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Legendary Crafting Imbalance


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It takes twice as much material to craft a second one-handed weapon as it does just for a two-handed weapon. To craft one greatsword, you just need 1 desert/Maguuma mastery, mystic tribute, etc. If your toon uses a dagger in each hand, you need 2 desert/Maguuma masteries, 2 mystic tributes, etc. That’s right, you need 500 funerary incense for a 2 daggers/swords as opposed to 250 funerary incense (as well as other materials like 200 mystic curios instead of 100, 144 mystic clovers instead of 77, 500 mystic coins instead of 250, etc) for a greatsword/longbow. Yup you pay the same price to get half the stats and slots. That doesn’t make sense...

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I see your point but disagree as I think that being legendary is the thing rather than something needed for stats and slots (ascended give you all that and cost appropriately less for one-handed than two). A legendary comes with lots of effects, footfalls, etc. that are the same magnitude for one- and two-handed weapons. My impression is legendary weapons were meant to be a rare thing and that a character would not be wielding more than one (or it should be appropriately difficult to do so).

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@"ChronoPinoyX.7923" said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

and @"VDAC.2137" you might want to not assume what legendary items are supposed to be since you can't possibly know.

i couldn't give half of a flying fuck how a weapon looks, i want legendaries for their long term utility alone. 1 legendary saves me 3-4 different stat variations of each weapon type which accumulates to quite a lot of inventory slots. could be a grey stick or a black dildo with a range indicator for all i care. i can't fucking stand the shiny bling legendary skins with a billion animations that give me eye-aids whenever i have to look at them. usually i slap some non-animated neutral skins on them. and yes, i have mostly stuck to 2-handed so far because of the additional cost of making a weapon set with 1-hand + offhand.however, i do have the decency to not mirror my view on "most people".no matter what "most people" do or want, equalizing the cost for 2-handed and 1-handed+offhand would be only fair.

however, i also understand that it will never be done since having the majority of usable legendaries cost more than they should drives people into buying gems more often on average.

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@zaced.7948 said:

@"ChronoPinoyX.7923" said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

Except it's a fact that Legendary are just skins and that's the only reason why people unlock it. Nothing about Legendary makes it any better than Ascended outside of a slightly more convenient stats change. I'm not assuming anything, this is literally the only thing Legendary is made for which is skin. It's the reason Legendary weapons aren't exactly hyped up outside their appearance.

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@zaced.7948 said:

@"ChronoPinoyX.7923" said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

and @"VDAC.2137" you might want to not assume what legendary items are supposed to be since you can't possibly know.

i couldn't give half of a flying kitten how a weapon looks, i want legendaries for their long term utility alone. 1 legendary saves me 3-4 different stat variations of each weapon type which accumulates to quite a lot of inventory slots. could be a grey stick or a black kitten with a range indicator for all i care. i can't kitten stand the shiny bling legendary skins with a billion animations that give me eye-aids whenever i have to look at them. usually i slap some non-animated neutral skins on them. and yes, i have mostly stuck to 2-handed so far because of the additional cost of making a weapon set with 1-hand + offhand.however, i do have the decency to not mirror my view on "most people".no matter what "most people" do or want, equalizing the cost for 2-handed and 1-handed+offhand would be only fair.

however, i also understand that it will never be done since having the majority of usable legendaries cost more than they should drives people into buying gems more often on average.

I make them purely for cosmetics, so with you and me we have at least a 50-50 split. Maybe more people can chime in and we can see what most people craft them for. =)

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@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:

@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

Except it's a fact that Legendary are just skins and that's the only reason why people unlock it. Nothing about Legendary makes it any better than Ascended outside of a slightly more convenient stats change. I'm not assuming anything, this is literally the only thing Legendary is made for which is skin. It's the reason Legendary weapons aren't exactly hyped up outside their appearance.

oh, so the option to change stats and the 3-4 inventory slots per weapon type it saves are just imaginary then, yes? i guess i must be dreaming because i'm ingame and doing it right now.

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@zaced.7948 said:

and @VDAC.2137 you might want to not assume what legendary items are supposed to be since you can't possibly know.

You’re right that I don’t know; that’s why I said that was simply my impression of what legendaries were meant to be. :)

I DO think that another mechanism should be added to change stats on ascended weapons and armor and not lose the sigil/rune unless a utility extractor is purchased, something that costs more than you he one time stat change but is a one time cost for unlocking a utility for the item or something similar. It would be great to not have to carry multiples of weapons or sink more gold into stat changes and runes/sigils anytime a nerf/patch kind of kills a build.

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@"MachineManXX.9746" said:I'm a far cry from a "hardcore" player. I've made 6 legendary weapons so far. All have been for the skins. Stat swapping was not even a consideration.i don't think you realize how much of a hardcore player you are. on average a casual player invests 2-3 hours of gameplay per week. it's doubtful that such players would even consider crafting more than one legendary in their entire gw2 career.

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@zaced.7948 said:

@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

Except it's a fact that Legendary are just skins and that's the only reason why people unlock it. Nothing about Legendary makes it any better than Ascended outside of a slightly more convenient stats change. I'm not assuming anything, this is literally the only thing Legendary is made for which is skin. It's the reason Legendary weapons aren't exactly hyped up outside their appearance.

oh, so the option to change stats and the 3-4 inventory slots per weapon type it saves are just imaginary then, yes? i guess i must be dreaming because i'm ingame and doing it right now.

Your point being?Stat swap is literally just added incentive that has almost no effect in gameplay. Considering equipment swapping is just probably more useful since you don't have to buy/craft runes constantly, Legendary stat swap isn't exactly a godly incentive. Runes/Inscription play the bigger role in the stats changing category and that outranks a simple stats swap so equipment swapping is far more useful.

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@zaced.7948 said:

@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

Except it's a fact that Legendary are just skins and that's the only reason why people unlock it. Nothing about Legendary makes it any better than Ascended outside of a slightly more convenient stats change. I'm not assuming anything, this is literally the only thing Legendary is made for which is skin. It's the reason Legendary weapons aren't exactly hyped up outside their appearance.

oh, so the option to change stats and the 3-4 inventory slots per weapon type it saves are just imaginary then, yes? i guess i must be dreaming because i'm ingame and doing it right now.

You know... the stat changing ability of legendary weapons was not always a thing. It wasn't until this update nearly a year after the games release:https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Game_updates/2013-09-03#Changes_to_Legendary_Weapons

So it is safe to say that at least the original purpose of legendary weapons was purely cosmetics. The stat changing was added later as an extra bonus incentive for people to craft them and not as the original main draw.

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Three of my legendary weapons were crafted for cosmetic reasons. The other eight were crafted for the stat swap functionality. I made WvW legendary armor, Ad Infinitum, and Aurora as well, all for stat swapping reasons. I would transmute Aurora if I could. Ad Infinitum remains hidden. My next two planned legendary weapons are also for stat swapping purposes.

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@Mewcifer.5198 said:So it is safe to say that at least the original purpose of legendary weapons was purely cosmetics. The stat changing was added later as an extra bonus incentive for people to craft them and not as the original main draw.This is why I sold the first precursor I received. Had I known stat swapping would be added later, I would have held on to it.

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@zaced.7948 said:i couldn't give half of a flying kitten how a weapon looks, i want legendaries for their long term utility alone. 1 legendary saves me 3-4 different stat variations of each weapon type which accumulates to quite a lot of inventory slots.

I am confused, on what possible profession can you use the same weapon for 3-4 different builds? Weapons tend to be tied to their function more or less, I don't need a Viper staff for my condi firebrand because it is a healing weapon, so i only keep one staff with the appropriate stats for when I need it

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@zaced.7948 said:

@"MachineManXX.9746" said:I'm a far cry from a "hardcore" player. I've made 6 legendary weapons so far. All have been for the skins. Stat swapping was not even a consideration.i don't think you realize how much of a hardcore player you are. on average a casual player invests 2-3 hours of gameplay per week. it's doubtful that such players would even consider crafting more than one legendary in their entire gw2 career.

You're assuming you know the difference between a "hardcore" player and a "casual" player, so you just fell into the same trap as the other two you accused of assuming what "most" people want a Legendary for. There's no strict definition of "hardcore" just as there's no strict definition of "casual", and assuming what "MOST' players do something for is not the same as assuming what "all" players do something for, most could be 51% or it could be 89%(most only has to be more than half).

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@zaced.7948 said:

@"ChronoPinoyX.7923" said:Considering most people unlock Legendary for skins and not stats, this isn't exactly a cause for concern. Once you get that Legendary unlocked, you can skin as many ascended weapons as you want with that Legendary skin since they have the exact same stats.

you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want. unless you can read minds. i highly doubt that tho.

and @VDAC.2137 you might want to not assume what legendary items are supposed to be since you can't possibly know.

Well if that's how we are going to play it, it is statistically probable that the overwhelming majority of players and builds do not run the SAME weapon in their main hand as they do their offhand, so this won't be a problem most legendary weapon users will face, and of those that do, it is also statistically probable that the overwhelming majority of players won't necessary need to swap stats on a regular basis, so they will opt for 1 legendary + 1 ascended w/ legendary skin.

TLDR: the amount of people this will be a problem for is a small outlier. (in all probability)

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@phoenixwil.6071 said:It takes twice as much material to craft a second one-handed weapon as it does just for a two-handed weapon. To craft one greatsword, you just need 1 desert/Maguuma mastery, mystic tribute, etc. If your toon uses a dagger in each hand, you need 2 desert/Maguuma masteries, 2 mystic tributes, etc. That’s right, you need 500 funerary incense for a 2 daggers/swords as opposed to 250 funerary incense (as well as other materials like 200 mystic curios instead of 100, 144 mystic clovers instead of 77, 500 mystic coins instead of 250, etc) for a greatsword/longbow. Yup you pay the same price to get half the stats and slots. That doesn’t make sense...

Crafting 2 different 1 handed weapons also yields 2 skins.

Crafting 2 of the same 1 handed weapon (aka 2 legendary Swords) does not use the T2 crafting approach, but would rather craft the T2 and T1, again yielding 2 skins (for any person with half a brain).

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@"zaced.7948" said:you might want to stop assuming what "most people" do or want.

you might want to not assume what legendary items are supposed to be since you can't possibly know....... having the majority of usable legendaries cost more than they should drives people into buying gems more often on average.

You yourself might want to avoid making assumptions about the economic impact of the relative costs. Unless you have data on why people buy gems and how many legendaries were built with mats purchased through gold acquired by spending RL cash on gems.

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@"phoenixwil.6071" said:It takes twice as much material to craft a second one-handed weapon as it does just for a two-handed weapon.Well, no, not exactly. It takes twice as many account bound materials. The unbound mat differential is comparable to that for ordinary weapons.


Here are the alternatives:

  • Two-handed weapons require two sets of account mats (two gifts of mastery, two gifts of exploration, ...). Fairly easy to implement, as it's "just" a set of recipe changes.
  • ANet invents one new set of Gifts for one-handed weapons (or perhaps two new sets: one for main-handed, one for off-handed). (Not easily implemented.)

Either way, the community won't be pleased. Sure, it will appeal to a minority who thinks (a) that this is more consistent and (b) that consistency is more important than simplicity or economic impact or gameplay impact or developer costs. It won't appeal to those who are on the way to completing legendaries and/or those who have already done so.

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If this is all about inventory space, you'd be better off just buying more bag/bank slots and keeping the ascended weapons. And if you have all of those maxed out, manage your kitten inventory because there's no way you should still be having space problems. Stat swapping is nice, but unless you're bouncing weapons around from toon to toon you'll hardly ever need to swap weapon stats. And swapping weapons between toons is way more annoying than just having each have their own weapons.

I've made 5 weapons, all for their skins. It's simply a waste of time and money if you're going to get legendaries just to hide their skins. Exceptions to this would definitely be Aurora, Ad Infinitum, and armor since you can use those for any build. That said, they're still a lot of work to save some inventory slots.

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@"MachineManXX.9746" said:I'm a far cry from a "hardcore" player. I've made 6 legendary weapons so far. All have been for the skins. Stat swapping was not even a consideration.

Same here, though I've made 3 (2 weapons + Ad Infinitum), , currently slowly working on 4th (Aurora). I don't think I've ever stat swapped any of them.

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