Dear Anet: Condi gear prices are out of control

[yann.1946]

21 hours ago, Ombras.2853 said:

If I’m commanding a Strike squad and one of my dps players is on Marauder, I’ll kick him out without even questioning.

There is an appropriate gear for each kind of content. For story, champ solo, bounties, farms etc, Marauder/Cele/Trailblazer is absolutely fine (even preferred). If you expect to come to T4 Fractals/Strikes/Raids with those, don’t complain if you see people not accepting you.

How would you know? 

And the difference is really small, it seems really weird to kick someone for playing marauder. 

[yann.1946]

19 hours ago, DragonMoon.6098 said:

Apparently you didn't read my whole post. That's ok, I'll say it again. 

There's a reason why I don't do raids or T4 fractals...nor will I ever want to do them. 

You could do these fine with marauders. If that's the only thing stopping you you do not have to let that stop you. 🙂

 

Ofcourse if their are other reasons, or you just don't like the type of content ignore what I said

[DragonMoon.6098]

4 hours ago, yann.1946 said:

You could do these fine with marauders. If that's the only thing stopping you you do not have to let that stop you. 🙂

 

Ofcourse if their are other reasons, or you just don't like the type of content ignore what I said

My main reason for staying away from raids and high-end fractals...and really group content in general, is staying away from toxic jackholes. I get enough of that in WvW, lol. 

[ArchonWing.9480]

14 hours ago, Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

It's not even that much of a difference.  Unless a build is breaking the crit cap while wearing it, Marauder has between 90% to 92% of the damage of berserker.  Build specific considerations like ferocity and power bonuses favor the two builds differently, with ferocity benefiting Marauders and precision benefiting Berserkers.

That's just the start of it.  With banners losing their raw stat bonuses soon, it'll be even harder to crit cap.  Full berserker builds will start equipping accuracy sigils and swapping more and more pieces over to assassin's gear.  Marauders already has a natural 10% crit chance higher than berserkers, so it'll gain the benefits of keeping the impact sigils.  Remember that weapon strength varies by 10%, so a good marauder player is nigh indistinguishable from a berserker player on the DPS meters.  

 

Yea I was thinking more about toons that cap crit of which marauders would be truly suboptimal for, but now that you bring it up, it's probably not even worth considering.

Ironically, Valk could be a thing lol (especially in fractals where it's easier to cap). Wonder if they boot for that.

[Dante.1508]

13 hours ago, yann.1946 said:

And this is objectively wrong, the exact opposite is true. Most people in the raiding community won't kick you for subpar gear. 

 

(Ofcourse if somebody takes over the tanking because they have more toughness then the tank it becomes problematic, but then it's more about communication then anything else.) 

 

I am coriuous why you claim raids are unpopular because of a lie. Is there no true statement you can give to say they are unpopular? 

If they are so popular why does only a tiny percentage of the community do them.

[Linken.6345]

9 minutes ago, Dante.1508 said:

If they are so popular why does only a tiny percentage of the community do them.

Because only a tiny % ever do harder content.

If you check at dollar spent on content raids and fractals are probabely the most bang per buck over the years.

Raiders have been running wing 1 for how many years now?

[Dante.1508]

21 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Because only a tiny % ever do harder content.

If you check at dollar spent on content raids and fractals are probabely the most bang per buck over the years.

Raiders have been running wing 1 for how many years now?

Which is why 90% of the rest of us avoid them. Harder content is not fun for the majority.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

8 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Yea I was thinking more about toons that cap crit of which marauders would be truly suboptimal for, but now that you bring it up, it's probably not even worth considering.

Ironically, Valk could be a thing lol (especially in fractals where it's easier to cap). Wonder if they boot for that.

Well, if the point is to get extra vitality to help stay alive, then a mixture of Dragon's and Marauder would do the trick.  The 4-stat combinations have more total points than the 3-stat ones, so it is usually more efficient to pick those for buildcraft.  

[yann.1946]

6 hours ago, Dante.1508 said:

If they are so popular why does only a tiny percentage of the community do them.

I never said they where popular, I said that raids are not filled with toxic people for the most part. 

 

The funny thing is, if I take your word for it that raids are unpopular because they get perceived as toxic, then funnily enough the people who caused the unpopularity are players like you, who spread either ignorantly or willingly the lie that they are filled with toxic people.

Edited April 24, 2022 by yann.1946
fixed a weird sentence

[DarcShriek.5829]

On 4/23/2022 at 7:00 AM, yann.1946 said:

How would you know? 

And the difference is really small, it seems really weird to kick someone for playing marauder. 

It's not wierd when you realize how little the people with commander tags know about how to play GW2.  Many of them just don't get it.  That's why they need the cookie cutter builds.

[ArchonWing.9480]

15 hours ago, yann.1946 said:

I never said they where popular, I said that raids are not filled with toxic people for the most part. 

 

The funny thing is, if I take your word for it that raids are unpopular because they get perceived as toxic, then funnily enough the people who caused the unpopularity are players like you, who spread either ignorantly or willingly the lie that they are filled with toxic people.

Nah, raiders are the toxic people. Defintely not the people that spew constant negativity and slander  people that aren't here to defend themselves.

I mean, I have a lot of negative posts myself, but unlike some people I know there are those that enjoy the game and there is no need to rain on their parade. 

Without going much in detail, I have  had the misfortune to encounter some very familar vocal personalities in game and honestly it is no surprise nobody wants to play with them. It is not a skill thing. I don't even know if they actually play the game.

I can say without a doubt that I have helped improve someone's experience every now and then. When was the last time you (the reader, not neccessarily anyone in particular) have done the same? 

Edited April 24, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480

[Xerxez.7361]

On 4/23/2022 at 7:00 AM, yann.1946 said:

How would you know? 

And the difference is really small, it seems really weird to kick someone for playing marauder. 

 

There's no real way to check another players gear, but if they are dealing less damage than the Healer of the group it becomes apparent that somethings off with their build. Arc DPS shows you each individual's DPS during the fight.

[ArchonWing.9480]

13 minutes ago, Xerxez.7361 said:

 

There's no real way to check another players gear, but if they are dealing less damage than the Healer of the group it becomes apparent that somethings off with their build. Arc DPS shows you each individual's DPS during the fight.

Yea but if someone is doing sub-healer dps that isn't because they have marauder. They either have the wrong build, wrong rotation, or are afk. Or some combo of the above.

Also if the fight goes south, everyone's numbers are going to be bad due to well, death.

I don't ever think I have seen anyone know mechanics and have potato dps, honestly.  

Edited April 24, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480

[Linken.6345]

39 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Yea but if someone is doing sub-healer dps that isn't because they have marauder. They either have the wrong build, wrong rotation, or are afk. Or some combo of the above.

Also if the fight goes south, everyone's numbers are going to be bad due to well, death.

I don't ever think I have seen anyone know mechanics and have potato dps, honestly.  

Then start playing with more all welcome groups and you will see a ton of them.

[ArchonWing.9480]

1 hour ago, Linken.6345 said:

Then start playing with more all welcome groups and you will see a ton of them.

I never said anythng about problems joining groups. Edit: nvm, ignore. I misread.

But...

We were talking about zerker vs marauder and how someone doing sub healer dps isn't conclusive of them running it.  In fact it is more likely they aren't.

Edited April 24, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480

[DragonMoon.6098]

16 hours ago, DarcShriek.5829 said:

It's not wierd when you realize how little the people with commander tags know about how to play GW2.  Many of them just don't get it.  That's why they need the cookie cutter builds.

I was following a tag through Palawadan last night and they had no flipping clue what they were doing. Spent so much time flitting around not following the meta steps that the ships didn't spawn soon enough, which in turn caused us to run out of time on Iberu. 

Anybody with 300g can buy a Commander tag, right? 

Moral of the story...don't tag up unless you know the ins and outs of what you're doing. Because people will follow you right off whatever cliff you're on. 

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

9 pages and I've still yet to see any reasonable argumentation as to why Power DPS gets to be cheap and easy to gear while cDPS gets to be 3-4x the price with Viper's and runes.

[DragonMoon.6098]

52 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

9 pages and I've still yet to see any reasonable argumentation as to why Power DPS gets to be cheap and easy to gear while cDPS gets to be 3-4x the price with Viper's and runes.

It's because the materials needed for Condi-based gear are more expensive. From what I can see...most of the cost is in the leather (if crafting medium gear) and flax seeds. The black diamonds aren't that bad in price and you don't need a crazy number of them. And Trailblazer gear is even more expensive to make when you consider the need for Maguuma Lilies and Charged Quartz on top of ridiculous T6 leather. 

My recommendation would be to get stat select armor from VB...or craft your own stat select gear from Warbeast recipes. They are way cheaper to make, though you can't sell it...so just make it for yourself. 

Edited April 25, 2022 by DragonMoon.6098

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

54 minutes ago, DragonMoon.6098 said:

It's because the materials needed for Condi-based gear are more expensive. From what I can see...most of the cost is in the leather (if crafting medium gear) and flax seeds. The black diamonds aren't that bad in price and you don't need a crazy number of them. And Trailblazer gear is even more expensive to make when you consider the need for Maguuma Lilies and Charged Quartz on top of ridiculous T6 leather.

Yes, that's the practical reason why but I want an actual justifiable reason why condition DPS set ups have to be more expensive/more difficult to acquire in exotics when starting from nothing while power DPS slaps on Thief/Scholar runes with force/impact/accuracy  in berserker/assassins and calls it a day.

 

Quote

My recommendation would be to get stat select armor from VB...or craft your own stat select gear from Warbeast recipes. They are way cheaper to make, though you can't sell it...so just make it for yourself. 

Warbeast recipes require PoF farming.  Berserker/assassin gear being core stats are simply discoverable manually crafting and Berserker even has a cheap heavy, medium, and light armor set to go with it.

[DragonMoon.6098]

7 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Yes, that's the practical reason why but I want an actual justifiable reason why condition DPS set ups have to be more expensive/more difficult to acquire in exotics when starting from nothing while power DPS slaps on Thief/Scholar runes with force/impact/accuracy  in berserker/assassins and calls it a day.

...so people should make the armor and lose money selling it?

[Khisanth.2948]

2 hours ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

9 pages and I've still yet to see any reasonable argumentation as to why Power DPS gets to be cheap and easy to gear while cDPS gets to be 3-4x the price with Viper's and runes.

because  that claim is wrong

The actual issue isn't condi gear is more expensive. It is crafting being a lot more expensive than items obtainable as drops.

A better way to have started this thread would be "Expansion content should drop gear with their respective stats".

Some people in this thread have jokingly(I assume) suggested increasing the price of power gear. That might actually come true in when the banner rework happens because it will require more Assassin's pieces to crit cap. Assassin's also requires either crafting or stat selectable gear. I guess we'll see in a month or two. Although it also doesn't matter at the ascended level.

[Ombras.2853]

20 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Yea but if someone is doing sub-healer dps that isn't because they have marauder. They either have the wrong build, wrong rotation, or are afk. Or some combo of the above.

Also if the fight goes south, everyone's numbers are going to be bad due to well, death.

I don't ever think I have seen anyone know mechanics and have potato dps, honestly.  

Marauder IS wrong build, that’s the point.

Don’t hold other people in the group down because you cannot dodge or position yourself.

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

22 minutes ago, Khisanth.2948 said:

because  that claim is wrong

It's not.  maths, it takes either more time or more materials & Gold to get exotic tier gear for condition DPS than it would to get exotic tier gear for power DPS.  Berserker's and Assassin's has the added benefit of being core stats so both can be acquired on the cheap.

As of this post:
Full exotic Vipers Via Crafting is 126 gold: https://gw2efficiency.com/crafting/calculator/a~0!b~1!c~0!d~1-76756;1-73959;1-71768;1-71073;1-71075;1-71794;1-74101;1-74671;1-75779;2-71654;1-73962;2-76704

Full exotic berserker's is 52 gold: https://gw2efficiency.com/crafting/calculator/a~0!b~1!c~0!d~1-15433;1-14493;1-15475;1-11103;1-11145;1-11187;1-11229;1-11271;1-11348;2-13417;1-13459;2-13501
Even with Sigils and Runes, it's still not quite enough:
Force+Impact = 10g 28s 72c buy | 12g 01s 78c sell
Scholar = 26g 76s 18c buy |  33g 47s 88c sell
Thief = 10g 99s 02c buy | 13g 97s 64c sell
making the total value ~73g to ~95g 50s . 

But hey, that ignores the perfectly valid Devona's (Heavy), Nika's (Medium), and Zhed's (Light) berserker armor that goes for even less than the crafted set.
 

Quote

The actual issue isn't condi gear is more expensive. It is crafting being a lot more expensive than items obtainable as drops.

A better way to have started this thread would be "Expansion content should drop gear with their respective stats".

Named exotic armors in the vein of Devona's/Nika's/Zhed's that have the expansion attributes and drop from the expansion content would've been great.
 

Quote

Some people in this thread have jokingly(I assume) suggested increasing the price of power gear. That might actually come true in when the banner rework happens because it will require more Assassin's pieces to crit cap. Assassin's also requires either crafting or stat selectable gear. I guess we'll see in a month or two. Although it also doesn't matter at the ascended level.

Assassin's is made out of the cheapest (As of this post) t6 material available.  The major cost comes from the leather+ectoplasm used to make the insignias and the wood+orichalcum & ectoplasm to make the inscriptions.  And full exotic assassin's crafted is about the same cost as berserker gear.

[Khisanth.2948]

I have no horse in this race. I am just pointing out that making false claims or half truth(because it is ignoring other factors) at best in an argumentative style is not great way to gain support.

[ArchonWing.9480]

1 hour ago, Ombras.2853 said:

Marauder IS wrong build, that’s the point.

 

I already know that and nobody in this thread said it was right. I just find the hillariously smug attitude towards booting people  to be pretty worthy of mockery.

Edited April 25, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480