Profession Balance: Next Steps and Preview of June 30 Balance Update

[Astralporing.1957]

36 minutes ago, Kayberz.5346 said:

Exactly 

 

These bladesworn haters are extremely hyperbolic about how "bad" bladesworn is

 

They simply dont WANT to learn to play it correctly, it has nothing to do with how it actually performs objectively.

 

99% of the mechanics they complain about making them "lose all their damage cuz dodge qq" can be trivialized with aegis and flickerstep, or simply using dragontrigger 2/3 instead of 1 in that 1 instance, and with how much dps bladesworn does it will STILL out dps berserker(and many current metadps classes) even with small interruptions in its optimal rotation as long as you actually think about what you're doing and aren't a berserker-only monkey that relies purely on muscle memory rotations while shutting your brain off to whats going on.

 

"Its unfun" is an entirely subjective thing, i could say that about ANY build in the game, its not a legitimate argument 

 

Out of curiosity, since you are so sure, how much raiding did you do on bladesworn so far?

[Kayberz.5346]

46 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Out of curiosity, since you are so sure, how much raiding did you do on bladesworn so far?

Ive fully cleared wings 1- 4 the past 2 weeks playing only power bladesworn and was top dps in all but 2 fights. One of which was the fault of people messing up xera buttons at the end of the fight which left me with no dps uptime for like 20 seconds, but i was still #2 beaten only by a soubeast by less than 100k damage 

The other was one of the Mathias fights, that one was me messing up early in the fight resulting in me going down in my own red away from the group. That was just user error, totally avoidable and my fault. Finished 3rd beaten by 2 mechanists 

Edited July 13, 2022 by Kayberz.5346

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

8 hours ago, blambidy.3216 said:

As much as this is a better change. This won’t fix the attention of making warrior back into the mix of using it as a quickness source. Or that it still won’t be used by most groups within the raid, and strike community. It uses warhorn which no one will use it as a build and requires numerous amount of boon duration. What could change it is banner could work like spirits uptime. Druid spirits uptime is very easy to upkeep. Warrior banners could pulses quickness per interval depending on how many banners and how much potency it will give out each pulse could justify bringing warrior back in the mix as quickness. 
 

another thing is the fact that since a lot of supports can already give might + quickness/ alac at the same time. You could rotate a couple traits around in the tactic traitline. Phalanx strength trait being grandmaster and And martial cadence master grandmaster should be separated trait masters. Ether martial cadence be major grandmaster and then phalanx strength master grandmaster. That way you can run both. Give might + quickness. While most raid/strike squads warriors will run axe/axe. You can upkeep as long as you have the banner pulse quickness every interval it would be more realistic to the community. 
 

I am only saying this because mech alac can give 25 might + alac. Druid can give 25 might + alac. Healbrand can give 25 might + quickness. tempest can give 25 might + alac. It should only be fair for warriors to do the same. 

They can do that by using the PvP/WvW split on the FGJ might stacks while keeping the PvE duration the same. That plus Empower Allies would keep might over capped.

Edited July 13, 2022 by Lan Deathrider.5910

[anbujackson.9564]

2 hours ago, Kayberz.5346 said:

Exactly 

 

These bladesworn haters are extremely hyperbolic about how "bad" bladesworn is

 

They simply dont WANT to learn to play it correctly, it has nothing to do with how it actually performs objectively.

 

99% of the mechanics they complain about making them "lose all their damage cuz dodge qq" can be trivialized with aegis and flickerstep, or simply using dragontrigger 2/3 instead of 1 in that 1 instance, and with how much dps bladesworn does it will STILL out dps berserker(and many current metadps classes) even with small interruptions in its optimal rotation as long as you actually think about what you're doing and aren't a berserker-only monkey that relies purely on muscle memory rotations while shutting your brain off to whats going on.

 

Thats just stupid insulting to players that like berserker.  Good luck playing like that as condi berserker by the way. 

You think this attitude makes you better than the people who criticize bladesworn? 

Also I am telling you this again. Your top dps ego in a pug w1-4 doesnt mean anything. The skill level of players there is vastly different from group to group. Playing in a group of new/average players and being top dps is not worth braggering about. People can be top dps with reaper in pugs. Does that change the problems of reapers? No. 

[Will.9785]

Bladesworn being semi-decent when you put in the work is no excuse for berserker and spellbreaker being bad.

Edited July 13, 2022 by Will.9785

[Kayberz.5346]

49 minutes ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

Thats just stupid insulting to players that like berserker.  Good luck playing like that as condi berserker by the way. 

You think this attitude makes you better than the people who criticize bladesworn? 

Also I am telling you this again. Your top dps ego in a pug w1-4 doesnt mean anything. The skill level of players there is vastly different from group to group. Playing in a group of new/average players and being top dps is not worth braggering about. People can be top dps with reaper in pugs. Does that change the problems of reapers? No. 

Well when im consistently pulling ~30k dps on real encounters competing with people that have CM tittles and full legendary armor, 30k achievement points, ect. i think it says something. more than the equally anecdotal comments people make about how "bad" bladesworn is. I also have plenty of anecdotal experience seeing a large majority of bladesworns i encounter contributing almost nothing to a group, fumbling mechanics and doing less than 10kdps, but that was the players problem, not the spec

I like berserker,  ive been playing warrior since the 3 day headstart as my main, and with that im fully aware of how auto pilot berserker can be once you are familiar with it. If you prefer that playstyle thats fine, i like it too, i just like bladesworns much more engaging playstyle more, and its just objectively stronger with the current balance (when played CORRECTLY)

I didn't say anything about being better than people that criticize bladesworn.

But theres been a pattern of a handful of particularly active "warrior mains" on the forums trashing bladesworn every single chance they get. And a lot of the criticism that ive observed comes from a place of ignorance and blatant personal bias rather than objective "problems" with the spec.

They seem to want bladesworn deleted, and seem to view bladesworns strength as a threat to berserker/spellbreaker ever getting the buffs it deserves (not entirely hard to see why they might feel that way given anets history of warrior balance)

Edited July 13, 2022 by Kayberz.5346

[Kayberz.5346]

11 minutes ago, Will.9785 said:

Bladesworn being semi-decent when you put in the work is no excuse for berserker and spellbreaker being bad.

I dont disagree with this at all

[Knamliss.9148]

20 hours ago, mirage.8046 said:

What would be a fair compensation is putting those stat buffs into minor traits for core traitlines, so like strength would grant +100 power, and discipline'd grant +100 precision and ferocity, and the list goes on. the extra +5% is appreciated but a lil' more would make up for what warrior lost. 

Your proposed solution is way too similar to how the specializations used to work when it was a point system. But they did away with that system so I doubt they would go back to it. 

[Myror.7521]

@Kayberz.5346 rly think you missunderstood. Most peoples that saying bladesworn is bad mean its gameplay+mechanics. So they mean the feel of playing, not how Bad it is when it comes to dps and souch. I myself say "its bad" sometimes but i also say "i dont play it even when its the most broken kitten in game i would not playing it". 

[Kayberz.5346]

27 minutes ago, Pati.2438 said:

@Kayberz.5346 rly think you missunderstood. Most peoples that saying bladesworn is bad mean its gameplay+mechanics. So they mean the feel of playing, not how Bad it is when it comes to dps and souch. I myself say "its bad" sometimes but i also say "i dont play it even when its the most broken kitten in game i would not playing it". 

Well a lot of them instead of saying "i personally dont like this playstyle, I'll just not play it" they go with "this spec is designed WRONG and isn't a real warrior, it should be deleted and completely remade from the ground up, it cant do anything but hit stationary golems, junksworn amiright guyz?"

 

Its one thing to not like something and refuse to play it, thats how i feel about mechanist. But to CONSTANTLY bring up how much you hate it in every thread, even in unrelated topics, spread misinformation about what the spec is capable of, and trash on the devs and petition to remove it from the game or nerf it into irrelevance is another thing entirely 

Edited July 13, 2022 by Kayberz.5346

[Myror.7521]

@Kayberz.5346 well not gonna lie i also would see it deleted but thinking in things like. "Its still funny against 1 targed things like raid bosses or Open World champs" plus the fact that at least a small group of players DO enjoy the spec let me rethinking it a bit.

[Angesombre.4630]

In the return the position of the demon "Banish Enchantment: Increased energy cost from 20 to 30 in WvW only." was nerfed again. Ok maybe this skill is too powerful but the other skills are even more powerful in front of the elite who have already experienced nerfs to the torment change. So this is the only skill that does damage with the elite how can we compete with the other classes with all these nerfs?

With so many nerfs the class loses interest and ability without a solution. A small reminder, the torment, the resistance has been modified, a can of resistance has been given to a skill that can't send back the alteration and that at the same time absorbs the one of the allies.

At the same time you increase the CD of 2 herald skills, is the energy management already not enough for the nerf?

[Angesombre.4630]

What is your logic? You increased everything for several years and since 2 years you nerf drastically without compensation and study of what you did.

[Angesombre.4630]

Can't wait for the release on Steam to see the scores drop with the unbalanced professions.

Edited July 14, 2022 by Angesombre.4630

[Hazell.2065]

22 hours ago, Kayberz.5346 said:

Well when im consistently pulling ~30k dps on real encounters competing with people that have CM tittles and full legendary armor, 30k achievement points, ect. i think it says something. more than the equally anecdotal comments people make about how "bad" bladesworn is. I also have plenty of anecdotal experience seeing a large majority of bladesworns i encounter contributing almost nothing to a group, fumbling mechanics and doing less than 10kdps, but that was the players problem, not the spec

I like berserker,  ive been playing warrior since the 3 day headstart as my main, and with that im fully aware of how auto pilot berserker can be once you are familiar with it. If you prefer that playstyle thats fine, i like it too, i just like bladesworns much more engaging playstyle more, and its just objectively stronger with the current balance (when played CORRECTLY)

I didn't say anything about being better than people that criticize bladesworn.

But theres been a pattern of a handful of particularly active "warrior mains" on the forums trashing bladesworn every single chance they get. And a lot of the criticism that ive observed comes from a place of ignorance and blatant personal bias rather than objective "problems" with the spec.

They seem to want bladesworn deleted, and seem to view bladesworns strength as a threat to berserker/spellbreaker ever getting the buffs it deserves (not entirely hard to see why they might feel that way given anets history of warrior balance)

Post your KO CM or Ankka CM log with bladesworn. I want to see you outdpsing average scourge there. I don't care about raids, it's pretty much irrelevant content because it is heavily powercreeped(especially w1-4) and the rewards are also terrible.

[ericpeggy.8206]

Just want to ask something about Ranger.

 

Now axe/axe is best weapon combination both power and condition builds.

 

Where is our diversity?

 

You can't say you never thougt about that, right?

[Angesombre.4630]

I take advantage of this as they have revised the engineer's rifle, couldn't we do something better with the hammer coming back especially on the skill 2 with the space that there is between the skill and the player.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Angesombre.4630

[Nimon.7840]

On 7/13/2022 at 5:17 PM, Will.9785 said:

Bladesworn being semi-decent when you put in the work is no excuse for berserker and spellbreaker being bad.

 

u know, theres other classes that do not have a good power spec at all

[Mik.3401]

Didn’t they remove negative comments here and change reactions summary under the post? Lately I’m having this impression they do it under some topics or maybe I’m crazy

[JTGuevara.9018]

On 7/13/2022 at 11:28 AM, Kayberz.5346 said:

Well when im consistently pulling ~30k dps on real encounters competing with people that have CM tittles and full legendary armor, 30k achievement points, ect. i think it says something. more than the equally anecdotal comments people make about how "bad" bladesworn is. I also have plenty of anecdotal experience seeing a large majority of bladesworns i encounter contributing almost nothing to a group, fumbling mechanics and doing less than 10kdps, but that was the players problem, not the spec

I like berserker,  ive been playing warrior since the 3 day headstart as my main, and with that im fully aware of how auto pilot berserker can be once you are familiar with it. If you prefer that playstyle thats fine, i like it too, i just like bladesworns much more engaging playstyle more, and its just objectively stronger with the current balance (when played CORRECTLY)

I didn't say anything about being better than people that criticize bladesworn.

But theres been a pattern of a handful of particularly active "warrior mains" on the forums trashing bladesworn every single chance they get. And a lot of the criticism that ive observed comes from a place of ignorance and blatant personal bias rather than objective "problems" with the spec.

They seem to want bladesworn deleted, and seem to view bladesworns strength as a threat to berserker/spellbreaker ever getting the buffs it deserves (not entirely hard to see why they might feel that way given anets history of warrior balance)

Yes and I'm one of these warrior mains. (Try seven years...) Let me you and others something. Bladesworn is lipstick on a pig. Objectivity eh? Here it is.

Number one. It locks your mobility. (Dragon Trigger). Number two. It locks your weapon-swapping. (gun saber). TWO things that warriors need and rely on in any scenario( pve, pvp, wvw). All Dragon Trigger skills are self-rooted. The gun saber is clunky and impractical to justify not having your usual burst and not being able to swap weapons because of a cooldown. On top of that, you have to spec to lower it. Number three. It doesn't work in a pvp/wvw environment. There is a reason you see mostly core warriors or spellbreakers: they work! Even berzerker is played over bladesworn lmao! The only exception is shout healing, in which this build alone and its associated ammo trait props up the spec.

See...this is the problem with raiders. They have a limited understanding of the classes they play and think they know better, or rather choose to neglect any analysis that does not fit within the confine and contexts of a raid environment. (Yet we're the biased ones?...) They only see the numbers and statistics and not the big picture. Their entire argument hinges on, "I can do x amount DPS on it, what's so bad about it?"

Edited July 17, 2022 by JTGuevara.9018
add

[Gotejjeken.1267]

11 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Yes and I'm one of these warrior mains. (Try seven years...) Let me you and others something. Bladesworn is lipstick on a pig. Objectivity eh? Here it is.

Number one. It locks your mobility. (Dragon Trigger). Number two. It locks your weapon-swapping. (gun saber). TWO things that warriors need and rely on in any scenario( pve, pvp, wvw). All Dragon Trigger skills are self-rooted. The gun saber is clunky and impractical to justify not having your usual burst and not being able to swap weapons because of a cooldown. On top of that, you have to spec to lower it. Number three. It doesn't work in a pvp/wvw environment. There is a reason you see mostly core warriors or spellbreakers: they work! Even berzerker is played over bladesworn lmao! The only exception is shout healing, in which this build alone and its associated ammo trait props up the spec.

See...this is the problem with raiders. They have a limited understanding of the classes they play and think they know better, or rather choose to neglect any analysis that does not fit within the confine and contexts of a raid environment. (Yet we're the biased ones?...) They only see the numbers and statistics and not the big picture. Their entire argument hinges on, "I can do x amount DPS on it, what's so bad about it?"

 

Raiders and sPvP, the bane of GW2.

[Ashen.2907]

17 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Yet we're the biased ones?

Yes, apparently you are. If your argument comes down to claiming to know what others are thinking and falsely generalising their knowledge and understanding of the game in order to have a point, you are clearly biased. I am not a raider, but even I can see your bias.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

Bladetrash. 

All non-mains praise that bs. 

Sheep gonna keep consuming anet trash anyway. 

[Kayberz.5346]

23 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Yes and I'm one of these warrior mains. (Try seven years...) Let me you and others something. Bladesworn is lipstick on a pig. Objectivity eh? Here it is.

Number one. It locks your mobility. (Dragon Trigger). Number two. It locks your weapon-swapping. (gun saber). TWO things that warriors need and rely on in any scenario( pve, pvp, wvw). All Dragon Trigger skills are self-rooted. The gun saber is clunky and impractical to justify not having your usual burst and not being able to swap weapons because of a cooldown. On top of that, you have to spec to lower it. Number three. It doesn't work in a pvp/wvw environment. There is a reason you see mostly core warriors or spellbreakers: they work! Even berzerker is played over bladesworn lmao! The only exception is shout healing, in which this build alone and its associated ammo trait props up the spec.

See...this is the problem with raiders. They have a limited understanding of the classes they play and think they know better, or rather choose to neglect any analysis that does not fit within the confine and contexts of a raid environment. (Yet we're the biased ones?...) They only see the numbers and statistics and not the big picture. Their entire argument hinges on, "I can do x amount DPS on it, what's so bad about it?"

Oh the irony

 

Ah yes it is I the "raider" with a pvp level of 220 who had no problem maintaining plat rank the entirety of the fist pvp season of EoD solo queueing almost entirely on bladesworn, pre buffs. 

Surely it is ME that is talking out of my kitten about things i have no knowledge of. 

🤡

Edited July 18, 2022 by Kayberz.5346

[JTGuevara.9018]

4 hours ago, Kayberz.5346 said:

Oh the irony

 

Ah yes it is I the "raider" with a pvp level of 220 who had no problem maintaining plat rank the entirety of the fist pvp season of EoD solo queueing almost entirely on bladesworn, pre buffs. 

Surely it is ME that is talking out of my kitten about things i have no knowledge of. 

🤡

So, you mostly play pvp. Then you should know better since that is where bladesworn is the weakest. Correct. You do not know what you're talking about.

You believe there are no substantial and systemic problems with bladesworn because you had personal success with it. You prove my point with your own words. "I did good with it! What's the problem!" See...you represent the mentality I used to have, where I let personal success cloud my perspective and analysis of the game and what I play. People hate to admit the flaws and drawbacks of something they had personal success with. Unfortunately Anet listens to these types of players because they are the loudest.

Also, you succeeded at release, where nobody really knew anything about the new classes and how to play them. It is typical post-expansion face-roll where pvp is always at its worst.