Ugh... overpriced skins

[MarshallLaw.9260]

@Adenin.5973 said:because the gemshop is where you get the cool stuff.

This is just personal opinion. I understand that many others agree with this but it's not for everyone.

@Adenin.5973 said:What a terrible waste. In other games (like Warframe) you get cashshop items but there's still a grind option that also has some story and lore for the new item. Anet needs to completely separate both ways of acquiring an item ingame and through the shop. Right now, we have only the shop, regardless where the money comes from.

The "grind" option is to get gold and convert to gems via exchange, the access is there for any player who has a non-F2P account. No need to separate as it might encourage lower gem spend and reduce game income necessary for development.

I understand your idea about all things having "lore", but then how are you going to write a story about getting your baseball cap or sunglasses or any other clown outfit for that matter? Too many random fashion items at this point to create lore about them all.

[IndigoSundown.5419]

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

Cost: Without ANet taking the time to explain their thinking, the cost difference seems arbitrary, capricious, and abrupt.

I don't know the development costs for outfits versus mountfits, but they don't seem all that different to me. If anything, I'd think designing single outifts for 5 races is trickier than rendering 5 similar mountfits for 5 different mounts. Plus, given that the two seasonal sets have a retail cost (at most) 2000 gems for five, it seems like even ANet thinks the resources required to produce them are comparable. Thus, I'd think it was in ANet's interest to explain to us the difference.

Possibilities:

• ANet did something with mount outfits that made them different and much more expensive to create than outfits. Unlikely.
• ANet is testing the market to see what the market will bear. Likely.
• ANet will explain the difference to the players. When pigs fly.

Implementation: Which brings us to how they rolled it out. Let's assume Mike O'Brien means what he said: that Mountfits really are costly to develop Let's also presume that he's right that, to sustain the game in the manner to which we are accustomed, ANet needs to find a smaller number of high-price-point items. According to him, that is more attractive to those willing and able to spend more RL cash on the game. (That sounds plausible, similar to a boat company making more money from selling a tiny number of yachts compared to selling lots of more economical vessels.)

If all that is the case, why didn't they first rollout the fancy skins, to set our expectations about high prices? Imagine if the Warmount and Raptor of Paradise were released first at 2k each. Then the Halloween bundle of 5 skins at 1.6k looks like a crazy bargain... and the mount licenses would have been amazing at "only" 400 gems each. Instead, they did the opposite: show us the bundle first and get us used to the idea that Mountfits would be priced similarly to (and perhaps less than) Outfits.

That feels more manipulative than the way they did it. Not what I would have wanted.

[Bloodstealer.5978]

@costepj.5120 said:

@"Kheldorn.5123" said:

Game is B2P.

---

Is the skin overpriced? Yes.

Will people leave because of this? No.

Will it ever change? No.

Gaming industry is one of the most disrespectful braches towards customers. Why? Because they can. Game dev companies scam theri customers every day with shady practices like lootboxes but people pay for this. Who is to blame? Customers. Stop paying, that's your only option.

If mount gate teaches us anything, bad press is irrelevant for the game. People are still playing and what's more important, people are still buying these skins. Nothing will ever change.

I completely disagree. I've been playing GW1/GW2 for nearly a decade. During that time I've spent about £150 for both games and all expansions, which have provided me with many thousands of hours of entertainment and enjoyment. That's not much more than £1 per month. There is no other branch of the entertainment industry that provides so much for so little. By contrast, I spend nearly £100 each month with my cable company.

I think the real issue is more around the choice of buying a mini metro or a Ferrari... but on closer inspection you see the Ferrari is just another min metro with a different paint job and no bells and whistles. That is what turns me away from buying skins for these silly prices.We were told these would be the real deal Ferrari skins but a wooden brick painted fancy is still a wooden brick.

[costepj.5120]

@"Kheldorn.5123" said:

whatever you or me think about this is irrelevant.

No it is not irrelevant. If you think Anet are just a bunch of scammers then you should take action. At the very least delete your account so you don't get scammed further. Words are cheap; actions count.

[Despond.2174]

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@Haleydawn.3764 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

The issue is that it takes about a year (for me at least) to get 500 gold is what I'm getting at.

500g= 250 days of just doing your daily. Unless you only log in for those 5mins/day to do your daily on semi-regular basis, then I’d believe you when you said it takes a year for you to make 500g.

Which is most of my game income actually. The daily is where I get most of my money outside the few times I do/can do Fractals.A lot of that money then goes into trying to make materials I need to craft ascended (which I still don't have a single ascended armour yet).

I have 0 clue how to make gold in this game outside of the 2 from the daily and then the certain times when I remember to do Tequila, which I just remembered I didn't get to do today.

Press Y to access LFG. Go to Core Tyira > Squads And usually there is a SW riba farm 3/4 of the time. Do that, follow the commander after the meta and loot all the chests. Open and salvage the chests on a 45-50 character, sell the mats. That's 15g/hr easily.

Search LFG once more for leather farms, meta farms. I was in a 20g/hr leather farm the other day, was a 20 man group and a good com.

Any method is fine, just use 15g/hr as a rough mark to see if it's worthwhile - though you may want to mix it up to not get bored. Sometimes I will farm something I know is not the best g/hr but it's something different.

Make sure you try do at least 1 Auric Basin and 1 Tequatl per day. You may luck out on Teq and get a free box that's worth about 60-80g in mats. You could chain TD > AB as well in HoT metas and select the amalagamanted rune to sell for 1.7g+ on top of all the other loot.

Or you could do something as simple as run across Timberlake or any tier 3-4 mat zone on a mount and mine/log. Usually it's about 1g per 5min. Either way you'll have to do something repetitive. You can also play the TP market, but you might want some bank before you do that.

[STIHL.2489]

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

[STIHL.2489]

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@"Sojourner.4621" said:a) There are "just skins" in this game that easily beat the $25 mark for gem to gold conversion, some of them came exclusively from the gem store. 2000 gems with in game gold is 528g... no one would even blink if they saw that cost for one of these skins on the TP... in fact it would be almost expected. I honestly don't see the big deal... want the skin badly enough, farm it up. It's not as hard as you think to make that kind of gold, I guarantee it.

I think this is the real problem with this discussion. 2000 gems is ~500 gold, for veteran players that's easy to get, or they already have it. If the price was much lower then it would've been even easier to get the skins by using gold. Low gem price = players buy it with gold meaning Anet doesn't make money. I believe that's why MO said individual items do not result in much revenue, I find it unthinkable that players do not buy them at all, but rather they buy them with gold due to their lower gem price.

That's one part though, because although in terms of gold it's "cheap" or something you can farm, 2000 (or $25) is not a sum worth paying in real world money. So we have a real problem here, in terms of gold it's cheap/farmable, in terms of cash it's way too expensive.

My proposal? Add gem discounts. The more gems you buy at once, the higher the discount. Of course, this would only apply to real world cash and have zero effect if you buy the gems with gold, no discount with gold. That way players have an incentive to buy "expensive" items artificially lowering the cash price, while keeping the gold price the same. In effect, they can keep the same overpriced (when bought with cash) items.

They could just raise the cost of gems for gold. IE: as opposed to 500 gold being 2000 gems.. 500 gold buys you 800 gems, and it would have the same effect.

[ReaverKane.7598]

@Sojourner.4621 said:

@"Einlanzer.1627" said:The problem with charging $25 for a mount skin is:

a.) it's just a skinb.) all the new skins so far are through the gem shopc.) we have five types of mounts that often need to be swapped between.

O'Brien defended this as industry standard, but it actually isn't - that was a disingenuous comment. In other games, $25 skins are only released occasionally as premium skins to supplement what can be found in the game, and they are usually entirely new creatures with special effects that can be used exclusively if desired by the player.

a) There are "just skins" in this game that easily beat the $25 mark for gem to gold conversion, some of them came exclusively from the gem store. 2000 gems with in game gold is 528g... no one would even blink if they saw that cost for one of these skins on the TP... in fact it would be almost expected. I honestly don't see the big deal... want the skin badly enough, farm it up. It's not as hard as you think to make that kind of gold, I guarantee it.

Which one skin exclusive from the GEMSTORE costs more than 2000 gems?I know what you mean... There's a lot of skins that got their prices inflated to be over 500 gold. But that's just because of a different aggressive marketing tactic employed by Arena Net.Under the guise of avoiding UI clutter, they keep items available only on limited time windows to increase impulse buys (buy now or you may never have the chance), what this does for unbound skins is that it makes them more scarce, which inflates their price.By that same mechanic, there's a couple green items for 5000 gold. Are they worth it? No. But it's their price, their value because you can't get those any more.

b) it took six months for a single glider skin to be obtainable in game (Ad Infinitum)... there even now are exactly three, and they are all just a bonus feature of Legendary Back Items, tacked on as an afterthought. There was NO way they were ever going to release in game attainable mount skins on an earlier timetable than this, and even if they do, they likely will require about as much time and in game gold expense as these three glider skins do.

Except, no... It took a bit over 2 months for the Ascension to be added to the game.And Glider skins at most cost 800 Gems, not 2000. There's no RNG glider box. Also there's bundles with gliders and back items, there's bundles with outfits and gliders and other stuff, all of that at equal or less than a single mount skin.

c) Okay, sure...

Also it's not really disingenuous. For account wide mount skin unlocks, actually yeah this is close to the industry standard (compare to ESO where the extra exclusive skins are $40 and the normal ones are 20-25, if they are ever even obtainable outside a loot box.) Games that charge less for mount skins tend to only give that skin on a single character as someone stated aboveWouldn't say that ESO is the industry standard, BUT ok, lets begin:1) They have SEVERAL mounts purchasable ingame. (http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Mount_(Online))2) The cheapest gemstore non RNG mount costs ~10€ (so ~800 gems) the most expensive is actually cheaper than here, because in there the more "crowns" you buy the cheaper the get, but even so if one would be dumb and buy in increments of the lowest bundle it would cost ~27€, so pretty much the same as here.(http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Crowns)3) They're all account bound. (https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/2zkt3j/crown_store_mounts_account_wide/)

Now lets look at what could be considered the industry standard, since it's definetly the most popular MMORPG, WoW:1) Has a ton of mounts available in game through simple purchases, drops, crafting, achievements, etc. These are in general Bound on Pickup. (http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Mount)2) Has a fraction of the number of ingame mounts available for 25€ (ACCOUNT WIDE) (https://eu.shop.battle.net/en-gb/product/world-of-warcraft-mount-armored-bloodwing)

FFXIV:1) Same as WoW, a ton of in-game mounts, a fraction are store bought.2) Prices vary from 12 to 30$3) Aren't account bound because the game is made so that you can have all classes on a single character, and so it's not considered necessary to have more than one character.(https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Mounts)

If GW2 would follow the same practices as those other games, you'd have a ton of in-game choices to pick before you had to resort to gemstore. As it stands even the dye channels on ingame mounts are restricted to the bare minimum possible.

Do I want to pay that for a mount skin? Not really... so I won't... unless the skin is 100% perfect. But I also won't be upset at ANet for being "disingenuous" or for not putting the skins as attainable in game, especially after they have demonstrated in the past that they really just don't do that, at all, ever.Well, Arena Net pushed it A LOT with mounts. They blow away their PREVIOUSLY DEMONSTRATED STANDARDS. And yes, some statements from MO are a bit disingenuous.I would actually counter that they have demonstrated in the past that they do, frequently, add skins attainable ingame.Discounting armor and weapons there's several outfits that are/were available ingame. The Hexed Outfit is regularly obtainable during Halloween ingame. The Royal Guard Outfit was given away to players. The old town clothes are now outfits, all of them were and still are (to a point) obtainable ingame.There's 3 Gliders obtainable ingame.A ton of minis are obtainable ingame.There's special gathering tools (not infinite tough) obtainable ingame.Boosts, Styling kits, bank access, etc are also all available through in-game rewards.Only exception is mounts. And since i don't see them adding a legendary... Mount? I doubt you'll ever get ingame mounts the same way we got gliders. Which just makes the poorly managed gemstore mounts all the worse.Because if there were in-game alternatives, that would make it different. They could say: "sure this one costs 30€, BUT you can get all those other ones in-game." Now they're saying: "whoo EA did it, we can do it too!!"

[OneYenShort.3189]

I already stated my opinions in the previous threads about this topic. I know anet will ignore it once again if I bothered to repeat myself.

I also know that after that fiasco, anet "suddenly" had several quality of life updates that players have asked for, for years. Coincidence?

And I'll make an amendment to my "never" buying a skin for 2500 gems. If they released a moa mount that was utterly dyeable (they could use the raptor as a base) I'd give up and buy that one. However, they probably can't due to Square/Enix.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@STIHL.2489 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

Keys can be obtained weekly by doing their personal story and map completion.

[MithranArkanere.8957]

The problem isn't that they are $25. The problem is that they will stay like that forever. Maybe a measly 20% discount. Then get removed to make room for other stuff.

That is BAD. Really, really. BAD.

Whatever price they start with, and whatever discounts they may get, the price needs to go down over time. So those who would never pay the full price will eventually buy it.

This is how you get the most spent by the most people: start high, eventually go down. And as the price goes down, the likelyhood of more people getting it goes up. By the time no one else or very few more people would buy it, you lower the price, and what you get is way more people buying it for the lower price, and you earn more than what you'd earn from the few people less that would pay the full price.

And the items must be made purchasable from the hero panel, so when they have to be removed from the trading post to make room for other stuff, people can still buy it. Because the last thing you need when someone wants to buy something is not having it available at all. What if the whim fades by the time it retuns? No. People has to be able to just click the icon in the hero panel, pay the price, and get it. Even if it got removed from the trading post.

Then everyone who wants something can get it. First those who can afford the full price, and over time as the price goes down and new things get added, those with less purchasing power can get it too.

And we get cash from everyone, and everyone can enjoy the stuff. All wins.

[Zedek.8932]

@"MithranArkanere.8957" said:Whatever price they start with, and whatever discounts they may get, the price needs to go down over time. So those who would never pay the full price will eventually buy it. All wins.

No. We have "this kind of customer" as well. They are still buying "Happy New Year" items TODAY because we discounted them for 70%.But we are a business and not the "hand out free stuff because people wait after certain day"-company.

Also, what's with new players? Are they supposed to get discounted items just because they are several years late?

Sorry, but since I hate this kind of "customers", I already might skip several levels of empathy and sympathy, but:It's terrible that people nag so much about such stuff. I never will drive a Lamborghini, so what?You either want an item and buy it, or you are declining it and have to live with that.But always come up to the information desk at the store and nag, nag nag, this won't get you the item.It's a store a after all, not the social welfare office. Both applies to real life point of sale and ingame transactions.

Excelsior.

P.S.

@ReaverKane.7598

WoW and FF14 have a monthly subscription. So comparing "obtainable ingame mounts" with GW2's mount system is wrong. Also, after the current rip-off of the Carbuncle mount from the Gemstore, Squeenix is doing a terrible thing.

[STIHL.2489]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

Keys can be obtained weekly by doing their personal story and map completion.

Gold can be obtained daily.. you can just buy the gems with that. Both items come from the gem store..

[MithranArkanere.8957]

@Zedek.8932 said:

@"MithranArkanere.8957" said:Whatever price they start with, and whatever discounts they may get, the price needs to go down over time. So those who would never pay the full price will eventually buy it. All wins.

No. We have "this kind of customer" as well. They are still buying "Happy New Year" items TODAY because we discounted them for 70%.But we are a business and not the "hand out free stuff because people wait after certain day"-company.

Also, what's with new players? Are they supposed to get discounted items just because they are several years late?

Sorry, but since I hate this kind of "customers", I already might skip several levels of empathy and sympathy, but:It's terrible that people nag so much about such stuff. I never will drive a Lamborghini, so what?You either want an item and buy it, or you are declining it and have to live with that.But always come up to the information desk at the store and nag, nag nag, this won't get you the item.It's a store a after all, not the social welfare office. Both applies to real life point of sale and ingame transactions.

They arrived late. And THAT is the tradeoff. Yes, they may be spending less if they arrive late. But there's way more stuff to buy, and they have way less time to play, because they lost all the time they could have spent playing if they joined earlier.

Because the extra price is not just for the item, but for getting it NOW. Just look at Steam. First a game is released for $50, DLCS for10. Those who can buy for that price buy it right on release. But eventually games go down to prices like $10-5 and DLCs for $1. And they earn way more by doing that because at some points there's no more people who can afford to pay $50, because not everyone in the world earn the same and live in the same place.There's no 'veterancy checks' that will lower the price for old steam accounts and keep it high for new accounts. The price is lowered for all. But Steam still earns more by lowering the price than by keeping it high.This way they earn the most from the most people, but also let the most people play the games without leaving anyone out.

That is what works. It isn't just the most fair considering the different levels of wealth in the world and how not everyone earns the same even in the same country, it's also what gets the most paid by the most people, thus getting more money for the company.

[Adenin.5973]

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:

@Adenin.5973 said:because the gemshop is where you get the cool stuff.

This is just personal opinion. I understand that many others agree with this but it's not for everyone.

@Adenin.5973 said:What a terrible waste. In other games (like Warframe) you get cashshop items but there's still a grind option that also has some story and lore for the new item. Anet needs to completely separate both ways of acquiring an item ingame and through the shop. Right now, we have only the shop, regardless where the money comes from.

The "grind" option is to get gold and convert to gems via exchange, the access is there for any player who has a non-F2P account. No need to separate as it might encourage lower gem spend and reduce game income necessary for development.

I understand your idea about all things having "lore", but then how are you going to write a story about getting your baseball cap or sunglasses or any other clown outfit for that matter? Too many random fashion items at this point to create lore about them all.

Okay, not every single item should have some quest (doesn't even have to be voice acted or with custom enemies or whatever). But things like the legendary mounts, balthasars helmet or grenths outfit.Imagine the possibilities for quests. It could even be some sort of collection you need to complete, whether you buy it with real game money or not. Travel back to orr, read some inscriptions in some temples, fight some undead priests or whatever, fight some reused arah dungeon boss. Doesn't have to be with cutscenes, just use what is already in the game.

If you buy it with real money you could buy all needed items for the "grenths outfit collection" instantly but you would still need to do the story (which is like a 15 min quest if you have all needed items) and if you want to do it without cash, you have to grind for certain collection items. The grind would be balanced around the game time needed to grind the gold to buy the collection items in the shop directly.

This scenario would be my dream. A quest, cheap to produce content wise, that adds a bit of lore and ties the "fancy gemstore crap" deeply to the game world. Anet would still make the same amount of money, since it's still the same amount of grind to get stuff without paying real cash and all the players, the one that use their credit card and the ones that don't have new content with meaningful rewards.

The biggest problem that gets apparent to me if you think about the scenario above is: Gemshop items are only for a very short period available. Which means the lore and quests for the new items would also only be available for a short time during one year. That's the most annoying thing probably. If they would be always there, I could start grinding for specific things. I would play with a specific goal in mind, it would feel rewarding to get it.But currently this is not possible. You have to grind in advance, just in case something pops up in the gemstore you want. You play without a real reward in mind. That's imo a very frustrating thing.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

Keys can be obtained weekly by doing their personal story and map completion.

Gold can be obtained daily.. you can just buy the gems with that. Both items come from the gem store..

It still stands that you can get keys without going to the gem store.

[STIHL.2489]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

Keys can be obtained weekly by doing their personal story and map completion.

Gold can be obtained daily.. you can just buy the gems with that. Both items come from the gem store..

It still stands that you can get keys without going to the gem store.

irrelevant to the discussion as you can get gems without paying money.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

@IndigoSundown.5419 said:

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

Implementation:

Which brings us to how they rolled it out. Let's assume Mike O'Brien means what he said: that Mountfits really are costly to develop Let's also presume that he's right that, to sustain the game in the manner to which we are accustomed, ANet needs to find a smaller number of high-price-point items. According to him, that is more attractive to those willing and able to spend more RL cash on the game. (That sounds plausible, similar to a boat company making more money from selling a tiny number of yachts compared to selling lots of more economical vessels.)

If all that is the case, why didn't they first rollout the fancy skins, to set our expectations about high prices? Imagine if the Warmount and Raptor of Paradise were released first at 2k each. Then the Halloween bundle of 5 skins at 1.6k looks like a crazy bargain... and the mount licenses would have been amazing at "only" 400 gems each. Instead, they did the opposite: show us the bundle first and get us used to the idea that Mountfits would be priced similarly to (and perhaps less than) Outfits.

That feels more manipulative than the way they did it. Not what I would have wanted.

Everything about marketing and pricing is manipulative. My point is that ANet's implementation was ineffective in Mike O'Brien's stated goal: to help support the game (and allow ANet to continue to run in the manner to which we have become accustomed).

I don't expect them to have priced Mountfits differently (even though I would have preferred them to be cheaper). I'm assuming that's not an option, that they really do have to sell more high-priced items rather than lots & lots of lower-priced ones. Given that economic reality, wouldn't you prefer that ANet handle the introduction of a new pricing system in a way that helps us get used to it, rather than what they did, which caused a lot of people to be upset enough to threaten to leave the game?

[Ayrilana.1396]

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

Keys can be obtained weekly by doing their personal story and map completion.

Gold can be obtained daily.. you can just buy the gems with that. Both items come from the gem store..

It still stands that you can get keys without going to the gem store.

irrelevant to the discussion as you can get gems without paying money.

Relevant to the side discussion you and the other user are in.

[STIHL.2489]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:I don't see the problem. In other games, they really are just skins (that run faster), and 25 for a skin, well, that's a matter of personal choice.

Just to put this in perspective.. a Scythe Skin (staff) sells for 2898 gold.. that's 10,986 Gems.. or put another way.. $137 cash.

$137 for a weapon skin.. and you all are fussing about $25 for a Mount?

Scythe Skin you can get in the game without gems so that is a very idiotic comparison.

Really.. How?

Same way I got my Ghastly Grinning Shield Skin that sells for over 2300g... BLC Wardrobe unlock. Weekly key farm. Didn't cost me a dime or gold :open_mouth:

Key farm.. like the keys I can buy in the Gem Store?

Sounds to me like its still a gem store item..

Keys can be obtained weekly by doing their personal story and map completion.

Gold can be obtained daily.. you can just buy the gems with that. Both items come from the gem store..

It still stands that you can get keys without going to the gem store.

irrelevant to the discussion as you can get gems without paying money.

Relevant to the side discussion you and the other user are in.

No, the whole point is that people will pay a lot for a skin.

What in game item they farm, be gold or keys, to find alternate paths then cash to getting the skin, is irrelevant. Think of this, how many keys would it really take to luck out on that Skin? maybe 1.. maybe 1000.. since it's random.. no one knows for sure what the chance is.. but it's rare enough that cost 2898 gold (137 dollars) on the TP to buy it outright.

and no one has a problem with this.. but they lose their minds over 550 gold for a mount skin..

[Malediktus.9250]

I am boycotting 1600-2000 gems purchases for a single skin

[Goettel.4389]

Don't want it? Don't buy it /thread

[Holykitten.3064]

@Goettel.4389 said:Don't want it? Don't buy it /thread

I like your style.

[kharmin.7683]

@"MithranArkanere.8957" said:

This is how you get the most spent by the most people: start high, eventually go down. And as the price goes down, the likelyhood of more people getting it goes up. By the time no one else or very few more people would buy it, you lower the price, and what you get is way more people buying it for the lower price, and you earn more than what you'd earn from the few people less that would pay the full price.

I'm not sold on this example. If the price will eventually go down, and everyone knows that it will, then no one will purchase at the "premium" price -- rather, they will wait for the price reduction which they know will occur. Sure, there is the likelihood of more people purchasing as the price goes down; however, there would probably not be anyone purchasing at the higher price. I know that I wouldn't.

/me shrugs

[Ayrilana.1396]

@kharmin.7683 said:

@"MithranArkanere.8957" said:

This is how you get the most spent by the most people: start high, eventually go down. And as the price goes down, the likelyhood of more people getting it goes up. By the time no one else or very few more people would buy it, you lower the price, and what you get is way more people buying it for the lower price, and you earn more than what you'd earn from the few people less that would pay the full price.

I'm not sold on this example. If the price will eventually go down, and everyone knows that it will, then no one will purchase at the "premium" price -- rather, they will wait for the price reduction which they know will occur. Sure, there is the likelihood of more people purchasing as the price goes down; however, there would probably not be anyone purchasing at the higher price. I know that I wouldn't.

/me shrugs

Tons of electronics start off selling at a premium and then gradually go down. I don’t see any reason that couldn’t occur within an online game’s store.