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Just what is the point of necro anymore?

Valisha.8650

By Valisha.8650
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Valisha.8650

Valisha.8650

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-Power Reaper is just a selfish dps, now with rather low dps numbers.

-Condi scourge's sustain and barriers got gutted, i don't see a reason to play it instead of condi virtuoso, specter or mechanist.

-Harbinger is a very... specific spec. The elixirs feel forced due to the blight mechanic, and basically could just be replaced with "add blight" buttons, wouldn't make a major difference. Not to mention the pistol might not fit as necro aesthetics for everyone, and the lack of second healthbar, combined with blight decreasing health pool, makes it rather squishy. Harbinger is also inherently inferior to condi quickbrand, due to shroud taking away its utility skills.

What is the point of necro, if everything it does, can be done better/easier/more reliably by someone else?

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Valisha.8650
Valisha.8650

-Power Reaper is just a selfish dps, now with rather low dps numbers. -Condi scourge's sustain and barriers got gutted, i don't see a reason to play it instead of condi virtuoso, specter or mecha

Valisha.8650
Valisha.8650

I think you COMPLETELY miss the point of this post. Read again, think again.

Obtena.7952
Obtena.7952

If you don't see the point of playing it, then don't. That's not necessarily indication of a problem if you don't see it's value. Necro has a point for lots of people because people still play it. 

Valisha.8650

Valisha.8650

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1 minute ago, Xerxez.7361 said:

Power Reaper is nice for Open World...

Most things work in open world.

1 minute ago, Xerxez.7361 said:

Scourge is easy and reliable to use for Damage & Transfusion if your group is struggling.

Condi Virtuoso is even easier, with bigger DPS numbers.

2 minutes ago, Xerxez.7361 said:

Harbinger can swap between DPS and Quickness reliably without changing gear.

A great thing from new player's perspective for sure, but for veteran players, one more set of ascended gear is not that big of a hustle, let alone those with legendaries.

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ZeftheWicked.3076

ZeftheWicked.3076

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Core necro is still doing fine in competitive modes. He's tankiest of all our specs. In end game pve he does not exist, but then again he never did.

Reaper is hurting in end game PvE. Needs damage buffs if benches are true.

Condi scourge may be hurting, but heal scourge is still hard carry in pugs.

Harb is busted. Busted dps with quickness.

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Radina.6057

Radina.6057

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2 hours ago, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

Harb is busted. Busted dps with quickness.

There arent alot of bosses that enable Harbinger to pull ahead of Scourges. Anytime you need to walk out of melee range, and stay there for the duration of a mechanic, you cant do your shroud rotation, which screws up your damage. A weakness that alot of other specs dont share. Most famously, atm, Specter, Mirage, Virtu, and Mech, that have about the same damage numbers.

 

The Quickness variant is hardly doing any more than the usual QFB, which brings not only full might, but all sorts of helpful tools, like on demand stab and/or aegis. You could argue that this is alot of damage for a Quickness source, but it simply stinks atm compared to others.

 

Condi Scourge might have been the "easiest good damage source" a while ago, but since the latest balance patch, Condi Virtu, and Mech did a number on that claim.

 

2 hours ago, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

Reaper is hurting in end game PvE. Needs damage buffs if benches are true.

Reaper isnt hurting, it is dead. For years.

 

The only reason you see Necros atm is because people like to play the class, not because they are best in slot anywhere.

 

As a side note. Scourge heal is alot less effective than just a Tempest alac heal with Rebound, or any alac heal Mech. If you want/need a third healer, take a Aura Tempest.

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ZeftheWicked.3076

ZeftheWicked.3076

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Radina.6057 said:

There arent alot of bosses that enable Harbinger to pull ahead of Scourges. Anytime you need to walk out of melee range, and stay there for the duration of a mechanic, you cant do your shroud rotation, which screws up your damage. A weakness that alot of other specs dont share. Most famously, atm, Specter, Mirage, Virtu, and Mech, that have about the same damage numbers.

 

The Quickness variant is hardly doing any more than the usual QFB, which brings not only full might, but all sorts of helpful tools, like on demand stab and/or aegis. You could argue that this is alot of damage for a Quickness source, but it simply stinks atm compared to others.

 

Condi Scourge might have been the "easiest good damage source" a while ago, but since the latest balance patch, Condi Virtu, and Mech did a number on that claim.

 

Reaper isnt hurting, it is dead. For years.

 

The only reason you see Necros atm is because people like to play the class, not because they are best in slot anywhere.

 

As a side note. Scourge heal is alot less effective than just a Tempest alac heal with Rebound, or any alac heal Mech. If you want/need a third healer, take a Aura Tempest.


You don't take Scourge for the actual heals, but for the mass ress pull that is available most of the time. Rebound has nothing on Scourge, as it's an elite with long cd and requires you to predict someone is about to die, while scourge is ready to pick them up when that happens eliminating bad prediction scenarios, and dreadful cooldown that follows.

As for condi scourge it's bench isn't bad (35k), and it's already been proven that scourges are far more in real applications than on paper because of extremely stable damage output where others far more frequently struggle due to specifics of given encounter.

Edited by ZeftheWicked.3076
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Nimon.7840

Nimon.7840

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11 hours ago, Artificer.3468 said:

Scourge and Harbinger are fine.

 

I dont even particularly like harbinger but it's really strong and The fact that its shroud doesnt get deleted by incoming damage is a good thing.

 

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't call harbinger fine. If you mean by that, that it's doing more DPS on most bosses in raids than firebrand while providing quickness and fury. Ok.

 

BUT:

It doesn't bring firebrand utility.

And even if you take out some of the abilities, you loose a lot more:

- Heal elixir: changeable, but looses dps and there aren't really great options to change into, that would actually help the team

- blood is power: one of your best dps skills and provides might, you don't want to change this

- elixir of anguish: not changeable because it's necessary for quickness uptime

- elixir of risk: the only changeable skill, but only if you have another fury source in your group

- Plaguelands: changeable but also looses you a lot of dps. Flesh golem is okish because.it can do a lot of breakbar dmg, elite elixir is basically useless. The boonduration is far to short in PvE for that long cooldown.

 

Another problem: even if you take aristocracy runes you aren't able to keep up 25 might over a long fight, unless you also take elite elixir maybe (didn't use that in my calc). And you have to adjust the most DPS rotation to a "most might uptime"-rotation. Which nets you around 23-26k DPS.

 

All of that doesn't sound too bad.

But people keep forgetting, that harbinger has 3 completely dead traits. There's only one trait played on cele harbinger for roaming in wvw: the one that gives 1 stack of stab on shroud entry. But it's not played for it's power dmg enhancement.

 

It's not just reaper that suffers in the power dmg department, it's necro in general, and the main reason it's held back are the weapons. Mainhand weapons are pretty bad and there isn't a single offhand power weapon, they are all either utility or condi.

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KrHome.1920

KrHome.1920

Posted
Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Valisha.8650 said:

I think you COMPLETELY miss the point of this post. Read again, think again.

Your post has no point. You don't see any reasons to play specific specs, but that's your individual problem. We can only read what you have written and that is not very substantial.

Edited by KrHome.1920
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Dadnir.5038

Dadnir.5038

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Necromancer shine in competitive modes, so the point of necromancer is competitive modes.

As for PvE:

- Core has always been handicaped by it's shroud in this gamemode so...

- Reaper is fine with a condi build.

- Scourge is fine as both a "healer" and dps, you just need to specialize more than before through gear choice (which is a good thing).

- Harbinger is good dps wise and "ok" as a quickness provider (even if it's not "the best choice").

I'm not saying that the necromancer's specs don't need some polish (every spec of this game need some polishing) but they aren't really in a dire state.

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Squeesidhe.4761

Squeesidhe.4761

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Harbinger is squishy? LOL. Barely anything can kill my Harbinger in PVE (Maybe you're talking about PVP? PVP is about as fun as pulling teeth, so I don't compare my builds to any of that broke-kitten junk). The Blight health reduction takes you from a pile of health to a slightly smaller pile of health, while increasing your health regeneration and damage output. 

 

Elixirs all you to add stacks of Blight quickly while also doing other things, like adding conditions or boons. An "add Blight" button would lose all that strategy. 

 

To each their own, but Harbinger made me enjoy my Necro again. Pistol is a lot of fun, at least for a Condi build. 

 

 

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Artificer.3468

Artificer.3468

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10 hours ago, Nimon.7840 said:

 

I wouldn't call harbinger fine. If you mean by that, that it's doing more DPS on most bosses in raids than firebrand while providing quickness and fury. Ok.

 

BUT:

It doesn't bring firebrand utility.

 

 what other quick dps brings firebrand utility besides firebrand. it's an exception not the rule 

 

In a team setting there are other specs to upkeep might as well. Tempest and mech for example

 

As I mentioned before I really dont like harbinger because I find the traits boring and the power traits pointless but even with the dead traitline it is far from useless which is the part I took issue with. 

 

I agree on necro's power weapon issue.

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Bakeneko.5826

Bakeneko.5826

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Posted (edited)
On 8/1/2022 at 8:11 PM, Valisha.8650 said:

Condi Virtuoso is even easier, with bigger DPS numbers

You forgot to mention, that it needs whole life support unit truck to keep DPS high, like Weaver used to. Also, consumables cost kidney and a half, or, if you run budget variant, necro will do similar DPS in real encounter environment

 

 

 

Edit: nvm, build is changed now, you can disregard this comment.

Edited by Bakeneko.5826
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Methuselah.4376

Methuselah.4376

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Scourge and Harbinger are doing very well in terms of dps. I personally have really taken a liking to Harbinger, which is funny considering I didn't like the concept of it when it was first introduced. I agree that power Reaper needs a serious buff to its damage; it's a shame really, cause it's very easy to buff its numbers by adjusting/adding multipliers on traits and making GS a bit faster and Gravedigger a guaranteed critical strike. 

I haven't played Heal Scourge in months so can't comment on its current performance, but when I used to play it it was some of the best time I've had supporting in this game, mostly because I played it while teaching raids so in a way it was  a crutch. Currently am really getting into Heal Alac Tempest so that's another reason why I haven't touched heal Scourge in a while. 

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reapex.8546

reapex.8546

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Valisha.8650 said:

According to statistics, PvE is the most played game mode.

Doesn't matter if it's the most played.  
People still use necros in the other game modes and enjoy them too.

Your post wasn't about PvE only but Necros in general.

Edited by reapex.8546
Added clarification about game mode.
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