Celestial Challenge - Observations and Thoughts

[Valandil.6453]

So I know this is a new thing for the Lunar New Year (can we say Canthan New Year? I'm a GW1 tragic), and like all Arenanet things recently implemented into an already-established framework like this event, there are some things that seem to need honing and tidying up.

1. Dog's Challenge (and other capture-based challenges) - I see capture points that are named in the GUI at the top-right of screen (with the meters), but nothing is named on the ground. How are we supposed to know what to cap?
2. Boar's Challenge - this I've found to be one of the hardest, particularly the mushroom Celestial foes we have to deal with. Plenty of nodes to go to, decent collection points, respawn time for each isn't too bad, but the sheer number of foes to get around - even if your aim isn't to engage them as such - is mind-boggling. Even with 10 players in the map, I don't think I've ever managed to hit the goal number.
3. Rat's Challenge -
   • pro: good speed boost.
   • cons: speed boost only helps if you're going in a straight line, and DR's Palace Waypoint and the upper area of the city (the area that we get to run around in), is far from running in a straight line.Only one collection point. I feel this challenge in particular could use the Boar's Challenge template for collections to be manageable.
4. Not knowing how many players there are in the map at any one time. I get that this map is a co-operative play type of layout and whatnot, but I feel the map could use a player list similar to a PvP-based map.
5. Continuing on from the above point, I've also noticed quite a few leechers in these maps.

I know that this type of minigame is supposed to be a relaxed type of gameplay and not really that competitive, however it does get rather grindy just to farm these Tokens, and I believe by addressing the above points the grind can at least be lessened.

Anyone else have other ideas on how to improve these challenges and the overall gameplay?

[Linken.6345]

Make getting bronze, silver or gold mean something 1 base and +1 stack added on each.Since you cant get 12 stacks before 1 set of them complete at the moment.This might make people afk less aswell.

[Luthan.5236]

It's okay to do it once daily. Also helps to reach the achievement (8 needed I think) since the event/festival is longer than 8 days. Other than that it is pretty boring. I don't care about rewards that much. So not farming it.

Wintersday hat a bit better things to do. (Though the Toypocalypse was a lot of grind and I did this even less - only for the annuals and not the 5AP repeatable thing cause it took too long per full round to to all the 10 waves.)

[CaspeR.6943]

@Luthan.5236 said:It's okay to do it once daily. Also helps to reach the achievement (8 needed I think) since the event/festival is longer than 8 days.But for full reward u need to repeat it 12 times for full AP ( 8x12x15 min(average time to loot chest) = 1440 minutes of wasted time

I think Anet must add a reward for each event completed to compensate this time and increase reward from chest for each stuck of aura.

[Gop.8713]

The biggest problem with 'leeches' is that, like toypocalypse, the design encourages it. Toypocalypse is designed for the players to build defenses and let them do the work, but if they do a good job they are punished for being 'afk'. In this event if a player is trying to maximize stacks before opening then they're not bothered if the bar fills slowly, setting their interests against those trying to finish quickly . . .

[Glider.5792]

@"Gop.8713" said:The biggest problem with 'leeches' is that, like toypocalypse, the design encourages it. Toypocalypse is designed for the players to build defenses and let them do the work, but if they do a good job they are punished for being 'afk'. In this event if a player is trying to maximize stacks before opening then they're not bothered if the bar fills slowly, setting their interests against those trying to finish quickly . . .

It not that people want to afk to "get more stack", people just dont want to repeat this boring "challenge" 96!!!! times.For us ap hunter, this is basicaly a must do (60ap), however doing this boring thing this many times, yeah right...

Anet should change the "8 chests opened" to "8 events completed". BAM. Problem solved. People now get actual progress with every event finished, and it will go by alot quicker.

[Gop.8713]

@Glider.5792 said:

@"Gop.8713" said:The biggest problem with 'leeches' is that, like toypocalypse, the design encourages it. Toypocalypse is designed for the players to build defenses and let them do the work, but if they do a good job they are punished for being 'afk'. In this event if a player is trying to maximize stacks before opening then they're not bothered if the bar fills slowly, setting their interests against those trying to finish quickly . . .

It not that people want to afk to "get more stack", people just dont want to repeat this boring "challenge" 96!!!! times.For us ap hunter, this is basicaly a must do (60ap), however doing this boring thing this many times, yeah right...

Anet should change the "8 chests opened" to "8 events completed". BAM. Problem solved. People now get actual progress with every event finished, and it will go by alot quicker.

Sure, same thing described differently. But the ppl who want stacks would still not be encouraged to participate. I'd like to see events designed in a way that everyone wants success, regardless of motivation . . .

Changing it to 'events completed' doesn't really help bc you still just need one tick to get credit. 'Events completed' plus extra credit for gold or silver might work, but then we're closer to getting more envelopes more easily which is what anet seems to be trying to avoid . . .

[Glider.5792]

@Gop.8713 said:

@Glider.5792 said:

@Gop.8713 said:The biggest problem with 'leeches' is that, like toypocalypse, the design encourages it. Toypocalypse is designed for the players to build defenses and let them do the work, but if they do a good job they are punished for being 'afk'. In this event if a player is trying to maximize stacks before opening then they're not bothered if the bar fills slowly, setting their interests against those trying to finish quickly . . .

It not that people want to afk to "get more stack", people just dont want to repeat this boring "challenge" 96!!!! times.For us ap hunter, this is basicaly a must do (60ap), however doing this boring thing this many times, yeah right...

Anet should change the "8 chests opened" to "8 events completed". BAM. Problem solved. People now get actual progress with every event finished, and it will go by alot quicker.

Sure, same thing described differently. But the ppl who want stacks would still not be encouraged to participate. I'd like to see events designed in a way that everyone wants success, regardless of motivation . . .

Changing it to 'events completed' doesn't really help bc you still just need one tick to get credit. 'Events completed' plus extra credit for gold or silver might work, but then we're closer to getting more envelopes more easily which is what anet seems to be trying to avoid . . .

Changing it to 'events completed' would help. I dont belive at all that people do this event for envelopes. Most of them just want their daily or are grinding the achievment.Chaning it to 'events completed' would make the grind for the ap shorter, hence lowering the amount of afkers.If you want envelopes(gold) this event is not worth doing at all. Like, go kill regular mobs in queensdale, you will earn more in those 15min.

[aspirine.6852]

@CaspeR.6943 said:

@Luthan.5236 said:It's okay to do it once daily. Also helps to reach the achievement (8 needed I think) since the event/festival is longer than 8 days.But for full reward u need to repeat it 12 times for full AP ( 8x12x15 min(average time to loot chest) = 1440 minutes of wasted time

I think Anet must add a reward for each event completed to compensate this time and increase reward from chest for each stuck of aura.

How is it wasted time if it is that important to AP hunters?

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

I'm confused...are these AFKers actually not AFK, but just not participating in the events, as you must open the Chest for credit?

[Rasimir.6239]

@"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:I'm confused...are these AFKers actually not AFK, but just not participating in the events, as you must open the Chest for credit?The way I understand it, some people want the ap badly while at the same time decided they do not want to actually play the challenge, so they stay off in a corner where the mini events don't tag them, then come "alive" during the looting period to open the chest, then go back to their afk spot (while doing stuff on another monitor I suppose?) until the next chest loot phase.

Why anyone would choose to "play" this way is beyond me, but then I'm not an ap hunter, just a lowly casual that only plays the content they find fun at that moment.

[Ashantara.8731]

I was expecting something challenging (because "Challenge") like the Queen's Pavillion during The Festival of the Four Winds. Imagine my disappointment.

[Zaklex.6308]

@"Valandil Dragonhart.2371" said:So I know this is a new thing for the Lunar New Year (can we say Canthan New Year? I'm a GW1 tragic), and like all Arenanet things recently implemented into an already-established framework like this event, there are some things that seem to need honing and tidying up.

1. Dog's Challenge (and other capture-based challenges) - I see capture points that are named in the GUI at the top-right of screen (with the meters), but nothing is named on the ground. How are we supposed to know what to cap?

       Is it that hard to just run to one of the flagged areas and cap it, each area is flagged and has a capping circle, and they're all displayed on the mini-map, not hard to find in such a confined area.

2. Boar's Challenge - this I've found to be one of the hardest, particularly the mushroom Celestial foes we have to deal with. Plenty of nodes to go to, decent collection points, respawn time for each isn't too bad, but the sheer number of foes to get around - even if your aim isn't to engage them as such - is mind-boggling. Even with 10 players in the map, I don't think I've ever managed to hit the goal number.

      I was in maps last night with an average of 5 players, and we managed to hit the target count every single time...you're not supposed to engage the enemy at all, just collect the nodes.

3. Rat's Challenge -
   • pro: good speed boost.
   • cons: speed boost only helps if you're going in a straight line, and DR's Palace Waypoint and the upper area of the city (the area that we get to run around in), is far from running in a straight line.Only one collection point. I feel this challenge in particular could use the Boar's Challenge template for collections to be manageable.

      See reply for Boar's Challenge, also, using the speed boost isn't that important, and there's more than enough items that have a relatively clear shot to the collection point that it works...otherwise just use it to get "close enough".

4. Not knowing how many players there are in the map at any one time. I get that this map is a co-operative play type of layout and whatnot, but I feel the map could use a player list similar to a PvP-based map.

      Totally not necessary, doesn't matter how many people are on a map.

5. Continuing on from the above point, I've also noticed quite a few leechers in these maps.

      The ones that I saw in my games where close enough to the arena that they ended up getting attacked by the mobs and dies multiple times, they also never came over to get the chest so I'm not even sure what the point of AFK'ing there was for those 2 people.   Just leave them be, it's not like it scales up the difficulty or anything.

I know that this type of minigame is supposed to be a relaxed type of gameplay and not really that competitive, however it does get rather grindy just to farm these Tokens, and I believe by addressing the above points the grind can at least be lessened.

Anyone else have other ideas on how to improve these challenges and the overall gameplay?

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Rasimir.6239 said:

@"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:I'm confused...are these AFKers actually not AFK, but just not participating in the events, as you must open the Chest for credit?The way I understand it, some people want the ap badly while at the same time decided they do not want to actually play the challenge, so they stay off in a corner where the mini events don't tag them, then come "alive" during the looting period to open the chest, then go back to their afk spot (while doing stuff on another monitor I suppose?) until the next chest loot phase.

Why anyone would choose to "play" this way is beyond me, but then I'm not an ap hunter, just a lowly casual that only plays the content they find fun at that moment.

Pretty much. They still have to get credit for one of the events in order to get one stack of the buff but that threshold is incredibly low.

[Westenev.5289]

I was playing Rabbit's challenge, when I got stuck inside a DR shrubbery with no hope of escape. That was fun, I guess.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

I'm amazed at how this wasn't a multi tiered achievement with a total of 25AP. Luna New Year really does get the short end of the festival stick.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

@Eloc Freidon.5692 said:I'm amazed at how this wasn't a multi tiered achievement with a total of 25AP. Luna New Year really does get the short end of the festival stick.

I'm confused...You are sad that it doesn't have less AP?

[Firebeard.1746]

It's a cool concept. It feels REALLY slow.

[Esterie.7409]

I get that the whole event is based around "luck" - either magic find or the stacks of lucky aura you get for completing rounds of the Celestial Challenge. However, it does feel kinda bad to have 8 stacks, open the chest, and only get some minor luck and one unidentified gear bag. Like I said, I understand that receiving a token from the chest is random until you get 12 stacks of lucky aura (upon which a token is guaranteed), it just takes so long. Considering you need to get five tokens from the Celestial Challenge to be able to buy the max of 16 envelopes, the time investment just isn't worth it to me. Today I had to bow out after only getting three tokens, which took an hour and a half. I have no qualms with Celestial Challenge = tokens to buy envelopes. It's just the time it takes to get the tokens that's my issue.

Also, I've noticed that sometimes after completing a round, my lucky aura won't increase at all. I don't know if this aspect is RNG as well, but that's also is a pretty bad feeling and adds to the time issue I outlined above. Editing to add that when this happens, I am participating in the round for its entirety.

[Donari.5237]

@Westenev.5289 said:I was playing Rabbit's challenge, when I got stuck inside a DR shrubbery with no hope of escape. That was fun, I guess.

Yep, me too, was trying to do just one round for a daily before going to eat dinner. I now just skip the tall center shrubbery during Rabbit. I did get unstuck by relogging to unroot from the greenery and then jiggling around in place to get clear of the tight spot but by the time I loaded back in and freed myself I couldn't get to the chest in time.

I have no idea how one would ever get to 12 stacks. Even when I stay in for multiple sessions (and I do fully participate, my only afk moment was a couple of minutes when a package came to the door and I had to fetch it in), I get maybe 3 stacks before the chest and then they disappear.

[Jimbru.6014]

I would much rather have had a strike mission like Freezie than the Celestial Challenge as it is. How about a strike mission fighting to keep Shiro Tagachi caged in the underworld for another year? It's just an idea...

Anyway, beefs with the present challenge...

• Having to repeat ANYTHING in this game 96 times for AP sucks, no matter how well it's designed.
• The mushroom collecting challenge, I have yet to see a team meet the bonus goal, even with a full team participating. That event needs re-designed, or at least the goal lowered to something achievable.
• There is no credit for killing mobs in most of the phases. They're just there to get in your way and annoy you to death, which they will if you let them. I think there's something wrong with not getting credit for fighting.
• The token award, which is what most people are there for, needs to be awarded more consistently, if not every time.
• Do the reward levels actually mean anything? I honestly can't tell.
• The fighting part of the challenges is heavily skewed toward Power and burst damage. Unless you're a Firebrand, condi need not apply.

[Tumult.2578]

The challenge events here are Dragonball related. That's just what there is. What's lacking is PvE content worth actually doing. The race reward is insignificant. The gold award on the other race is not worth the effort. Opening gifts is not a challenge, it's part of the reward process and includes no effort. If they rewarded 2 tokens during the Celestial Challenge after actively defeating 5 or 6 challenges, and added the equivalent of a new years world boss that scales, at the end of the event, that awarded 2 tokens, the event would be lots of fun, rewarding enough to take part in, not ungodly long, and much more in line with other festivals. Significant involvement would need to be required to gain the rewards though, with additional attempts required if not enough interaction with enemys was done. Festivals should be fun first and difficulty second. Under no circumstances should raids or adventures be part of a Festival.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

@Eloc Freidon.5692 said:I'm amazed at how this wasn't a multi tiered achievement with a total of 25AP. Luna New Year really does get the short end of the festival stick.

I'm confused...You are sad that it doesn't have

less

AP?

Apparently I couldn't find the 60 AP tiered achievement without someone showing me directly. Festivals have too many pages in different spots. I guess we both have our faults at reading.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

Speak only for yourself.

[Zaklex.6308]

@Westenev.5289 said:I was playing Rabbit's challenge, when I got stuck inside a DR shrubbery with no hope of escape. That was fun, I guess.

@Donari.5237 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:I was playing Rabbit's challenge, when I got stuck inside a DR shrubbery with no hope of escape. That was fun, I guess.

Yep, me too, was trying to do just one round for a daily before going to eat dinner. I now just skip the tall center shrubbery during Rabbit. I did get unstuck by relogging to unroot from the greenery and then jiggling around in place to get clear of the tight spot but by the time I loaded back in and freed myself I couldn't get to the chest in time.

I have no idea how one would ever get to 12 stacks. Even when I stay in for multiple sessions (and I do fully participate, my only afk moment was a couple of minutes when a package came to the door and I had to fetch it in), I get maybe 3 stacks before the chest and then they disappear.

You both know about the /stuck command, don't you?

You get 12 stacks by NOT opening the chest after each round, opening the chest removes the stacks.