NO Downstate should STAY permanently. - [Merged]

[Jilora.9524]

@Suraci.1642 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

no ds you become bag instantly, with ds you still become bag but takes a little longer, you died, you got downed, you are done, what "more skilled" you are talking about here? bag feeding skill?

Oh so ds isn't an issue? You become a bag anyway? But I thought everyone was getting downed then rezzed? I explained to beepbeep. I'm talking about I have no issue securing the kill after downing someone which seems to be a skill because so many want this op ds to be removed so they must not be able to kill someone after downing them

[Jilora.9524]

Also which takes more skill? Killing someone with no ds or with ds. I mean we got the event? My k/d ratio went way up. Did yours? Did you suddenly become more or less skilled because of this event? Or was it because this event let us skip half the process with no other changes we all were more skilled for one week but now we struggling? That's my point. If you are skilled you are skilled. Shouldn't take some bad event to separate

[BeepBoopBop.5403]

@Jilora.9524 said:

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

The skilled tactic of letting your HP get to 0 and going to down state ;) show me more

Oh you again. It doesn't matter 1 v 1 now does it? Only when you think you should be able to jump into a 1 v 3 and should get a kill right by skipping half the process. Obviously getting HP to zero and downed state was not the "skill" I was referring too. The skill of being able to secure kills the rest of the time with ds active is the skill. Because downed is not dead no matter how many times you think you won a fight because you downed someone. I obviously can down and finish the kill where you run off after downing someone thus I am more skilled

Yes bro I'm sure you in your infinite wisdom of getting yourself killed for the bodyguards to pick you up, have much to share with us about skill. We're 'skipping half the process', while Anet lets you skip the walk back from spawn lol.

No one was even talking about 1v1? Maybe the 3 in 1v3 just shouldn't go down LOL because if the 1 goes down its game over to him. Is the picture clear yet? This community is amazing. Only in GW2 do the outnumbering side need more of a handicap, according to most people here. Explains how the game got to this state, anyone serious about getting good has left.

[Suraci.1642]

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

no ds you become bag instantly, with ds you still become bag but takes a little longer, you died, you got downed, you are done, what "more skilled" you are talking about here? bag feeding skill?

Oh so ds isn't an issue? You become a bag anyway? But I thought everyone was getting downed then rezzed? I explained to beepbeep. I'm talking about I have no issue securing the kill after downing someone which seems to be a skill because so many want this op ds to be removed so they must not be able to kill someone after downing them

No, it is an issue, yes you become bag anyway, but in small scale fights. Against big zerg fights, roamers getting someone downed is completely inconsequential thus taking fun out of the gamemode where bad players get carried, they can down as many times as they want to as long as their server's numbers game on top of other servers.

[JusticeRetroHunter.7684]

@ledernierrempart.6871 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:This is more like a list of things you’ve yet to learn about playing the game.

No downstate exposes all the bad players that can’t assess complex game mechanics and interactions.

You walk into WvW and complain about getting +1’d? That’s your fault because you should have prepared not just your build, but yourself for fighting outnumbered in a game mode that is open world.

how does getting better at the game will change the unfairness and frustration of what i have listed?

Because none of it is unfair.

When I was a baddie running around in the first couple years of the game, I had trouble with all those things you listed. But then I learned how to play the game and those things were not only no longer a problem, but I can use those things you listed to my advantage to actually do more complex things like fight and WIN outnumbered fights.

[Jilora.9524]

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

The skilled tactic of letting your HP get to 0 and going to down state ;) show me more

Oh you again. It doesn't matter 1 v 1 now does it? Only when you think you should be able to jump into a 1 v 3 and should get a kill right by skipping half the process. Obviously getting HP to zero and downed state was not the "skill" I was referring too. The skill of being able to secure kills the rest of the time with ds active is the skill. Because downed is not dead no matter how many times you think you won a fight because you downed someone. I obviously can down and finish the kill where you run off after downing someone thus I am more skilled

Yes bro I'm sure you in your infinite wisdom of getting yourself killed for the bodyguards to pick you up, have much to share with us about skill. We're 'skipping half the process', while Anet lets you skip the walk back from spawn lol.

I have no body guards. I play solo and if I follow zerg I don't join squad and never would I dl some discord and log into that to hear players but funny you should mention bodyguards.Like today I was doing daily's on my alt and ran to sos bl and that camp south of bay. Lo and behold there was a qq in the camp w 40 secs RI. I/m like oh a QQ alone that's rare but I'm not dumb af. I warclaw past right side and oh another QQ up on the archway and 2 more down below.Now I could have engaged the QQ and probably died to just 1 guy but what if I somehow was winning? Would he scream in discord or guild for help? Yeah bodyguards lol. You talk to me about bodyguards.No idea if you were there just funny to me.

[BeepBoopBop.5403]

@Jilora.9524 said:

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

The skilled tactic of letting your HP get to 0 and going to down state ;) show me more

Oh you again. It doesn't matter 1 v 1 now does it? Only when you think you should be able to jump into a 1 v 3 and should get a kill right by skipping half the process. Obviously getting HP to zero and downed state was not the "skill" I was referring too. The skill of being able to secure kills the rest of the time with ds active is the skill. Because downed is not dead no matter how many times you think you won a fight because you downed someone. I obviously can down and finish the kill where you run off after downing someone thus I am more skilled

Yes bro I'm sure you in your infinite wisdom of getting yourself killed for the bodyguards to pick you up, have much to share with us about skill. We're 'skipping half the process', while Anet lets you skip the walk back from spawn lol.

I have no body guards. I play solo and if I follow zerg I don't join squad and never would I dl some discord and log into that to hear players but funny you should mention bodyguards.Like today I was doing daily's on my alt and ran to sos bl and that camp south of bay. Lo and behold there was a qq in the camp w 40 secs RI. I/m like oh a QQ alone that's rare but I'm not dumb af. I warclaw past right side and oh another QQ up on the archway and 2 more down below.Now I could have engaged the QQ and probably died to just 1 guy but what if I somehow was winning? Would he scream in discord or guild for help? Yeah bodyguards lol. You talk to me about bodyguards.No idea if you were there just funny to me.

There's more than 1 [QQ] guild smart one. I played completely solo today fighting 1v4s so ¯\(ツ)/¯

You always seem to deflect to my guild or the class I play it's hilarious lmao. Just shows you have no point other than Q____Q

[BeepBoopBop.5403]

@Suraci.1642 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

no ds you become bag instantly, with ds you still become bag but takes a little longer, you died, you got downed, you are done, what "more skilled" you are talking about here? bag feeding skill?

Oh so ds isn't an issue? You become a bag anyway? But I thought everyone was getting downed then rezzed? I explained to beepbeep. I'm talking about I have no issue securing the kill after downing someone which seems to be a skill because so many want this op ds to be removed so they must not be able to kill someone after downing them

No, it is an issue, yes you become bag anyway, but in small scale fights. Against big zerg fights, roamers getting someone downed is completely inconsequential thus taking fun out of the gamemode where bad players get carried, they can down as many times as they want to as long as their server's numbers game on top of other servers.

I don't know what's so hard to understand about the above. This is the core of the downstate problem, it encourages this ridiculous minstrel meta of no one ever dying; the supports DON'T EVEN HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION. They'll just get you up with 3k+ armor and stability after you go down.

[Jilora.9524]

@Suraci.1642 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Suraci.1642 said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

no ds you become bag instantly, with ds you still become bag but takes a little longer, you died, you got downed, you are done, what "more skilled" you are talking about here? bag feeding skill?

Oh so ds isn't an issue? You become a bag anyway? But I thought everyone was getting downed then rezzed? I explained to beepbeep. I'm talking about I have no issue securing the kill after downing someone which seems to be a skill because so many want this op ds to be removed so they must not be able to kill someone after downing them

No, it is an issue, yes you become bag anyway, but in small scale fights. Against big zerg fights, roamers getting someone downed is completely inconsequential thus taking fun out of the gamemode where bad players get carried, they can down as many times as they want to as long as their server's numbers game on top of other servers.

Sure I'm the guy just like you trying to pick off players from zergs in keeps or towers. It's not easy. Yeah they get rezzed esp if it's a guild group. At that point it's about positioning and killing the pugs with them first. Separate isolate down burst kill. Do it all day. Sometimes you can't recover because you are outnumbered too much. That's the game. There's no 5 v 5 limit. No rule saying I can't jump you 50 to 5. It's an open field map and trying to say oh in that situation remove ds but other times it's ok I'm against. DS is part of the game. You have to play with that im mind. I doubt the situation changes much overall except w no ds maybe we can pick off more from the zerg but numbers are going to win w or w/o ds most times.

[Jilora.9524]

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@BeepBoopBop.5403 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• If you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you wouldnt die in the first place and therefore no need of downed stateAlso if you are skilled (or dont have "bad builds") you would be capable of fully killing someone in downed state hence no need to be concerned about it being there.

It's just going around in circles.

Just give up. They are more skilled during no ds and we are more skilled during the 99 percent of the times there is no event

The skilled tactic of letting your HP get to 0 and going to down state ;) show me more

Oh you again. It doesn't matter 1 v 1 now does it? Only when you think you should be able to jump into a 1 v 3 and should get a kill right by skipping half the process. Obviously getting HP to zero and downed state was not the "skill" I was referring too. The skill of being able to secure kills the rest of the time with ds active is the skill. Because downed is not dead no matter how many times you think you won a fight because you downed someone. I obviously can down and finish the kill where you run off after downing someone thus I am more skilled

Yes bro I'm sure you in your infinite wisdom of getting yourself killed for the bodyguards to pick you up, have much to share with us about skill. We're 'skipping half the process', while Anet lets you skip the walk back from spawn lol.

I have no body guards. I play solo and if I follow zerg I don't join squad and never would I dl some discord and log into that to hear players but funny you should mention bodyguards.Like today I was doing daily's on my alt and ran to sos bl and that camp south of bay. Lo and behold there was a qq in the camp w 40 secs RI. I/m like oh a QQ alone that's rare but I'm not dumb af. I warclaw past right side and oh another QQ up on the archway and 2 more down below.Now I could have engaged the QQ and probably died to just 1 guy but what if I somehow was winning? Would he scream in discord or guild for help? Yeah bodyguards lol. You talk to me about bodyguards.No idea if you were there just funny to me.

There's more than 1 [QQ] guild smart one. I played completely solo today fighting 1v4s so ¯\

(ツ)

/¯

You always seem to deflect to my guild or the class I play it's hilarious lmao. Just shows you have no point other than Q

____

Q

I like it cause QQ is a guild and an emotion kinda. You could be right. I just saw the QQ. Didn't check if it was I will make you but are you against sos this week? I can't exactly see who's there either unless I block you and look at names as I have a lot blocked from pvp pve a few from wvw so that be a pita. Right because your guild does alot of camp monuments on daily day jump 4 v 1 or you who's a port in port out reset teef w steath. Cause be invisible is very skillful I swap to that fun argument like you assume I'm a zerger needing ds to survive.

We are not more skilled on no ds week we are less skilled because we skip a step and that's why I disagree w this entire thread started by not the leader of QQ.

[Dawdler.8521]

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• You should know that it doesn't matter how skilled someone is, you can't kill player getting ressed by a zerg, it takes like 3 seconds to stomp and they can fully heal the downed player in 1.2 secs, daredevil maybe the only class could cheese through that. I have no problem with stomping when there are 3-4 people around but it is definitely a big concern in big fights.Counterpoint, zerglings remain zerglings.

Oh the argument is definetly going around in circles, people are just spinning around too much to notice it.

[ledernierrempart.6871]

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@ledernierrempart.6871 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:This is more like a list of things you’ve yet to learn about playing the game.

No downstate exposes all the bad players that can’t assess complex game mechanics and interactions.

You walk into WvW and complain about getting +1’d? That’s your fault because you should have prepared not just your build, but yourself for fighting outnumbered in a game mode that is open world.

how does getting better at the game will change the unfairness and frustration of what i have listed?

Because none of it is unfair.

When I was a baddie running around in the first couple years of the game, I had trouble with all those things you listed. But then I learned how to play the game and those things were not only no longer a problem, but I can use those things you listed to my advantage to actually do more complex things like fight and WIN outnumbered fights.

for example?

[MedievalThings.5417]

Even groups that seem super skilled, where 10-15 guys just sit out in front of a keep getting kill after kill, are dependent on numbers. No downstate proved that. Sure, they are aware, and understand their class and what their opponents can do, but all you see during normal play is how they constantly over-extend, make bad choices and get downed, only to be instantly ressed by everyone. Poor play should make you have to respawn. No downstate rewards players who time their skills right, are aware, and make good choices. I don't think for a second that Anet will ever remove it, but downstate is a crutch that players use to overcome their constant poor choices, which is why people stack. Right now the game is controlled by numbers not skill. No downstate would change that.

[God.2708]

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• You should know that it doesn't matter how skilled someone is, you can't kill player getting ressed by a zerg, it takes like 3 seconds to stomp and they can fully heal the downed player in 1.2 secs, daredevil maybe the only class could cheese through that. I have no problem with stomping when there are 3-4 people around but it is definitely a big concern in big fights.Counterpoint, zerglings remain zerglings.

Oh the argument is definetly going around in circles, people are just spinning around too much to notice it.

Rofl. Close the topic n pack it up. Video shows what 300+ posts across 5 topic couldn't get across.

[JusticeRetroHunter.7684]

@ledernierrempart.6871 said:for example?

Two Examples:

First ExampleMy most memorable fight i've ever had was a 1v8 on one of the alpine borderlands. At first the engagement began with an ally struggling against 2 other players, and he was in downstate. First what happened is that they both tried to stomp/cleave out this downstate ally of mine, and because they were both on his position, i expolited this oppurtunity to cleave them, and at the same time, rezzing my ally little by little. First enemy goes into downstate, the other enemy pulling back a bit. I cleave out the downstate, while rezzing my friend little by little. I kill him and my ally get's the rally. We are now both going after the other player, which happened to be some kind of condi bunker. The fight was now getting bigger, as another couple enemies showed up from spawn, and we had another ally. it was now a 5v3, and my other allies get downed out. But because of these downstates happening, i kept exploiting that oppurtunity to get big damage on the enemies who were cleaving out the downs. After my allies got axed to take the walk of shame back to our spawn on the other side of the map, i had created 3 downstates, and attempting to play some mind games with the other two players to get them to rez their allies. They took the bait of course and i ended up one by one taking them out. 3 more players show up, and in a constant cycle of playing chicken with their downstate allies, i was able to kill them all.

This 1v8 was back when i was solo roaming on Reaper back before it was cool...back then damage was powercreep city, and a lot, so it was essentially not-viable at the time to run around as a lonely reaper because getting one shot was common. But i had tweaked my build to make sure i was ready for every single scenario so that even in the event where i might have gotten in trouble i could disengage. (Back then i ran Become the Snow Leopard)

Second exampleSo my 1v8 was on a Reaper, and was a testament to my audacity to solo roam on a spec that was not viable to see how good of a player i was. Before playing Reaper, i was a P/P Dash thief main, and pretty well-known as the one of the few that played the build back WAY before Deadeye came out.

Now on P/P Dash, The ability to cleave out a player is almost non-existent. I found that the most pertinent issue i had was taking out players who i put into downstate. and then had to solve this issue, and i did so by capitalizing on my stomps rather than my cleaves. So what i did was used Impact Strike on my build to secure downstate stomps half of the time, and the other half i would use a Teleport stomp (Shadowstep Stomping) to secure them the other half of the time.

What i would do on P/P dash sometimes, would be to keep a player bleeding if i win a 1v1 or something...and when their ally comes along, i usually get to free-cast my pistols on em' while they attempt a rez, and then with a steal into Impact Strike, i could take out the enemy in downstate (to end the bait) and put the other one into downstate, and finish off the fight, or bait again another unsuspecting player.

This is just some of the ways I've exploited the existence of downstate in many many ways, and you can do this on pretty much any class.

[Sleepwalker.1398]

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:This is more like a list of things you’ve yet to learn about playing the game.

No downstate exposes all the bad players that can’t assess complex game mechanics and interactions.

You walk into WvW and complain about getting +1’d? That’s your fault because you should have prepared not just your build, but yourself for fighting outnumbered in a game mode that is open world.

Yeap, sure does expose the good from bad when someone comes complaining to the forum about a broken rune and their gameplay was blow Ventari tablet.

[God.2708]

@Ubi.4136 said:Even groups that seem super skilled, where 10-15 guys just sit out in front of a keep getting kill after kill, are dependent on numbers. No downstate proved that. Sure, they are aware, and understand their class and what their opponents can do, but all you see during normal play is how they constantly over-extend, make bad choices and get downed, only to be instantly ressed by everyone. Poor play should make you have to respawn. No downstate rewards players who time their skills right, are aware, and make good choices. I don't think for a second that Anet will ever remove it, but downstate is a crutch that players use to overcome their constant poor choices, which is why people stack. Right now the game is controlled by numbers not skill. No downstate would change that.

How hard is it to understand that, in a mode where sides have 40+ people, getting downed isn't a component of poor play, it's a fact of life? The only world where good play will keep you 'alive' against 5+ people targeting you is a world where all damage is non-existent. If that is what is required in order to push into an objective without having friends respawn, the only two outcomes are people tanking to the point all damage is non-existent, or simply not playing.

[Mokk.2397]

Removing the downstate is NOT the fix all for what is currently the problem in WvW . Whether it exists or not , WON'T change the blob mentality . Blobs promote bad play far more than downstate ever could . Over stacking servers promotes the blob mentality because poor players band wagon to the over stacked servers . To many successive transfers without penalties promotes the blob mentality which promotes bad play . Fix the population imbalance . Fix the for FOUR class META mentality . Force more individual self reliance by removing the excess boon share . Spread the application of boons out among ALL classes so ALL classes have a n active part to play . If your playing is carried by another player supplying all the benefits , that is far more a "crutch" than down state is . Far to many people jump on this forum demanding nerfs to everyone else because some build they got off a website does far less than the players expectations . Only a few classes can cover all aspects far to easily . That in it's self is the very definition of imbalance . Fix the downstate Imbalance so the its equal for all classes . NO mobility when downed ., No stealth when downed , NO pets when downed , NO pulls , No knock backs . Remove hard res . One downed , one healer when healers are in combat .The biggest problem in WvW is far to many people want everything for nothing . People don't want to do the work and complain that it's unfair . Learn the mechanics of the game . Learn how your builds work and it's limitations . Learn your own limitations . Learn to pick your battles . Learn how to strategize your attacks , retreats and stomps . Get on comms so you can hear what your commander is saying . Don't blame everything and everyone else for what is YOUR problem to fix . Get busy and do the work !

[krz.1327]

downstate is the biggest mistake of this game

[Suraci.1642]

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• You should know that it doesn't matter how skilled someone is, you can't kill player getting ressed by a zerg, it takes like 3 seconds to stomp and they can fully heal the downed player in 1.2 secs, daredevil maybe the only class could cheese through that. I have no problem with stomping when there are 3-4 people around but it is definitely a big concern in big fights.Counterpoint, zerglings remain zerglings.

Oh the argument is definetly going around in circles, people are just spinning around too much to notice it.

Just a bunch of mediocre players left their pug behind to get stomped by an engi that maybe didn't even need to elixir invul to stomp, what are you supposed to show here?The context is me as a solo trying to clip some people off a dense and coordinated zerg that would hyper focus on their downs to insta ress, if that was shown in the video were a good zerg they would first stealth the downed player or necro port that player out, that downed player maybe not even in the squad for the commander to care about.

The argument is definetly not going around in circles, you are just spinning around too much to notice it.

[BeepBoopBop.5403]

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Suraci.1642" said:

• You should know that it doesn't matter how skilled someone is, you can't kill player getting ressed by a zerg, it takes like 3 seconds to stomp and they can fully heal the downed player in 1.2 secs, daredevil maybe the only class could cheese through that. I have no problem with stomping when there are 3-4 people around but it is definitely a big concern in big fights.Counterpoint, zerglings remain zerglings.

Oh the argument is definetly going around in circles, people are just spinning around too much to notice it.

No idea what that clip proves. All I saw was a dude had to waste his most valuable cooldown to secure a stomp on a dead man.

A clip of the most half asleep squad I've ever seen does not represent WVW.

Also LMAO at showing a clip of downstate saying it ends the discussion, when no one is even rezzing.

[displayname.8315]

No downstate scrubbies.. git gud and stop playing ranger from 1600 range..

Complain about relevant game breaking mechanics like guild objective buffs. And pls stop following the bandwagons around.

[DemonSeed.3528]

If nds happened guess what else would follow suit? Unnecessary nerfs to just about everything I bet.

[ledernierrempart.6871]

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@ledernierrempart.6871 said:for example?

Two Examples:

First ExampleMy most memorable fight i've ever had was a 1v8 on one of the alpine borderlands. At first the engagement began with an ally struggling against 2 other players, and he was in downstate. First what happened is that they both tried to stomp/cleave out this downstate ally of mine, and because they were both on his position, i expolited this oppurtunity to cleave them, and at the same time, rezzing my ally little by little. First enemy goes into downstate, the other enemy pulling back a bit. I cleave out the downstate, while rezzing my friend little by little. I kill him and my ally get's the rally. We are now both going after the other player, which happened to be some kind of condi bunker. The fight was now getting bigger, as another couple enemies showed up from spawn, and we had another ally. it was now a 5v3, and my other allies get downed out. But because of these downstates happening, i kept exploiting that oppurtunity to get big damage on the enemies who were cleaving out the downs. After my allies got axed to take the walk of shame back to our spawn on the other side of the map, i had created 3 downstates, and attempting to play some mind games with the other two players to get them to rez their allies. They took the bait of course and i ended up one by one taking them out. 3 more players show up, and in a constant cycle of playing chicken with their downstate allies, i was able to kill them all.

This 1v8 was back when i was solo roaming on Reaper back before it was cool...back then damage was powercreep city, and a lot, so it was essentially not-viable at the time to run around as a lonely reaper because getting one shot was common. But i had tweaked my build to make sure i was ready for every single scenario so that even in the event where i might have gotten in trouble i could disengage. (Back then i ran Become the Snow Leopard)

Second exampleSo my 1v8 was on a Reaper, and was a testament to my audacity to solo roam on a spec that was not viable to see how good of a player i was. Before playing Reaper, i was a P/P Dash thief main, and pretty well-known as the one of the few that played the build back WAY before Deadeye came out.

Now on P/P Dash, The ability to cleave out a player is almost non-existent. I found that the most pertinent issue i had was taking out players who i put into downstate. and then had to solve this issue, and i did so by capitalizing on my stomps rather than my cleaves. So what i did was used Impact Strike on my build to secure downstate stomps half of the time, and the other half i would use a Teleport stomp (Shadowstep Stomping) to secure them the other half of the time.

What i would do on P/P dash sometimes, would be to keep a player bleeding if i win a 1v1 or something...and when their ally comes along, i usually get to free-cast my pistols on em' while they attempt a rez, and then with a steal into Impact Strike, i could take out the enemy in downstate (to end the bait) and put the other one into downstate, and finish off the fight, or bait again another unsuspecting player.

This is just some of the ways I've exploited the existence of downstate in many many ways, and you can do this on pretty much any class.

so you won a 2v2 fight started as 1v2 then got in a 3v5 scenario? this is far from 1v8.by the description you gave me about the fight it seems like the player you faced did not have a very high individual skill nor good decision making.you lost time dealing with downstates. from what i understood it is a fight you would have totally destroyed without downstate.so your argument of downstate helping outnumbnered fights isn't valid.

you second example show nothing of an 1v8.you can't win a true 1v8. even 1v3 is nearly impossible in normal scenario without some noobs as opponents.but you talk about it like it is a walk in the park.

there was some times when 1vX against small groups was possible because of OP gear that got nerfed afterwards.(like the rune that gave flat healing upon blocking. was OP on warriors when dealing with alot of foes.)

[Jilora.9524]

He is clearly the most skilled player of all time. He was outnumbered. They were a zerg that always rez before stomps according to some. He still somehow secured a kill against all odds.