If You Give out CC's like Candy, at least give out more Breakstuns

[Yerlock.4678]

2 isn't enough much of the time. So often a stun break only leads to another cc from something else 2 milliseconds later. And considering how much damage there is in this game (scepter ele and chrono shatter to name a few) every split second counts when breaking a cc. 

 

You're being seriously stingy giving many classes/specs stability when it isn't a bunker spec, so at least give us the option to break the bloody cc more of the time instead of having to insanely monitor our breakstuns and time it perfectly else we seriously screw up and die because there was a follow up cc right after. 

[Terrorhuz.4695]

I hate you lot so much

[Hotride.2187]

Usually if you break stun and get CCed immediately, you are either being focused very hard or you used stunbreak early. With a few exceptions where you must stunbreak dodge.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

I mean, with Berserker you can run 5 stunbreaks on your keyboard and 1 via traits, so it isn't like some specs don't have that kind of stunbreak access already.

[The Boz.2038]

Sane people asked for grace period for CC and conditions you stunbreak/cleanse.
Those sane people were drowned out by some very loud voices every single time.

[Fueki.4753]

I have proposed multiple ways to deal with CC spam in the past.

However, apparently they think that being disabled and eaten alive is engaging combat.

Edited December 16, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

I don't think we need more stunbreaks (most professions have an abundance of options), but we need more access to on-demand stability.

 

For instance, Warrior's balanced stance and Dolyak signet are both stunbreaks and sources of stab and would be ideal for this purpose. However, their 60s CDs make them hard to justify vs other stunbreaks or utilities with literally half the CD.  Reducing the CD of these skills to 40-45s would provide a more cost effective source of both stunbreak and stab that would address the CC spam.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

19 hours ago, gmmg.9210 said:

2 isn't enough much of the time. So often a stun break only leads to another cc from something else 2 milliseconds later. And considering how much damage there is in this game (scepter ele and chrono shatter to name a few) every split second counts when breaking a cc. 

 

You're being seriously stingy giving many classes/specs stability when it isn't a bunker spec, so at least give us the option to break the bloody cc more of the time instead of having to insanely monitor our breakstuns and time it perfectly else we seriously screw up and die because there was a follow up cc right after. 

 

Nah, hard disagree.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander. 2-3 stunbreaks is enough for most engagements. If you need additional stability, adjust your build.

. If you're getting disabled, stunbreak, then get disabled immediately after, I'd chalk that up more to not managing your stunbreak/evades properly moreso than an issue with cc. Imagine what your stunbreak suggestion would do to your interaction with power berserker. 

If you're going to make use of builds that dish this out to other players, you should be able to tolerate it happening to you, especially in the case of chrono shatter/scepter ele since those two builds usually run extremely glass and have narrow windows for burst that can be completely mitigated with one good evade.

18 hours ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

I hate you lot so much

lol lmao, I understand this energy.

Getting targeted for having too much cc, even indirectly, from a warrior would be immensely frustrating if the shoe were on the other foot.

Nah man, stunbreak then dodge arcane blast then look out for gust and comet/ stunbreak then dodge mes burst and hide behind a wall, you're more dangerous in the stunlock department. 

 

Edited December 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

12 hours ago, CalmTheStorm.2364 said:

I don't think we need more stunbreaks (most professions have an abundance of options), but we need more access to on-demand stability.

 

For instance, Warrior's balanced stance and Dolyak signet are both stunbreaks and sources of stab and would be ideal for this purpose. However, their 60s CDs make them hard to justify vs other stunbreaks or utilities with literally half the CD.  Reducing the CD of these skills to 40-45s would provide a more cost effective source of both stunbreak and stab that would address the CC spam.

Nah I disagree with this too. I would agree with you before the shipping of stalwart strength, but we're no longer in that timeline and cannot ask for certain things right now.

You could make a case for bladesworn specific stability, but not balanced stance or anything that would affect spellbreaker anymore. You have to consider there will be scenarios where, like some spellbreakers did with resistance spam, players will stack a lower cd balanced stance on top of stalwart strength and just become immune to CC. Don't get us put on a fast track back to the shadow realm.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[bethekey.8314]

13 hours ago, CalmTheStorm.2364 said:

 

For instance, Warrior's balanced stance and Dolyak signet are both stunbreaks and sources of stab and would be ideal for this purpose. However, their 60s CDs make them hard to justify vs other stunbreaks or utilities with literally half the CD.  Reducing the CD of these skills to 40-45s would provide a more cost effective source of both stunbreak and stab that would address the CC spam.

Holy moly a warrior advocating for more warrior stunbreaks/stab to help against stun meta, for which warrior is the main culprit. Do you know what it's like fighting against a spellbreaker or hammer warrior as a 1 stunbreak engi without any sources of stab?

[roederich.2716]

Stuns and movement infringing conditions are indeed a powerful tool to land your damage after so actually using these should also include to have skill to time them properly. But currently the game literally feels like immob and stuns are basic attacks. Some classes just chain it and you guys justify it by saying warrior (a single class out of 9) can carry several stunbreaks using a one certain espec (a single espec out of 27 plus 9 core variants) No further words for this.

You guys wonder why nobody wants to play this gamemode anymore…

Edited December 17, 2022 by roederich.2716

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

19 minutes ago, roederich.2716 said:

Some classes just chain it

 

Some classes do just chain it, but I do not often see situations where stuns being chained was not preceded by a failure to dodge a key skill, nor have I seen many situations where the damage portion of the chain (since stuns do no damage) was inescapable in such a way that managing a stunbreak differently would not have avoided the whole situation.

19 minutes ago, roederich.2716 said:

Stuns and movement infringing conditions are indeed a powerful tool to land your damage after so actually using these should also include to have skill to time them properly. 

 

If you know of any such instances, elaborate.

If there are classes that are particularly susceptible to this with no means of mitigating these situations by playing a bit differently vs certain matchups, or if the cc delivered does not require skill to land, also elaborate.

We can't speak in generalities about this, because some classes require CC to land damage, and asking for blanket adjustments to them when the ccs already do no damage and provide significant time to use a stunbreak/escape if caught is probably a -bit- too much coddling.

Be specific. The alternative is direct damage, which people also hated. If a class is cc rolling you and you think it shouldn't, explain why and what it should do instead. 

 

 

Edited December 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Zekent.3652]

4 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Holy moly a warrior advocating for more warrior stunbreaks/stab to help against stun meta, for which warrior is the main culprit. Do you know what it's like fighting against a spellbreaker or hammer warrior as a 1 stunbreak engi without any sources of stab?

Yeah, because engi barely have CCs, dmg and stunbreaks 🧢🧢🧢

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

7 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Holy moly a warrior advocating for more warrior stunbreaks/stab to help against stun meta, for which warrior is the main culprit. Do you know what it's like fighting against a spellbreaker or hammer warrior as a 1 stunbreak engi without any sources of stab?

Bro.... If you choose to run one stun break and no stab, whose fault is that? You absolutely have the ability to take more; if you decide not to and get CC locked as a result, that's on you. You can't expect the game to revolve around your wishes just so you can run a risky build and not get punished for it. I find it necessary to run at least 2 and preferably 3 stunbreaks, including a source of on-demand stab, to have a chance against being focused down. I can choose to take less, but if I get CC locked as a result, I have no one to blame but myself. Them's the breaks.

 

 

Also, don't act like engi (especially holo) can't chain CC like crazy. In fact, most professions are capable of high CC builds. Warrior is capable of high CC, true, but so is most everything else. The wealth of CC out there isn't just the result of one profession, especially in a conquest match.

Edited December 17, 2022 by CalmTheStorm.2364

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

9 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Nah I disagree with this too. I would agree with you before the shipping of stalwart strength, but we're no longer in that timeline and cannot ask for certain things right now.

You could make a case for bladesworn specific stability, but not balanced stance or anything that would affect spellbreaker anymore. You have to consider there will be scenarios where, like some spellbreakers did with resistance spam, players will stack a lower cd balanced stance on top of stalwart strength and just become immune to CC. Don't get us put on a fast track back to the shadow realm.

A few things:

1) I was advocating that all professions have at least one good source of on-demand stab.  I provided potential examples from Warrior because that's what I'm most familiar with.  

 

2) Stalwart Strength doesn't provide on-demand stab, and generally is most effective in a large teamfight where you are likely to CC at least something. In a 1v1 or smaller scale fight, gaining stab after you CC'd an enemy doesn't help as much because, well, they're already CC'd and probably won't be CC'ing you back.  

 

I'm not saying SS isn't good, but I am saying that it doesn't address the need for on-demand stab that is the counter to being rag-dolled.  And again, I'm saying this for all professions, not Warrior specifically.

[shion.2084]

11 hours ago, Zizekent.2398 said:

Yeah, because engi barely have CCs, dmg and stunbreaks 🧢🧢🧢

It’s true that engi have lots of stun break options, but look at any competitive build, like tools holo and you’ll only see one on it.

 

sometimes you’ll get 2 like elixir U and E gun…. But elix u is a long cd and needed for burst so using it for the stun break  is very detrimental 

[shion.2084]

Basically things have hit an absurdity where the only real defence against CC spam is to have it yourself and CC the opponent first.  Which ironically just perpetuates more and mor CC 

[Morwath.9817]

The best CC break is *dodge*.

[Eugchriss.2046]

6 minutes ago, Morwath.9817 said:

The best CC break is *dodge*.

says the mirage

[Morwath.9817]

8 minutes ago, Eugchriss.2046 said:

says the mirage

 

I've total 105 games as Mesmer done in 10 years. Probably less than 5 as Mirage.

[Fueki.4753]

7 hours ago, shion.2084 said:

but look at any competitive build, like tools holo and you’ll only see one on it.

While I also think that CC is too over-bearing, you should just adjust such a "competitive build" to better suit your personal play and capability levels.

Just taking a build made by others and hard-headedly trying to play it as is usually won't do much good.

Edited December 18, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[Chewy Komeiji.2576]

Stability should be removed from the game altogether and hard CC should only be on elite skills, ever.

 

Problem solved.

[Shao.7236]

And I remember seeing demands for damage on CC. Afaik you can literally afk CC skills and stunbreak only when you see damage coming.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

11 minutes ago, Shao.7236 said:

And I remember seeing demands for damage on CC. Afaik you can literally afk CC skills and stunbreak only when you see damage coming.

^^^^^^^^^

Seriously, some people need to learn when to stunbreak almost as much as learning when to dodge.

[Eugchriss.2046]

2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

^^^^^^^^^

Seriously, some people need to learn when to stunbreak almost as much as learning when to dodge.

I ve never understood this argument. Who CC without following up with dmg?