Rework coming June 28th!

[Vinny.7260]

What do you think is up for changes?

[draxynnic.3719]

We know they're reworking banners and spirits at least.

[Vidit.7108]

I think that there is a difference between which class needs the most work and which class is more likely to have big changes made to it. 

I think ranger and warrior might have the most attention paid to them with the banner/spirits rework but I think mesmer and ele probably have the most issues they need worked out.

Given past history though I'm not confident that the june balance patch will have all that many big changes, they over promise a lot.

[vardeleanu.8972]

hey at least it's not yearly balance patch anymore, right guys
maybe they'll finally get to fixing some skills that have been useless in both pve and pvp since before pof
jk lmao

[Gorem.8104]

Warrior needs an entire redesign essentially, but knowing Anet they'd somehow make warriors worse even after entirely redesigning them. 

[ZDragon.3046]

2 hours ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Warrior needs an entire redesign essentially, but knowing Anet they'd somehow make warriors worse even after entirely redesigning them. 

That just means they dont need a redesign and you are over exaggerating.

Warrior could use some help with certain traitlines and something to make weapons other than axes and maces more attractive but other than that the class is fine. To say it needs an entire redesign is a big stretch from what it really needs. 

[Ryou.2398]

1 hour ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

That just means they dont need a redesign and you are over exaggerating.

Warrior could use some help with certain traitlines and something to make weapons other than axes and maces more attractive but other than that the class is fine. To say it needs an entire redesign is a big stretch from what it really needs. 

I think warrior is just such a popular class and as usual people only care about their own classes instead of balancing everything, if anything rev has been the most neglected in this game and one or two elite specs does not mean the base class is good at all as a whole.

[ZDragon.3046]

7 minutes ago, Ryou.2398 said:

I think warrior is just such a popular class and as usual people only care about their own classes instead of balancing everything, if anything rev has been the most neglected in this game and one or two elite specs does not mean the base class is good at all as a whole.

I dont think rev is neglected but it certainly stands out as it is the only classed with fixed utility based on your legend rev has alot of things about it that none of the other professions have which can be seen as a positive or a negative depending on the person. Heck i would argue that almost all of revs stuff had a good peek at some point. I dont think the june 28th patch is to address a class as a whole based on how much someone thinks its neglected its to bring lesser used tools up to par with meta tools. or at least move them closer. 

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

If you're gonna claim that anet has said something you should prob put a link to that statement in your thread

Edited May 21, 2022 by Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365

[Ryou.2398]

1 hour ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

I dont think rev is neglected but it certainly stands out as it is the only classed with fixed utility based on your legend rev has alot of things about it that none of the other professions have which can be seen as a positive or a negative depending on the person. Heck i would argue that almost all of revs stuff had a good peek at some point. I dont think the june 28th patch is to address a class as a whole based on how much someone thinks its neglected its to bring lesser used tools up to par with meta tools. or at least move them closer. 

What are you talking about? The rev is still unfinished and still has some class bugs, it was majorly neglected im sorry but it seems your going for some type of damage control here.

[Puck.3697]

16 hours ago, Vidit.7108 said:

I think that there is a difference between which class needs the most work and which class is more likely to have big changes made to it. 

I think ranger and warrior might have the most attention paid to them with the banner/spirits rework but I think mesmer and ele probably have the most issues they need worked out.

Given past history though I'm not confident that the june balance patch will have all that many big changes, they over promise a lot.

Tbh. I'd say they all need reworking. Just for different reasons. 

- 3/4s of necromancers specs had to be absolutely obliterated in spvp to stop it's plague, shroud mechanics are still a major hold back in pve for both reaper and core. Quite clearly its design is simply just bad realistically. And they've acknowledged that with scourge snd harbinger. But it's left reaper to literally die. 

Firebrand had to be deleted from spvp due to its toxic design, DH is useless now trapper rune got nerfed and it was leaning on it so heavily, willbenders OP but as soon as its damage Is fixed its gonna drop to bottom of the barrel. 

Mesmers don't have a single specc that's above average in spvp and hasn't done in years realistically. Mirage still works on a mechanic that got noticed to be bad game design. And they've gutted it because of it. Virtuoso just is too 1 dimensional. 

Rangers, Pet AI is outdated 36 of its pets are majorly bugged, untamed is terrible in all pve content and Hammer is terrible in all content. Soulbeast has now fallen behind. Druid got absolutely deleted with the drop to 5 man boons. 

Warrior quite literally needs help In every aspect of the game. 

Elementalist, conjures being terrible has ment it now has no access to the other side of game play outside its weapon. Weaver still doesn't do enough dmg to warrant a spot in Raids and tempest again got deleted in pve content. 

Revenant herald is now even worse, renegade has lost its purpose and just doesn't compete against the new alacrity providers anymore, And still lacks a decent power dps option in pve content. 

Thief has become mundane and boring due to the continous rising of initiative costs and nerfs to the wrong things. Making it a one trick pony and auto attack centric which has severely dulled its playstyle. Its just boring 

Holosmith has fallen behind, scrapper lost its barrier with 0 compensation and now isn't really that great. 

Every proffessions core proffession has been eroded down to barely anything useful and because of this, quite literally every elite falls on its face after time passes. It's mechanic is either so broken they gut it. Or simply something gers nerfed to cater to a new elite and they get nerfed in the process. 

This game need a a redesign to basically every core proffession and a large quantity of core weapons aswell as traits. 

Some elites such as mirage and chronometer need reworking instead of just being absolutely gutted down to pieces due to a broken mechanic that they've had to shut down entirely in game modes. Aswell as several others. 

 

 

 

[ZDragon.3046]

4 hours ago, Ryou.2398 said:

What are you talking about? The rev is still unfinished and still has some class bugs, it was majorly neglected im sorry but it seems your going for some type of damage control here.

Every class has or has had bugs for a significant amount of time thats not really a valid argument here. While sure i would love to see lingering bugs fixed thats not the point of the 28th patch but i wont be upset if they managed to do some bug fixing.

Do not assume what im going for and explain your perspective first.

I dont play enough rev but when i do play it i dont exactly feel like its an unfinished profession. In this case unfinished is a matter of perspective. Ive played rev since HoT beta so ive been around to see how it changed from having really busted mechanics to the simpler ones it has now. 

What would you consider about it unfinished I want to hear you out on this from your perspective. 

[Ryou.2398]

3 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

Tbh. I'd say they all need reworking. Just for different reasons. 

- 3/4s of necromancers specs had to be absolutely obliterated in spvp to stop it's plague, shroud mechanics are still a major hold back in pve for both reaper and core. Quite clearly its design is simply just bad realistically. And they've acknowledged that with scourge snd harbinger. But it's left reaper to literally die. 

Firebrand had to be deleted from spvp due to its toxic design, DH is useless now trapper rune got nerfed and it was leaning on it so heavily, willbenders OP but as soon as its damage Is fixed its gonna drop to bottom of the barrel. 

Mesmers don't have a single specc that's above average in spvp and hasn't done in years realistically. Mirage still works on a mechanic that got noticed to be bad game design. And they've gutted it because of it. Virtuoso just is too 1 dimensional. 

Rangers, Pet AI is outdated 36 of its pets are majorly bugged, untamed is terrible in all pve content and Hammer is terrible in all content. Soulbeast has now fallen behind. Druid got absolutely deleted with the drop to 5 man boons. 

Warrior quite literally needs help In every aspect of the game. 

Elementalist, conjures being terrible has ment it now has no access to the other side of game play outside its weapon. Weaver still doesn't do enough dmg to warrant a spot in Raids and tempest again got deleted in pve content. 

Revenant herald is now even worse, renegade has lost its purpose and just doesn't compete against the new alacrity providers anymore, And still lacks a decent power dps option in pve content. 

Thief has become mundane and boring due to the continous rising of initiative costs and nerfs to the wrong things. Making it a one trick pony and auto attack centric which has severely dulled its playstyle. Its just boring 

Holosmith has fallen behind, scrapper lost its barrier with 0 compensation and now isn't really that great. 

Every proffessions core proffession has been eroded down to barely anything useful and because of this, quite literally every elite falls on its face after time passes. It's mechanic is either so broken they gut it. Or simply something gers nerfed to cater to a new elite and they get nerfed in the process. 

This game need a a redesign to basically every core proffession and a large quantity of core weapons aswell as traits. 

Some elites such as mirage and chronometer need reworking instead of just being absolutely gutted down to pieces due to a broken mechanic that they've had to shut down entirely in game modes. Aswell as several others. 

 

 

 

Sadly we cannot express any criticism here without defensiveness from the team, the damage control is just unreal.

[anbujackson.9564]

5 hours ago, Ryou.2398 said:

What are you talking about? The rev is still unfinished and still has some class bugs, it was majorly neglected im sorry but it seems your going for some type of damage control here.

The only neglected thing is maybe herald (or vindicator dps). What exactly do you want? You got a wide variety of builds and options.

[Puck.3697]

2 hours ago, Ryou.2398 said:

Sadly we cannot express any criticism here without defensiveness from the team, the damage control is just unreal.

In all honesty. I dont think June 28th will fix everything, i'd like to see a Positive directino from it however.

im hoping

Elementalist conjure weapons get some changes done, i think picking these up properly would solve ALOT of issues by itself and would be a high impact change.

Necromancers see some form of rework to its Life force system to modernise core and reaper uptoo scourge and harbingers standard.

Warriors get some Core changes following its Banner buffs, somethings done concerning the fact bladesworns gunblade hits like a wet noodle espically in PvE

Rangers get some really good changes with its Spirits rework, Untameds Hammer gets some reworks, and Druid gets Reworked.

Thief gets Some initiative cost reductions and some other balancing factors to take place.

Engineers Scrapper gets some strong Damage buffs to mitigate the loss of barrier.

Core mesmer gets some buffs, Mirages Dodge gets dealt with properly and its 2nd dodge restored and Chronomancer takes some level of Reworking.

Guardians Willbender gets tuned properly not to put it in the trash, Firebrand takes some level of reworks so it can be properly balanced in game modes.

Revenant, Vindicators Power DPS Gets some positive changes. Herald gets some level of rework as its been made even More irrelevant since the cut in 10 man boons.

now my dissapointment will be like somewhere between 1 and 10 xD so we'll see how it turns out lol.

 

[Dadnir.5038]

We know that both Banners and Spirits will see a "rework" in the summer patch. I believe it's wiser to not expect more rework than that for a patch.

That said:

- Elementalist: I believe the core profession could have an extra that only belong to it. Just like revenant ended up getting an F2 a few years after release. In general, conjured weapons, cantrips and arcanes skills probably deserve to be looked at in order to raise their popularity. (I believe that working on the conjured weapons should alleviate the core weapon issues, which is why I don't point out to the core weapons)

- Engineer: I'd dare say it's mostly fine, but I'd like to see some work put on the tools traitline as I feel the traits aren't worth a "main mechanism" traitline. (that said it might just be me not liking the traitline). As utilities, for me, Gadgets need to be looked at.

- Guardian: No comment.

- Mesmer: Personally I'd like to see work done on mirage's shatters as they are merely core shatters at the moment.

- Necromancer: Minions and associated traits need to be reworked from scrap. (If we can also replace of lich form by a non-transformation skill, it would be nice)

- Ranger: Core pets need work (And it's already a huge amount of work), druid need work as well.

- Revenant: Apart from herald's shield skills I don't see any need for major rework.

- Thief: If something need a rework it's the acrobatics traitline. I'd also like to see the stolen skills being updated as they tend to vary a lot in usefulness and strength.

- Warrior: Like elementalist, warrior need an "extra" to it's core profession. As it stand, being able to spend 3 tiers of adrenaline into their bursts isn't really worth contending with what it's e-specs offer. Defense could afford a being made more attractive by getting rid of the unsightly 300s CD trait that plague the traitline. But, all in all, I believe we will have to see what happen to banners and the consequences of these changes.

[Sigmoid.7082]

14 hours ago, Ryou.2398 said:

Sadly we cannot express any criticism here without defensiveness from the team, the damage control is just unreal.

People express criticism all the time. Some people just get too "passionate" and often express themselves and their opinion very much in opposition of the forums code of conduct. 

 

More often than not it's not what is being said that's the problem, but how.

[Buran.3796]

  Hammer Rev needs more nerfs; some of the skills still do damage and none of them did reach a 2" cast time, so there's still room for "improvements".

[draxynnic.3719]

20 hours ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

Every class has or has had bugs for a significant amount of time thats not really a valid argument here. While sure i would love to see lingering bugs fixed thats not the point of the 28th patch but i wont be upset if they managed to do some bug fixing.

Do not assume what im going for and explain your perspective first.

I dont play enough rev but when i do play it i dont exactly feel like its an unfinished profession. In this case unfinished is a matter of perspective. Ive played rev since HoT beta so ive been around to see how it changed from having really busted mechanics to the simpler ones it has now. 

What would you consider about it unfinished I want to hear you out on this from your perspective. 

Just to start: it's supposed to have viable condition options as core, but mace/axe is the only core weapon set that's oriented towards conditions. That's a big hole that affects every elite spec that doesn't bring a condi weapon.

It happened because rev wasn't originally intended to be a weapon swapping profession, so in the original design one condi set was enough. Like spear was eventually supplemented with trident, however, for rev to really feel complete it needs something to swap to that offers a bit more condition damage than 'it has some chill so it will proc Abyssal Chill'. Every other profession with a weaponswap has at least to sets in core that are suitable for dishing out conditions (in guardian's case this is through Justice procs, but that's how guardian is designed). That revenant doesn't is a holdover from its original design that was never addressed.

[Lighter.5631]

On 5/20/2022 at 10:32 AM, Ryou.2398 said:

I think warrior is just such a popular class and as usual people only care about their own classes instead of balancing everything, if anything rev has been the most neglected in this game and one or two elite specs does not mean the base class is good at all as a whole.

statistically warrior is the least played class in the recent times, pay attention and go see how many warrior you see

[Telgum.6071]

The Revenant subforum at its finest.

[ZDragon.3046]

3 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Just to start: it's supposed to have viable condition options as core, but mace/axe is the only core weapon set that's oriented towards conditions. That's a big hole that affects every elite spec that doesn't bring a condi weapon.

It happened because rev wasn't originally intended to be a weapon swapping profession, so in the original design one condi set was enough. Like spear was eventually supplemented with trident, however, for rev to really feel complete it needs something to swap to that offers a bit more condition damage than 'it has some chill so it will proc Abyssal Chill'. Every other profession with a weaponswap has at least to sets in core that are suitable for dishing out conditions (in guardian's case this is through Justice procs, but that's how guardian is designed). That revenant doesn't is a holdover from its original design that was never addressed.

I mean a few of other classes dont have 2 true core sets of condi weapons so im not sure what you are on about with that one. 

Sure some of them have traits that make certain weapons condi viable but many of them really dont have 2 sets. As for the idea that rev changed from what it was originally suppose to be does not mean unfinished. Many of gw2's classes changed from their original concept but that does not mean they are unfinished. If not having another core condi weapon and more condi options at core means the whole class is unfnished from your perspective  nothing they can do to it will make it ever feel finished to you because you are dead set on looking at its initial concept which we know likely wont ever be revisited

I cant think of any way to like realistically make that finished from your point of view with any kind of fix that wont ruin  it in some way for people who like how it currently is aside from adding an elite spec to offer you more options.... and they already did this....

 

Like I get where you are coming from but im not sure i call wanting more option =  being unfinished.

I would like a weapon that lets me block with core necro so i can make legit tanking builds in raids but im not going to say that the class is unfinished because of that for example.

[anbujackson.9564]

- Elementalist: Catalyst could use some additional love to its energy mechanic. Its not great as heal. On core conjures are kind of outdated. At least catalyst gave new utilities, so only FGS is kind of mandatory.

- Engineer: Scrapper needs some more damage to compete. Either that or give it more might/fury access. 

- Guardian: The only changes needed would be nerfs, so yeah...

- Mesmer: It pains me to see chrono in its current state. The wells are unbelievable clunky for todays standards. It has no real boon access except quickness/alacrity and a bit of aegis. The lack of additional boons makes chrono less desirable. Also it has the highest effort to keep its boons up, its not that much more but still more than pressing two skill on cooldown.

- Necromancer: It needs a useful heal skill. Besides that I would say that reaper could take a bit more damage after its nerf to shroud.

- Ranger: More damage to untamed. Thats about it. With the fall of druid, soulbeast shot up the ladder significantly (in addition to the change of OWP).

- Revenant: Herald got completely gutted with the 5men stuff. At least give it perma 25 might or something.

- Thief: I dont it play that much, maybe some QoL to deadeye?

- Warrior: Well, defense is kind of a worthless traitline. Tactics is a niche on bladesworns shout abuse. In general traits compete with each other too much, aka its kind of a mess. The ICD of 10 seconds is a sad joke. Berserker is the role model of too many tradeoffs. Spellbreaker? Yes. And bladesworn oh boy. I am kind of wondering here. Since I dont really PvP much at all, I checked the presence of this spec in PvE. Where exactly are all those enjoyers in endgame? If I see a warrior, its only berserker. In fact every person I know who plays just a bit of warrior, has a negative view on bladesworn. Big numbers arent everything. A six digit number wont ever excuse its clunky playstyle. Not even considering that its just another dps spec with no group value in it.

Edited May 21, 2022 by anbujackson.9564

[Jski.6180]

Core classes and please nerf all elite spec power creep? Sadly that not the world anet is running these days.

[Puck.3697]

5 hours ago, Lighter.5631 said:

statistically warrior is the least played class in the recent times, pay attention and go see how many warrior you see

 

Statistics? What statistics are you reading exactly?

Statistically i'd say the game says the opposite.. unless ur talking about their popularity in Raids and high level SPVP which your talking about a TINY minority If u are so.

Warrior Guides are one of the Most viewed proffession guides on the platform. Valluns Bladesworn guide got 30k Views. While no other Proffession guide got above 18k Views.

There are More content creators maining Warrior then there are of SEVERAL proffessions, including Mesmer, Elementalist and Ranger.

you seem to be unfamilar.

95% of this game. Do not know whjat is and isnt meta, they dont even know Warrior is bad, because they never do content which makes it Obvious and they simply dont even know a DPS Addon exists for the game. Its the TINY Quantity of the playerbase that reads forums and Engages in the game Outside of the game itself who are aware Warriors arent in a great position.

However i never Stop running into Warriors in SPVP.. or Open World content realistically.

its defintly not the MOST Played Proffession. This games too Alt friendly to realistically engage with statistics in that sorta way im afraid.

Just because the same 5 Groups who still do fractals spam One Team comp 10000 Times so it Looks like Nothing else is played. Doesnt mean that nothing else is Played. its Simply the fact. the Fraction of players who still do Fractals. Still Raid, Do Strikes and Engage in SPVP is soooo TINY that Simply the Statistics are automatically Skewed and of 0 Representation of what actually is played.

The reason WoW its SOOO obvious what is and Isnt played.

Is because Difficulty settings Exist.

a Tiny minority engage with M+ in WoW past a +10 Key comparitively. but because Everyone eruns +2s and stuff and does LFR effectively we can Gauge popularity as over 90% of the playerbase engage with Some content that is Measurable.

GW2 simply doesnt have this. so theres no Actual Statistics that means a Dime.

Raidlogs, Fractal logs, Top 250 on SPVP leaderboards, ATs and MATS just dont have a Pool wide enoughb to gauge any sorta Popularity realistically.