support too strong

[felix.2386]

support stronger then wb and harb.

way too hard to kill, while res utility effect is too strongly felt, it has stronger snowball potential then even wb/harb

in plat game, a wb or a harb less is no big deal, but a team without a support and team with one, the difference is day and night and win against a team with support is incredibly hard if not impossible within similar skill bracket.

also supports allows zerg snowballing, which is basically impossible to break the snowball now.

because even support are some what slow(not so much), people can run back to the support so fast

now i think about it that's why specter(tho being a strong class on its own) is still meta, one of the reason is to stop the rez.

 

Edited June 6, 2022 by felix.2386

[Tycura.1982]

I disagree

[felix.2386]

2 minutes ago, Tycura.1982 said:

I disagree

and i disagree with you

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

You appear to have reached an impasse, goodfellows.

Let's stir the pot:

 

Support too strong? Or damage too weak?

[SlipLihte.1307]

Either way, the answer is to nerf core engi.

[SlayerXX.7138]

Just split for side nodes? Works good enough for me.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

You appear to have reached an impasse, goodfellows.

Let's stir the pot:

 

Support too strong? Or damage too weak?

Obviously all boon removal skills need to have their damage removed. After all removing a boon is it's own reward.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

2 hours ago, Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

Support too strong? Or damage too weak?

TTK is fine, it doesnt need to be shorter. What isnt fine is having to do 100k damage to down someone only to have them get rezzed instantly.

[Tescao.3042]

Remove from poison -healing reduction for new DoT -disease - 50% healing reduction that will be applied after poison cleans for counter games with resistance and for more pressure on sustain? The most important thing in this is to leave the identity to certain classes. I already wrote about bloody fields and changes in bleeding. Void fields - boons removal. Well most importantly 5vs5 is very limited.

[Downstate.4697]

Well I mean spectre supports without even trying to support. Also, besides spectre, supports are having a hard time keeping up with the pace of dps professions.

Whats really missing is meta builds that rip boons. If spellbreaker had better damage mitigation it would thrive in this meta.

I also want to put this out there; condi spectre can shut down a tempest

[Curennos.9307]

34 minutes ago, FrownyClown.8402 said:

 

I also want to put this out there; condi spectre can shut down a tempest

How? Aside from siphoning their overloads.

 

Genuinely asking, sounds interesting. I've had some fun with support specter and have managed to 2v2 tempest + DPS duos to a standstill (my ally stands on the node, I support them and my single target support is better than the tempest - if their DPS comes to hit me, the tempest loses peels. If the tempest comes to whack me, the DPS dies) but haven't been overly inspired about condi specter yet. 

 

[Downstate.4697]

24 minutes ago, Curennos.9307 said:

How? Aside from siphoning their overloads.

 

Genuinely asking, sounds interesting. I've had some fun with support specter and have managed to 2v2 tempest + DPS duos to a standstill (my ally stands on the node, I support them and my single target support is better than the tempest - if their DPS comes to hit me, the tempest loses peels. If the tempest comes to whack me, the DPS dies) but haven't been overly inspired about condi specter yet. 

 

Assuming something like this.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PagAwqlhyqYpMWWLO2WvxPA-zZoOBVOA

The biggest thing is you get them stuck in your seal+ult+using sword 3 and you can either rip all their stab or inflict a lot of torment and prevent them from moving by spamming cc.

[Luna.6203]

Support is only as strong as team mates he/she supports. Support alone is useless. Healing is nerfed to the groud in spvp. Your amulet is basically 500 vita and 500 healing..

 

Any further nerf to support or healing and i bet supports would disappear. and whole spvp will be just zerg fest.. If thats what you want.. i personally play support and i wish i could play firebrand instead of core. BTW weaver is also great support. But i think guardian is more popular overall than ele.

 

Also enemy teams matter.. how good they are, how they can focus target.. Support is actually squishy as f. if you focus properly support can survive max few seconds with CDs. If enemy team is bad without focus (most of cases) and you have good team mates around u are practially invincible.

 

I agree if one team has support and other don't.. Most likely one with support wins. BUT there is nothing wrong or OP about it. Its hows mmos works. In any other mmos ive played healers are even stronger in pvp.

Edited June 6, 2022 by Luna.6203
typo

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

2 hours ago, FrownyClown.8402 said:

seal+ult

This shuts down most builds, ele is actually one of the best classes for surviving that kind of trap. Tempest has 3 invulns to get out of it.

1 hour ago, Luna.6203 said:

Healing is nerfed to the groud in spvp.

No.

 

1 hour ago, Luna.6203 said:

BTW weaver is also great support.

Lol no.

 

[Zoser.7245]

If you believe that support role is too strong, wait until the next balance patch when new support ways are added and more viable supports will be available to choose. Then add, if they do it, the alleged upcoming nerf to willbender and harbinger that a lot of players are aking, probably double nerfing or overnerfing them,  like the did a lot of times with others and if you sum 2+2, is not difficult to watch what is coming, you'll have supports and bruisers/supports  everywhere.

So be patient, in few weeks we will watch it. 😅

Edited June 6, 2022 by Zoser.7245

[Newholiday.8103]

1 hour ago, Luna.6203 said:

Support is only as strong as team mates he/she supports. Support alone is useless. Healing is nerfed to the groud in spvp. Your amulet is basically 500 vita and 500 healing..

 

Any further nerf to support or healing and i bet supports would disappear. and whole spvp will be just zerg fest.. If thats what you want.. i personally play support and i wish i could play firebrand instead of core. BTW weaver is also great support. But i think guardian is more popular overall than ele.

 

Also enemy teams matter.. how good they are, how they can focus target.. Support is actually squishy as f. if you focus properly support can survive max few seconds with CDs. If enemy team is bad without focus (most of cases) and you have good team mates around u are practially invincible.

 

I agree if one team has support and other don't.. Most likely one with support wins. BUT there is nothing wrong or OP about it. Its hows mmos works. In any other mmos ive played healers are even stronger in pvp.

 

You also can't get rid of support, since every class has some amount of team support potential.  You'd have to redesign nearly every class in the game.

[Luna.6203]

10 minutes ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

No.

Offcourse it is! I would not dare to compare pve heal but lets see heal in WvW.. Heal is nerfed to ground in spvp.

 

12 minutes ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

Lol no.

Yes weaver is good support. Its bit different kind of support and i we can argue which one is better. I personally swap from core support do dps if i have supp weaver in group.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

1 hour ago, Luna.6203 said:

Offcourse it is! I would not dare to compare pve heal but lets see heal in WvW.. Heal is nerfed to ground in spvp.

 

Yes weaver is good support. Its bit different kind of support and i we can argue which one is better. I personally swap from core support do dps if i have supp weaver in group.

Im going to assume you mean tempest?

[Grimjack.8130]

support is hyper strong in teamfights sure but its at its weakest its pretty much ever been in 2v2s, its really only used to rotate to a 2v1 to stabilize/force certain bad 2v2s away but because its ranked ur player skill is very relevant and probably isnt good enough to capitalize on the what should be a bad 2v2 leading to frustration

[Bazsi.2734]

Nerf teef.

[greedywholesome.9081]

3 hours ago, Luna.6203 said:

Yes weaver is good support. Its bit different kind of support and i we can argue which one is better. I personally swap from core support do dps if i have supp weaver in group.

 First of all, I love ppl that play support, especially those brave enough to do it soloQ. But you kinda make my weaver seem so selfish as I don't have a support weaver build at all. At best, I can support teammates when I drop a conjured shield. There are traitlines I feel that aren't compatible with weaver. I know tempests are amazing at support but I just suck at it. 

[Luna.6203]

1 hour ago, greedywholesome.9081 said:

 First of all, I love ppl that play support, especially those brave enough to do it soloQ. But you kinda make my weaver seem so selfish as I don't have a support weaver build at all. At best, I can support teammates when I drop a conjured shield. There are traitlines I feel that aren't compatible with weaver. I know tempests are amazing at support but I just suck at it. 

 

I usually duoQ with friend.. This at least garantie one good player that i can support. But sometimes i just want fast daily and than i soloQ. Problem is if you team sux there is nothing you can do about it as support. You can carry group to certain degree but you know how it works in spvp bad players are usually 1st to afk and blame other for their own failure. Some people insist on avoid support at any cost and constantly die alone feeding enemy team with free points. etc..

 

If weaver is weak even more proof this thread is not true. Spellbreaker support is to me like an empty spot. No offence warriors. Even worse with empty spot at least you wont lose rating. And finally guard .. Its good no doubt about it. But try i!. Its not easy to kite two willbenders and los two harbringers each match while keeping eye on groupmates.

 

But again it a lot depends enemy.. sometimes i can laugh on 4 enemies trying to chase me other time i have problem to survive one good player. Good teammeates around you makes huge difference too.

 

Anyway ...I bet there is huge nerf comming to willbelbender and i hope it wont pull down core support with it. I wish heal firebrand would be viable though its much more versatile and fun to play.. But that's offtopic. I just wanted to show my disagreement with this topic. Thats it. bb

 

Edited June 7, 2022 by Luna.6203

[greedywholesome.9081]

@Luna.6203 - TYVM for your input. I play weaver selfishly but support my team indirectly by creating "tunnel vision" much like how I played Spellbreaker before EoD. Back then I had to kill ppl on the node as fast as I could before they stacked up against me after they spawned. 

 

Before the Harb and WB were introduced, it was less of a challenge to hold and keep a node. But now, my weaver needs to kite... a lot 🙂

 

I'm glad that you found a viable weaver support build. However, I have a weird feeling the support builds other pvpers are referencing to are: core guard, tempest, maybe vindi, and maybe specter, heck even harb has a support-ish build. 

 

Who knows! The last 3 ranked games I played had 2 Harbingers on each team and 1 Willbender (total out of 3 games, there were more DH and core). My data is small so it's probably an anomaly but I've been seeing far more Harbingers that WBs. 

Edited June 7, 2022 by greedywholesome.9081

[Luna.6203]

@greedywholesome.9081

I dont play ele.. but i played with one. And i double checked (wisted swirl icon = tempest) not weaver my bad 🙄 really sorry i caused so much misunderstanding in this thread -> @Paradoxoglanis.1904

I think most of guards like me go mainly support. Cuz this is what matters most. If team already have support ill swap to willy or DH. Btw DH is actually good if you have support to boost your sustain a bit otherwise its way too fragile to my taste.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Luna.6203

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

On 6/6/2022 at 6:34 AM, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Obviously all boon removal skills need to have their damage removed. After all removing a boon is it's own reward.

Especially might and fury. Tools of el diablo. 🙏

 

On 6/6/2022 at 7:05 AM, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

TTK is fine, it doesnt need to be shorter. What isnt fine is having to do 100k damage to down someone only to have them get rezzed instantly.

Well alright then! I mean, having to do like 4-10x as much hp as someone has to down them doesn't sound very fun to me either, but I could definitely see how them getting insta rezzed could make the process a lot worse.

Ah well, back to immortality. To the dump, to the dump, to the dump, dump, dump!