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Banner Warrior death (and Warrior in general for pve)

WelshCat.1306

By WelshCat.1306
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WelshCat.1306

WelshCat.1306

Posted
Posted

From reading the patch notes I can pretty much safely say that Warrior has no place in high end content. 
A lack of dps that falls behind all classes but Ranger and little utility that is out shined by near all, if not all classes. 

 

Removing the unique buffs from banners and giving them inferior boons, which you have to PICK UP TO MOVE, which once again other classes can provide better while on the move. Just run Mesmer/Guardian/Engi. 

 

I'd give anet the benefit of the doubt and say maybe it doesn't play like what the patch notes say but I've been around for 9 years and I have no hope for this.
 

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Silent.6137

Silent.6137

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I consider my main a warrior since I spent the most time on it, and was the only character I actively played for 2 or 3 years. It drops very nice banners. And has 3 very nice elite names.  And also.....well, it does a few things better ....

I'm sure I can think of more benefits of being a warrior before the next expansion.

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someguy.4107

someguy.4107

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Every time I see a new player pick warrior as a main (PvE, PvP, WvW) I tell them, "All warriors are homies". Like one big patch note abuse family. No matter how bad it gets, when you see another warrior out there you know you'll always have something in common. Loving an honest, yet trash, profession. Welcome to the family :j

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Dadnir.5038

Dadnir.5038

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I don't want to be mean but it was obvious that the change to banner would lead to the death of warrior when they announced it back in march. Ranger had hopes to survive but they also killed spotter so there is no hopes anymore.

I think the best option for warrior is to go turtle by abusing trait that heal on might, now. MMR, Mending might, empower allies, healing signet, banner of strength... etc. Let all hate broke lose, let the bunker boredom make the devs regret these changes.

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Endaris.1452

Endaris.1452

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I think you're slightly overdramatizing things.

Other classes had no relevant unique thing you'd take them at all for years, pre-EoD Ele and Engi were in that situation basically forever. They still got played and you can still play warrior. You just won't be the most valuable squad member for squad dps by throwing down 2 banners anymore and occasionally recasting them.

Your DPS builds have always been viable and even if Anet doesn't get anything else done, I somewhat do expect them doing something about the crit rate bonus in Arms and that is going to be about everything you need to retain viability as a regular DPS.

 

Yeah, the banner rework is inadequate but be positive, they're still going to be better than engi turrets.

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Fueki.4753

Fueki.4753

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Posted (edited)
35 minutes ago, Dante.1508 said:

I've tried to use warrior in the past in pve but its just not worth the hassle..

I've played through EoD with my Warrior recently. I can confirm that it's just terrible.

Now she's parked in Maguuma Jungle again, for the eventual Maguuma Jungle dailies.

Edited by Fueki.4753
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anbujackson.9564

anbujackson.9564

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Endaris.1452 said:

I think you're slightly overdramatizing things.

Other classes had no relevant unique thing you'd take them at all for years, pre-EoD Ele and Engi were in that situation basically forever. They still got played and you can still play warrior. You just won't be the most valuable squad member for squad dps by throwing down 2 banners anymore and occasionally recasting them.

Your DPS builds have always been viable and even if Anet doesn't get anything else done, I somewhat do expect them doing something about the crit rate bonus in Arms and that is going to be about everything you need to retain viability as a regular DPS.

 

Yeah, the banner rework is inadequate but be positive, they're still going to be better than engi turrets.

The banner builds were essentially dps builds. Even more so on bladesworn, just look at the difference of damage from banner to full dps. 

Those banners held warrior back and made them viable at the same time.

The nerf to banners would have been a good time for berserker buffs, hell just QoL changes for berserker would have been great. At least the bladesworn enhoyers got something.

And about engineer: Holo was never bad. Scrapper yes, and its still not rly good. Core engi condi used to be very good back then.

And I say it again: Bad performance in the past doesnt excuse OP and gamebreaking performance in the present (mech cough cough).

Edited by anbujackson.9564
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Endaris.1452

Endaris.1452

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Yeah sure, I just felt like I had to throw in a comment in to this dramatic claim that warrior is now generally dead in PvE, because if this is what dead looks like then you have no idea what dead is. Much more inclined to look into the chronomancer direction for that kind of label with this patch. 😅

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Dadnir.5038

Dadnir.5038

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31 minutes ago, Endaris.1452 said:

Yeah sure, I just felt like I had to throw in a comment in to this dramatic claim that warrior is now generally dead in PvE, because if this is what dead looks like then you have no idea what dead is. Much more inclined to look into the chronomancer direction for that kind of label with this patch. 😅

Warrior only existed in high end PvE due to banner's unique buffs. While warrior was basically absent from competitive modes. All warrior dps build are dependant on double standard dps increase which is lost in this patch.

Edited by Dadnir.5038
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Hotride.2187

Hotride.2187

Posted
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20 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

I don't want to be mean but it was obvious that the change to banner would lead to the death of warrior when they announced it back in march. Ranger had hopes to survive but they also killed spotter so there is no hopes anymore.

I think the best option for warrior is to go turtle by abusing trait that heal on might, now. MMR, Mending might, empower allies, healing signet, banner of strength... etc. Let all hate broke lose, let the bunker boredom make the devs regret these changes.

Yeah it was obvious. They could've made room for it but why touch high skill high reward gameplay like SPAM FB MANTRAS.

I was actually going to go bladesworn in wvw roaming, doing exactly that, abusing the absurd sustain. If every1 is gonna turtle, lets turtle too. But its just so boring... I can't bring myself to play even core, whats left for even more bunkering. And if you are gonna do that best to do it right, go play boonbeast (cele or whatever optimized cele there is).

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Dadnir.5038

Dadnir.5038

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2 hours ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Yeah it was obvious. They could've made room for it but why touch high skill high reward gameplay like SPAM FB MANTRAS.

I was actually going to go bladesworn in wvw roaming, doing exactly that, abusing the absurd sustain. If every1 is gonna turtle, lets turtle too. But its just so boring... I can't bring myself to play even core, whats left for even more bunkering. And if you are gonna do that best to do it right, go play boonbeast (cele or whatever optimized cele there is).

The devs like to keep what's bad and remove what's good.

Ideally, Banners should have been changed completely. They should have removed the whole planting banner gameplay for a more "conjure/kit" gameplay. They could have just brought back the old banner kits, the bonus stats would have buffed the wielder only (like conjure does) and used banner skill#2, #3 or #5 to provide the boons. Maybe even add a banner burst to provide the quickness.

Simple, effective and a bit more engaging to play.

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anbujackson.9564

anbujackson.9564

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Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, Morokey.8534 said:

So warrior is useless without banners in your oppinion ? .. I mean.. WTF ?

Its not useless. Its just worse in comparison. Except theoretical bladesworn dps, which they like for some reason. Untamed isnt useless either, neither is catalyst. Or what is your opinion especially on the former?

Support options on warrior are also vastly inferior to pretty much any other class? Feel free to prove me wrong on that.

It still has strong cc on power berserker but unlike bladesworn, berserker got no buffs, which makes it inferior. Not like it matters when condi is dominant and the easy to play classes are getting no nerfs.

Edited by anbujackson.9564
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Astralporing.1957

Astralporing.1957

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Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Morokey.8534 said:

So warrior is useless without banners in your oppinion ? .. I mean.. WTF ?

Warrior dps was once competitive in PvE, but has went through several phases of nerfs to "balance" for their banner slave role. Even though it affected the non-banner builds to even greater degree. But at least banners still guaranteed warrior a slot even with subpar performance. Now that performance is going to fall down (due to crit chance loss and double standarts loss) and in "compensation" warior will be able to do something other classes do much better.

What do you think the end result of that will be?

Edited by Astralporing.1957
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Hotride.2187

Hotride.2187

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22 hours ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

Its not useless. Its just worse in comparison. Except theoretical bladesworn dps, which they like for some reason.

IMO that is the biggest issue with bladesworn, that you are now gonna meet the "BUT BLADESWORN" wall. Previously it was the "BUT BANNERSLAVE" wall, now it will be bladesworn. Before that it was the "BUT BANNERSLAVE AND BUBBLEBOT" wall.

"Yo I tried playing warrior and its really a lackluster experience"

"BUT BLADESWORN"

"I kinda dont l-"

"BUT BLADESWORN"

Oh well. What can you do. Maybe they'll clean up after the upcoming patch (or maybe even before, though highly unlikely) and you can at least compete for a dps slot, if nothing else. Or just reroll guard. You don't need fast hands when you don't need weapon swap 🙂

 

Edited by Hotride.2187
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wondermuffin.9680

wondermuffin.9680

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Whatever role I can think of for warrior, I immediately think, "yes, but [other class] does this better." More cc capabilities than other classes? Maybe the Winds elite is helpful in WvW? 🙃

 

I just don't get why banners couldn't keep their unique passive effects AND have quickness as a pulsing boon. I know nothing about coding/programming, but that doesn't seem impossible to implement?

Edited by wondermuffin.9680
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Dadnir.5038

Dadnir.5038

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3 hours ago, Hotride.2187 said:

IMO that is the biggest issue with bladesworn, that you are now gonna meet the "BUT BLADESWORN" wall. Previously it was the "BUT BANNERSLAVE" wall, now it will be bladesworn. Before that it was the "BUT BANNERSLAVE AND BUBBLEBOT" wall.

"Yo I tried playing warrior and its really a lackluster experience"

"BUT BLADESWORN"

"I kinda dont l-"

"BUT BLADESWORN"

Oh well. What can you do. Maybe they'll clean up after the upcoming patch (or maybe even before, though highly unlikely) and you can at least compete for a dps slot, if nothing else. Or just reroll guard. You don't need fast hands when you don't need weapon swap 🙂

 

It was a smart move to prevent the playerbase to be confused between BS (bannerslave) and BS (Bladesworn). Next in line is removing Greatsword (GS) to allow people to use Gunsaber (GS).

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