Treated like a free to play player with both expansions

[divineDerivative.5194]

8 hours ago, Naxos.2503 said:

I'll equally draw attention to the fact that for literal years, they have been re-releasing living world seasons for free, periodically, to the point anyone investigating the game just a little bit can know that content will be made available to them down the line.

This is incorrect. Each episode was free when it first released, and free a second time during the Return To event. That's it, and it's highly unlikely they'll do such an event again.

[Obtena.7952]

18 hours ago, Hartassen.9632 said:

I was never under any false illusions about what buying the expansions gave me. I recently started playing again a few days ago after leaving the game earlier. I just think it's sad to treat customers this way, there's more than enough monetization options in this game.
 

It's sad to treat customers like WHAT way? The way that EVERY other business treats customers? Shouldn't that be EXACTLY how we would expect to be treated as customers? I think it is. 

I don't get your argument. Like, somehow, specific items shouldn't be things Anet sells to you and others are OK to be sold? Just because in your opinion, there are already enough things on the shelf we can buy in the game? What is the criteria you are using to differentiate the OK things from the not OK things here? How do you know there is 'enough' things monetized in the game?

Edited April 28, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Cuks.8241]

@Hartassen.9632 since everyone is shooting you down. There's one feature though for which the majority seems to agree that it's a rip off - build templates. Probably the darkest dirty spot on Anet's overall fair business model. They even took down a free mod, that was way better than their version, to sell this half feature.

[Ledi.9742]

i am a bit confused, because nothing in the game implies that you are getting free bank tabs or template slots for buying expansions. the game itself and purchase page is very clear about what you are getting, and there even is clear charts that tell what perks premium accounts have compared to free accounts.

its a bit unfair to blame anet when you assumed something you had really no reason to assume.

[Tukaram.8256]

21 hours ago, Hartassen.9632 said:

I bought path of fire and heart of thorns but I still only have 1 bank tab, 2 equipment templates and 3 build templates.

I have been playing since launch. I paid for the core game, and pre-ordered all 3 expansions, in whatever the most expensive deluxe pack they had. I bought my own bank tabs, and still have whatever amount of equipment and build templates they gave me (I never use them so do not buy them). 

The core game is now free - I happily paid $60-$70 for it. Two of the expansions are bundled at a discount price - I happily pre-ordered each for about $70. I also pre-ordered EoD for $70.  The game has no subscription fee.  So even with the close to $300 I paid in almost 10 years... it is a bargain.  What you paid was insanely cheap... but not good enough?

Why would you expect all the quality of life upgrades for free?  Should all the gem store items be free as well? 😎

[Iron Monkey.8953]

People that have been playing for years did not have built templates. We survived without it and moved on. Nit being tied to a subscription it what makes GW unique, you can pick and choose what you want to spend money on. If you don't then it does not stop you from playing. Do fractals it's the biggest profit making mode in the game it free and you can use that gold to unlock the seasons that you want. 

 

It's simple and cheap and fun. If you want a subscription you can make your own by buying 20 worth of gems every month to open and buy all the stuff you want 

[kharmin.7683]

1 hour ago, Iron Monkey.8953 said:

People that have been playing for years did not have built templates. We survived without it and moved on.

To be fair, there had been a template system that was a third-party add-on that many used. 

[Naxos.2503]

2 hours ago, divineDerivative.5194 said:

This is incorrect. Each episode was free when it first released, and free a second time during the Return To event. That's it, and it's highly unlikely they'll do such an event again.

I'll return that "incorrect" remark, with my own. They had made it available for free before that Return event. Digging up far enough you'll find references to that.

[Ashen.2907]

3 hours ago, Zeph.5927 said:

It is pretty bad when a Buy to Play game doesn’t give you a reasonable amount of storage or bag slots, that’s for sure. Anet has a bad habit of monetizing the game in ways that are generally reserved for the likes of F2P games. It’s something that’s always irritated me, especially when I go to make a new character and have almost no bag slots available on that character that I then have to waste a ton of gold on or spend real world money on.

Don’t get me wrong, I love playing the game, but some of Anet’s monetization decisions are pretty bad from a consumer perspective.

Define, "reasonable amount of storage or bag slots."

The game's monetization approach means that everyone can play the game for free without there being pay to win features. Those paid cosmetic or QoL features that do exist can be earned in game. It is the most consumer friendly business model Ive encountered.

[SnackParty.3178]

20 hours ago, Stx.4857 said:

Overall, I would recommend just spending some money every month on gems and pretend it's a sub fee.  Pay for the expansions plus a monthly sub, that's standard for any MMO.  Over time you can buy what you want from the shop, and even though it's not fun, remember you can always farm gold to buy gems.  

That's what I do, spend a little money but it goes towards skins, toys and minis.

Stuff like bank slots, tools, builds, that gets treated like a form of account progression (minus cheating once when pre buying. EOD on it's highest tier.)

Gold farming isn't too bad if you're not overly thinking about it. Almost everything level 80 earns $ just by playing the game. 

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

9 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I'm not under any misconception. As I said, it made more sense when it was B2P and didn't have expansions and stacking LW costs, that QOL stuff was locked behind gem purchases.

Bundling expansions is not making stuff "free". That's just a sales tactic to get newer people to buy.

LW has never been "free." It was "free" to people who had bought the game and showed up when it was released. That is not free and I wish people would stop abusing the word free. A more accurate way to put it, would be that for players who had purchased the game and were playing when LW came out, it was not an additional DLC cost. A smart promotion to incentivize them to play the game consistently. Free is overstating it.

GW2 is not the only game to do a system where you can unlock some stuff without paying money by paying in opportunity cost (e.g. playing the game a huge amount and converting in-game coin to store currency). It's nothing novel and it's also not "the opposite of greedy." It's a way of making the model more appealing to people who play a lot, but can't spend much (ex: the unemployed). And in general, since it makes the stuff more in reach, it makes it more likely that people will engage with the store in general and thus more likely to spend if they do come into money, since they are already accustomed to seeking items in the store.

Yes, money has to come in from somewhere. Nowhere did I say they should give everything out without charging money anywhere. The point I made I thought was clear, but apparently not. I don't know how to make it more clear. Companies in this industry have a clear pattern of doing stuff that gives them good PR (looks "nice") but is part of a path that leads to more and more monetization over time. The mount thing you bring up is not a strange anomaly, but an unsurprising evolution of the overall practices. Sometimes these companies go too far too fast and people give a resounding NO and they have to backpeddle a little bit, and then when the controversy dies down, they go back to more and more monetization wherever possible.

And this is not meant to be ragging on GW2, it's the industry as a whole and relates to profit models where profits are expected to always be increasing.

And yet, players can unlock Living World Season Episodes without purchasing the associated expansion at no cost, whatsoever.  And can access said Episodes once the associated expansion becomes free of charge.  True, it takes time, but ArenaNet does enable players to acquire content at no cost, eventually. 

[Fuchslein.8639]

3 hours ago, Naxos.2503 said:

I'll return that "incorrect" remark, with my own. They had made it available for free before that Return event. Digging up far enough you'll find references to that.

Can you clraify this? I google and found only the last year, where anet gave all lw parts for free.
When i remember correctly, in the forum here, someone said there was another time. But expect for these 2 occasions the LW was never given free(expect for the login when it comes out). There are a few times, they got a discount, thats it.

So, can you please show the source of your information?

[Naxos.2503]

19 minutes ago, Fuchslein.8639 said:

Can you clraify this? I google and found only the last year, where anet gave all lw parts for free.
When i remember correctly, in the forum here, someone said there was another time. But expect for these 2 occasions the LW was never given free(expect for the login when it comes out). There are a few times, they got a discount, thats it.

So, can you please show the source of your information?

The most direct source would be to say that I myself benefitted from that second release, as I joined in near the end of Living World season 2, and thus missed the first two episodes of it. I got them for free when they re released them, if my memory serve it was before Path of Fire was released, but due to how mediatized the Return Event of last year, it has become increasingly difficult to find older posts mentionning it, here, on reddit and anywhere else. I remarked on that fact when I read the responses in that thread.. It's likely one could find references of it on the Old forums, provided one is masochistic enough to try and naviguate it 😄

Edit : For your perusal, I found a page linking to one such Occasion regarding living world season 4, where you can see 3 release dates on the wiki : 1 the original release, the second release, and the Return events : Living World Season 4 - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Edited April 28, 2022 by Naxos.2503
Source

[Fuchslein.8639]

1 hour ago, Naxos.2503 said:

The most direct source would be to say that I myself benefitted from that second release, as I joined in near the end of Living World season 2, and thus missed the first two episodes of it. I got them for free when they re released them, if my memory serve it was before Path of Fire was released, but due to how mediatized the Return Event of last year, it has become increasingly difficult to find older posts mentionning it, here, on reddit and anywhere else. I remarked on that fact when I read the responses in that thread.. It's likely one could find references of it on the Old forums, provided one is masochistic enough to try and naviguate it 😄

Edit : For your perusal, I found a page linking to one such Occasion regarding living world season 4, where you can see 3 release dates on the wiki : 1 the original release, the second release, and the Return events : Living World Season 4 - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

K, so the same as i said.

But i would not call this as A-net re-releasing the Lw-stories periodically. although, i'm not mad about it. Just wouldn't recommand new players to wait for a free release.

[Sobx.1758]

11 hours ago, Zeph.5927 said:

You’re using a game that is literally pay to win as an example…

You seem to have completely missed the point. He's not using it as an example, read what he quoted. It was OP that tried making this comparison by asking "am I playing lost ark or something?". And I guess the answer is: not even close.

On 4/28/2022 at 12:23 AM, Labjax.2465 said:

Games have gotten endlessly more greedy over the years and this is just one example. GW2 gating QOL features behind store purchases made somewhat more sense when they were purely B2P: you purchase once and you own the game forever, no subscription fees. Now that there are expansion costs and living world costs, and it's technically "free to play," but also B2P, but not really?

It's this thing now where games "double dip" in whatever way they can. They hybridize models, so they can get the good PR of one model and the money of another.

The only way I tolerate it now is going in knowing full well what I'm dealing with, but even then, games still surprise me sometimes. Like this game and it's character bound equipment templates and bag slots, which is just nickel and diming. It could still be profitable with those slots being an account unlock, but that's not how the interests running this industry and others relating to things I can't talk about here works.

It appears someone just discovered non sub-based mmorpgs.

14 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

How is it free? You still have to pay for an expansion somewhere in there. It's like "buy one, get one free" deals.

You've responded your own question in the same post.

Edited April 28, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Zeph.5927]

10 hours ago, Ashen.2907 said:

Define, "reasonable amount of storage or bag slots."

The game's monetization approach means that everyone can play the game for free without there being pay to win features. Those paid cosmetic or QoL features that do exist can be earned in game. It is the most consumer friendly business model Ive encountered.

Anyone with half a brain can see that the amount of bag space you get on a new character is abysmally pathetic. And the only way to get more? Grind and grind and grind for gold or pony up real world money. It’s an artificial pain point that Anet purposely puts in place to try and get people to spend money.

Cosmetics are one thing. Something that most sensible people see as more of a necessity in an MMO like inventory space? Come on man. Get real.

Edited April 29, 2022 by Zeph.5927

[zackvalentinerose.8652]

GW2 is comparably better because of it's lack of subscription structure.

The content they put out is top tier bang for your buck. I literally bought this game nearly a decade ago and have played on and off over those years.

 

If I want to drop $25 on a gem card and buy a few things doesn't worry me. Even in 5 years if I don't play for a couple of years as long as the servers are still around I know I can just jump back on and not have to pay for a month at a time.

[Voltekka.2375]

THIS GAME IS P2W! AND YOU CANNOT CONVINCE ME IT ISN'T! *SHAKES FIST ANGRILY*

[DarkerCrimson.8574]

On 4/27/2022 at 11:09 AM, Hartassen.9632 said:

I bought path of fire and heart of thorns but I still only have 1 bank tab, 2 equipment templates and 3 build templates. If I want any more I have to buy gems for real life money or grind endlessly in game.

Am I playing lost ark or something? I paid for the game and you're gating me out of quality of life features expecting me to pay even more for them?

If this is the way you treat your customers I'll never buy anything from you again. Because it's bad enough I have to spend all my gold unlocking living seasons that you gave out for free earlier.

 

Just curious, when you go to a fast food place and order a burger, do you complain that the fries and drink cost extra? Buy a house and complain that it doesn't come with furniture?

 

You paid $30 for 2 expansions and no sub fee, which neither said they'd give you bank tabs, and can buy everything in the gem store with in game currency. How many other games let you spend in game gold in their real money store? It's not that long of a grind to make gold unless you are ridiculously casual. And I'm pretty kitten causal.

 

Yes, I will happily defend ArenaNet, cause Guild Wars doesn't force me to pay just to play and gives the option to earn those upgrades. Because their story is unique and delivered to the player better than most other games. But if it's not worth it to you, so be it, have fun on those other mmo's you prefer. 

[Gehenna.3625]

On 4/28/2022 at 11:03 AM, Vayne.8563 said:

As an option for not charging $15 a month, sure. Buy $15 a month worth of gems and get what you want over time. You get a subscription MMO and the rest of us are happy.

I was just gonna answer this and then I saw you already posted it. The OP (and others) don't understand that this game has no sub at all and that they (Anet) still have to make money. 

I've played this game a while now with this approach. I don't mind paying a sub so I do it this way. Other MMOs have subs and a cash shop as well. 

Edited April 29, 2022 by Gehenna.3625

[Silent.6137]

This is what Anet promised: Guild Wars 2 Free Account (Features)

Quote

...you can play the entire core version of the game entirely for free. ...

Nothing else are free and no one should expect them to be otherwise. Is anyone under any illusions that they should get any new releases and expansions for free?

If they made any releases available in-game, then the item is free. If they bundle an item with a purchasable item, then the bundle is free. Saying that it's not free because the expansion is B2P is just word gymnastics.

If any items are in the gem store, then they can be obtained for free. Play the game, earn gold, convert gold to gem and buy the items. This includes all LW episodes, bank tabs, etc., etc., etc. You should not expect anything more than what was advertised.

If you choose to fast-tracked and purchase with real money, it's your choice. Or alternatively, grind for them. If you choose not to spend real money or grind for them, it's also your choice. Then just go without them.

You shouldn't expect to get everything especially when they were not advertised or included in any expansions.

Edited April 29, 2022 by Silent.6137