Done with fractals until AR character locking is addressed

[Boogiepop Void.6473]

Every time I try to do them either we can't get needed roles (healers primarily) or we try and can't finish due to the those roles being missing, resulting in almost complete waste of time since the rewards are garbage if you don't finish. The current form of the AR system creates character lock (you can't play things because they don't have AR) and makes it virtually impossible to gather a decent group composition. I literally have everything that could every possibly be needed even to run CM fractals but I can't use any of it because of AR, so I am left begging for scraps in LFG instead of helping my party. You can sit in LFG for literal hours and not be able to assemble a working party. It's not worth the time to try in the current state, and given how profitable completed fractals are, that is saying something. AR needs to be reworked to prevent character locking.

(Before anyone brings up buying more AR, I can use that money to get Legionaries that let me engage with every single other part of the game more readily with that money rather than blowing it just to let me play added characters in a single game mode, and also MY having more AR won't fix the issue because whatever role I fill, there won't be other people to fill the other roles because they will still need AR.)

[Ashantara.8731]

8 hours ago, Boogiepop Void.6473 said:

AR needs to be reworked to prevent character locking.

And if they did, your solution for players who already have multiple characters fully equipped with AR/+Attribute infusions would be what exactly? Compensation of sorts?
 

Edited September 2, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[Linken.6345]

I guess your done with fractals then OP

[Cyninja.2954]

You made a post about this 1 month ago on August 6th.

If you weren't able to "fix" the issue by now, you seem to have a problem with figuring out what to run or how to setup a decent fractal group, not with the actual AR system. It was more than possible to gear at least 1-2 characters in that time, even if resorting to running lower fractals like T2-3, which would have yielded the gold needed multiple times over.

Maybe we will see an AR rework, maybe not. Nothing was mentioned from developer side which means you are likely done with fractals then or you can always run T1 fractals which require no AR.

Edited September 2, 2022 by Cyninja.2954

[Boogiepop Void.6473]

21 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

And if they did, your solution for players who already have multiple characters fully equipped with AR/+Attribute infusions would be what exactly? Compensation of sorts?
 

No one can ever have something nice because someone before them didn't have it. We saw the same arguments from people when the legendary armory was added and people who had made multiples were complaining that now their effort was "wasted".

[Ashantara.8731]

Just now, Boogiepop Void.6473 said:

No one can ever have something nice because someone before them didn't have it.

ANet has already made a lot of things easier for them, e.g. the change in mount availability.

If all you want to do is just log in and not invest time in gearing up, then go find a game that supports this playstyle. But being new and coming in and demanding for everything to be changed is a bit... impertinent? Lazy? I don't know.

By the way, have you considered what a huge financial loss it would be if infusions were made account-wide without compensation for those who have geared up all their characters? "Something nice" would be a free mount skin -- what you are asking for is huge.

[Brandon Uzumaki.1524]

Would be nice for infusions to have an armory of sorts, or be added to the armory, and they could work like the Sigils and Runes.

You can equip 20 infusions on any character (provided your rings are attuned/infused, and your backpack is infused), them being added to the armory means everyone would need 20 of EACH infusion to be maxed out, this includes 20 +9, then 20 of each +9 that give stats (if you want), and 20 of each fashion ones too (Chak, Queen Bee, Polysaturating, etc), there's also the WvW ones that people would like to max out too (very important when you look at it), can only see benefits in the short term.

And tbh, infusions are devalued already, infusions are almost at "vendor value" for quite some time (specially +1, they are costing coopers lol), a system like this will give them a much needed "boom", won't last forever, of course, but anyone that wants "compensation" will get that by making a lot of gold selling all the extras with the potential spike in price infusions will have (specially +9), it can't get worse than it already is tbh.

[Valisha.8650]

4 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

By the way, have you considered what a huge financial loss it would be if infusions were made account-wide without compensation for those who have geared up all their characters? "Something nice" would be a free mount skin -- what you are asking for is huge.

Should we also demand compensations if a certain elite spec gets nerfed too much?

[Linken.6345]

6 hours ago, Valisha.8650 said:

Should we also demand compensations if a certain elite spec gets nerfed too much?

Ofcourse we should and the compensation will be some Testimony of Jade Heroics since that is what you spent to get elite specs unlocked.

[Labjax.2465]

On 9/3/2022 at 9:58 AM, Ashantara.8731 said:

If all you want to do is just log in and not invest time in gearing up, then go find a game that supports this playstyle.

So now GW2 is a gear treadmill game? 🤔

Huh, here everyone tells me about how optional everything is and how it's a breath of fresh air and different from all those gear treadmill games... something strange is going on here.

[Spucke.4163]

AR needs no rework. just play the game and gear up as said before. ascended gear isn't hard to gather and infusions are cheap nowadays. there's nothing to complain.

[Zohane.7208]

So... rather than spend some gold on getting a full set of +7 and +9 AR infusions so that you can easily make 30g or so daily with about 1h of play, you'd rather skip out on it and save the (probably less) gold you make from other content for future legendaries?

Well, hopefully you're happy with that choice 🙂

 

(On a single day of t4+recs I usually get just over 200 +1's, which is just less than what's needed to make one +9, as well as about 30g raw gold and materials, with these you could easily get about 8 +9's in a single day - two days would give you enough for 144 AR.)

[The Boz.2038]

People here really are entirely devoted to not even trying to understand the issue, eh?

Wow.

 

The problem isn't "best gear costs money". The problem is "best gear costs money, needs more money for infusions, and is absolutely required for this content", leading to very limited freedom in build and role selection, no adaptability, and the painful prospect of a patch coming out and saying "lol bye".

You can raid in exotics. "Oh, we need a DPS alac? Lemme hop on to my other character and we're good." Other character is wearing exotics, yeah, so it's about 90% as effective, but you know what? It works. It clears content. And it costs peanuts to do.
The same maneuver in fractals just results in that character becoming instantly dead the moment any agony appears.

"Oh, but it's an investment!" kinda almost works, if you don't look at the actual real numbers. The fractal income numbers used are always with the super-hilarious fractal god title and omnipotions and stuff, "oh, sure, you can earn 50 gold an hour, easy, so it's fair you need costlier gear!" That argument doesn't really work if you aren't yet fractal god, but are just there with your ~80ish AR from the weapon and trinkets you grabbed with S3/4 currencies, and your whole T1+T2+maybe half of T3 run earns you, what, five gold? If that? 

"Waah waah compensation!" is a deficient response. There are trivial ways to make this system account-wide and not be a slap in the face of anyone who geared out their multiple character's multiple builds already. Hell, *I* have a dozen fractal-ready builds on half a dozen characters, all at 150+ AR, and would love to see this nonsense done away with, even if all those infusions were just deleted from my account. Hell, half of those I decked out before the massive infusion price drop last year.

[Asum.4960]

The funny thing is that they could add Legendary Infusions, a full set of which could cost more than fully gearing 20+ characters in regular infusions (which would be in line with other legendary pricing), and people would go crazy for it - just because of that feeling of finality. 

AR is super cheap these days - just make a habit of combining all the +1's into +9's each day, and before you know it you have all your Fractal builds/characters set up. 

It's not like we are talking about weeks per character here to set up/earn AR, but <2 hours.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Asum.4960

[Cyninja.2954]

12 minutes ago, The Boz.2038 said:

People here really are entirely devoted to not even trying to understand the issue, eh?

Wow.

 

It's not about misunderstanding the issue, at least not for me. The AR system needs a rework, that I agree with. What I disagree with is to base this decision around players to stubborn or cheap to make the current system work for them. If players come here demanding changes be made because they can't be bothered to gear 1-2 additional characters, which by now is absolutely not an issue, that is not the outset I see as beneficial to start discussing changes (mostly because those same players will likely have very different opinions on how these changes should be implemented).

 

More to the point: the current AR and infusion system is a HUGE part of the games economy. Messing with it just because someone can't be bothered is not something I personally would be risking. Not to mention that fractals remain some of the highest liquid gold in the game, if not the highest, and messing with the ease of access will have to see this changed as well (which I think is fine but might annoy other fractal players).

 

Now if there is a proper idea or coherent concept brought forth which seems sensible (I gave some ideas myself in a past thread like an infusion armory, etc.) that absolutely should get, and was, discussed.

 

Topic creator brought forth his complaint 3 weeks ago and now throws a temper tantrum that his demand was not met. Hardly what I consider a player reasonably invested in the content.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Cyninja.2954

[The Boz.2038]

1 minute ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

the current AR and infusion system is a HUGE part of the games economy

Hasn't been a huge part for a year now; +1s are literally pennies, and the other component of building up the infusions are a literal low-intensity gold sink.

[Cyninja.2954]

3 minutes ago, The Boz.2038 said:

Hasn't been a huge part for a year now; +1s are literally pennies, and the other component of building up the infusions are a literal low-intensity gold sink.

You are not factoring for infusions overall and how other infusions might be affected by crafted pure stat infusions value wise.

That said, even the +1 price right now having bottomed out leads to thousands gold worth of value in the crafted infusion market if one decides to look past the +9 only.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Cyninja.2954

[LSD.4673]

Prepare yourselves for the coming weeks, where they decide to remove AR altogether...

[Bakeneko.5826]

18 hours ago, The Boz.2038 said:

Hasn't been a huge part for a year now; +1s are literally pennies, and the other component of building up the infusions are a literal low-intensity gold sink.

High resistance infusions can be traded for stated ones (one of the reasons why high resistance ones are expensive).

 

On 9/2/2022 at 6:15 PM, Boogiepop Void.6473 said:

we can't get needed roles (healers primarily) or

Seriously? AlacTemp? AlacHealRen? HFB? Specter? HAM? 5 very good healer builds are available for fractals and you fail to find one? Don't you think your party reqs are too high or too low? On EU never had problem to fill party in 5k-30k bracket by any role.

[Cuks.8241]

That is why I only have my FB for fractals and dont really intend to gear up anything else (maybe if Anet actually started to make more fractals in the future). On my FB I can cover 2-3 critical roles and will be probably always one of the most sought after professions. Im not going to gear up something else that might get very little play time or even shelved at some point. I could go for only +9 AR infusions but that would actually make my other characters worse as they are now. 

Its a shame because in 10 man modes I can take pretty much anything a group needs or I feel like playing. In fractals its FB (well guardian). 

[Bakeneko.5826]

On 9/5/2022 at 1:38 PM, The Boz.2038 said:

People here really are entirely devoted to not even trying to understand the issue, eh?

Wow.

 

The problem isn't "best gear costs money". The problem is "best gear costs money, needs more money for infusions, and is absolutely required for this content", leading to very limited freedom in build and role selection, no adaptability, and the painful prospect of a patch coming out and saying "lol bye".

You can raid in exotics. "Oh, we need a DPS alac? Lemme hop on to my other character and we're good." Other character is wearing exotics, yeah, so it's about 90% as effective, but you know what? It works. It clears content. And it costs peanuts to do.
The same maneuver in fractals just results in that character becoming instantly dead the moment any agony appears.

"Oh, but it's an investment!" kinda almost works, if you don't look at the actual real numbers. The fractal income numbers used are always with the super-hilarious fractal god title and omnipotions and stuff, "oh, sure, you can earn 50 gold an hour, easy, so it's fair you need costlier gear!" That argument doesn't really work if you aren't yet fractal god, but are just there with your ~80ish AR from the weapon and trinkets you grabbed with S3/4 currencies, and your whole T1+T2+maybe half of T3 run earns you, what, five gold? If that? 

"Waah waah compensation!" is a deficient response. There are trivial ways to make this system account-wide and not be a slap in the face of anyone who geared out their multiple character's multiple builds already. Hell, *I* have a dozen fractal-ready builds on half a dozen characters, all at 150+ AR, and would love to see this nonsense done away with, even if all those infusions were just deleted from my account. Hell, half of those I decked out before the massive infusion price drop last year.

Ok, but if AR becomes account wide, raid armour needs to be obtainable in open world, because you need gear, to farm gear to make gear

[TheQuickFox.3826]

I like the infusion system but I dislike that you have to choose between WvW and Agony infusions. I play WvW 99% more often than fractals so I'm fully loaded with WvW infusions. But because agony infusions use the same slots and cannot be combined I have zero agony infusions slotted. This limits my access to fractals to the lower levels and I don't think this is well designed.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

2 hours ago, TheQuickFox.3826 said:

I like the infusion system but I dislike that you have to choose between WvW and Agony infusions. I play WvW 99% more often than fractals so I'm fully loaded with WvW infusions. But because agony infusions use the same slots and cannot be combined I have zero agony infusions slotted. This limits my access to fractals to the lower levels and I don't think this is well designed.

This is the biggest problem, especially since WvW infusions are used for all other instanced content so its hard to use the same character for both Fractals and dungeons/raids/strikes., and that's assuming you also don't want to use a Fractal character for WvW either, which is also a thing that happens sometimes.

 

They need to merge the two together somehow. Maybe provide us a way to convert WvW infusions to agonised WvW infusions just like we do with rings currently.

Edited September 26, 2022 by Mariyuuna.6508

[ugrakarma.9416]

- +9 agony infusion is 5g, a full set is cheaper(100g?) for ppl who running T4.

- i'm against any change on fractals economy, what i see is raiders migrating  to fractals.

[The Boz.2038]

1 hour ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

what i see is raiders migrating  to fractals

!?

Seriously?