Which class has the best downstate skills?

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

I'm looking to dominate the meta utilizing only the best class once this pesky event is over. So it's imperative we have a consensus on which class abuses this OP game mechanic. I want damage. I want heals. I want cleanses, and I want boons. The only way to top the parse is with downstate. Invisibility is a plus unless it reduces output.

D:

[Justine.6351]

Ranger is insane in downed state with a pet like wolf.

Rev has the dps.

Necro can stay alive long time and help an ongoing fight.

Edit,Rofl dug up this ancient vid...

! Rofl and people think you couldn't get wtf blown up back then...

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

mes can 1 shot people with their downstate phantasm. Ive seen it hit for nearly 12k in pvp. Also their 1 skill confusion spam still does decent damage on power builds.

[Shroud.2307]

Every class has some decent downed state skills, maybe except Engineer and Thief.

Necro's Siphon does absurdly high damage and can keep it alive for quite some time.Guard can revive itself and others if they're close enough with it's AOE heal.Mesmer can one shot people with their Phantasm if they're glassy.Revenant does pretty decent damage with it's 1 skills that also Slow, and has another skill that hits quite hard.Ranger can basically infinitely revive itself while under water. It's very annoying on land as well if they stun you while you're trying to stop the revive.Warrior can literally get back up and kill you, and if RNGeezus blesses them they'll survive if they win.Ele has Mistform. Enough said about that tbh.

I'd put it between Ranger and Necro for best downed state skills. Although all of Necro's require a target, the AOE Poison field is quite damaging and the Siphon is ridiculous. Ranger can CC you for a week and a half if it's running the right pets/traits and can get itself back up too.

[Dawdler.8521]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:Every class has some decent downed state skills, maybe except Engineer and Thief.Thief can exploit their stealth in downstate, such as dumping down the house just before they go down. That gives them enough time to literally heal up using skill 4 while invisible. Since they can tp, they wont be in a known position (ie cleave where house was dropped wont work).

Engie got good CC while down, but only any damage on power specs.

The most dangerous downed in my experience when you have problem stomping is rev and mesmer - the amount of torment and confusion just from their autoattacks make hell seem pleasant.

The "strongest" in any group or any defense situation with portals nearby is ele with vaporform.

[Shroud.2307]

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:Every class has some decent downed state skills, maybe except Engineer and Thief.Thief can exploit their stealth in downstate, such as dumping down the house just before they go down. That gives them enough time to literally heal up using skill 4 while invisible. Since they can tp, they wont be in a known position (ie cleave where house was dropped wont work).

Engie got good CC while down, but only any damage on power specs.

The most dangerous downed in my experience when you have problem stomping is rev and mesmer - the amount of torment and confusion just from their autoattacks make hell seem pleasant.

The "strongest" in any group or any defense situation with portals nearby is ele with vaporform.

True about Thief and it's downed Stealth. I think it's one of those things like Rev's push back skill. It is situationally very good, but generally not great. The ability to move around in downed state while Stealthed is pretty strong and can make it take a lot longer to completely finish the Thief, so in that regard I put it in a similar category to Ranger. It's not about the damage, it's about how long it can prevent you from finishing it off.

Still, I think Thief's downed state isn't great even if it can be very annoying under the right circumstances. And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state. The bomb is okay sometimes, it can hit fairly hard. The pull rarely does anything other than denying one stomp, and the auto attacks are terrible. I think the bomb should do a lot higher damage or the duration of the knockdown should be a lot longer.

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:Every class has some decent downed state skills, maybe except Engineer and Thief.Thief can exploit their stealth in downstate, such as dumping down the house just before they go down. That gives them enough time to literally heal up using skill 4 while invisible. Since they can tp, they wont be in a known position (ie cleave where house was dropped wont work).

Engie got good CC while down, but only any damage on power specs.

The most dangerous downed in my experience when you have problem stomping is rev and mesmer - the amount of torment and confusion just from their autoattacks make hell seem pleasant.

The "strongest" in any group or any defense situation with portals nearby is ele with vaporform.

True about Thief and it's downed Stealth. I think it's one of those things like Rev's push back skill. It is situationally very good, but generally not great. The ability to move around in downed state while Stealthed is pretty strong and can make it take a lot longer to completely finish the Thief, so in that regard I put it in a similar category to Ranger. It's not about the damage, it's about how long it can prevent you from finishing it off.

Still, I think Thief's downed state isn't great even if it can be very annoying under the right circumstances. And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state. The bomb is okay sometimes, it can hit fairly hard. The pull rarely does anything other than denying one stomp, and the auto attacks are terrible. I think the bomb should do a lot higher damage or the duration of the knockdown should be a lot longer.

Thief downstate not enough dps for my purposes. Only neat thing is their shadow step can prevent fall damage if used at the last second on ground.

D:

[ledernierrempart.6871]

i vote for ranger, necro, mesmer with an honorable mention to thief.

[Mokk.2397]

Ele all the way with mist form . Can't count the number of failed stomps because of a downed ele escaping through a door .

[Zyreva.1078]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:I think the bomb should do a lot higher damage or the duration of the knockdown should be a lot longer.

Really? It is already one of the hardest hitting "skills" in the game with a higher dmg coefficient than most regular burst skills, all while having a powerful cc attached to it. Meanwhile almost all non downed cc skills got their dmg basically removed.

[Shroud.2307]

@UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:I think the bomb should do a lot higher damage or the duration of the knockdown should be a lot longer.

Really? It is already one of the hardest hitting "skills" in the game with a higher dmg coefficient than most regular burst skills, all while having a powerful cc attached to it. Meanwhile almost all non downed cc skills got their dmg basically removed.

Engi is one of my mains and I've never hit anyone harder than like 5k with it. And I've played full glass many times.

Not saying it can't hit harder, just that typically it doesn't and I think it could use something else. Strange that it has such a high coefficient though, which I was unaware of, given 9 times out of 10 I'll only ever see it hit for like 3k tops and all it does is knock people back about 200 units.

[Jaruselka.5943]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:. ....And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state.

^ Truth. Engi has 100% garbage downed state skills. Really bad..especially in WvW. Anet should be ashamed of themselves.

SMH...

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

@Jaruselka.5943 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:. ....And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state.

^ Truth. Engi has 100% garbage downed state skills. Really bad..especially in WvW. Anet should be ashamed of themselves.

SMH...

Idk. I think it's a brilliant idea to pull enemies closer to get it over with.

D:

[Jaruselka.5943]

@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@Jaruselka.5943 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:. ....And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state.

^ Truth. Engi has 100% garbage downed state skills. Really bad..especially in WvW. Anet should be ashamed of themselves.

SMH...

Idk. I think it's a brilliant idea to pull enemies closer to get it over with.

D:

lol

A cyanide capsule would be more merciful...

[Justine.6351]

@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@Jaruselka.5943 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:. ....And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state.

^ Truth. Engi has 100% garbage downed state skills. Really bad..especially in WvW. Anet should be ashamed of themselves.

SMH...

Idk. I think it's a brilliant idea to pull enemies closer to get it over with.

D:

But the real question is what Engi even needs downed state skills?

[Svarty.8019]

@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:Which class has the best downstate skills?

1. Elementalist.
2. Thief.

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

@Jaruselka.5943 said:

@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@Jaruselka.5943 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:. ....And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state.

^ Truth. Engi has 100% garbage downed state skills. Really bad..especially in WvW. Anet should be ashamed of themselves.

SMH...

Idk. I think it's a brilliant idea to pull enemies closer to get it over with.

D:

lol

A cyanide capsule would be more merciful...

Only if it gets upgraded with Elixir traits.

D:

[TheGrimm.5624]

@Jaruselka.5943 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:. ....And Engi, I don't know, lol. Engi is one of my most played classes and I can't find any redeeming features about it's downed state.

^ Truth. Engi has 100% garbage downed state skills. Really bad..especially in WvW. Anet should be ashamed of themselves.

SMH...

SMH x3 from all three of my engis.

[Blocki.4931]

All I know is that Warrior is really low on the list.

Vengeance is a cool idea, but in PvP/WvW the cooldown on it is so long you're either dead or the enemy just walked away from you while you wave your fist angrily at them before keeling over.Other than that.. we have rocks.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:I'd put it between Ranger and Necro for best downed state skills. Although all of Necro's require a target, the AOE Poison field is quite damaging and the Siphon is ridiculous. Ranger can CC you for a week and a half if it's running the right pets/traits and can get itself back up too.

Playing some of all classes, would agree. ^^^^

[Jeydra.4386]

I feel like the other answers are missing the point, Ele obviously has the best downed state mechanic. The point is, once you are downed, your priority is to get to safety and revive yourself. The best way to get to safety is to move backwards, and Ele is the best at that. Damage output while downed isn't really relevant. The only other comparable skill is the Ranger self-revive, but that's no Vapor Form since it still takes time to fill and you'll probably be on dangerous ground during that duration.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@Jeydra.4386 said:I feel like the other answers are missing the point, Ele obviously has the best downed state mechanic. The point is, once you are downed, your priority is to get to safety and revive yourself. The best way to get to safety is to move backwards, and Ele is the best at that. Damage output while downed isn't really relevant. The only other comparable skill is the Ranger self-revive, but that's no Vapor Form since it still takes time to fill and you'll probably be on dangerous ground during that duration.

I would rank Ele and Rev up there as well. Ele due to the reason you mentioned. Necro can outright drop and finish another player though, so though it doesn't have that escape mechanism its still able to actively fight and defeat another while downed.

[KrHome.1920]

Every downstate skill has a counter. So there is no best downstate skill. It depends on what build you encounter. And then it depends whether surviving or dealing as much damage as possible is more important to you in downstate.

Necro:

• insane damage, a highly telegraphed fear (easy to dodge), low range, countered with stability, invuln, range

Thief:

• insane stomp denial, low damage, faster to cleave than to stomp

Engi:

• 2 hard cc skills in downstate, low damage but takes forever to stomp if no 2x stability source

Revenant:

• lots of cc (slow against cleave and push to get rid of melee targets) and a damage skill if the stomp takes too long, can be countered with stability

Elementalist:

• two useless damage skills, but additionally the ultimate stomp denial and disengage skill, no counter if the ele is at close distance to a safe spot (door, his team etc.)

Mesmer:

• a stomp denial that has technically no counter (stealth) but is unreliable and a big damage skill (oneshot potential)

Ranger:

• needs to be stomped fast or the pet will revive it, one interrupt to deny a fast stomp, countered with stability

Warrior:

• the same as ranger but instead a revive you get vengeance, the interrupt is only single target

Guardian:

• the same as ranger and warrior but with a (weaker) healing field instead of revive and vengeance, the interrupt is multi target

Again: there is no "the best".

[SweetPotato.7456]

Warrior has the best down state HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

[Doug.4930]

@"KrHome.1920" said:Every downstate skill has a counter. So there is no best downstate skill. It depends on what build you encounter. And then it depends whether surviving or dealing as much damage as possible is more important to you in downstate.

Necro:

• insane damage, a highly telegraphed fear (easy to dodge), low range, countered with stability, invuln, range

Thief:

• insane stomp denial, low damage, faster to cleave than to stomp

Engi:

• 2 hard cc skills in downstate, low damage but takes forever to stomp if no 2x stability source

Revenant:

• lots of cc (slow against cleave and push to get rid of melee targets) and a damage skill if the stomp takes too long, can be countered with stability

Elementalist:

• two useless damage skills, but additionally the ultimate stomp denial and disengage skill, no counter if the ele is at close distance to a safe spot (door, his team etc.)

Mesmer:

• a stomp denial that has technically no counter (stealth) but is unreliable and a big damage skill (oneshot potential)

Ranger:

• needs to be stomped fast or the pet will revive it, one interrupt to deny a fast stomp, countered with stability

Warrior:

• the same as ranger but instead a revive you get vengeance, the interrupt is only single target

Guardian:

• the same as ranger and warrior but with a (weaker) healing field instead of revive and vengeance, the interrupt is multi target

Again: there is no "the best".

I would say anything that has a 2 skill that can deny stomps is objectively better. Mesmer/Thief/Ele. Ele has no counter you need to wait for the skill skip. Thief can be countered by a targeted teleport or an AOE teleport + stealth. Mesmer you need reveal and a teleport half the time. All other classes are easier to counter the 2 skills. Stability/teleporting/invulns/blinds/stealth etc.

I still think that downstate skills should be the same. the 2 should CC the 3 should give a small heal or AOE damage.