Achievement Timegate Cap should not be 20 years!

[Bladestrom.6425]

incidentally, every mmorpg has retired achievements, including WOW.

Edit, ok i think i see it now, you are referring to wow feats of strength, so this is about numbers, but again its irrelevant, the determining factor is time you spend in game doing achievements and how efficiently you progress them.  If you stop looking at other people and remember its just a track of your progress then your only concern is if you don't have access to enough Achievements to feed you game time, and the ratio of retirement achievements to active is so miniscule that it does not impact this until you yourself is a 10-20 year old vet.

Edited October 23, 2022 by vesica tempestas.1563

[just.9782]

13 hours ago, Silent.6137 said:

1. A MMO that can be finished is an end of the road MMO. It means they are not adding any new achievements and/or contents.
2. It is basically asking for free stuffs. With every 500 APs, you get combos of Skins, MF+, Coins+, Karma+, XP+, Laurel+, Gold+ & Gems+. Achievement point rewards
3. Other than for Festivals, there are NO time-gates (unless you want to include Daily and Weekly). Some achievements has been retired for various reasons but they only offer 361 APs total. GW1 offers 550 APs, so if you must, get those. Those totals 911 APs. So, where's the 40k vs 50k differences you're talking about? Retired Achievements
4. Again, what time-gates from APs are you refering to? Do you expect to get all the annual customs points from Festivals since their inceptions for each of them? They are called Festivals for a reason. Not year round events, And the customs for all the festivals total 2585 APs to date.
5. You want to be equal to someone who has been playing for 17 years (GW1)? Or 10 years (GW2)? Have you even gotten more than half of the available APs yet?

All achievements and points available

How close minded are you? He was very clear
1.An MMO that has many people finishing it simply adds another expansion and achievements. But those can still be finished 
2. He said it so many times. no free stuff. Just let people do them 10 times like veterans and catch up. It will take me the same time and efford. Its not free.
3. Read more carefully. The numbers were an example. GW1 shoul just give unique skins or titles not points that people measure and compete in the leaderboards. Simple.
4.Whenever every festival is up to allow us to repeat the annual until we have reached the cap
5. If someone in 3 years have played the same time with someone who plays for 10. Then YES. He should expect to be equal! Because they have played the same time. if next year one have more play time than the veteran simply because they have more free time. They should be able to pass them in the leaderboard.
Why do leaderboards even exist?

Edited October 23, 2022 by just.9782

[mythical.6315]

On 10/20/2022 at 10:11 AM, Vavume.8065 said:

They should reduce the cap down to 500 ap, I agree it is not fair to new players.

How is it not fair to new players?

[Silent.6137]

1 hour ago, just.9782 said:

How close minded are you?
1.An MMO that has many people finishing it simply adds another expansion and achievements. But those can still be finished 
2. I said it so many times. no free stuff. Just let me do them 10 times like veterans and catch up. It will take me the same time and efford. Its not free.
3. Read more carefully. The numbers were an example. GW1 shoul just give unique skins or titles not points that people measure and compete in the leaderboards.
4. I whenever every festival is up to allow us to repeat the annual until we have reached the cap
5. If I in 3 years have played the same time with someone who plays for 10. Then YES. I expect to be equal! Because we have played the same time. if next year i have more play time simply because i have more free time. I should be able to pass them in the leaderboard.

Nice start by hurling insults first instead of simply debating the points!

1. Then it is not finished as long as it's ongoing. GW2 is not done. There will be more Achievement added with the implementation of more contents.
2. It is free stuffs whether you want to admit it or not. And get them faster. Else why ask for the easy APs? You gain everything faster with each level of rewards. If not for the rewards, then it is just a useless number. "Current maximum achievable from Achievement Point Rewards - MF: +36%; Coins: +33%; Karma: +48%; XP: +72%; Laurel: 322; Gold: 587; Gems: 4800" + Achievement chests.
3. Are you suggesting that they should put all the achievements from GW1 available even if you don't have the story or maps available? And get rid of the achievements already earned by those veteran players?
4. So you can earn your next rewards in a couple of days. YES! FREE STUFFS.
5. Are you even anywhere close to the top Leaders? And my question remains. Have you even completed more than half of the available Achievements yet? Or just looking to get the easy APs fast?

It all boils down to wanting rewards faster and more. Get APs just for bragging rights? It's possible a few players only care about that but I doubt this is the case unless OP has already completed majority of the achievements.

1 hour ago, just.9782 said:

2. He said it so many times.

Edited 57 minutes ago by just.9782

1 hour ago, just.9782 said:

2. I said it so many times.

Noticed the edits? OP switching accounts to support own arguments. Too obvious especially with one account being brand new and this account being 3 years old - how long OP said he has been playing.

 

Edited October 23, 2022 by Silent.6137

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

If everyone could acquire all Festival APs in one go, what would be the incentive to play the Festivals for many?  Would there not be 'new player' (each year) threads lamenting the lack of population in Festivals, then?

[Khisanth.2948]

19 hours ago, Reverielle.3972 said:

It's a computer game.

and not a checklist simulator

an arbitrary checklist to boot since there are a bunch of 0 AP achievements so by OP's definition you can "complete" the game without even having to check off everything

19 hours ago, Reverielle.3972 said:

Play the game for fun and focus on what you can do and enjoy,

on the other hand maybe some people only have fun while checking off lists

 

[kharmin.7683]

1 hour ago, just.9782 said:

 
2. He said it so many times. no free stuff. Just let people do them 10 times like veterans and catch up.

Catch up?  Catch up to whom or what, exactly?  AP is a personal gauge, not a competition or a race.

[Khisanth.2948]

On 10/20/2022 at 11:42 PM, Solvar.7953 said:

I also wonder if there was 0 AP available for completing festival rewards, if the effect of that is festivals would be much less populated.  I know one of my motivations for doing the festival achievements is the relatively easy to get 50 AP.

There is also the very obvious cosmetic item added each year and we have at least 3 more years to go for Sparking Stone's inventory to fill out all possible weapon types.

[Debesyla.7102]

To be fair it's a great point - the cap should be 50 years, because what will we do after 20th game anniversary?

[Ashen.2907]

22 hours ago, Minoitis.3804 said:

i never asked for anything for free)

You asked for equity between those who have spent more than a decade acquiring rewards and someone who has spent an hour. That is a request for free things for the 1 hour person (unless it is a request that all rewards be taken away from anyone who has spent more time accumulating rewards than the 1 hour person).

As it stands, if you want it, you will have more AP than I do now by the time you have played as much as I have now. Asking that someone be given, immediately upon creating an account (at which point they are the new player you describe) what took everyone else 10 years to acquire is asking for free things.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Ashen.2907

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

44 minutes ago, Debesyla.7102 said:

To be fair it's a great point - the cap should be 50 years, because what will we do after 20th game anniversary?

The Achievement didn't start in 2012, so we will still be working toward the cap. 

[Labjax.2465]

1 minute ago, Ashen.2907 said:

You asked for an equity between those who have spent more than a decade acquiring rewards and someone who has spent an hour. That is a request for free things for the 1 hour person (unless it is a request that all rewards be taken away from anyone who has spent more time accumulating rewards than the 1 hour person).

As it stands, if you want it, you will have more AP than I do now by the time you have played as much as I have now. Asking that someone be given, immediately upon creating an account (at which point they are the new player you describe) what took everyone else 10 years to acquire is asking for free things.

No, it's pretty clear to me they are asking for it to be possible for someone who came in late to catch someone who has been here forever. This is someone who is clearly willing to put in a huge amount of effort to catch up if they aren't going to be stonewalled on it by time-gates. And because video game discourse is so one-dimensional, people are saying they want stuff for free, cause that's one of like the three total talking points that people use.

Some people say you can complete dailies in like 5 minutes. If you add that up for once a day for 4 years or so, that's like 121 hours, if I'm not screwing up the math here. If you played 4 hours a day, every day, and spent all your game time working on that objective (were it possible to rush it) it'd take you about a month to catch up (~30 days in my calculations). The exact numbers aren't really important here though, the point is to illustrate the difference time gates make in whether it's possible for someone to catch up. "Played as much" is a misleading way of framing it, in this way. Over time, you can outpace a person who has been playing for ten years if they played casually and you don't, but in terms of actual objectives in the game, you'll mainly be outpacing them on hours played. Some objectives, you won't be able to outpace them on because of time-gates.

[b k.1648]

For the most part, GW2 doesn't gate progress too hard in the areas that matter for gameplay. You can compete in PvP, WvW, and pull your weight in PvE groups within a relatively short time at the same power level as everyone else.

Achievement points are a rare exception, and they're allowed to be an exception because they don't have any impact on the rest of the game.

Choosing to compete with veteran players on achievement points, and then complaining that you can't catch up, is picking the only form of "competition" you're guaranteed to lose and then complaining that you lost.

[Randulf.7614]

I have 31k ap. It doesn’t make me better than anyone, so I’m not sure what the rush to catch up is all about.

[Silent.6137]

2 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

 And because video game discourse is so one-dimensional, people are saying they want stuff for free, cause that's one of like the three total talking points that people use.

So, what's the point of getting Top APs? Something that few will even notice. If not for the rewards, then Just for bragging rights?

2 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

Some people say you can complete dailies in like 5 minutes.

Some days, it can be completed in less than 2 mins but not often. And this include screen loading time. Example: Big Spender + Guild Hall farming (same hall and farming with Reaping/Industry glyphs) and Vista. Most will usually take about 5 mins or so if chosen carefully.

----

Aside from those, fast Dailies includes JPs with Mesmers, Master of Monuments, Mystic Forge, Home Instance farmings, OW farmings  at rich nodes, etc. Reset Bounties  and Master of Monuments can be timed to finish immediately after reset to save time.

Daily/easy dailies is especially helpful for those who wants to complete them fast.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Silent.6137

[Labjax.2465]

1 hour ago, Silent.6137 said:

So, what's the point of getting Top APs? Something that few will even notice. If not for the rewards, then Just for bragging rights?

What's the point of winning a PvP match? What's the point of getting a rare skin? What's the point of beating a difficult raid boss before others do? Video games are full of features that feed into competitive mindset. Hell, games as a thing in general going back to chess are competitive. Why would AP be any different? You might as well ask, "what is the point of competition?"

[Ashen.2907]

6 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

No, it's pretty clear to me they are asking for it to be possible for someone who came in late to catch someone who has been here forever.

As stated in the post you quoted that is already possible.

They specified being on equal footing now.

[Reverielle.3972]

8 hours ago, Khisanth.2948 said:

...

on the other hand maybe some people only have fun while checking off lists

 

 

Oh absolutely, I'm glad you agree. Just don't become a slave to it as I said above.
 

Keep a sensible perspective. Too many become obsessed with it. Just do what you can and don't worry about that which you can't, for there is almost certainly bound to be something. 

[Silent.6137]

4 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

What's the point of winning a PvP match? What's the point of getting a rare skin? What's the point of beating a difficult raid boss before others do? Video games are full of features that feed into competitive mindset. Hell, games as a thing in general going back to chess are competitive. Why would AP be any different? You might as well ask, "what is the point of competition?"

What's the common denominator for most of them? $$$. Or in terms of MMOs, Loots, Loots, Loots..

What comes after recognitions for being first or best? Yes, rewards. Sponsorships, etc. First to kill a hard boss? Recognitions and be the first to receive the rewards. Why would AP be any different?

Do you think the winners are satisfied with just winning and can now go hide in obscurity because they have achieved their goals? Don't kid yourself. It's the prize that comes after that's most important.

Rare skins? Rare items? That translate into name recognitions for those who has them, which are also a form of rewards.

Personal satisfaction of being one of the top dogs? OP won't even get within spitting distance of it. And by trying to do it through short-cuts to boot? Hmmm... If it's just achievements OP wants, he/she will have lots to do without these easy APs OP is asking for. And will not even come close to finishing them anytime soon.

Edited October 24, 2022 by Silent.6137

[Labjax.2465]

3 hours ago, Ashen.2907 said:

As stated in the post you quoted that is already possible.

They specified being on equal footing now.

It isn't, what are you talking about. Why is this thread full of people just straight up lying about how the game works.

[Nash.2681]

On 10/20/2022 at 6:49 AM, Minoitis.3804 said:

Ap matters, they are competitive.

Is it 2013 again and the lfg is full of "CoF p1 farm, 4 War 1 Mes, 4k AP min. or kick" searches?

 

[costepj.5120]

7 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

Why would AP be any different? You might as well ask, "what is the point of competition?"

I think the issue is calling them "Achievement" points, when most of them are anything but. I understand competition in competitive game modes, but in co-operative open world gaming?? So many APs I've "earned" are a direct result of help from other players ... leading me through dungeons, carrying me through T4 fractals, porting me through hard JPs etc.

There are lots of things you can count and measure in sport which don't merit any celebration. If your football team loses 1-0 but forced the most corners in the game, they don't do a lap of honour before leaving the pitch.

[Shadows Creed.3902]

These posts always make me laugh and end up being the same:   "I am at 20k ish and suddenly realize achieves are hard to get so i want it lowered to catch up"

 

Achieves aren't a competitive advantage so there is no real reason to be removing etc.  If you feel that passionate about the XP/Karma +1% boost ya get.. by all means have it they essentially worthless with how many lvl 80 scrolls are in game.

 

Also love no one has complained yet about GW1 achieves that is a legit solid chunk. 

 

When someone hits like 46K+ and is missing just retired ones to be rank 1 mathematically then i will entertain this. but complaining when you sub 30k is just funny at best. 

[Dinas Dragonbane.2978]

11 hours ago, Silent.6137 said:

 

What comes after recognitions for being first or best? Yes, rewards. Sponsorships, etc. First to kill a hard boss? Recognitions and be the first to receive the rewards. Why would AP be any different?

Do you think the winners are satisfied with just winning and can now go hide in obscurity because they have achieved their goals? Don't kid yourself. It's the prize that comes after that's most important.

Rare skins? Rare items? That translate into name recognitions for those who has them, which are also a form of rewards.

Is the #1 AP holder sponsored by anet or anybody for that matter? Does anybody know who that person is and/or want to know? I fail to see how AP is the same as those things, because for all this talk about catching up, what happens to the OP when they DO catch up? Anything of note? 

Cue Colin Johansen's sword swinging: "I got an AP! I got an AP AGAIN!"

The real question behind this is a personal one to the OP: Why does this matter, to you?

[Izzy.2951]

On 10/20/2022 at 8:06 PM, Randulf.7614 said:

Why do new players need to compete with veteran players on achievements?

Because this game is based around gathering achivements (theres even a leaderboard), and every piece of content doesnt matter if is pve instanced, open world, pvp, wvw... has this. 

But the current situation is that the achivement ladder is a fake, no1 can compete with those players unless you have been playing gw2 10 years nonstop, even the veterans cannot compete with those players if they have stopped playing the game for some years.

Why? cos doing permanent achivement is USELESS, specially the ones from Pof onwards that gives what 1-2 points? when there are thousands of points retired from the game that are no longer obteinable like monthlys, retired achivements etc...

So achivements should be the dailys, the permanent ones, and anual events only. All the monthlys and retired achivements or either you give those points to all the players so we can all "kinda" be competitive and have fun, or either retire those points from players but keep the rewards and put some new ones when they get there again.

This just discourages new players or players that have been  playing for years but still cannot compete cos this problem. So ppl end up not doing them since its a waste of time and effort. Missing also cool story stuff. And making the "re-playable" content of gw2 not that replayable anymore.

Edited October 25, 2022 by Izzy.2951