Patch notes up July 7th, Wvw NERFS.

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/109335/game-update-notes-july-7-2020

Warclaw

• Battle Maul: Reduced target cap from 3 to 1 in WvW. Increased target cap from 3 to 10 in other game modes.
• Superior Battle Maul: Reduced target cap from 3 to 1 in WvW.
• Warclaw Mastery 4: This mastery no longer causes Superior Battle Maul to finish downed enemies. Instead it causes Superior Battle Maul to deal 20% bonus damage to downed enemies.
• Fatal Fangs: This achievement will now progress when striking a downed enemy with Superior Battle Maul instead of when finishing a downed enemy. This does not affect existing achievement progress.

Dragon Banner

• Dragon's Might: Reduced initial strike power coefficient from 0.666 to 0.5. Reduced second strike power coefficient from 0.8333 to 0.625. Reduced third strike power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.75.
• Dragon Talon: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.75.

Siege Weapons

• Arrow Cart: Reduced power damage of all skills by 20%.
• Ballista: Reduced power damage to players of all skills by 20%. Damage to siege weapons is unchanged for skills 1 and 3.
• Cannon: Reduced power damage of all skills by 20%.

Congratulations guys!Warclaw stomp and siege made useless!Banner changes probably nothingburgers! reduce target cap and range maybe?Enjoy the boon ball pirate ship dancing!

I agree with Dragon banner but I don't get the rest. It seems like they want these already hard to kill 20+ guilds groups to be able to live forever. I mean I already watch or stand under 3 or 4 ac's and don't die. Warclaw a huge cat is 1 target and shades are what 10. Pugs can't even pick off a downed now with warclaw which was one way of thinning them and their run back and forth overhealing and rezzing in 2 seconds over and over.

@"XenesisII.1540" said:https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/109335/game-update-notes-july-7-2020

Warclaw

• Battle Maul: Reduced target cap from 3 to 1 in WvW. Increased target cap from 3 to 10 in other game modes.
• Superior Battle Maul: Reduced target cap from 3 to 1 in WvW.
• Warclaw Mastery 4: This mastery no longer causes Superior Battle Maul to finish downed enemies. Instead it causes Superior Battle Maul to deal 20% bonus damage to downed enemies.
• Fatal Fangs: This achievement will now progress when striking a downed enemy with Superior Battle Maul instead of when finishing a downed enemy. This does not affect existing achievement progress.

Dragon Banner

• Dragon's Might: Reduced initial strike power coefficient from 0.666 to 0.5. Reduced second strike power coefficient from 0.8333 to 0.625. Reduced third strike power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.75.
• Dragon Talon: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.75.

Siege Weapons

• Arrow Cart: Reduced power damage of all skills by 20%.
• Ballista: Reduced power damage to players of all skills by 20%. Damage to siege weapons is unchanged for skills 1 and 3.
• Cannon: Reduced power damage of all skills by 20%.

The removal of the warclaw finisher might directly be tied to the idea of rebuffing scourge shades.

Quick finishers on warclaw were a recent strategy against ultra durable fast rez blobs after feb25. That's gone now but in exchange scourges can melee push again.

(I am not saying that this might be a good idea! It just seems reasonable regarding how ANet "fixes" things.)

@"XenesisII.1540" said:Congratulations guys!Warclaw stomp and siege made useless!Banner changes probably nothingburgers! reduce target cap and range maybe?Enjoy the boon ball pirate ship dancing!

Yup, I thought they would reduce the duration or Target limit on Dragon Breath Banner #5 too, but it looks like people will still be carrying alot of these around in open field fights. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dragon%27s_Breath

@Jilora.9524 said:I agree with Dragon banner but I don't get the rest. It seems like they want these already hard to kill 20+ guilds groups to be able to live forever. I mean I already watch or stand under 3 or 4 ac's and don't die. Warclaw a huge cat is 1 target and shades are what 10. Pugs can't even pick off a downed now with warclaw which was one way of thinning them and their run back and forth overhealing and rezzing in 2 seconds over and over.

Yeah I kinda liked being able to pick off the first couple downs from the initial bomb before getting into the fight, especially when fighting bigger groups.Advantage big groups again.

But yeah AC's were already useless, boon balls could sit under multiples of them no problem, pugs could also easily avoid them(if you're not a mirage you have two dodges!), might as well just remove acs from the game at this point. AC's should have had their range reduced not damage, they're suppose to be an area denial tool. Canons were already just barely able to kill rams before a reinforced gate would go down. Now don't even bother.Advantage big groups again.

Banners should be brought down to target cap of regular aoes and reduced range. Every fight now has 1-3 of these, which is just worse when the bigger team is doing it. But hey anet loves rolling snowballs down hills.Advantage big groups again.

Boon ball.Advantage big groups again.

Scourge double shroud skills.Advantage big groups again.

@"KrHome.1920" said:The removal of the warclaw finisher might directly be tied to the idea of rebuffing scourge shades.

Quick finishers on warclaw were a recent strategy against ultra durable fast rez blobs after feb25. That's gone now but in exchange scourges can melee push again.

(I am not saying that this might be a good idea! It just seems reasonable regarding how ANet "fixes" things.)

Actually I find that most scourges were saving their shroud for themselves instead of shades, since most of the organized groups push as melee anyways, there was a whole lot less shades to avoid in battles. So I doubt the changes were from the shade changes, more like a hey we're listening to wvw forums! change, some people have been crying about stomp for a year now.

The wvw updates seem good for the wvw only tools. Its a bit different for scorges and scorge alone but that can be fixed.

I think "WVW and wvw only effects" this was realty good update and a good indicator anet willing to push player combat.

The original warclaw stomp was one of the very few things I agreed with for the mount in WvW cause it actually provided some counterplay to how overpowered downstate and rezzing is. But fuck that lets just once again further devolve this game mode into whoever has the most numbers so they can be carried by the utterly broken downstate mechanic

Siege made useless how? Even with a 20% damage nerf that's negligable since it's AoE damage. It's like saying that oh man, the 5 arrowcarts up there... they only equal 4 arrowcarts now. Because 4 arrowcarts does nothing on a zerg, right? And a ballista bolt still does what, 10k damage?

So its back to PoF launch pretty much but with less counter to the zerging. Fantastic. Wonderful. I guess Ill wait six months until the next balance patch of worth to come back and give a good chunk of my time~

@"Jski.6180" said:The wvw updates seem good for the wvw only tools. Its a bit different for scorges and scorge alone but that can be fixed.

I think "WVW and wvw only effects" this was realty good update and a good indicator anet willing to push player combat.

Or more likely it's that they want more ktrains running. Check, we can stop the shoutouts since there is no longer any defending. Go ahead and remove all the servers, we are in a good spot to just divide people up into green-blue-red as they long into WvW.

Next patch notes:

• New bot tags added that will appear and just move from structure to structure around the map. Players not within 2000 units will be kicked from game mode, the same will occur to players staying in a structure for more than 10 seconds. Each sides' tag will move in a clockwise motion to ensure no player overlapping from the three groups. If you are spawning in, just wait for the next bot rotation to come back to your spawn.

acs are garbage and a well sieged objective with 3-4 of them covering any one point requires a blob to take it, and fucks over smaller groups from attempting. but but trebs + catas!!!11 yeah well guess what that objective will have counters to that to, so what happens is a pvp mode turns into siege vs siege. its lame and needs to die.

@"XenesisII.1540" said:https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/109335/game-update-notes-july-7-2020

Warclaw

• Battle Maul: Reduced target cap from 3 to 1 in WvW. Increased target cap from 3 to 10 in other game modes.
• Superior Battle Maul: Reduced target cap from 3 to 1 in WvW.
• Warclaw Mastery 4: This mastery no longer causes Superior Battle Maul to finish downed enemies. Instead it causes Superior Battle Maul to deal 20% bonus damage to downed enemies.
• Fatal Fangs: This achievement will now progress when striking a downed enemy with Superior Battle Maul instead of when finishing a downed enemy. This does not affect existing achievement progress.

I love how they think anyone uses the Warclaw outside of WvW. Like...seriously?

@"KrHome.1920" said:The removal of the warclaw finisher might directly be tied to the idea of rebuffing scourge shades.

Quick finishers on warclaw were a recent strategy against ultra durable fast rez blobs after feb25. That's gone now but in exchange scourges can melee push again.

(I am not saying that this might be a good idea! It just seems reasonable regarding how ANet "fixes" things.)

why they couldnt melee push before?tbh i fucking hate warclaw but i rather have insta stomp over the scourges pooping shades again from all over the place

No point in laying siege anymore or defending stuff. Next patch, they'll just remove the disables too. Seriously making me wonder why we still play this game, let alone this mode. They could have gone an entirely different direction in improving the game. What do they do? Nerf the kitties to the point that it's just faster to run on foot, scratch your ass while you wait for a door or wall to come down while under "siege" fire, and double down on wanting fights with multiple dragon banners.

Wait so they buffed the warclaw in pve? Kept the damage of battle maul but removed the stomp....

lawl.

I mean nerfing dragon banner is good but nothing when it came to skill balance.

See you in 6 months. :S

@Dawdler.8521 said:Siege made useless how? Even with a 20% damage nerf that's negligable since it's AoE damage. It's like saying that oh man, the 5 arrowcarts up there... they only equal 4 arrowcarts now. Because 4 arrowcarts does nothing on a zerg, right? And a ballista bolt still does what, 10k damage?

The only times you run into 5 acs raining down on you is at specific chokes in the game, like smc gates, less often on keep gates because there's so many other places to break into a keep. I've seen zergs sit under 4-5 acs, and I've seen them counter with one shield. Most other times you're breaking into places with catas, because they're ranged, easier to defend more so with shields of their own and the gen, and in some cases for keeps double wall break through with the same siege.

Why was another damage nerf warranted? the boon ball zergs too damn lazy to move around now too?

But hey who cares, lets get wvw closer to the eotm ktrain state. It's about time they drop alliances too and just move to eotm population sorting anyways.

I'm confused. Haven't people been complaining about siege since forever? And now it gets nerfed and everyone's upset?

The WvW community is an enigma. I'd say "the happy ones are playing the game and not complaining", but the people complaining are the same ones that wanted nerfs to these things in the past, lol.

My two cents, all of it sounds pretty okay to me. The removal of Warclaw stomp is 50/50. It had a lot of value in some situations and in others it was obnoxious. So it's both good and bad - I feel roughly neutral about it.

Balista still needs to not do heavy damage to players. It should be for killing siege. Arrowcarts, Cannons and Burning Oil are all perfectly good enough for defense. Why there needs to be something that can cut someone's health clean in half from across the field is beyond me. Sure, it's single target, but it's far too rewarding and easy to be a pest with. It should be doing 5k absolute tops. Ideally more like 3k because again, there are other options for siege to damage players.

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:I'm confused. Haven't people been complaining about siege since forever? And now it gets nerfed and everyone's upset?

Yes, if they had been listening to twitch on thursday when Anet are running in WvW, they would of known about these changes coming, but clearly they didn't and while one side are happy about the changes to warclaw and siege like me, the other side now come onto forums about the nerfs which they don't like, either way, whatever happens people will always complain.

@Mini Crinny.6190 said:...they would of known about these changes coming...

they would HAVE known. There I fixed it for you.

@Melian.5368 said:

@Mini Crinny.6190 said:...they would of known about these changes coming...

Nice to have a grammar nazi here :)

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:I'm confused. Haven't people been complaining about siege since forever? And now it gets nerfed and everyone's upset?

The WvW community is an enigma. I'd say "the happy ones are playing the game and not complaining", but the people complaining are the same ones that wanted nerfs to these things in the past, lol.

My two cents, all of it sounds pretty okay to me. The removal of Warclaw stomp is 50/50. It had a lot of value in some situations and in others it was obnoxious. So it's both good and bad - I feel roughly neutral about it.

Balista still needs to not do heavy damage to players. It should be for killing siege. Arrowcarts, Cannons and Burning Oil are all perfectly good enough for defense. Why there needs to be something that can cut someone's health clean in half from across the field is beyond me. Sure, it's single target, but it's far too rewarding and easy to be a pest with. It should be doing 5k absolute tops. Ideally more like 3k because again, there are other options for siege to damage players.

Siege is a double-edged sword in that way because of the compounding effects of the current boon/sustain meta. A comped up guild blob can sit with utter impunity under nearly any amount of siege, and moreso now. Their heal-over-time plus quick rez potential means they can just ball up on a gate no problem. And that's before even talking about shield gens.

On the other hand, siege is pretty oppressive on smaller groups. If you have 5-10 on a door, a couple of sup ACs hurt bad, and are more than enough to push you off.

So the answer is kind of twofold - there needs to be a way to area-deny large groups so they are forced to deal with the siege instead of just turtling under it (or the sustain of larger groups needs to be nerfed). But at the same time, smaller groups shouldn't be able to be mowed down by 2 dudes on ACs. Personally I've thought the damage was in a good place for siege in most situations prior to today. I still think shield gens are overpowered (not relevant to this patch, but) and that siege doesn't affect very large groups enough.

All great changes, but Dragon Banner 3 and 5 should've gotten adjusted. Dragon Blast and Dragon's Breath are the real issues. A knockback should not do this much damage, and Dragon's Breath damage modifier too high for the number of targets it hits. There should also be a cap how many Dragon Banners can be picked up at once on a given map. Facing a server with a map queue while they're using 5 Dragon Banners is pretty ridiculous. And this isn't even an exaggeration.

Warclaw stomp removed, finally, this is one of the best changes in a long time. People don't get to just sit on their mounts waiting to stomp a clump of downs. They actually have to gasp play their class and help out. A quick test today shows support classes actually have a chance to revive downed players. They are not insta mount stomped with zero counter-play. Ty Anet.

Still searching for the Stealth changes did I miss it in all the words ???