Super hard solo pve unlockables

[Fipmip.7219]

It strikes me that there's nothing particularly difficult to obtain in the game for solo players. there's a lot of very time consuming things, but none that really demand a combination of build, skill, patience and willpower. In runescape there's blood torva, in ff14 you have the palace of the dead. I feel GW2 is really missing that piece of gear or mount or title that once you see, you know you're looking at someone that can really play videogames real gud.

I know the precedent for GW2 shies away from this philosophy. But couldn't that also mean its about time? We have achievements tied to hardcore group experiences. its not like theres not hard stuff in the game. but what about something solo? one that really pits you against the game with no help, no allies, just a serious challenge you can sit down and take anytime, and a prestigious award at the end.

[Surelia.2651]

I mean, it's kind of subjective I suppose but in my view accomplishing something incredibly difficult with a group vs doing it alone can be a lot harder imho, since there are so many variables that need to be just right for everything to work.  When you are alone, you will know what, where, when, and how you will do something.  It's all on you and that's all there is.  So it's far more simple in terms of process.  

That said, considering the amount of "sellers" in so many MMOs now anyway, including here, I don't know that all titles and skins necessarily always mean what you think they do.  Plenty of people get carried to skins and titles, and play the game horribly. 

If they were to introduce something for solo, I would hope there could be some assurance that it could not be circumvented in some way, so that it would have real meaning if you achieved it.

[Gop.8713]

gw2 has always been more about builds and time investment than 'skill', which imo is a good thing for an mmo, keeps everything accessible to everyone. That's not the same thing as saying everything is designed for everyone, just that there's not much content that's limited to 'elite' players. It's just not that kind of game . . .

"Accomplishments" in this game have always been about how ppls choose to invest their time, idk if there is any compelling reason that should change . . ?

[Surelia.2651]

14 minutes ago, Gop.8713 said:

gw2 has always been more about builds and time investment than 'skill', which imo is a good thing for an mmo, keeps everything accessible to everyone. That's not the same thing as saying everything is designed for everyone, just that there's not much content that's limited to 'elite' players. It's just not that kind of game . . .

"Accomplishments" in this game have always been about how ppls choose to invest their time, idk if there is any compelling reason that should change . . ?

Long term goals in this game have always included improving your skills in the game.  It's an integral part of end game, and is the reason why we do not have gear progression in the first place.  You are supposed to be improving how you play, not just your stats.   Builds only get you so far.

There is nothing wrong with wanting to have a skin or title to reflect that in the game.  Anet obviously wants to address that in any case, given the recent intro of the leggy purple title on the new CM for example.

[DeanBB.4268]

Is this about the bling or about personal satisfaction? If the latter, being able to solo stuff that would normally be group content could scratch that itch. If it is all about the bling, well, aren't there titles in WvW/PvP for "killed a million players" and such?

[Fipmip.7219]

11 hours ago, Surelia.2651 said:

I mean, it's kind of subjective I suppose but in my view accomplishing something incredibly difficult with a group vs doing it alone can be a lot harder imho, since there are so many variables that need to be just right for everything to work.  When you are alone, you will know what, where, when, and how you will do something.  It's all on you and that's all there is.  So it's far more simple in terms of process.  

That said, considering the amount of "sellers" in so many MMOs now anyway, including here, I don't know that all titles and skins necessarily always mean what you think they do.  Plenty of people get carried to skins and titles, and play the game horribly. 

If they were to introduce something for solo, I would hope there could be some assurance that it could not be circumvented in some way, so that it would have real meaning if you achieved it.

I mean the point about solo being more simple is exactly the draw of the concept. in group content, you might be carried, you might be the weakest of a strong team, or you might have to deal with others. the simplicity of solo makes it much easier to be invested in, both as someone doing it or seeing someone else do it. because there's no ambiguity. Its not like things have be easier just because they're solo. there's some insanely hard stuff to do out there, like beating halo 2 on LASO without dying. The fact that its so straightforwards is what makes it appealing.

[Kitty.4806]

11 hours ago, Fipmip.7219 said:

It strikes me that there's nothing particularly difficult to obtain in the game for solo players. there's a lot of very time consuming things, but none that really demand a combination of build, skill, patience and willpower. In runescape there's blood torva, in ff14 you have the palace of the dead. I feel GW2 is really missing that piece of gear or mount or title that once you see, you know you're looking at someone that can really play videogames real gud.

I know the precedent for GW2 shies away from this philosophy. But couldn't that also mean its about time? We have achievements tied to hardcore group experiences. its not like theres not hard stuff in the game. but what about something solo? one that really pits you against the game with no help, no allies, just a serious challenge you can sit down and take anytime, and a prestigious award at the end.

Okay bro go enjoy your predatory subscription based game. GW2 is not a single player game bud.

[Linken.6345]

25 minutes ago, Fipmip.7219 said:

I mean the point about solo being more simple is exactly the draw of the concept. in group content, you might be carried, you might be the weakest of a strong team, or you might have to deal with others. the simplicity of solo makes it much easier to be invested in, both as someone doing it or seeing someone else do it. because there's no ambiguity. Its not like things have be easier just because they're solo. there's some insanely hard stuff to do out there, like beating halo 2 on LASO without dying. The fact that its so straightforwards is what makes it appealing.

Did you play during path of fire release?

If so do you remember this guy?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Eater_of_Souls

That had to be nerfed because blue bar and sucking life steal effect was to hard for people.

Do you really think your idea got any tracktion after that?

[Eekasqueak.7850]

Do the arena fights in festival of the four winds count? 

[Shuzuru.3651]

Well, while there isn't much on it, there are actually a few of them.

The ones that came in mind are the liadri minipet and the turai ossa title.

Sure they have been powercreeped a bit, but are still fairly challenging.

While not tied to cosmetics, some achievement and adventures provide some nice challenges, manifest of self doubt in lw3 ep6 without the sak and scrap rifle test/shooting stand adventures came in mind instantly

[Ashantara.8731]

21 hours ago, Fipmip.7219 said:

but none that really demand a combination of build, skill, patience and willpower.

The Queen's Gauntlet's Kingslayer and Liadri titles come to mind, or some of the mount adventures on master tier, and other things, like certain story achievements (like two of the achievements during the Shining Blade trials), that do indeed require skill, patience and willpower. (Or at least they used to back when I did them, before the power creep. 😉 )

[AliamRationem.5172]

I love things like the Queen's Gauntlet, although it's obviously suffering from power creep.  The problem with "hard" solo content is the classes aren't even remotely balanced for it.  You have builds like condi reaper that have more sustain than most classes can muster on a full celestial sustain build while also dealing more damage than those classes are capable of on their full DPS glass cannon builds.  Self-boon support is also all over the place, with some classes enjoying easy access while others have to sacrifice their first born just to get a taste.

The harder you design the content, the more these issues come to bear.  Queen's Gauntlet works because the DPS check is laughable with the power creep that's occurred since it released.  It barely matters what build you bring.  I suppose you could design puzzle/gimmick fights like 8 orb Liadri, but that strongly favors high mobility.  So you're probably going to run into similar balance issues where some classes are dramatically better at completing these solo challenges than others.

If you then create highly desireable rewards for these things, it's likely to create a lot of resentment.  Especially if you make the content hard enough that the casual vs. hardcore debate rears its ugly head.

[Fipmip.7219]

couple of salty people in this thread lol. the thing to remember is that these are optional side things, not required story or character progression content.

Believe it or not, these problems with power creep and build variety exist in other games too. There's multiple solutions to them, from balancing around good builds, to adding new challenges with new updates as new classes or build options come out, to adjusting the challenges themselves, to making the challenges be really long with no mistakes, to making challenges that are build independent. Either way, I'm sure the devs can find a way to create some with the particular GW2 spin on things. either way, I believe it would fill a hole in the GW2 experience. Like I said, there's hardcore group content. there's no reason to not have a solo challenge.

[Linken.6345]

44 minutes ago, Fipmip.7219 said:

couple of salty people in this thread lol. the thing to remember is that these are optional side things, not required story or character progression content.

Believe it or not, these problems with power creep and build variety exist in other games too. There's multiple solutions to them, from balancing around good builds, to adding new challenges with new updates as new classes or build options come out, to adjusting the challenges themselves, to making the challenges be really long with no mistakes, to making challenges that are build independent. Either way, I'm sure the devs can find a way to create some with the particular GW2 spin on things. either way, I believe it would fill a hole in the GW2 experience. Like I said, there's hardcore group content. there's no reason to not have a solo challenge.

You should watch some lord hizen videos here is but 1 example.

 

Edited June 16 by Linken.6345

[Albadaran.1283]

Hmmm this game is more lik ESO. It looks like many players here voted for houses. In other words: a cozy home instead of heavy battles lol.

[maxwelgm.4315]

While I do think more solo combat content would be welcome (we have, maybe not enough, but a reasonable number of adventures/puzzles/leaderboards of non-combat solo content), I also think those other games have solo content as filler for their lack of group activities that would suffice for a subscription based playerbase. GW2 gets a lot of flak for lack of content, and maybe it's even justified, but then again you can play the heck out of achievements of a given release and just come back months later without "losing" a single penny for not having played during that time, while also not really going through the cancellation of your subscription or anything like that. If the game wants you always online for whatever reason, they better have a lot of content you can also do solo - in fact, MMOs became quite good at this but Diablo IV is the one who really mastered it - GW2 is not exactly this kind of game though.

In short, I'd love if they did introduce some solo combat content where unused traitlines, utility skills and weapons would see the light of day. Strap some achievements and titles into it and we're golden. But if it was a choice in between getting this or more group content such as open world/raids/strikes/fractals, I'd always pick the latter all the way.

[Dean Calaway.9718]

On 6/14/2024 at 3:49 PM, Fipmip.7219 said:

I feel GW2 is really missing that piece of gear or mount or title that once you see, you know you're looking at someone that can really play videogames real gud.

Considering you can just straight up buy the fancy new Legendary Challenge Mode title that's suppose to be a flex...

I'd say your best best of anything like this would be the crown pavilion that puts players in solo arenas, I really wish Anet hadn't drop that idea so they could have just keep adding to it, there's other places in game that in the lore they have pit fights, like in Gendarran Fields or Black Citadel, I'm sure in a future expansion that could be something to look at where they add these bosses and keep adding them over time.

[Hotride.2187]

On 6/14/2024 at 5:49 PM, Fipmip.7219 said:

you know you're looking at someone that can really play videogames real gud

The ones who are really good at video games play MMOs? I had no idea.

[Widebody.5071]

Just go and clear a meta event alone, that'll add some spice to your gameplay. Anyways solo content players have always been frowned upon and attacked in the forums, not because of them doing anything wrong they just did things their way instead of needing a crowd around them. Doing a event in Bjora marches saw a player with their very own buffer following them around even when travelling from one spot to another, it's different strokes for different folks. There's just some who's a bit more vocal and crass about respecting others who choose to play in a way that's fun for them.

Edited June 17 by Widebody.5071

[kiroho.4738]

On 6/15/2024 at 5:03 AM, Linken.6345 said:

Did you play during path of fire release?

If so do you remember this guy?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Eater_of_Souls

That had to be nerfed because blue bar and sucking life steal effect was to hard for people.

Do you really think your idea got any tracktion after that?

Tbf, that one was inside a story instance.
Story is not supposed to be hard, it should be doable by everyone.

I don't think that example fits OP's demand for challenging solo content.

 

 

On 6/14/2024 at 4:49 PM, Fipmip.7219 said:

but what about something solo?

The thing is, it would drive the game away from it's overall cooperative philosophy.
The whole (PvE) game is designed to make people play together, not against each other or alone.

GW2 is an MMO after all, no single player RPG.
There are a few solo challenges in the game such as the queens gauntlet at the Festival of the Four Winds, but even that one a) is limited to the festival's duration and b) doesn't make you be alone. While fighting alone, there are people watching you, people talking in map chat and so on.

Other content is made for groups but also can be done solo, such as DRM's, the current private holo arena, Mad King's Ascension dungeon during Halloween and nowadays also most regular dungeons and Fractals.
There are just no special rewards for doing so. You can do it, if you want the challenge, but not if you only want to flex with something.

[Zyreva.1078]

21 hours ago, Albadaran.1283 said:

Hmmm this game is more lik ESO. It looks like many players here voted for houses. In other words: a cozy home instead of heavy battles lol.

Even ESO as super casual game has its Maelstrom Arena ...

(Kinda like a solo "raid wing" where you have to fight your way from arena to arena with different mobs and mechanics and bosses inside and increasing difficulty, but unlike in GW2 raids you can't progress to the next arena until the previous one has been cleared).

Edited June 17 by Zyreva.1078

[taara.3217]

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Edited June 18 by taara.3217

[taara.3217]

On 6/14/2024 at 5:49 PM, Fipmip.7219 said:

there's nothing particularly difficult to obtain in the game for solo players

boss soloes - it really demand a combination of build, skill and patience)

[Fipmip.7219]

It seems a lot of people dont understand the point of the post. yes you can go and solo a dungeon or something. but you cant unlock anything from that experience that is uniquely obtainable by soloing it. The idea is all about showing off that piece of armour or weapon or title or something that has prestige. Kind of like how your pvp season rank will show up next to your name.

I also find the argument that "GW2 is casual" or "Gw2 is all about being cooperative" to be poorly thought out. Adding one or two of these things wont destroy that. I'm not asking for this to be the new philosophy going forwards. Just that there's something.

[kharmin.7683]

1 hour ago, Fipmip.7219 said:

 

I also find the argument that "GW2 is casual" or "Gw2 is all about being cooperative" to be poorly thought out.

Well, this is the model that Anet has chosen to build upon.  They likely believe this to be the best use of resources to return the most profit.  Taking resources away to create content that doesn't follow the model would be, to me, an unsound business decision.