The Untamed is so incredibly bad.

[vectorfox.6894]

4 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

The ranger community was crying for Bunny Thumper despite being warned against the idea, this bunny thumper has been cried about for years since soulbeast launch.......this happens because a developer studio seriously makes use of forum banter to design a prodcut..rather than use common sense and trusted methods like any other studio does

I never played bunny thumper but if it worked in Gw1 then im sure its fine and im not even really annoyed at what we got as much as people mis-classifying the class as some pet focused spec when the player is also sharing the damage and receiving empowered skills. I really think if they did a pet specific elite it wouldn't require that much extra for the playerside, no unique buffs from mechanics or traits on the player side just use what the player has to make it enhance the pet on top of giving it updated or controllable skills.

Examples; Giving pets more cc/taunt, receive a portion of player inc healing, taking some of the player stats, player sending boons to pets who get additional effects, crit-ing an enemy buffs your pets ferocity or applying condis improves its condi dps.

[ChronoPinoyX.7923]

6 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

The ranger community was crying for Bunny Thumper despite being warned against the idea, this bunny thumper has been cried about for years since soulbeast launch.......this happens because a developer studio seriously makes use of forum banter to design a prodcut..rather than use common sense and trusted methods like any other studio does

Except the core concept of Bunny Thumper would have worked just fine since it doesn't rely on a sudden Switching mechanic between pet and player, all your capabilities in a Bunny Thumper are readily available to you and you're not suddenly getting punished because you happen to switch to a different state. 

[mistsim.2748]

If ANet wants us to mass CC people, then they need to build in gap closers for the hammer. Also, GW2 is all about damage, this has been the case for 8 years. You CC someone, ok so? What's the follow-up? There has to be huge spike damage. Untamed has to be a DPS spec first, CC spec second. 

If I want CC and utility in zerg fights, hammer Spellbreaker  does that so much better. 

All this being said, Untamed actually blows as a CC spec. You have one daze, one hugely telegraphed aoe stun, and a bad immob. Immob Druid with MM does way more CC, while also bringing lots of cleansing to the table.

Edited October 27, 2021 by mistsim.2748

[Nighthawk.2401]

1 hour ago, mistsim.2748 said:

If ANet wants us to mass CC people, then they need to build in gap closers for the hammer. Also, GW2 is all about damage, this has been the case for 8 years. You CC someone, ok so? What's the follow-up? There has to be huge spike damage. Untamed has to be a DPS spec first, CC spec second. 

If I want CC and utility in zerg fights, hammer Spellbreaker  does that so much better. 

All this being said, Untamed actually blows as a CC spec. You have one daze, one hugely telegraphed aoe stun, and a bad immob. Immob Druid with MM does way more CC, while also bringing lots of cleansing to the table.

 

Yeah, I main immob druid (and occasionally soulbeast), I think the existing builds feel like better squad-CC builds in WvW than this new spec does, which is sad. In small fights you get more mobility and utility with the existing builds than you do with hammer. And in larger fights, where stability is so prevalent, most of Untamed's CC is useless. I feel like Anet missed the mark big time on this. I was oh so hoping to finally get a serious/competitive ranger WvW spec, but instead we got a meme Spec that blows at 1v1s, 5v5s, and 20v20s...

 

...and they screwed over all of the existing pet controls while they were at it. You can't keybind "retreat" and "attack" keys anymore, so no more microing your pet out of damaging AoEs like you were supposed to in order to keep it alive. Nor can you even stow your pet when stealthing anymore. And clicking the come-to-me command doesn't even function the same, the pet won't stay by your side, and instead re-engages in the fight after only a couple of seconds.

 

Please at least give back all of the old pet controls as other optional keybinds in the settings menu. The dev team at anet may not play at a high enough level to have ever considered using these in the middle of a fight for an advantage, but they're essential tools for rangers to get what little value they can out of their pets.

Edited October 27, 2021 by Nighthawk.2401

[HotDelirium.7984]

Yeah what's the point of the vine ability that holds people in place......for them to still just wreck you in place? lol

[InsaneQR.7412]

7 hours ago, Mell.4873 said:

Honestly I believe the untamed can be amazing if each weapon and each pet family got its own unleashed mode. It could create some crazy niche builds like a poison aoe heal block build.

Or just unleashed depending on archetype would do a lot

[Kaenaydar.5631]

5 hours ago, Nighthawk.2401 said:

 

Yeah, I main immob druid (and occasionally soulbeast), I think the existing builds feel like better squad-CC builds in WvW than this new spec does, which is sad. In small fights you get more mobility and utility with the existing builds than you do with hammer. And in larger fights, where stability is so prevalent, most of Untamed's CC is useless. I feel like Anet missed the mark big time on this. I was oh so hoping to finally get a serious/competitive ranger WvW spec, but instead we got a meme Spec that blows at 1v1s, 5v5s, and 20v20s...

 

...and they screwed over all of the existing pet controls while they were at it. You can't keybind "retreat" and "attack" keys anymore, so no more microing your pet out of damaging AoEs like you were supposed to in order to keep it alive. Nor can you even stow your pet when stealthing anymore. And clicking the come-to-me command doesn't even function the same, the pet won't stay by your side, and instead re-engages in the fight after only a couple of seconds.

 

Please at least give back all of the old pet controls as other optional keybinds in the settings menu. The dev team at anet may not play at a high enough level to have ever considered using these in the middle of a fight for an advantage, but they're essential tools for rangers to get what little value they can out of their pets.

Couldnt agree more im a core ranger main because i have autism and its just a easier class to take to. I want to like untamed however i feel like i have more control of my pet in core ranger then i do untamed. When they announced this class i had hoped this class was made for us core rangers that didnt leave for Soul Beast or Druid. This class has potential so much so i made a ascended svaard hammer in my bank for when class comes out given my gear is svaard on my main ranger. Ask me they just need to up damage a bit and put pets back to where they were and class will be nice. As for pets untamed skills just let the pet decide when to use those when they are untamed. Being untamed means a pet should seem more wild anyway.

Edited October 27, 2021 by Kaenaydar.5631

[Ehecatl.9172]

15 hours ago, mistsim.2748 said:

 

All this being said, Untamed actually blows as a CC spec. You have one daze, one hugely telegraphed aoe stun, and a bad immob. Immob Druid with MM does way more CC, while also bringing lots of cleansing to the table.

 

Untamed even goes so far as to make it harder to chain control effects together with your pet since if your pet is Unleashed it loses its control effects and if the ranger is Unleashed hammer loses its control effects.

 

Then the pet also loses its hard hitting moves when it has the Unleashed damage boost and none of its control skills count for the various Untamed traits.

[Raven.8156]

After getting stuck with the soulbeast green swirl animation, anet doubles down and gave us another, more awful looking one. They need to get rid of it. 

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

you can have our mech if u want

[anduriell.6280]

1 hour ago, Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:

you can have our mech if u want

I am pretty confident most of pvp / wvw don't really want the mech or the untamed. 

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

1 minute ago, anduriell.6280 said:

I am pretty confident most of pvp / wvw don't really want the mech or the untamed. 

this expac is for all the brain deaad pvers i guess

[Dadnir.5038]

50 minutes ago, Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:

this expac is for all the brain deaad pvers i guess

The specs are mostly developped with small scale PvP in mind. The issue is more that players don't have the same priorities than the devs for this gamemode. A pet spec can perform pretty well in small scale PvP and, well, mechanist does perform well. A CC spec is exclusively useful in competitive modes even if Untamed don't really perform well there.

For me Bladesworn is designed for role players, they are a minority but well... whatever. Virtuoso try to address some issues of the mesmer in both PvE and WvW large scale fight which is a good thing. Willbender is an openworld spec as it is even if it aim to be a selfish teamfighter (does it even make sense?) all it does in the end is being good at moving quickly between PvE packs of mobs where it can enjoy multihits from it's skills in order to proc it's virtues. Harbinger, vindicator, catalyst, Untamed, specter and mechanist are all sPvP specs (whether they reach the mark or miss it, they are designed with this gamemode in mind).

[anduriell.6280]

4 minutes ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

harbinger, vindicator, catalyst, Untamed, specter and mechanist are all sPvP specs (whether they reach the mark or miss it, they are designed with this gamemode in mind).

That is the preception you have, as i pointed out multiple times in the stream untamed was reffered as "wvw frontiner" multiple times . 

In any case ranger does not need neither is wanted another small scale pvp elite, we already have 3 of those . 

[Levetty.1279]

2 hours ago, Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:

this expac is for all the brain deaad pvers i guess

Yeah they should have made the expac for the people who spend all day on the forums crying everything is OP instead of playing the game.

[Aleksander Suburb.4287]

3 hours ago, Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:

you can have our mech if u want

If you want, that mech will get nerfed in no time 🙂

[Arheundel.6451]

2 hours ago, Levetty.1279 said:

Yeah they should have made the expac for the people who spend all day on the forums crying everything is OP instead of playing the game.

I can now see PvErs under a positive light, if there is one things all MMO players can agree on is...how the official forum is generally used by players to cry for nerfs after being defeated, that's like common across all MMOs

[Xenash.1245]

I'm still of the opinion that the elite spec can be quite good, but yeah there's a lot of tuning that needs to take place along with some quality of life improvements with controlling the pet in general. Personally it just feels a bit off that the best way to do damage with your pet is to teleport it in with it's unleashed state, and then to immediately drop that and let it use it's normal skills.

I'm also just flat out confused as to what they want the hammer to do, since it doesn't appear to be really good at anything currently.

Hopefully we'll see some good changes and fine tuning for the beta with all the specs, as I'm sure it'll be far easier to test everything that in comparison to now.

 

[Xanadrine.4352]

In game last night all people could say was how awful untamed is, the hammer the whole swap mechanic not making the elite skills just for hammer. The awful color, then people said hammer is the worst and both spec that got hammer ,catalyst and untamed, are both terrible. When someone brought up that ranger should have gotten rifle and most everyone agreed I thought yeah I did think ranger should have been given rifle or pistol even. Cata maybe shortbow, because both hammer professions are so bad. 

Make it so ranger can use his other weapons , and take unleashed off the hammer make it a cooldown button that effects the ranger and the pet at the same time no matter what weapon the ranger has on. The unleashed mechanic should follow as part of the spec, not the hammer.

[chemiclord.3978]

On 10/27/2021 at 5:37 AM, Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582 said:

Here's the thing, if Bunny Thumper was used for actual design of Untamed, it would be TOTALLY different. They are not even similar apart from the fact that there is a Ranger, a Hammer and a Pet.

That's kinda what it boils down to.

Untamed feels like ArenaNet saying, "Here's the meme build you liked in GW1!  Hopefully you'll be so excited to see it that you won't notice we STILL don't have ANY idea how to make ranger pets viable after 16 years!"

Edited October 29, 2021 by chemiclord.3978

[Kaenaydar.5631]

19 hours ago, Ehecatl.9172 said:

 

Untamed even goes so far as to make it harder to chain control effects together with your pet since if your pet is Unleashed it loses its control effects and if the ranger is Unleashed hammer loses its control effects.

 

Then the pet also loses its hard hitting moves when it has the Unleashed damage boost and none of its control skills count for the various Untamed traits.

That too i found my pet couldnt hold agro in a fight. I tend to let my smokescale fight for me while i dps. My pet lineup until i find something better is smokescale and for a ranged option bristleback. Untamed on pets should just buff up their attacks and maybe add the new animations. I might change Bristleback one day but i love my smokescale who is named Smokescreen lol.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Kaenaydar.5631

[chemiclord.3978]

20 hours ago, Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:

this expac is for all the brain deaad pvers i guess

It's actually a pretty garbage spec for PvE at that.  Hammer damage is pathetic as a general rule, and Untamed doesn't change that.  And anything Untamed gives damage wise outside of hammer is pretty significantly overshadowed by the already existing Soulbeast spec.

Edited October 29, 2021 by chemiclord.3978

[Kaenaydar.5631]

12 hours ago, chemiclord.3978 said:

It's actually a pretty garbage spec for PvE at that.  Hammer damage is pathetic as a general rule, and Untamed doesn't change that.  And anything Untamed gives damage wise outside of hammer is pretty significantly overshadowed by the already existing Soulbeast spec.

Truth be told atm core ranger can outshine this untamed spec. I run core ranger with a marauder build. I feel my current build is more adaptive lol. My build is Marksman, Wilderness Survival and Beastmastery. When i tried Untamed removed Wilderness survival. Simply because i like marksman piercing arrows with longbow and i use duel axes as a second weapon.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Kaenaydar.5631

[Leonidrex.5649]

On 10/27/2021 at 9:48 AM, Arheundel.6451 said:

The ranger community was crying for Bunny Thumper despite being warned against the idea, this bunny thumper has been cried about for years since soulbeast launch.......this happens because a developer studio seriously makes use of forum banter to design a prodcut..rather than use common sense and trusted methods like any other studio does

untamed can be fixed and made both fun and strong, its held back by
1 pet being broken
2 hammer being useless piece of kitten ( cmc I hold you responsible for this kitten man )
3 it cant survive.
Its not about mechanic much, as with simple touchups it can be fine.
They tried to make a bruiser with no mobility, sustain or damage, but a bruiser focuses on those 3 things so no kittening kitten its going to be bad

[Leonidrex.5649]

On 10/28/2021 at 2:37 PM, Arheundel.6451 said:

I can now see PvErs under a positive light, if there is one things all MMO players can agree on is...how the official forum is generally used by players to cry for nerfs after being defeated, that's like common across all MMOs

then there is you, complaining about people that want to make their hobby better