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Will 3rd Expansion happen at all?

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  • Sorry for bumping this topic, but I'd like to point something out about the percenteges that you guys posted and were debating about.
    Those percenteges can easily be read in a different way too. While I'm sure that the game is in decline, the percentages could easily show an increase of base game players too, since they can't actually start the story chapter if they don't own the expansion first.

  • @Ameepa.6793 said:
    I am 100% sure it will.

    boy, this didnt age well...

  • Ameepa.6793Ameepa.6793 Member ✭✭✭

    @Konrad Curze.5130 said:

    @Ameepa.6793 said:
    I am 100% sure it will.

    boy, this didnt age well...

    Oh kitten, I was wrong 2 years ago!

  • In all honesty, ANET imploded before the restructuring (at least based on Jessica Price's twitter posts).
    If anything, the restructuring and the change of ownership might have saved the franchise.
    I'm taking in consideration that all big companies have a 1 year plan (that's usually planned at the end of the year and goes in effect at the beginning of the next one) that they follow and that all bigger mmo studios a lot of content ready in advance, making the content (both the actual content and time window for releasing it) that we got in the last 11 months not something that the new restructured teams came up with, but rather the leftovers of the old ones.
    If this is the case, we should start seeing some kind of difference in a month or so.
    (An indication of this possibly being the case, is their release of the roadmap for Q1 2020, in which they said they will start releasing content every month).

  • Daddicus.6128Daddicus.6128 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 21, 2020

    The game is dying, but has a lot of inertia before it goes completely.

    They insured the game would die when they let Gaile go; no game can survive without a community liason. It's just a matter of when.

    But, even if they hadn't, they shaft veterans so often that it's hard to stick around. Caps on achievements instead of diminishing returns, for example.

    For me, though, the biggest thing is the absurdly low amount of achievement points available. The first player to get the top reward did so less than a year ago. How can "achievements" be so sparsely distributed that the very best of the best took over six years to reach the top? What hope do I have of EVER attaining that goal? Zero. I still love the game, but it's hard to dive into anything really interesting. I suspect there are a lot of players like me: frustrated at the absurdly low achievement point distribution.

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Daddicus.6128 said:
    The game is dying, but has a lot of inertia before it goes completely.

    They insured the game would die when they let Gaile go; no game can survive without a community liason. It's just a matter of when.

    But, even if they hadn't, they shaft veterans so often that it's hard to stick around. Caps on achievements instead of diminishing returns, for example.

    For me, though, the biggest thing is the absurdly low amount of achievement points available. The first player to get the top reward did so less than a year ago. How can "achievements" be so sparsely distributed that the very best of the best took over six years to reach the top? What hope do I have of EVER attaining that goal? Zero. I still love the game, but it's hard to dive into anything really interesting. I suspect there are a lot of players like me: frustrated at the absurdly low achievement point distribution.

    inb4 "BUt yOu don't hAVe tO Get aLL THe acHIEVeMENtS!"

    Depression and anxiety are the worst...

  • Hashberry.4510Hashberry.4510 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Good lord, cheevos are some meaningless number. Vets are rewarded constantly, as we master the classes, the crafts, the gold game. Why should we need a silly number.

  • zityz.6089zityz.6089 Member ✭✭✭

    @Hashberry.4510 said:
    Good lord, cheevos are some meaningless number. Vets are rewarded constantly, as we master the classes, the crafts, the gold game. Why should we need a silly number.

    I think it's more for completionists and people who would like the achievement armour/chests. That would be my guess.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hashberry.4510 said:
    Good lord, cheevos are some meaningless number. Vets are rewarded constantly, as we master the classes, the crafts, the gold game. Why should we need a silly number.

    Given that you get weapon skins and armour skins (as well as other stuff) through doing achievements, it's not just a number.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @zityz.6089 said:

    @Hashberry.4510 said:
    Good lord, cheevos are some meaningless number. Vets are rewarded constantly, as we master the classes, the crafts, the gold game. Why should we need a silly number.

    I think it's more for completionists and people who would like the achievement armour/chests. That would be my guess.

    Those armor/weapon skins didn't exist when the achievement rewards were added. The achievement rewards get new things as the game progresses, the achievements have no actual "top". The mistake they did was adding skins to the achievement rewards when nobody was able to reach them, they should unlock the achievement skins when the first player gets them, so as to avoid this non-sense of "please give more AP".

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @zityz.6089 said:

    @Hashberry.4510 said:
    Good lord, cheevos are some meaningless number. Vets are rewarded constantly, as we master the classes, the crafts, the gold game. Why should we need a silly number.

    I think it's more for completionists and people who would like the achievement armour/chests. That would be my guess.

    Those armor/weapon skins didn't exist when the achievement rewards were added. The achievement rewards get new things as the game progresses, the achievements have no actual "top". The mistake they did was adding skins to the achievement rewards when nobody was able to reach them, they should unlock the achievement skins when the first player gets them, so as to avoid this non-sense of "please give more AP".

    The real problem, imo, is the "missing APs" when coupled with the lower AP gain nowadays. Basically, not only people starting now are, and always will be behind (which alone could be justified), but they are behind way more than those missing 1-2 years of AP, as getting now the same amount is going to take way, way more time than then.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • Zok.4956Zok.4956 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 22, 2020

    @yefluke.3168 said:
    Will 3rd Expansion happen at all?

    >

    Since MMORPG games are in the age of decline, and new expansion will most likely release in late 2019.
    It is almost 1 years and half from today, (and 2 years might see drastically change in game trends, popularity of certain kind of game and technology)

    I'm not very sure if GW2 will invest in new expansion...(they started but might not release...)
    Do you guys think of how much % that it will not happening?

    For me it is 30%. that it won't happen...

    Anet was in the past experimenting with a lot of new things, others before have not tried before. This lead to a lot of things that made GW2 outstanding to other MMOs, but not everything was a "hit", there were also "misses".

    If I remember correctly, during S1, Mo said, the Living-world episodes, a really changing world, will be the way to go. Expansions are so old-fashioned (and happen only every few years, in between players have not much to do...) but GW2 will deliver a constant content stream with the Living World and everything that would be in an Expansion, would be delivered with the Living-Word.

    In my opinion, this base-idea (not every episode and not the writing itself, at the beginning) of S1 worked well. It was a bold idea, that you have to be present, to play the content. It worked in a way, that no Living-world episodes that came later felt so "epic" as some of the S1 episodes. However, players that missed an episode or new Players that came later to the game, could not play this content. The massive work/investment/content from Anet for S1 was lost and players started complaining "there is no content". So, commercially it seems, how S1 was delivered, was a very costly decision.

    In the end with S1 and later in S2 there were usually new living world episodes/festivals every two weeks. It was a lot of content that was delivered in a fast pace and with S2 a lot more of the story happened in instances, that could be replayed. But a lot still happended in existing Maps (when I remember correctly, the only new Maps from S1 and S2 were Southsun, Dry-Top and Silverwastes).

    However, somtime during S2 Anet made the decision to make an expansion (HoT). They announced this January 2015 with the last episode of S2. And because all devs at Anet now worked for the expansion, non were left to create more livin-world episodes. This resulted in nearly 10 month of no new content before the release of HoT.

    I do not rember a statement from Anet, why they changed their mind and created an expansion.

    With the release of HoT they did not want to make the same mistake (content draught) and when they started with the work for S3 they also formed parallel Teams that worked on the next expansion (that came after S3 and became PoF). For S3 they also created a new map for every episode. The wanted not to change the core maps anymore to overcome phasing problems etc. with the Living-Story, so every episode has its own new map that is frozen in time of the story of that episode.

    There were some updates after the release of HoT but it took nine months after the relase of HoT until S3 started. However, PoF was realeased only two months after the end of S3.

    Because, simplified, half the company worked on S3 and the other half worked on PoF, the Living world S3 was not released every two weeks anymore, but around every 2-months. There was now a new map with every Episode of S3, but the two-monthly cycle felt as "not enough content".

    The first episode of S4 was released two-month after the release of PoF. This was much faster than the nine-months waiting time before (from HoT until S3).

    From the time of the release of PoF, or shortly after, I remember some statement from Anet, that their planning will be: S4 will lead into S5 which will lead into Expac-3.

    From the amount of content that was delivered with S4 (compared to the past) it was clear, that Anet also had to work heavily on other things (i.e. expac-3) with the
    large amount of devs they had (and the head count increased more and more).

    During/After the layoffs in 2019 it shine through, that an unannounced big-sideproject was cancelled (mobile game or console game), because it was delayed again-and-again and that also Mo worked at early stages for a GW3. Maybe the "big-sideproject" was GW3 and Maybe S5 should lead not to an expac but to GW3.

    However, MikeZ of Anet stated sometime in 2019 (after the big layoffs) that they now will be focussion completely on GW2, but also, that they are actually not working on another expansion and that season 5 will be called a "Saga" and will be content like an expansion ("expansion-worthy", or something like that, forgot the exact wording).

    S5E0 (Prolog) was small-content, but has fun/great elements and it was not the "official" first episode of the saga.
    S5E1 (Whisper in the Dark) was also small, story/content wise, and it felt not-finished. It definitely could not deliver the promise from the stage-event from Anet.
    Maybe this episode still suffered from the layoffs and was planned bigger but did not finish in time, so they released half of an episode as S5E1 and will deliver the other half as S5E2.

    So, now to the original question "Will 3rd Expansion happen at all?"

    Anet stated, that they are not working on a 3rd expansion. So, actually, it will not be in the near future (probably never). But they also said (before HoT), they did not want an expansion and then developed HoT later. So Anet can change its direction and could do so, again, in the future.

    However, if the amount of content, that will be delivered with S5, does not increase in the future (they created more content in the past with few people), it is clear (to me) that large ressources of Anet are still put into other (side-)projects and if this will not be an expac-3, maybe it will be GW3 or some other mobile/console-game and this would mean, that they are doing with S5 only so much, that they hold enough players for the gem-shop until that side-project will be delivered and makes-money (and then, at last, GW2 will be on maintenance-mode).

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  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 22, 2020

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    The real problem, imo, is the "missing APs" when coupled with the lower AP gain nowadays.

    It depends what you count as "nowadays" I guess

    2017: 1211 AP, Path of Fire: 1235 AP, 2446 Total AP
    2018: 861 AP
    2019: 1536 AP

    Living World Season 1 missing AP: 2344 (over 15 months)

    Notes:
    2017 includes the 368 AP from the old Current Events, transferred to different categories on August 2017, I wasn't sure when they were added to the game
    2018 includes the 85 AP from Current Events
    In Path of Fire I add Basic and Rare collections that were added after the release of the expansion, the initial total of the expansion was 1165
    I do not include any Black Lion weapon collections to my lists, they add about 3 AP per collection

    Results:
    As long as we are getting expansions, we don't get lower AP nowadays, or at least it's not a considerable difference. Also worth noting the vast difference between 2018 and 2019 (almost doubled the amount of AP) which is encouraging for the future of AP hunting. Moreover, in 2019 we got more AP than with Path of Fire, which is also good.

    In order for the post to be shorter I omitted the analysis.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dante.1508 said:
    You have that completely backwards.. those percentages are of the customers that did the content on gw2efficiency.. 67% never even bothered to do the final content.

    I did understand that 67% did not bother to do it. But that could be for any reason - most likely, they quit the game, as there is a decline in population, no?

    My statement still stands that 90% of those who did bother (i.e., who still play the game) finished said content without complaints. So, clearly, you did not understand what I was saying. ;)

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 22, 2020

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    The real problem, imo, is the "missing APs" when coupled with the lower AP gain nowadays.

    It depends what you count as "nowadays" I guess

    2017: 1211 AP, Path of Fire: 1235 AP, 2446 Total AP
    2018: 861 AP
    2019: 1536 AP

    Living World Season 1 missing AP: 2344 (over 15 months)

    Notes:
    2017 includes the 368 AP from the old Current Events, transferred to different categories on August 2017, I wasn't sure when they were added to the game
    2018 includes the 85 AP from Current Events
    In Path of Fire I add Basic and Rare collections that were added after the release of the expansion, the initial total of the expansion was 1165
    I do not include any Black Lion weapon collections to my lists, they add about 3 AP per collection

    Results:
    As long as we are getting expansions, we don't get lower AP nowadays, or at least it's not a considerable difference. Also worth noting the vast difference between 2018 and 2019 (almost doubled the amount of AP) which is encouraging for the future of AP hunting. Moreover, in 2019 we got more AP than with Path of Fire, which is also good.

    In order for the post to be shorter I omitted the analysis.

    I think when most people say that, they are referring to all of the LS1 achievements that are no longer able to be obtained + all the old festival achievements, and the rest of the historical achievements.

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  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dante.1763 said:
    I think when most people say that, they are referring to all of the LS1 achievements that are no longer able to be obtained + all the old festival achievements, and the rest of the historical achievements.

    I posted the LS1 achievements that can no longer be obtained, it's 2344 AP. There is a total of 246 retired achievements, fractals and the old minis. There is also the 405 AP from the first WvW season. Festival AP during Season 1 is 777 AP, bringing the grand total of AP missed during LS1 to 3772 AP (over 15 months)
    Now of course there were more festivals between the end of LS1 and 2018, when they changed it to the current format of tracking all achievement lifetime.

  • coso.9173coso.9173 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If they ever do, it would be after this season. If we go to season 6 after this I don't think we'll see another expac in the future. IMO of course.

  • Daddicus.6128Daddicus.6128 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @zityz.6089 said:

    @Hashberry.4510 said:
    Good lord, cheevos are some meaningless number. Vets are rewarded constantly, as we master the classes, the crafts, the gold game. Why should we need a silly number.

    I think it's more for completionists and people who would like the achievement armour/chests. That would be my guess.

    I wanted radiant armor skins.

  • I suspect the next expansion will cover Cantha and the unnamed sea dragon.

  • I'am a casual player. as well as all of my friends.
    I'm so bored with content right now, not even finish s4 E5, E6. and only login to get S5 content and never start it.
    Even if I have 20 of characters so far....

    I think the game need expansion or some refreshing.

  • Dante.1508Dante.1508 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    You have that completely backwards.. those percentages are of the customers that did the content on gw2efficiency.. 67% never even bothered to do the final content.

    I did understand that 67% did not bother to do it. But that could be for any reason - most likely, they quit the game, as there is a decline in population, no?

    My statement still stands that 90% of those who did bother (i.e., who still play the game) finished said content without complaints. So, clearly, you did not understand what I was saying. ;)

    Keep moving those goal posts lol