faster and relying on Agony and puzzle mechanics like OP is mentioning, rather than relying in classes, skills to help each other, tanks, supports, dps or actual game mechanics. Also OP is complaining about the stack mechanic that loads of ppl have said its super bad already, or like being static in a world boss pressing 1 when you are selling Gw2 as a fast paced mmo, and other less paced mmo have more movement in fights.

 

3 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Weird thread ... like, somehow the devs are influenced not just by people who don't by EoD ... but that ONE person that doesn't. 

I myself have all the expansions, including cantha. I also played GW1, i think ive given this company loads of money and time to be able to give my opinions on things that i think the game needs to improve, but its not just myself, streamers and lots of ppl have talked about this stuff. I will play Cantha even if its super bad, but it wont change the fact that this game needs to really look at their stacking system, the instanced content, 10 fps lags while opening Guild/Hero panel, PvP content, WvW, new features that will make the game good and re-playeble in the long term. And specially looking at Core Tyria, since its the worst experience a free to play player can get of Gw2, personal story compared to Xpac or LW its ultra low low quality. S1 most of it the same, so at least they dont have that up. 

Edited February 22, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[Randulf.7614]

GW2 did not start as a hardcore pvp game. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone genuinely describe it thusly and I’ve been here since launch. Sure we had an attempt to make it esports, but it never worked out. This has always been a casually minded game with emphasis on highly replayable, long term content. That has never fundamentally changed and is still the case today.
 

I concede it needs more wvw focus and I concede the inconsistent design philosophy on instanced content too,  but the issue has always been a combination of a lack of interest from the wider community in instanced content and the age old debate over elitism and exclusion. I can’t really blame the, for not knowing what to do with instanced content when what players are given aren’t actually as interested when said content is available

[witcher.3197]

16 hours ago, Freya.9075 said:

If this is the case where are your sources about this? And if what you say is true and they cater to gw1 players why did they choose the direction with eod as they did and not just “copy paste” the area like it seems some of the  gw1 players prefer?

Why does the film industry do so many reboots these days that completely go against the spirit of the original? Because hiding your ideas behind established household names is safer and guarantees short term success even if your new ideas are bad. Same thing with EoD. Anet isn't interested in doing justice to Cantha.

Edited February 22, 2022 by witcher.3197

[Izzy.2951]

24 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

GW2 did not start as a hardcore pvp game. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone genuinely describe it thusly and I’ve been here since launch.

Well they basically said it everywhere even b4 the launch, we want to make Gw2 sport with the same phylosophy as Gw1 (which was quite focused on PvP), there was even an interview were they said +33% of the devs at Anet where hardcore PvPers. Also if you look at the game balance it doesnt have any sense from a PvE perspective to have such low health with an ele or with a Thief, but since the  game was balanced for PvP and some "random PvE" (as we got until some polishing with elite specs, it is still is a bit random tho). And after the PvP failed they basically focus on PvE, story and OW.

I would even doubt the game would be like it is, if they didnt focus on PvP that way and removing mana bar monks/supports etc... I think we would have a casual/hardcore instanced content right now if it wasnt for that move. (gw1 didnt had a strong trinity either)

10 minutes ago, witcher.3197 said:

Why does the film industry do so many reboots these days that completely go against the spirit of the original? Because hiding your ideas behind established household names is safer and guarantees short term success even if your new ideas are bad. Same thing with EoD. Anet isn't interested in doing justice to Cantha.

Couldnt have explained better myself /Clap

Edited February 22, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[Randulf.7614]

Ah yes there was certainly a desire to make it esports, but it never really translated into the game and it didn’t start out life as a pvp game either. It was just something they wanted to develop alongside their living world. The difference between GW1 and GW2 pvp scene is astronomical. Even I loved pvp in GW1. Their main focus with GW2 has always been the living breathing cooperative open world and that was the focus before launch - after all, LS1 and fractals weren’t released as a result of in game feedback, they were already in development before the core game was released. LS1 was their true vision for the game, but it failed… miserably and plans were adjusted on that side of things.

Meanwhile fractals had to be adjusted to be more friendly to incoming players and hence the 4 tier system and the ditching of the 3 randoms + boss rotation. The esports tournaments were introduced, but there just wasn’t the interest internally or externally and the game really didn’t lend itself to a proper competitive pvp scene - the skills weren’t set up for it, the classes weren’t balanced for it, the ui wasn’t suitable for it and the visual noise took away from the viewing side of it.

Ultimately, the game was designed to be a casual, cooperative sandbox game, which tried to pioneer a more dynamic environment. On the side of that was a pvp mode which was really little more than a tagged on feature - as is generally the way with mmos.

Whatever failings GW2 has had, it remains in a great place with a continuation of quality replayable, content throughout. Has it dropped the ball at times? I don’t think anyone would disagree with that at least,  but it hasn’t somehow damaged the game to any significant degree. Instead, it’s settled profitably into the comfort zone it has carved out for itself

 

[Izzy.2951]

13 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

Ah yes there was certainly a desire to make it esports, but it never really translated into the game and it didn’t start out life as a pvp game either. It was just something they wanted to develop alongside their living world. The difference between GW1 and GW2 pvp scene is astronomical. Even I loved pvp in GW1. Their main focus with GW2 has always been the living breathing cooperative open world and that was the focus before launch - after all, LS1 and fractals weren’t released as a result of in game feedback, they were already in development before the core game was released. LS1 was their true vision for the game, but it failed… miserably and plans were adjusted on that side of things.

Meanwhile fractals had to be adjusted to be more friendly to incoming players and hence the 4 tier system and the ditching of the 3 randoms + boss rotation. The esports tournaments were introduced, but there just wasn’t the interest internally or externally and the game really didn’t lend itself to a proper competitive pvp scene - the skills weren’t set up for it, the classes weren’t balanced for it, the ui wasn’t suitable for it and the visual noise took away from the viewing side of it.

Ultimately, the game was designed to be a casual, cooperative sandbox game, which tried to pioneer a more dynamic environment. On the side of that was a pvp mode which was really little more than a tagged on feature - as is generally the way with mmos.

Whatever failings GW2 has had, it remains in a great place with a continuation of quality replayable, content throughout. Has it dropped the ball at times? I don’t think anyone would disagree with that at least,  but it hasn’t somehow damaged the game to any significant degree. Instead, it’s settled profitably into the comfort zone it has carved out for itself

 

First, let me point that for content to be replayeble you first need to make it fun/appealing/challenging. If you go to a World Boss and use 1 while you stand still maybe you get fascinated with the boss the 1st time, but its not gonna make content good in the long term and specially not replayeble cos that is boring as hell.

So in conclusion, if PvP sport failed and has been abbandoned (one of their mayor projects), if PvE end game content (another of their big project since launch) is not appealing up to a point people dont bother to play it or have fun. Then what are you left with? counting storys of old gw1 Tyria until you end up milking all the money from your fanbase? that just sets up Gw2 to maintenance mode some years after EoD. And if they dont have any other projects that will lead up in Arenanet dissapearing. 

Edited February 22, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[Randulf.7614]

Except those bosses are still being replayed. Day in and day out in large numbers for years. Core content bosses are still played, HoT events still very popular. In fact after PoF, more of that was requested. So we already know World bosses aren’t abandoned after the first attempt or in fact after the hundredth.
 

I have no access to metrics, but I’d be confident in saying the more challenging metas like Triple Trouble, Drakkar, Gerent attract many less players than say Shadow Behemoth, Claw of Jormag, Megadestroyer etc which lack challenge, mechanics or rewards. 

We have our long term content already and there’s nothing to suggest EoD isn’t building on that. 

Pve therefore is not abandoned. It simply isn’t. There is debate over instanced content and it’s delivery and there are some valid concerns, but open world still has huge amount of replayable content. Drizzlewood alone stands out as the most recent, popular example.

Even WvW - a mode long since under developed with content still attracts full server teams and big populations. And that’s with little investment in it beyond the many year promise of alliances. 
 

The doom and gloom arguments over maintenance mode and a dying game on the horizon have never really held water and we should be lucky that even now 10 years on, that such concerns pass without validity.

Edited February 23, 2022 by Randulf.7614

[Alcatraznc.3869]

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

But now i feel like the games not for me anymore, playing gw2 feels like playing minecraft on creative, i barely die and when i die is when it doesn't matter, dying in open world is just an inconvenience, and danger in story is just an illusion, theres no penalty for dying, the bosses don't even reset, and you can't fail those even if you try.

I dont always die in openworld but to say it is playing on minecraft creative is wrong.

Then again, maybe I would die less if I'm not trying to solo champion/legendary with some weird build .Story has never been hard. Core GW2 story is super easy, HoT is slightly harder than core GW2, PoF is slightly harder than core GW2 but easier than HoT. Living world is about the same as PoF and I guess EoD will also be the same. But point is, the story is there to offer you some gameplay with a bit of narrative behind. It is not some giga brain hardcore mode that requires you min max precision to beat it, and that's great. I dont want story to be locked behind specific build/level that's just plain bad.

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

 then you made all champs in Queensdale into veterans so the 2 level 8 friends i brought into the game had the delightful experience of killing one of those "bosses" without taking damage what a fun event! They droped the game right after btw. And the group content bosses mechanics feel more like a puzzle than a battle, every other major MMO have better group content, im here because i prefer open world and exploration, but if every monster is just a pinnata to me, theres no point.

The reason why Anet nerfed champion in Queensdale is because it makes no sense. This is a starting area for new player and yet you only see end game player roaming around in zerg and killing all the champion with no challenge and getting normal end game reward.  Yes Queensdale was arguably more lively before than it is today but that whole champion thing had to go.

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

I enjoyed the progression of masteries in HoT, but the masteries now require only 1/4 of the XP they required in HoT (from around 4kk xp to around 1kk, and 198 points on HoT to 130 in PoF) and as the ONLY progression system in the game it should be more lasting than that, might as well let us start with everything unlocked. I'll be paying 170 bucks for this thing (in don't live in a country as easy as you guys 29 dolars are 170 bucks here). I enjoy you bringing back the verticality of maps but you keep making the game for casuals, i feel like you make the game for people that doesn't play the game as much, instead of making a game for those who actually play the game more.

Have you considered that there are a lot of player here who dont want to turn GW2 into a job ? While masteries XP requirement arent too high, they requires you some time to complete them and some time to acquire the mastery point. If you want a game where people are punished for not turning their hobby into a job, play Black Desert Online. Have fun getting outgrinded and outgeared by someone who havent closed the game for weeks. 

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

And every old content got easy because of the subtle powercreep gw2 have because you don't nerf strong stuff, you just buff weaker builds so you don't upset anyone and don't compensate in mobs HP scaling, so everybody's damage increase while the world bosses HP stays the same, this way we kill an elder dragon in literally 1 minute (or 1 bite kitten ppl say).

And yet the forum is often filled with people complaining that X stuff received Y nerf. Quite a funny world

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

 

Im not saying the content from EoD is bad, i loved everything, the best elite specs ever, but i feel like this amazing content will just be like i said, playing minecraft on creative, not like i wanna play it on hardcore, i just wanna play it on survival.

Then I guess you can start by deleting your character everytime you die regardless whether it is intended or not. 

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

Im not saying to make the game "hardcore", HoT difficulty was perfect but just stop holding player's hands, they will never learn to evade if you don't make it matter, make consequences for missplays so everyone can improve themselves and have a lasting gaming experience.

Last time I time I wasnt playing Necro, I had to dodge if I wanted to survive lethal blow. Last time I did fractal, our group failed wiped if we didnt CC the boss in time. I would say the mechanic are here and people learned how to deal with them. 

On 2/22/2022 at 7:19 AM, AquaBR.9250 said:

 

Most people here will disagree with me, because they are the casuals, the veteran players are actually getting better at the game not complaining about how hard it is on the forums, and of course they will disagree, you are makign the game for them, for people that can't pass through dark souls tutorial and blame it on the game not on themselves.

You make a lot of assumption without any proof to back up your claim. 

 

[Obtena.7952]

2 hours ago, Izzy.2951 said:

I myself have all the expansions, including cantha. I also played GW1, i think ive given this company loads of money and time to be able to give my opinions on things that i think the game needs to improve, but its not just myself, streamers and lots of ppl have talked about this stuff. I will play Cantha even if its super bad, but it wont change the fact that this game needs to really look at their stacking system, the instanced content, 10 fps lags while opening Guild/Hero panel, PvP content, WvW, new features that will make the game good and re-playeble in the long term. And specially looking at Core Tyria, since its the worst experience a free to play player can get of Gw2, personal story compared to Xpac or LW its ultra low low quality. S1 most of it the same, so at least they dont have that up. 

Hey, everyone can give their opinion. The problem is that I'm not hearing anything that makes me thing anything other than you just had your run with the game.

[Destroyer.7503]

Topic about 30€/$ ? Seriously ? 3 MacDonald.

 

We speak about why buy expansion ? From july (annouce for EoD) it's 3.75€ per months. If you don't have that crazy.

[Izzy.2951]

 

6 hours ago, Randulf.7614 said:

Except those bosses are still being replayed. Day in and day out in large numbers for years. Core content bosses are still played, HoT events still very popular. In fact after PoF, more of that was requested. So we already know World bosses aren’t abandoned after the first attempt or in fact after the hundredth.
 

I have no access to metrics, but I’d be confident in saying the more challenging metas like Triple Trouble, Drakkar, Gerent attract many less players than say Shadow Behemoth, Claw of Jormag, Megadestroyer etc which lack challenge, mechanics or rewards. 

We have our long term content already and there’s nothing to suggest EoD isn’t building on that. 

Pve therefore is not abandoned. It simply isn’t. There is debate over instanced content and it’s delivery and there are some valid concerns, but open world still has huge amount of replayable content. Drizzlewood alone stands out as the most recent, popular example.

Even WvW - a mode long since under developed with content still attracts full server teams and big populations. And that’s with little investment in it beyond the many year promise of alliances. 
 

The doom and gloom arguments over maintenance mode and a dying game on the horizon have never really held water and we should be lucky that even now 10 years on, that such concerns pass without validity.

I Understand your point Randulf, but i dont think you look at the bigger picture of this. People play metas just to farm gold to get stuff or gemstore stuff, how many of those ppl will be grinding if theres no Cantha behind it? Because theres not gonna be Tyria, Kryta, Ascalon, Maguma, Elona, Cantha in the near future.

PvP and PvE instanced content is a base of any MMO in the market (i hope they really do well with Alliances which im not sure). You cannot just rely on making new maps, voice acting etc and selling that content behind Gw1 stablished name, because that content have a deadline, that is already nearly over.

Gw2 had one of the bigger stablished fanbases of MMOs before its launch, and not only that, they did a massive marketing and every little one was talking about it. After that we got that they sold lots of copies and there were less player in 2014 than in 2012, which for example in Gw1 was the opposite there were more players in 2007-2008 than in 2005, because how engaging/quality the game was. 

So basically Gw2 has become a niche game, that with the amount of work/fanbase/marketing it had should be for example on top of WoW (that was never the case). And not only that, Arenanet had around 390 employees and they needed to fire 150 ppl, cos neither gw2 is that popular as it should be neither is making money to sustain a company that big and making new projects. They werent just re-positioned in new projects, just literally fired. Anet needs desperate a new project and draining money from EoD. 

PD: There was also a topic of what are your good old memories of Gw2 vanilla? in reddit, which absolutly no1 could really say good things. Because the game was so bad at start, that literally only wvw was the only good thing it had. I dont think any1 will ever want to see a Gw2 classic ever released, because again the game was uttery bad, and even with lots of improvements its still a niche game.

 

5 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Hey, everyone can give their opinion. The problem is that I'm not hearing anything that makes me thing anything other than you just had your run with the game.

Seriously people like you i think that are just trolling. I mean saying that there are no complaints about the game and everything is cool and Gw2 is doing great in every single aspect, that is just me, its beyond blindness. I could link hundreds of topics but im not gonna show you something you dont wanna see. 

Edited February 23, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[Randulf.7614]

4 hours ago, Izzy.2951 said:

 

I Understand your point Randulf, but i dont think you look at the bigger picture of this. People play metas just to farm gold to get stuff or gemstore stuff, how many of those ppl will be grinding if theres no Cantha behind it? Because theres not gonna be Tyria, Kryta, Ascalon, Maguma, Elona, Cantha in the near future.

PvP and PvE instanced content is a base of any MMO in the market (i hope they really do well with Alliances which im not sure). You cannot just rely on making new maps, voice acting etc and selling that content behind Gw1 stablished name, because that content have a deadline, that is already nearly over.

Gw2 had one of the bigger stablished fanbases of MMOs before its launch, and not only that, they did a massive marketing and every little one was talking about it. After that we got that they sold lots of copies and there were less player in 2014 than in 2012, which for example in Gw1 was the opposite there were more players in 2007-2008 than in 2005, because how engaging/quality the game was. 

So basically Gw2 has become a niche game, that with the amount of work/fanbase/marketing it had should be for example on top of WoW (that was never the case). And not only that, Arenanet had around 390 employees and they needed to fire 150 ppl, cos neither gw2 is that popular as it should be neither is making money to sustain a company that big and making new projects. They werent just re-positioned in new projects, just literally fired. Anet needs desperate a new project and draining money from EoD. 

PD: There was also a topic of what are your good old memories of Gw2 vanilla? in reddit, which absolutly no1 could really say good things. Because the game was so bad at start, that literally only wvw was the only good thing it had. I dont think any1 will ever want to see a Gw2 classic ever released, because again the game was uttery bad, and even with lots of improvements its still a niche game.

 

Seriously people like you i think that are just trolling. I mean saying that there are no complaints about the game and everything is cool and Gw2 is doing great in every single aspect, that is just me, its beyond blindness. I could link hundreds of topics but im not gonna show you something you dont wanna see. 

I fully disagree with you, but I won’t labour it much further. All I will say is you are looking at things that aren’t relevant. People are not grinding just to get to Cantha. The population of GW1 players is likely very small at this point given GW2 has long since eclipsed it and become a vastly bigger game which given the industry has long moved away from mmos is impressive. As great as GW1 was, it was never as big as it’s successor which pulled in a bigger market due to its casual, accessible, replayable style whilst many games were trying to cater to the very limited hardcore crowd. And whilst I do think a healthy mmo needs to do both, the casual player base is by a massive way the biggest slice 

As for vanilla, I’ve seen plenty of people ask for a classic version of it, although I agree compared to the qol features we have today it would be terrible. It absolutely was not utterly bad at the time though. I’m sure many of us can come back with wonderful memories. People left between 2012-2014 due to the disaster of ls1, the pressure of keeping up with temp poor quality content and the fact that they wanted more about the Dragons.

Plenty of People have been asking for new areas and unshackling itself from the past. EoD is the start of that. It takes an area the last of the GW1 veterans still remember and does something new and refreshing. From here it can launch itself in any direction. It’s an exciting future for the game because it can shed the messy story and it can tap into a wider World. So yes, new maps will continue to sustain the game whilst the innovation and quality continues no matter where they are set.

I’ve had my share of criticisms of the game, but for the game to be this good, this replayable, this fun and still have a bright future in a declining market is both astonishing and a testament to the dev teams and the hard work they put into it despite the constant internal upheavals - which have long since settled and are no longer important.

That is your bigger picture

Edited February 23, 2022 by Randulf.7614

[Ashantara.8731]

On 2/21/2022 at 11:31 PM, Izzy.2951 said:

Its not about if its easy or not, its that for example, personal story you can do it AFK [...]

I think I am hearing the lost soul of Balthazar laughing at the distance... Wait..... I think I can make out words.......... "Mortal, I would have whupped your bottom had you AFK'd during our fight at the Sky Garden!"

Oh wait, you said "personal story" - oops! 😋

Edited February 26, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[Astralporing.1957]

On 2/21/2022 at 11:31 PM, Izzy.2951 said:

Its not about if its easy or not, its that for example, personal story you can do it AFK and you cannot fail any mission, even if you die you get revived. So its not about being good, its that its tremendously trivial and not nice to re-play.

And yet we get new threads about how the personal story is too hard on a  very regular basis.

The truth is that the game is designed in such a way that it is impossible to tune a content challenge in such  away it would be satisfying to all (or even most) players. A content that would feel challenging to experienced veterans would be flat out impassable for a huge majority of players - and that's not what you'd want with personal story. It's supposed to be a content for all players, after all.

[Goettel.4389]

Too late for can I haz stuffs? 🤍

[Trejgon.9367]

A message from another veteran player to the devs:

I disagree with virtually everything previous veteran player has stated in their opening post, and I have already pre-ordered EoD.

And I followed GW2 from before they were doing beta events, and remember alot of silly designs for systems that were changed before release. One funny example was character traits - did you know that at some early stage AN wanted traits to be two slots based on your current weapon selection, and then I think like third universal one?

Game was never meant to be hardcore anything, if you got that impression you were not paying attention to manifesto. Yes they wanted to make sPvP (Structured Player vs Player as that's how they called it during that time :P) into a serious esports, but they also were very serious about open world (main biggest change in design between GW1 and GW2) and they were also very serious about WvW. And from the very beginning they were like "we want everyone to be able to find content for them in GW2"

I am looking forward to play the expansion as soon as my PC manages to patch it, +/- some time spent on character selection screen for the main theme 😉

[witcher.3197]

11 hours ago, Goettel.4389 said:

Too late for can I haz stuffs? 🤍

This reply of yours was already cringe and unoriginal 2 decades ago so yes, kinda late.

[Shiyo.3578]

Agree with the OP.  Sadly, Anet is chasing the twitter log into a game and post screenshots then log off crowd and not actual gamers.

As you said, the game simply isn't being made for you(or me) anymore.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Shiyo.3578

[voltaicbore.8012]

On 2/22/2022 at 4:30 PM, Izzy.2951 said:

I myself have all the expansions, including cantha. I also played GW1, i think ive given this company loads of money and time to be able to give my opinions on things that i think the game needs to improve, but its not just myself, streamers and lots of ppl have talked about this stuff.

Like anything else in life, sometimes games move in a different direction - very different than the one you signed up for. The answer is to stop giving them money and find a game you still feel like playing. Note that I am not saying that your opinion is invalid, or that you shouldn't share it. As @Shiyo.3578 put it, 

12 minutes ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

As you said, the game simply isn't being made for you(or me) anymore.

As for veteran players, I've (only) played for 5 years, and I've been quite wrong about the direction of the game at least twice. Thankfully ANet didn't listen to all the veterans like me who hated the idea of mounts. Streamers are even worse. Many of their opinions are highly oriented towards a certain perspective of the game. Take MightyTeapot for instance. He makes massive amounts of gold passively by harvesting what I think is double-digit numbers of paid accounts. While having a second or even third account isn't that unusual, I surmise that the vast majority of players have just one single account. He and other content creators make a big deal about the movement of the MC market and other higher-level big baron business, while the majority of players simply do not care. WoodenPotatoes has very strong opinions on story and lore that most players wouldn't even be able to form an opinion about, due to not knowing as much about Tyria as he does. We don't even need to talk about the essentially nonexistent pvp streamers, what with their suuuper impressive Twitch numbers. /s 

Even outside of the context of GW2, many content creators hype up the value of full-loot, hard core open world pvp type games. Ask Amazon and New World how that turned out. Nobody wants that, other than sweaty streamers putting on a show.

Long story short, veterans and content creators - as experienced and well informed as they might be - probably don't represent GW2's primary constituency. Listening to those groups is not necessarily the magic solution to making a successful game; probably the opposite.

[Gibson.4036]

5 hours ago, witcher.3197 said:

This reply of yours was already cringe and unoriginal 2 decades ago so yes, kinda late.

To be fair, so were "I'm so special I have to create my own thread instead of adding to the many others on this topic" posts, so it fits. 😄