The Warclaw Needs Some Love ( in PVE ) - [Merged]

serialkicker.5274 · August 13, 2020

@"Jagblade.4627" said:I have only been lurking this thread but out of all the games (particularly MMOs) I've played in the last twenty years I have never before seen so many people actively argue against additional content or the refinement of content already in place, holy kitten. Keep the acquisition of the mount the way it is but I see absolutely no problem with allowing the Warclaw to at the very least run as fast as the Jackal or Raptor does. It doesn't need any special flare in my opinion, but if they see fit to add something that's fine too.
I really don't see how someone wanting a mount they worked for to be not useless outside of WvW affects anyone else at all. Let them have their cake, or their flavor mount in this case. I imagine that if the Warclaw was exclusive WvW only and couldn't be used outside of it these people would argue against allowing its use in the open world at all. In fact, I'll bet that these same people threw a hissy fit when they heard the devs were devoting resources to allow the skimmer to be used underwater.
I do not have a Warclaw nor do I want one, but why does it hurt anyone if the mount's PvE use is slightly buffed if they still have to work just as hard as anyone else to acquire it?

Welcome to gw2, buddy. I've learned long ago, that unfortunately, making any suggestion on this forum attracts bunch of people who don't care for change, so they shut it down. Looks like some people think entire game has to be made for them. Of course, if suggestion happens to be something they want, they will surely not use same logic of "it's not worth the time and it's not needed".I am all for discussion and sharing opinion why suggestion is good or bad, but telling others "it's not gonna happen, because we don't neeed it or because I personally don't care for it or we already have similar stuff" is just sad. Let developers decide what is needed for their game.

Jagblade.4627 · August 13, 2020

@serialkicker.5274 said:
@"Jagblade.4627" said:I have only been lurking this thread but out of all the games (particularly MMOs) I've played in the last twenty years I have never before seen so many people actively argue against additional content or the refinement of content already in place, holy kitten. Keep the acquisition of the mount the way it is but I see absolutely no problem with allowing the Warclaw to at the very least run as fast as the Jackal or Raptor does. It doesn't need any special flare in my opinion, but if they see fit to add something that's fine too.
I really don't see how someone wanting a mount they worked for to be not useless outside of WvW affects anyone else at all. Let them have their cake, or their flavor mount in this case. I imagine that if the Warclaw was exclusive WvW only and couldn't be used outside of it these people would argue against allowing its use in the open world at all. In fact, I'll bet that these same people threw a hissy fit when they heard the devs were devoting resources to allow the skimmer to be used underwater.
I do not have a Warclaw nor do I want one, but why does it hurt anyone if the mount's PvE use is
slightly
buffed if they still have to work just as hard as anyone else to acquire it?

Welcome to gw2, buddy. I've learned long ago, that unfortunately, making any suggestion on this forum attracts bunch of people who don't care for change, so they shut it down. Looks like some people think entire game has to be made for them. Of course, if suggestion happens to be something they want, they will surely not use same logic of "it's not worth the time and it's not needed".I am all for discussion and sharing opinion why suggestion is good or bad, but telling others "it's not gonna happen, because we don't neeed it or because I personally don't care for it or we already have similar stuff" is just sad. Let developers decide what is needed for their game.

My thoughts exactly. I've been around since November 2012, took breaks short and long off and on, but only recently began using the forums somewhat regularly. A sad state of affairs here.

voltaicbore.8012 · August 13, 2020

@"serialkicker.5274" said:
There were ton of people who said that for raids, same as you are now for this. "There is no way they will put raids in." "Guild wars 2 wasn't designed for raids." "Game is too casual for raids." "They said there won't be raids." Guess what. We have raids.

And guess what - raids aren't doing that great, IMO for the reasons you listed. GW2 really wasn't designed for the standard trinity raid, and it's too casual everywhere else to consistently attract a larger proportion of the playerbase. To ANet's credit you still don't need a hard trinity setup for all the fights, but I still believe raid design is a pretty stark departure from the trinity-free vision of GW2.

That being said, I get your point. People have said "X thing won't work" before in plenty of scenarios, and we actually have X thing now. That's 100% true. I would just like to add that simply because something gets added doesn't mean it's a great thing for the game.

serialkicker.5274 · August 13, 2020

@voltaicbore.8012 said:
@"serialkicker.5274" said:
There were ton of people who said that for raids, same as you are now for this. "There is no way they will put raids in." "Guild wars 2 wasn't designed for raids." "Game is too casual for raids." "They said there won't be raids." Guess what. We have raids.

And guess what - raids aren't doing that great, IMO for the reasons you listed. GW2 really wasn't designed for the standard trinity raid, and it's too casual everywhere else to consistently attract a larger proportion of the playerbase. To ANet's credit you still don't need a hard trinity setup for all the fights, but I still believe raid design is a pretty stark departure from the trinity-free vision of GW2.

That being said, I get your point. People have said "X thing won't work" before in plenty of scenarios, and we actually have X thing now. That's 100% true. I would just like to add that simply because something gets added doesn't mean it's a great thing for the game.

I agree. Raids should never have happened in my opinion. I was always more for dungeons. I think they would be better for the game, since it's kind of content that all players can easily enjoy and access and doesn't need heavy organizing. I find even fractals annoying with it's agony system.Anyway, to stay on topic. I prefer skins for warclaw over the ones for raptor hint for Arenanet :D

Svarty.8019 · August 13, 2020

@voltaicbore.8012 said:
@"serialkicker.5274" said:
There were ton of people who said that for raids, same as you are now for this. "There is no way they will put raids in." "Guild wars 2 wasn't designed for raids." "Game is too casual for raids." "They said there won't be raids." Guess what. We have raids.I would just like to add that simply because something gets added doesn't mean it's a great thing for the game.

Which is why I am baffled when Anet introduce things and don't refine them.

Look at the Warclaw. It won't ever get fixed because it means effort (in manpower terms).

Omega.6801 · August 13, 2020

Every mount has its niche. The Warclaw's niche is WvW. There's no need to alter anything with it in PvE. If it's just that you want to ride a kitty you can ask for skins for the other mounts.

Super Hayes.6890 · August 13, 2020

@dmone.5631 said:The Chain Pull functionality would be great for Drizzlewood Coast.

lol, yes please. If they added to warclaw in PvE this would be the place to do it as it would adequately showcase the mount to PvE only players.

Super Hayes.6890 · August 13, 2020

@Mewcifer.5198 said:
@frareanselm.1925 said:
@Mewcifer.5198 said:Wanting the warclaw to be a little better in PvE is not a
need
it is purely a
personal desire
. If you wanna ask anet to buff it because you want to ride around on a big cat in PvE without feeling like you are wasting too much time, sure, ask for that. But don't also ask them to code in a bunch of PvE unique abilities for it as well.
And do not present it as if it is something the game
needs
.

Wanting the warclaw to be better is not a desire its balance according to the other mounts. Every mount has a little situational advantage over others. Warclaw is jus a slow obese cat that cannot even jump properly.

Warclaw already has it's situational advantage. It is called WvW.

Agree or not, that was perfect phrasing for your point. Made me smirk too.

Super Hayes.6890 · August 13, 2020

@Jagblade.4627 said:I have only been lurking this thread but out of all the games (particularly MMOs) I've played in the last twenty years I have never before seen so many people actively argue against additional content or the refinement of content already in place, holy kitten. Keep the acquisition of the mount the way it is but I see absolutely no problem with allowing the Warclaw to at the very least run as fast as the Jackal or Raptor does. It doesn't need any special flare in my opinion, but if they see fit to add something that's fine too.
I really don't see how someone wanting a mount they worked for to be not useless outside of WvW affects anyone else at all. Let them have their cake, or their flavor mount in this case. I imagine that if the Warclaw was exclusive WvW only and couldn't be used outside of it these people would argue against allowing its use in the open world at all. In fact, I'll bet that these same people threw a hissy fit when they heard the devs were devoting resources to allow the skimmer to be used underwater.
I do not have a Warclaw nor do I want one, but why does it hurt anyone if the mount's PvE use is slightly buffed if they still have to work just as hard as anyone else to acquire it?

I think it is more about the lack of content addition in WvW over the years. Many players have left that mode as it pretty much stays the same. The warclaw existing in PvE draws new players to WvW. Buff it in PvE and these new players will just come to WvW to acquire it and never return. However, I doubt PvE players will stay in WvW just to fully utilize the warclaw's abilities. Overall this is just a weak theory of mine. The issue is more complex than that. I personally don't see an issue with buffing it in PvE but I can understand a lot of the points made against it. Obtena made the best point about players being enticed to try WvW. A buffed PvE warclaw gives them little reason to go back.

Ototo.3214 · August 13, 2020

I don't particularly care if it remains pretty useless in PvE, but if they want to keep it useless there then please for the love of Dwayna make it stop defaulting to warclaw on the mount skill whenever i come out of WvW.

And yes, I already have the mounts set to specific keybinds on the numpad for when I want to use a specific one. However, I also have a generic "mount" keybind that's easy to use on the fly that i use the little mount select slot near the elite skill for and makes it easy to select a mount i expect to be using the most at any given time. I like it this way and it's really annoying that it switches it to warclaw in PvE just because I used it in WvW. If they can make it so certain equipment/build slots are specific to mode, please do the same for mounts.

Jagblade.4627 · August 13, 2020

@Super Hayes.6890 said:
@Jagblade.4627 said:I have only been lurking this thread but out of all the games (particularly MMOs) I've played in the last twenty years I have never before seen so many people actively argue against additional content or the refinement of content already in place, holy kitten. Keep the acquisition of the mount the way it is but I see absolutely no problem with allowing the Warclaw to at the very least run as fast as the Jackal or Raptor does. It doesn't need any special flare in my opinion, but if they see fit to add something that's fine too.
I really don't see how someone wanting a mount they worked for to be not useless outside of WvW affects anyone else at all. Let them have their cake, or their flavor mount in this case. I imagine that if the Warclaw was exclusive WvW only and couldn't be used outside of it these people would argue against allowing its use in the open world at all. In fact, I'll bet that these same people threw a hissy fit when they heard the devs were devoting resources to allow the skimmer to be used underwater.
I do not have a Warclaw nor do I want one, but why does it hurt anyone if the mount's PvE use is
slightly
buffed if they still have to work just as hard as anyone else to acquire it?

I think it is more about the lack of content addition in WvW over the years. Many players have left that mode as it pretty much stays the same. The warclaw existing in PvE draws new players to WvW. Buff it in PvE and these new players will just come to WvW to acquire it and never return. However, I doubt PvE players will stay in WvW just to fully utilize the warclaw's abilities. Overall this is just a weak theory of mine. The issue is more complex than that. I personally don't see an issue with buffing it in PvE but I can understand a lot of the points made against it. Obtena made the best point about players being enticed to try WvW. A buffed PvE warclaw gives them little reason to go back.

I respectfully disagree. If the Warclaw performs the same in WvW as it does in PvE, they're not going to return to WvW to use it there when it functions just the same, they'll still just stick to PvE if that was originally their intention. If it is buffed for PvE, again, same exact thing. If their intention was just to unlock it they'll just do what they planned on doing. Anyone who ends up liking WvW will return to it regardless of the state of the Warclaw outside of it. It's a path of least resistance scenario but even that depends upon the tastes of the player. In example for myself personally, if I actually wanted the Warclaw I would go to WvW to unlock it and then never return as I don't particularly care for GW2 PvP. How well the mount performs inside or outside of WvW has absolutely no bearing on that if I don't like the mode to begin with.

kharmin.7683 · August 13, 2020

I admit to being one of those PvE players who obtained a warclaw and then never returned to WvW. It's not a game mode that I enjoy. Why did I bother with getting the warclaw? Because I wanted it to complete the "set" of mounts. /shrug

Obtena.7952 · August 13, 2020

@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Svarty.8019 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:why wouldn't you want to fight players in WvW anyway? Isn't that the whole point of the mode?
NO, the point of the mode is to score points. There are many ways to score points, only some of which involve killing enemies.

There are many reasons to avoid enemies, for example running back to teammates, particularly if you're running as a support build. Fighting in a group is something even non-twitchy players can do, which means you don't need to be the best player in the world, which means that it's an option available to normal/bad players which allows them to have fun with other players - so that's why the people running from spawn don't want to mess about with some gank-built 1v1 specialist. Or, as is more frequent recently, a group of five people who only jump on smaller numbers.

I doubt Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points.

Funny .. the evidence is that WvW exists to prove it. We can debate all we want why it was added ... but the real discussion is what Warclaw allows a player to do in WvW.

You seem to have missed my point. Killing players also gets points so this was obviously meant to happen...

That was never in question to begin with. This shouldn't cast doubt in your mind that Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points because that's exactly what WvW is. Warclaw is a WvW development that favours 'racking up points' in WvW ... I'm not against Warclaw getting some more focus in PVE ... but not without good reason.

Atomos.7593 · August 13, 2020

@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Svarty.8019 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:why wouldn't you want to fight players in WvW anyway? Isn't that the whole point of the mode?
NO, the point of the mode is to score points. There are many ways to score points, only some of which involve killing enemies.

There are many reasons to avoid enemies, for example running back to teammates, particularly if you're running as a support build. Fighting in a group is something even non-twitchy players can do, which means you don't need to be the best player in the world, which means that it's an option available to normal/bad players which allows them to have fun with other players - so that's why the people running from spawn don't want to mess about with some gank-built 1v1 specialist. Or, as is more frequent recently, a group of five people who only jump on smaller numbers.

I doubt Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points.

Funny .. the evidence is that WvW exists to prove it. We can debate all we want why it was added ... but the real discussion is what Warclaw allows a player to do in WvW.

You seem to have missed my point. Killing players also gets points so this was obviously meant to happen...

That was never in question to begin with. This shouldn't cast doubt in your mind that Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points because that's exactly what WvW is. Warclaw is a WvW development that favours 'racking up points' in WvW ... I'm not against Warclaw getting some more focus in PVE ... but not without good reason.

I certainly don't consider WvW to be a mode that involves only scoring points. It's clear that the mode was designed to facilitate fighting other players since you get points for that, and if they wanted a mode exclusively for scoring points they could have simply not had fighting players involved. If you choose to avoid fighting players then that's your choice (and extremely boring imo). Either way, the addition of the warclaw in WvW doesn't help this because of the reasons I stated earlier.

I'm curious, what would be a good reason to you?

Obtena.7952 · August 13, 2020

@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Svarty.8019 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:why wouldn't you want to fight players in WvW anyway? Isn't that the whole point of the mode?
NO, the point of the mode is to score points. There are many ways to score points, only some of which involve killing enemies.

There are many reasons to avoid enemies, for example running back to teammates, particularly if you're running as a support build. Fighting in a group is something even non-twitchy players can do, which means you don't need to be the best player in the world, which means that it's an option available to normal/bad players which allows them to have fun with other players - so that's why the people running from spawn don't want to mess about with some gank-built 1v1 specialist. Or, as is more frequent recently, a group of five people who only jump on smaller numbers.

I doubt Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points.

Funny .. the evidence is that WvW exists to prove it. We can debate all we want why it was added ... but the real discussion is what Warclaw allows a player to do in WvW.

You seem to have missed my point. Killing players also gets points so this was obviously meant to happen...

That was never in question to begin with. This shouldn't cast doubt in your mind that Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points because that's exactly what WvW is. Warclaw is a WvW development that favours 'racking up points' in WvW ... I'm not against Warclaw getting some more focus in PVE ... but not without good reason.

I certainly don't consider WvW to be a mode that involves only scoring points.

Neither does anyone else ... no one said it was ONLY about that.

What would a good reason be to me to make Warclaw useful in PVE? I don't have one, at least nothing that would justify diverting Anet from whatever else they were working on to do so ... that's why I don't support the suggestion. In fact I already gave/support a reason for NOT doing this suggestion, and it seems inline with how the Warclaw was introduced in the first place.

Atomos.7593 · August 13, 2020

@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Svarty.8019 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:why wouldn't you want to fight players in WvW anyway? Isn't that the whole point of the mode?
NO, the point of the mode is to score points. There are many ways to score points, only some of which involve killing enemies.

There are many reasons to avoid enemies, for example running back to teammates, particularly if you're running as a support build. Fighting in a group is something even non-twitchy players can do, which means you don't need to be the best player in the world, which means that it's an option available to normal/bad players which allows them to have fun with other players - so that's why the people running from spawn don't want to mess about with some gank-built 1v1 specialist. Or, as is more frequent recently, a group of five people who only jump on smaller numbers.

I doubt Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points.

Funny .. the evidence is that WvW exists to prove it. We can debate all we want why it was added ... but the real discussion is what Warclaw allows a player to do in WvW.

You seem to have missed my point. Killing players also gets points so this was obviously meant to happen...

That was never in question to begin with. This shouldn't cast doubt in your mind that Anet designed an entire mode involving players killing each other so that people could rack up points because that's exactly what WvW is. Warclaw is a WvW development that favours 'racking up points' in WvW ... I'm not against Warclaw getting some more focus in PVE ... but not without good reason.

I certainly don't consider WvW to be a mode that involves only scoring points.

Neither does anyone else ... no one said it was ONLY about that.

What would a good reason be to me to make Warclaw useful in PVE? I don't have one, at least nothing that would justify diverting Anet from whatever else they were working on to do so ... that's why I don't support the suggestion.

Of course no one said that. We were discussing what the point of WvW is and I said part of the point is fighting other players...

You don't have any suggestions so please stop dismissing other player's suggestions. I'm sure Anet is capable of doing this on their own if they feel like it, without needing hundreds of other players saying that it's a bad suggestion for no reason.

Obtena.7952 · August 13, 2020

@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Obtena.7952 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:
@Svarty.8019 said:
@Atomos.7593 said:why wouldn't you want to fight players in WvW anyway? Isn't that the whole point of the mode?
NO, the point of the mode is to score points. There are many ways to score points, only some of which involve killing enemies.