A lot of the activities in GW2 are not gameplay

[SuavePuppy.2809]

Holy semantics Batman, just say you don't like it

[Logos.5603]

38 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said:

What could the "RPG" in the word "MMORPG" (GW2 is an MMORPG) stand for? 😅

Again, the "play" in role play is not the same as the "play" that you do when you were a kid in the bathtub, for example. Words can and do mean different things in different contexts...um, homonyns they are called. In the case of role play, it means acting, or pretending to be someone (AKA a role), for example.

[Logos.5603]

20 minutes ago, Inssengrimm.7924 said:

Is the MIT definition from Rules of Play. One if not the most important and influential literature on game design.

You really are out of your league talking about things you don't understand.
 

Except this isn't a philosophical engagement with the topic. That's not the purpose of the book.

[Logos.5603]

33 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

At this point you should just check the meaning of the words you're trying to use instead of inventing your own definitions in a very obvious attempt to label anything you dislike as "not gameplay".

Yes, they do.

I mean, I like things that are not play or games. This doesn't have to do with that.

And you need to demonstrate that "they do."

[Triptaminas.4789]

Guys, it's clearly bad chatbot, debate is not possible. How can u not see it, it's not even properly coherent nor follows it's own banter chain, self contradicting every other post, I mean cmon lol. 

[Cyninja.2954]

1 minute ago, Triptaminas.4789 said:

Guys, it's clearly bad chatbot, debate is not possible. How can u not see it, it's not even properly coherent nor follows it's own banter chain, self contradicting every other post, I mean cmon lol. 

Pretty much this. Good troll bait thread. Thread has run its course by now.

[starhunter.6015]

Looks like someone just doesn't like the hearts. 

[Sobx.1758]

1 hour ago, Logos.5603 said:

I mean, I like things that are not play or games. This doesn't have to do with that.

And you need to demonstrate that "they do."

I never said you don't like anything that's not play or games, you're not responding to anything you quoted.

First you'd need to demonstrate that "they don't", but so far you only went against your own words in the opening post and then kept reinventing the definition of words because their actual meaning doesn't fit the goal you're going for. And there's hardly anything to "demonstrate" to actually understand what you said ("Games are structured, rule-based activities") and how it goes against whatever change you want to see in the game simply because... you disagree with the game's structure and rules.

And no, gw doesn't have "multiple games", it's one game with many activities and modes. You don't understand the words you're using here, so at this point you should be repeatedly sent back to dictionary like you already correctly were by multiple users in this thread.

 

And to top it all, I definitely like how the very basis of your -in reality nonexistent- argument is nothing more than an attempt to come up with the meaning of one word by disecting it into two separate words and then arguing that their definitions  (real or made up by you, at this point irrelevant) make up the exact meaning of an original word. In that case, I'm eagerly awaiting for you to start explaining to everyone that butterfly isn't a butterfly unless you're constructing a drone made of (nvm, that would be a butterdrone) witnessing a hovering butter. Wait.. that's a hoverbutter. We'd need some kind of winged butter then. I don't know, apparently you're making the rules here.

Edited August 28 by Sobx.1758

[Rogue.8235]

In terms of critical reasoning, the OP started with a conclusion then attempted to validate the conclusion by creating a series of premises which are purely suppositional and provide no factual basis.  The premises, themselves, have no validation and are essentially conclusory assertions themselves.  

When discussing the meta-physics of a concept, you begin with the premises.  Lay the groundwork which describes the structure of the concept and defines, either a priori or a posteriori, the pertinent sub-concepts.  This was not accomplished here.

The OP is essentially a demonstration of the confirmatory bias fallacy followed by belief perseverance.

[Mistwraithe.3106]

8 hours ago, Logos.5603 said:

I'm assuming you mean things like playing house and stuff? That's role play. That's a whole different use of the word "play." It the sense that we use when we say "play acting." See, this is why dictionary definitions (and common usage) are problematic when discussing essences...they are too slippery and ambiguous.

If you mean literally doing the dishes as a form of play, that's again another slippery use of the word. Here "imitation" is more accurate. People can have fun engaging in imitative behaviors, and when doing work. Doesn't mean it is play.

Well, I mean I'm not ignoring them...they are just confusing the essences of play and game. They give rise to all kinds of confusions in language and so are not really helpful. Not even as starting points.

 

Cyninja beat the chatbot on the first page when he pointed out that children often play by doing things adults do for work. Logos/the chatbot responded, as quoted, saying that this is role play which is different from play.

Yeah, nah, sorry. 5 year old kids are a better authority on what can count as play than the chatbot which hasn't ever actually played anything.

[anninke.7469]

6 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

I never said you don't like anything that's not play or games, you're not responding to anything you quoted.

First you'd need to demonstrate that "they don't", but so far you only went against your own words in the opening post and then kept reinventing the definition of words because their actual meaning doesn't fit the goal you're going for. And there's hardly anything to "demonstrate" to actually understand what you said ("Games are structured, rule-based activities") and how it goes against whatever change you want to see in the game simply because... you disagree with the game's structure and rules.

And no, gw doesn't have "multiple games", it's one game with many activities and modes. You don't understand the words you're using here, so at this point you should be repeatedly sent back to dictionary like you already correctly were by multiple users in this thread.

 

And to top it all, I definitely like how the very basis of your -in reality nonexistent- argument is nothing more than an attempt to come up with the meaning of one word by disecting it into two separate words and then arguing that their definitions  (real or made up by you, at this point irrelevant) make up the exact meaning of an original word. In that case, I'm eagerly awaiting for you to start explaining to everyone that butterfly isn't a butterfly unless you're constructing a drone made of (nvm, that would be a butterdrone) witnessing a hovering butter. Wait.. that's a hoverbutter. We'd need some kind of winged butter then. I don't know, apparently you're making the rules here.

Is the hoverbutter full of eels?

[cunningowl.8024]

Why. I lost 10 gold in the time I read that

[Tabula Rasa.7538]

That's an interesting thought you thunk. I think I understand, by your definition, what you mean when you say much of GW2 isn't gaming nor playing, but I don't agree we should be annoyed.

Many of us on the game aren't just here for gaming (beating bosses or gvg fights), or playing (jump puzzles). There's a great number of us that are simply filling our spare time (grinding), enjoy repetitive actions (1, 1, 1, F), and get a sense of satisfaction from completion (hearts). 

In comparative examples:  A gamer might like getting good at a fractal the way a runner might enjoy improving their time. A player that enjoys dressing their character up and role playing could be compared to someone that makes sand castles at the beach or going out to sing kareoke.  Someone that enjoys hearts and map completion could be compared to someone that enjoys doing 1000 piece puzzles. 

There's enough in the game to enjoy yourself in your way... leave those hearts empty if they annoy you. 🙂

[Bladestrom.6425]

18 hours ago, Logos.5603 said:

 

Why should this matter to you?

Gameplay, if it refers to anything at all, refers to these activities in video games.

Activities for heart completion are not gameplay. For example, picking poop or collecting trinkets is neither a game, nor a playful activity. Likewise, collecting materials is also not a form of gameplay. When we engage in these activities we are not playing, nor are we gaming.

As a buyer, who presumably bought the DLC to both play and game, you should be a bit annoyed that the inclusion of these activities in your video game. Especially when these non-gameplay elements make up a large part of the experience.

As a buyer, i didn't presume anything, mmoRPGs have had collection quests (aka hearts in GW2) since the beginning of RPGs in the 70s....   Collecting things is part of gameplay, it requires knowledge, the acquiring of which is a big part of gameplay.  Sounds like you don't understand MMORPG's.

Edited August 29 by Bladestrom.6425

[Darkborne.8725]

I think the GW2 forums are filled with progressive lawyers arguing over language now 😒. Language in which I am surprised many are actually engaging in. If you're having fun, you're having fun. Someone else does not need to define the parameters of your enjoyment. Live your life, and have fun.. or be miserable huffing your farts discussing what others think, and not yourself.

[Farming Flats.5370]

OP , 

This game is 12 years old. You will not change it. 

Find another game that is currently in development to talk about stuff you don't like ....

[deatine.2498]

The nice thing is, in my language there is only one word for "game" and "play", so I don't have to think about any of this. 

If you ask the leading German dictionary about the most common/primary meaning of game/play, you get "Tätigkeit, die ohne bewussten Zweck zum Vergnügen, zur Entspannung, aus Freude an ihr selbst und an ihrem Resultat ausgeübt wird;" - "activity that is performed for enjoyment or relaxation without intentional purpose, out of joy for [the activity] itself or its result".

Edited August 29 by deatine.2498

[Neathra.1950]

Finally, a thread where the stupid confused face emojis make sense.

Edited August 29 by Neathra.1950
Misspellings

[devzero.4093]

I'll just assume OP wants more fractals, strikes and raids and I agree.

[Marshall Sed.8643]

22 hours ago, Logos.5603 said:

For example, picking poop

Tamagotchi send their kindest regards........

22 hours ago, Logos.5603 said:

or collecting trinkets

Sonic would like to say "Hello!!" too.........

 

Don't like poop-picking then go kill stuff to fill the heart....don't like collecting and handing in trinkets then go kill something to fill the bar.

 

It would appear, from my perspective, that you're suffering some sort of angst while trying to have fun playing a game.......maybe this isn't the game for you....maybe you're just burned out with it.  Whatever the reason go play something else that causes you less angst and, should you feel like it, come back again refreshed.

[Neathra.1950]

19 minutes ago, Marshall Sed.8643 said:

Tamagotchi send their kindest regards........

Sonic would like to say "Hello!!" too.........

 

Don't like poop-picking then go kill stuff to fill the heart....don't like collecting and handing in trinkets then go kill something to fill the bar.

 

It would appear, from my perspective, that you're suffering some sort of angst while trying to have fun playing a game.......maybe this isn't the game for you....maybe you're just burned out with it.  Whatever the reason go play something else that causes you less angst and, should you feel like it, come back again refreshed.

I will say, as far as I can tell the first heart in Syntri can only be progressed by handing in trinkets.

But that's not a "not gameplay" problem. That's an "Anet does and Anet and forgets to flesh out the second map" problem.

[the NiKo.3762]

I suspect someone just had his first semester of undergrad philosophy...

[yoni.7015]

1 hour ago, Neathra.1950 said:

I will say, as far as I can tell the first heart in Syntri can only be progressed by handing in trinkets.

Not true. It takes a while but you don’t have to hand in the tokens. 

Edited August 29 by yoni.7015

[Dibit.6259]

And here I thought gameplay was engaging in the game in some form or another. Also play doesn't necessarily mean fun. <insert flashbacks to being forced to play sports at school 😱>

Edited August 29 by Dibit.6259
Typo

[mungozen.2379]

23 hours ago, Logos.5603 said:

You said a bunch of things and.....

As a buyer, who presumably bought the DLC to both play and game, you should be a bit annoyed that the inclusion of these activities in your video game. Especially when these non-gameplay elements make up a large part of the experience.

It's a video game, that has elements that include many types of interactions with many types of rewards.  Did you not think people would be aware of this buying an MMO?  The genre has existed for decades and while some gameplay mechanics are core to MMO (PvE and PvP), many non-gameplay activities exist as well (Fashion, RP, Exploration).

Telling the reader that "you should be a bit annoyed" because this MMO offers a lot of features that connect many different players to this game is absurd.  If you personally think the game has too much fluff, there are many other games to go play.  Or, you can choose to play the parts of the game you like and skip the parts you don't, like everyone else.