Naru just got rank 1 on NA ladder playing exclusively Willbender

[Arklite.4013]

I doubt there are still people who believe Willbender's current state is bad in sPvP, but just in case.

 

Copebending cured

Edited April 18, 2022 by Arklite.4013

[Stand The Wall.6987]

maybe the sheeple will change their minds now.

[Pleurodesed.7625]

I tried his build roaming in WvW. I pretty much just struggle against condis while not dealing enough damage.

 

[quaniesan.8497]

Even a blunt weapon can be deadly weapon in the hand of very skilled fighter.   Any class/specialization can be top in ladder if the person choose to use it if he has the skill for it and bothers to do so. One single anecdotal piece of data does not prove anything.  Maybe it is right that Willbender is that good like you said it, but this is not the sufficient evidence for it.   I would like to see Willbender statistical data in terms of ranking over the entire base players to make an evaluation.   meanswhile I can name a list of things that Willbender are not so good at, and a list of classes that can dish out damage for much less effort put out in comparison to the Willbender specialization.  While some recent changes improved the gameplay abit,  but this specialization still has much room to improve upon. 

Edited April 18, 2022 by quaniesan.8497

[Arklite.4013]

30 minutes ago, quaniesan.8497 said:

Even a blunt weapon can be deadly weapon in the hand of very skilled fighter.   Any class/specialization can be top in ladder if the person choose to use it if he has the skill for it and bothers to do so. One single anecdotal piece of data does not prove anything.  Maybe it is right that Willbender is that good like you said it, but this is not the sufficient evidence for it.   I would like to see Willbender statistical data in terms of ranking over the entire base players to make an evaluation.   meanswhile I can name a list of things that Willbender are not so good at, and a list of classes that can dish out damage for much less effort put out in comparison to the Willbender specialization.  While some recent changes improved the gameplay abit,  but this specialization still has much room to improve upon. 

Unfortunately, GW2's PvP population is not large enough for large-scale statistical analysis to be a valid way to evaluate spec performance so we are forced to actually analyze and evaluate classes for ourselves. Willbender is basically a better version of power herald.

Willbender provides:

- High damage

- Great offensive and decent defensive mobility

- Group condi cleanse and stability (as well as great personal condi cleanse - you farm Harbingers because if they ever throw 10 condis at you at a time, CoP turns you into a monster)

 

The only areas you're really lacking are sustain, CC, and group utility. WB is a ridiculously strong +1, good in teamfights, and can take a good number of 1v1s. You struggle vs tanky specs with damage that's difficult to dodge as your sustain isn't that high in prolonged fights, but you have the tools to disengage quite easily. It is notably more difficult than core or DH and the skill ceiling is much higher.

[JunkJunk.8971]

What is cop?.  Mentioned above.      

[Buran.3796]

2 hours ago, Arklite.4013 said:

 Willbender is basically a better version of power herald.

Willbender provides:

- High damage

- Great offensive and decent defensive mobility

- Group condi cleanse and stability (as well as great personal condi cleanse - you farm Harbingers because if they ever throw 10 condis at you at a time, CoP turns you into a monster)

   While WB is now after the buffs a worthy spec to be played in PvP I'll believe that is better than power Herald at that task IF replaces Herald at MATs. Meanwhile is a yolo build that in the hands of one of the best players in the world can reach the top in a game mode withut conformed teams.

[Arklite.4013]

1 hour ago, JunkJunk.8971 said:

What is cop?.  Mentioned above.      

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Contemplation_of_Purity

[JunkJunk.8971]

Ahh thank you 

[Puck.3697]

While i agree. Willbender has Defintly become Quite the force with the last round of updates, it works extremely well now.

I wouldnt base how valid a build is on someone like Naru. the Difference in skill between a MAT Winner and even the top 10% of ranked Queue is Drastically Unlevel. Naru is effectively better in general then the vast Majority who play this game. He very much likely could carry ALOT of builds to rank 1 that in others hands would Simply feed repeatively.

Due to the low population, you have Players alike naru Going against Silver/Gold Players, realistically any build will look like a absolute god if ur going to throw a MAT player at a bunch of Silvers realistically. people tend to just put too much weight on builds continously and ignore this Initial problem which drives everything.

 

[otto.5684]

16 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

   While WB is now after the buffs a worthy spec to be played in PvP I'll believe that is better than power Herald at that task IF replaces Herald at MATs. Meanwhile is a yolo build that in the hands of one of the best players in the world can reach the top in a game mode withut conformed teams.

I agree. It happened more than once that someone took the troll DH trapper rune build to #1. It does not mean the build is good. Will see how it performs on high level against equally skilled opponents.

[Asur.9178]

People still talking about rank/rating as if it's actually that relevant in 2022.

Remove duo-queue, fix the atrocious matchmaking, and then perhaps we can start having an actual conversation about rank and rating past gold 3/plat 1...until then, it's just huff puff, duo-queue during offhours/pay off people to dc games to climb rank/rating and pretend like it means something - as it's been for years.

Having said that, willbender (among a couple of others) was literally overbuffed (purposely by the balance team) in  the recent balance patches, which has left it to become extremely overpowered since then. Anyone that's not actually blind can see it clearly.

[Aeolus.3615]

On 4/18/2022 at 3:31 PM, Stand The Wall.6987 said:

maybe the sheeple will change their minds now.

Its still a meme in WvW, and did its adversaries know really how to counter skills?

Edited April 19, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Saiyan.1704]

17 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

I wouldnt base how valid a build is on someone like Naru. the Difference in skill between a MAT Winner and even the top 10% of ranked Queue is Drastically Unlevel. Naru is effectively better in general then the vast Majority who play this game. He very much likely could carry ALOT of builds to rank 1 that in others hands would Simply feed repeatively.

Due to the low population, you have Players alike naru Going against Silver/Gold Players, realistically any build will look like a absolute god if ur going to throw a MAT player at a bunch of Silvers realistically. people tend to just put too much weight on builds continously and ignore this Initial problem which drives everything.

I'd like to add that Naru is known to de-rank on stream (not purposely) and climb off stream with his Duo... considering he climbs from bottom top25 to top5 really just speaks for itself in terms of how a player can be good AND play the system well. This isn't to belittle Naru, he is one of the most mechanical multiclass players in the game. In terms of advocating newbies to the game on proficiency, he has grown as a person on Twitch GW2; he's not the ever-so egotistical Tournament player I saw 4 years ago. I would recommend anyone new to sPvP to watch his stream even if they don't play Guard. The matchmaking system however, is still grossly susceptible to manipulation that I just wont get into here.

And no, Top 10% of players "can't just carry any build" to top 25... 99% of the time it's from a meta build that even a strong AT team would consider choosing as a 5th for a role.

Edited April 20, 2022 by Saiyan.1704

[Puck.3697]

9 hours ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

I'd like to add that Naru is known to de-rank on stream (not purposely) and climb off stream with his Duo... considering he climbs from bottom top25 to top5 really just speaks for itself in terms of how a player can be good AND play the system well. This isn't to belittle Naru, he is one of the most mechanical multiclass players in the game. In terms of advocating newbies to the game on proficiency, he has grown as a person on Twitch GW2; he's not the ever-so egotistical Tournament player I saw 4 years ago. I would recommend anyone new to sPvP to watch his stream even if they don't play Guard. The matchmaking system however, is still grossly susceptible to manipulation that I just wont get into here.

And no, Top 10% of players "can't just carry any build" to top 25... 99% of the time it's from a meta build that even a strong AT team would consider choosing as a 5th for a role.

I said alot of builds not any 

Obviously he couldn't rank 1 with carrion longbow ranger, the build has to make sense of course. 

I said ant build could look like a god if wielded by a MAT player v silver and gold players, which is likely a exaggeration. The build of course would have to make sense. 

[Buran.3796]

On 4/18/2022 at 11:20 PM, Arklite.4013 said:

 Willbender is basically a better version of power herald.

   Apologies by my lack of faith; you were rigth, I was wrong.

   WB is currently top tier choice for conformed teams in PvP due the blend of high dps (both single target and AoE), good sustain, mobility and versatility of choices in terms of skills. Utterly outclased performance of Revs at this night MAT.

[Nezekan.2671]

On 4/19/2022 at 1:11 AM, quaniesan.8497 said:

Even a blunt weapon can be deadly weapon in the hand of very skilled fighter.   Any class/specialization can be top in ladder if the person choose to use it if he has the skill for it and bothers to do so. One single anecdotal piece of data does not prove anything.  Maybe it is right that Willbender is that good like you said it, but this is not the sufficient evidence for it.   I would like to see Willbender statistical data in terms of ranking over the entire base players to make an evaluation.   meanswhile I can name a list of things that Willbender are not so good at, and a list of classes that can dish out damage for much less effort put out in comparison to the Willbender specialization.  While some recent changes improved the gameplay abit,  but this specialization still has much room to improve upon. 

Not all blunt weapons are created equal. It's been YEARS since any Mesmer player has reached top 3, least of all top 1. So this "blunt weapon" has the skill ceiling to reach the top. If you watch his stream, he sometimes changes his build depending on who he is facing. Willbender/Guardian is a very versatile combination, allowing you to modify how much of Damage/mobility/cleanse/defense you want to have. It is in fact a better Herald, who used to be exactly this, but weaker.

I wonder which spec people think is performing better than Willbender right now in it's role. Especially in ranked (so discounting AT).

Edited April 24, 2022 by Nezekan.2671

[Math.5123]

23 hours ago, Nezekan.2671 said:

Not all blunt weapons are created equal. It's been YEARS since any Mesmer player has reached top 3, least of all top 1. So this "blunt weapon" has the skill ceiling to reach the top. If you watch his stream, he sometimes changes his build depending on who he is facing. Willbender/Guardian is a very versatile combination, allowing you to modify how much of Damage/mobility/cleanse/defense you want to have. It is in fact a better Herald, who used to be exactly this, but weaker.

I wonder which spec people think is performing better than Willbender right now in it's role. Especially in ranked (so discounting AT).

If by years, you mean months. RIP had one 6 accounts in top 10. 2 of them in top 3. This was like last fall or so. 

[myun.6395]

On 4/19/2022 at 6:41 PM, Asur.9178 said:

People still talking about rank/rating as if it's actually that relevant in 2022.

Remove duo-queue, fix the atrocious matchmaking, and then perhaps we can start having an actual conversation about rank and rating past gold 3/plat 1...until then, it's just huff puff, duo-queue during offhours/pay off people to dc games to climb rank/rating and pretend like it means something - as it's been for years.

Having said that, willbender (among a couple of others) was literally overbuffed (purposely by the balance team) in  the recent balance patches, which has left it to become extremely overpowered since then. Anyone that's not actually blind can see it clearly.

They basically made a powercreep of shiro herald prenerfs. And shiro herald was considered too oppressive, that's why his heal was nerfed, teleport was nerfed, sword4 and 5 nerfed.

 

At least herald is and was weak to condis and cc, willbender is not, and if your team doesn't have one, it will be a killing machine who can even run away from 3 people, which sometimes even a thief is struggling to.

 

I said this during the first beta test: "don't worry necros and guardians mains, they will find a way to make their special baby classes op and meta, it's guard and necro we are talking about".

I got insulted how they are trash, necro without shroud hp will never be played in serious play. Look now xD one of the top specs for ranked solo or duo and even meta in the last monthly at.

Lots of bias delusional players in this game.

 

[Hotride.2187]

11 hours ago, myun.6395 said:

I said this during the first beta test: "don't worry necros and guardians mains, they will find a way to make their special baby classes op and meta, it's guard and necro we are talking about".

One could hope but... yeah. Hope or no hope it was expected.

Especially giving guard another top tier build is pure bias. Though maybe they consider this overbuffing and will nerf it.

Edited April 28, 2022 by Hotride.2187

[Ragnar.4257]

On 4/28/2022 at 9:11 AM, Hotride.2187 said:

One could hope but... yeah. Hope or no hope it was expected.

Especially giving guard another top tier build is pure bias. Though maybe they consider this overbuffing and will nerf it.

It would be better to keep willbender and remove core-support if you only want 1 meta guard build. What is better for the game-mode, supports slowing everything down, or DPS punching through bunkers?

[Kuya.6495]

On 4/27/2022 at 4:30 PM, myun.6395 said:

They basically made a powercreep of shiro herald prenerfs. And shiro herald was considered too oppressive, that's why his heal was nerfed, teleport was nerfed, sword4 and 5 nerfed.

 

At least herald is and was weak to condis and cc, willbender is not, and if your team doesn't have one, it will be a killing machine who can even run away from 3 people, which sometimes even a thief is struggling to.

 

I said this during the first beta test: "don't worry necros and guardians mains, they will find a way to make their special baby classes op and meta, it's guard and necro we are talking about".

I got insulted how they are trash, necro without shroud hp will never be played in serious play. Look now xD one of the top specs for ranked solo or duo and even meta in the last monthly at.

Lots of bias delusional players in this game.

 

Weren't satisfied making a thread in the spvp forum complaining about willbender that you decided to go to the guard sub forums now?

[Hotride.2187]

6 hours ago, Ragnar.4257 said:

It would be better to keep willbender and remove core-support if you only want 1 meta guard build. What is better for the game-mode, supports slowing everything down, or DPS punching through bunkers?

So they added willbender to later on nerf core support (when/official statement)? Or willbender pushes out core support by being that OP? I dont understand this line of thinking, as long as core support is meta.

Also I doubt they have plans to remove core guard support if they want to get war shout support to be viable?

And if they wanted anti bunker builds, I'm sure they couldve given such to another profession / to all professions.

But honestly what do I care, maybe willbender is at least not boring to play unlike the rest of guard.

Edited April 29, 2022 by Hotride.2187

[Kuya.6495]

Yea they have no plans to nerf core support guard. They have said on record they like where core support guardian is and they want to bring other supports to that level. 

[Ragnar.4257]

52 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

So they added willbender to later on nerf core support (when/official statement)?

I never said I knew that was their plan, I just said that is the direction they SHOULD go in.

52 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Or willbender pushes out core support by being that OP? I dont understand this line of thinking, as long as core support is meta.

Again, I didn't say this is what HAS happened, I said this is what SHOULD be done.

52 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Also I doubt they have plans to remove core guard support if they want to get war shout support to be viable?

Again, I didn't say this is what they ARE planning, I said this is what they SHOULD do, in my opinion.

52 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

And if they wanted anti bunker builds, I'm sure they couldve given such to another profession / to all professions.

Do I have to say it again?