Shift Signet for all profession

[phandaria.4891]

With all the nerf mechanist threads, this is not one of them. I just want to say how satisfying Shift Signet to use, compared to all other utility skills, it never left my mechanist's skill bar. I believe this one skill adds on to the popularity of mechanist in PvE.

Shift signet is a ground-targeted shadowstep, with 1200 range, plus stun break and condi cleanse, with only 25 sec recharge utility skill. As an added bonus it gives passive movement speed.

This is the only oh kitten button needed for any encounter and versatile to be used aggressively too. It is top tier compared to all other utility skills.

While on this topic, why are there enemy target/ally target teleports? Why not make them all ground-targeted? Cos this type of skill sucks, at least for the utility skills.

Please make condi cleanse, stun break and ground-targeted teleport combo (preferably 1200 range, specter wells kinda short) for all professions, it is just too good!

Edited October 13, 2022 by phandaria.4891

[Waffles.5632]

This is why Mechanist is problematic.

The reason you don't see every class getting a point blank teleport is because it is extremely powerful, if not one of the most powerful skills in the game.

 

Mesmer has the OG blink. 1200 range, stun break, 35 sec CD in pvp, and now 20sec CD in pve (used to be 35sec until very recently)

Thief has the OG shadowstep. 1200 range, 1200 return, 3 condi cleanse, stun break 50 sec CD.

 

Both are these abilities are absurdly strong, in fact so much so, that for pvp, these 2 abilities have been -required- on every thief and mesmer spec since gw2 launch.

 

Since gw2 launch.

 

 

 

 

And now here rolls in mecha, getting the best of both worlds, with a FASTER cooldown AND then on top of it, 25% bonus movement speed kuz it's a signet.

 

Talk about an absurdly stacked ability.

 

I hope you do not take this the wrong way, it's just I don't think you realize what you are asking for. Mechanist blink needs a nerf still, it should not cleanse condis, even if it did not cleanse, it would still be top tier. That's how much power is caked onto the skill, and in general mechanist itself.

 

I have nothing against Mechanist, but when you trivialize the efforts of other classes, your game quickly goes down the drain, and everyone is seeing it now.

 

 

[phandaria.4891]

I understand what you are saying. Again, I made this to say how satisfying Shift Signet is to use in PvE.

Wanna go OOC but have that pesky burn/poison? Shift Signet.

Have that glowy AoE in strikes that would kill your teammates? Shift Signet away.

Stunned on a AoE? Shift Signet.

It is a literal absolute answer to many situations.

Regarding balance, I don't have much opinion on it. It's just that this skill on a spec that doesn't scream mobility (like thief or mesmer), doesn't feel quite right. Either Arenanet can take it away or give it to all other professions. I choose the latter.

Edited October 13, 2022 by phandaria.4891

[Serephen.3420]

Change the stunbreak to barrier signet or remove the condi removal from the signet orrr double the cooldown. 

 

Elementalist still stuck with one of the worst blinks in the game ever since cantrips got changed way back.

Edited October 13, 2022 by Serephen.3420

[Asum.4960]

6 hours ago, phandaria.4891 said:

Shift signet is a ground-targeted shadowstep, with 1200 range, plus stun break and condi cleanse, with only 25 sec recharge utility skill. As an added bonus it gives passive movement speed.

And let's not forget, enables boon share with the Mech on top of all that. 

It's basically three top Tier Utility skills in one (25% Movespeed passive + 1200 Shadowstep active, Pet boonshare + Pet respositioning tool, Condi Cleanse + Stunbreak).

[Xenesis.6389]

Thanks for highlighting the broken skill on mechanist in comparison to it's counter parts, talk about skills doing too much at once, this is top of the list.

[Fueki.4753]

Shift Signet is brokenly unbalanced, because it does too much.

As much as using it may satisfy you, it's one of the most bloated abilities and in need of being trimmed down. In my opinion, they should at the very least remove the teleport from it.

But for now, they love Mechanist too much to do anything substantial to bring it down to the level it belongs.

 

Edited October 16, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[Gwynnion.7364]

Shift Signet was literally designed to be broken like all the Mechanist Signets, to make people use them over kits or any other options.

That said, I think some people have an unreasonable hatred for blinks / shadowsteps in general, especially when combined with other effects.  I'm sure it's annoying in PVP.  It's occasionally annoying in WvW.  But it's just part of some classes' kits.  Whatever.

I'm not saying everything should be as powerful as Shift Signet, far from it, it needs to be brought down, but my elementalists would kill to have Lightning Flash be as useful as Shadowstep or Jaunt.  And yeah, Jaunt exists partially because Mirage Cloak doesn't move you when you dodge.  But the world won't end if we give some classes some nice things.

Edited October 13, 2022 by Gwynnion.7364

[Waffles.5632]

Blink and Shadowstep are near perfect as is, any stronger and they would be bordering OP.

So with that mind;

 

 

- Mesmer Blink should be 30secs CD in pvp/wvw, fine as is in pve since it can be traited to be 15sec CD now with 3 secs of superspeed. Not bad imo.

 

- Thief Shadowstep should probably be 45 sec CD pvp/wvw and probably 40 secs in pve because well it's pve. Nothing else needs changing. The 1200 return is phenomenal for top tier thief plays and the condi clear is icing on the cake.

 

- Lightning Flash should be 1200 range, do a ton more damage, and have around 30-45 sec CD. The CD should match the damage, so higher damage = longer CD. This incentivizes ele's to be aggressive with it, and not defensive since they already have so many mobile defensive evasive abilities. You can't add any defense or else every ele will suddenly be unkillable tbh, but IMAGINE using lightning flash on top of earthquake and they both hit for 10k or 15k damage or w/e. The numbers can change, but the important thing is that ele's feel GOOD when using lightning flash offensively.

 

- Shift Signet should be the worst blink, not the best. It should not clear condi's, it should have a 45 sec CD, or it should only have 900 range. Pick your poison, but the kit is too bloated, the bonus 25% movement speed literally hurts my soul because that's just kicking mesmers, thieves, and eles, when they're down. All of this on a PET spec too. My god Anet.

 

[Mike.7983]

Shift signets problem is its heavily loaded as a all in one miracle button,  no other signets in the game give you run speed, boon share with pet, teleport 1200 range, 2 condi cleanse and a stun break.  Shift signet to me is worth least 4-5 signets from any other class. From a mesmer main this signet just dumps over our blink skill as its superior in every way possible.  Really do believe the shift signet should lose some of its passive effects and remain a stun break teleport only with boon share to pet.  Remove the rest from this heavily bloated signet.

Edited October 13, 2022 by Mike.7983

[draxynnic.3719]

8 hours ago, Gwynnion.7364 said:

Shift Signet was literally designed to be broken like all the Mechanist Signets, to make people use them over kits or any other options.

Which is the main problem with comparing engineer utilities 1:1 with those of other professions. A large part of engineer's design is that its utilities are (supposed to be) more powerful than those of other professions, since every non-kit utility is competing with a kit for space on the bar.

And signets have to do this without a toolbelt.

Doesn't mean that signets can't be overpowered, but the question is a bit more complicated than whether a signet (or some other engineer utility) is stronger than a similar utility on another profession.

[phandaria.4891]

23 hours ago, Waffles.5632 said:

Thief has the OG shadowstep. 1200 range, 1200 return, 3 condi cleanse, stun break 50 sec CD.

And I believe the condi cleanse ONLY happens on the return, not initial shadowstep, which makes a huge difference.

Even the Elite Skill Jaunt (Mirage) has no stun break. Heck, I choose Shift Signet over any Elite Skills.

2 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Doesn't mean that signets can't be overpowered, but the question is a bit more complicated than whether a signet (or some other engineer utility) is stronger than a similar utility on another profession.

I'm happy to have overpowered signet on mech. I just want this 1200 ground-targeted shadowstep+stun break+condi cleanse combo on a low CD for other professions, without the passives is still fine. Other professions/specs get even less than half of Shift Signet, for example (just from the latest specs):

Untamed - Unnatural Traversal: Why can't it be ground-targeted? 40 sec CD with 50% refund is just bad. The condi cleanse is on another skill, which only converts it to vulnerability instead of total cleansing.

Specter - Wells: Why 600 range? So unfun to use. Please do 1200 range (PvE only). Why are there no condi cleanse and/or stun break for any of the wells?

 

Please please buff other profession options for mobility/escape button. Shift Signet is what I really miss when not playing Mechanist.

 

EDIT: One more thing about Shift Signet that is so satisfying to use, is that it feels so smooth. Is it because it has no cast time/animation lock? Compared to Specter's Wells, Shift Signet is above them all in terms of fun.

Edited October 14, 2022 by phandaria.4891

[Alcatraznc.3869]

Shift signet and pretty much all other Mechanist signet were designed to be strong enough to justify the removal of kits. But shift signet is a special one compared to other . Putting aside the blink it is the only way for the Mechanist to share boons with its pet.

 

That being said, I dont want all class to have access to a teleport. Teleport are already broken in this game and you can abuse them to teleport on the ledge. For PvE it's whatever but for PvP and WvW, it is totally fair and balance when someone can just blink and find himself at the top of a hill while you have to go all the way around to reach him. 

[anbujackson.9564]

3 hours ago, Alcatraznc.3869 said:

Shift signet and pretty much all other Mechanist signet were designed to be strong enough to justify the removal of kits. But shift signet is a special one compared to other . Putting aside the blink it is the only way for the Mechanist to share boons with its pet.

No offense, but this sounds like you actually think its fair the way it is.

Also it shares every boon permanently. You can only watch in silence as a ranger player... or bite the dust and use nature magic.

[Kodama.6453]

42 minutes ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

No offense, but this sounds like you actually think its fair the way it is.

Also it shares every boon permanently. You can only watch in silence as a ranger player... or bite the dust and use nature magic.

It is not fair and Anet is aware that the skill is doing way too many things.

The thing is that this is intended design by them. The main reason is that they put the boon share effect for the mech on this signet, which means that it is absolutely mandatory for basically every mechanist build in PvE. Because mechanist is extremely dependent on the ability to share boons with the mech for their performance.

And because this skill is mandatory, Anet has intentionally overbuffed it. Because it feels less bad for people if they are forced to use the same skill in any build if said skill also happens to be massively OP.

Sure, nerf shift signet, I am all for it. But at the same time put the boon share effect of it onto a minor trait in the mechanist trait line, please. The skill is mandatory for every single build in PvE, I think this warrants that it should become a base feature of the spec instead of relegated to a specific utility skill.

Once that effect is moved, you can nerf shift signet. Right now they are keeping the skill busted to make people forget that they are shackled to this skill in general.

[prototypedragon.1406]

I think we should give warrior a shadow step ability 😋

[shion.2084]

Mechanists don't do that well in PvP as it is.   The only thing that lets them have survivability is that shift signet, or they'd be instant deleted.    I dislike Mechanists, so go ahead take it away, but your basically removing the very small shred of viability they have in PvP.

 

[shion.2084]

Just now, shion.2084 said:

Mechanists don't do that well in PvP as it is.   The only thing that lets them have survivability is that shift signet, or they'd be instant deleted.    I dislike Mechanists, so go ahead take it away, but your basically removing the very small shred of viability they have in PvP.

 

I will also note that when comparing utilities.... if you do it without context, the engineer needs to be nerfed into the ground for like every single utility..  I mean dear god, every utility they have comes with a TOOLBELT which can be traited to give vigor, heal, remove condi.  Why Engine is clearly the most insanely over powered class that exists.

The point being that the Engineer class is built around having over powered utilities, because of its detriments in other areas.   Its like comparing an Engi weapon to a non Eng one, except not taking into account that they only get one weapon set.

[eXruina.4956]

back around mid, pof, i vaguely remember them mentioning that they were moving away from overloaded skills and traits that did too much, it was a sensible balance declaration, yet here we are now in 2022, some classes evidently way over-tuned and unrestricted, yet remain untouched. while others have been gutted and left rotting for years.

[MrChatters.9461]

It's really sad to realize that every single nerf Thief has received during these last years has been justified with the usual "well, it has stealth and a tons of mobility!" 

 

Weeeeeeeeeeeellllll, I'm not saying that it's a double standard,

 

but

[Alcatraznc.3869]

15 hours ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

No offense, but this sounds like you actually think its fair the way it is.

Also it shares every boon permanently. You can only watch in silence as a ranger player... or bite the dust and use nature magic.

 

When an entire spec doesnt give a single buff to the player and instead focus on a glorified buffed pet, not being able to buff the said pet is just shooting yourself in the foot.

 

For PvE, the boon sharing ability makes it a must have in every single build. The 25% movement speed, condi cleanse, breakstun and teleport is just the icing on the cake.

For WvW and PvP it is kind of the other way around. The teleport and breakstun makes it a must have.

 

I am not saying whether Shift signet and Mechanist signet are fair or not. I'm just explaining why Shift signet has been designed as such and why it shouldnt be handled casually to all classes .

[A Hamster.2580]

Honestly the blinking of Shift Signet doesn't even make sense in terms of lore. I can see a mesmer blinking with magic or a thief shadowstepping with rogue-like techniques or an elementalist blinking with lightning based energy or a scourge sandswelling with sand magic.

 

In terms of lore, how does a mechanist suddenly teleport from one position to another? In the wiki description and the description in-game, it states "you and your mech shadowstep to the target location". If you click on the hyperlinked "shadowstep", it directs you to the thief's skill shadowstep. So they basically just copied and pasted from the thief blink, but added a lot more to it and removed the option to return back to the original position.

 

Therefore, Shift Signet should not have the ability to blink. The active should just be the condi cleanse or maybe some superspeed to you and the mech.

[Lily.1935]

55 minutes ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

Honestly the blinking of Shift Signet doesn't even make sense in terms of lore. I can see a mesmer blinking with magic or a thief shadowstepping with rogue-like techniques or an elementalist blinking with lightning based energy or a scourge sandswelling with sand magic.

 

In terms of lore, how does a mechanist suddenly teleport from one position to another? In the wiki description and the description in-game, it states "you and your mech shadowstep to the target location". If you click on the hyperlinked "shadowstep", it directs you to the thief's skill shadowstep. So they basically just copied and pasted from the thief blink, but added a lot more to it and removed the option to return back to the original position.

 

Therefore, Shift Signet should not have the ability to blink. The active should just be the condi cleanse or maybe some superspeed to you and the mech.

What is and isn't a shadowstep seems arbitrary. Like the wiki says "Shadowteps usually require a target while teleports do not." Which is just very muddy if you ask me. Although Shadowsteps aren't exclusive to Thief and Mesmer even before this. Guardian and Revenant both had them, as did Necromancer. In fact, only Warrior and Ranger can't shadowstep. But Honestly, there really isn't a reason Ranger can't in a future elite spec... But there's a lot of arbitration with this... The Guardian skill Symbol of Blades used to be called a shadowstep but it is no longer a shadowstep even though mechanically its the same, but now its a teleport. And bladesworn can teleport too... Its all, wishy washy.

I remember hearing that shadowstepping was a form of short range mist travel like a Nightcrawler teleport from Xmen, But I can't find where I heard that from to verify if that's actually true or not. The lore behind shadowstepping is very very muddy as well as the difference between what is a teleport and what is a shadowstep. Basically, don't get hung up on the lore since its whatever arena net wants it to be.

[draxynnic.3719]

3 hours ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

Honestly the blinking of Shift Signet doesn't even make sense in terms of lore. I can see a mesmer blinking with magic or a thief shadowstepping with rogue-like techniques or an elementalist blinking with lightning based energy or a scourge sandswelling with sand magic.

 

In terms of lore, how does a mechanist suddenly teleport from one position to another? In the wiki description and the description in-game, it states "you and your mech shadowstep to the target location". If you click on the hyperlinked "shadowstep", it directs you to the thief's skill shadowstep. So they basically just copied and pasted from the thief blink, but added a lot more to it and removed the option to return back to the original position.

 

Therefore, Shift Signet should not have the ability to blink. The active should just be the condi cleanse or maybe some superspeed to you and the mech.

From a lore perspective, we can probably view mechanist as being primarily a jade tech expert. The distinction between this and regular engineering is primarily the jade mechs, but we do see jade tech teleportation devices. So, from that perspective, it's not unreasonable for mechanists to have a jade tech device that offers a line-of-sight teleport.

[Yellow Rainbow.6142]

People are still after Mech?