Why are EoD maps so dead already?

[yoni.7015]

55 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

In EoD however, you either start searching for LFG 45 to 30 mins early, or your chances of doing the meta drop to bottom level.

This is only true for DE meta, I never started searching for the other three meta events this early and I do them regularly. 

[idpersona.3810]

49 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

In HoT, if i get to map 5 minutes before event, it's usually early enough to get enough people to be succesful. Some metas i have started with maybe 15-20 people, with more people joining late, andit was still completely fine. In EoD however, you either start searching for LFG 45 to 30 mins early, or your chances of doing the meta drop to bottom level. And you are not very likely to organize it ad-hoc at the last moment either.

I'd say that this is a massive difference.

 

10 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

From my experience, it's the same for these metas. Pretty sure I didn't look for eod meta groups 30-45 minutes early.

Just speaking from my experience, but HoT maps are fine to show up time of. There's usually one map that's full (which succeeds 100%) and then an overflow map if you don't show up a few minutes early. Overflow map usually succeeds, but can occasionally have issues is people aren't split evenly (thinking AB and TG here). Dragon's Stand succeeds at least several times a day, though not every cycle in my experience.
All of this applies to the first 3 EoD maps too. Dragon's End is 100% the exception. If you don't get into a group early, chances of succeeding plummet. And again, I am only speaking from my personal experience. I've run it several times this last 2 weeks and mostly I had to get into group 45 minutes to an hour early. Squads were full about an hour before and all pre events were done by about 45 minutes before. then it was just killing time until the big fight.
Anytime I looked for a group within a half hour of the fight it just didn't work.  

[Sobx.1758]

51 minutes ago, idpersona.3810 said:

Just speaking from my experience, but HoT maps are fine to show up time of. There's usually one map that's full (which succeeds 100%) and then an overflow map if you don't show up a few minutes early. Overflow map usually succeeds, but can occasionally have issues is people aren't split evenly (thinking AB and TG here). Dragon's Stand succeeds at least several times a day, though not every cycle in my experience.
All of this applies to the first 3 EoD maps too. Dragon's End is 100% the exception. If you don't get into a group early, chances of succeeding plummet. And again, I am only speaking from my personal experience. I've run it several times this last 2 weeks and mostly I had to get into group 45 minutes to an hour early. Squads were full about an hour before and all pre events were done by about 45 minutes before. then it was just killing time until the big fight.
Anytime I looked for a group within a half hour of the fight it just didn't work.  

Ok, although in relation to what I was responding to as well:  "EoD metas/maps" =/= "DE meta/map", so if someone was attempting to apply DE meta ruleset -whatever it subjectively is, whether correct or not- onto EoD maps/metas in general... they're mostly just wrong (from my repeated experience).

DE is indeed "tighter" time-wise to succeed, but to get a full picture: when we're talking about the meta, do we only consider the "slapping soo won" phase or do we also consider the escorts (for me escorts are clearly a direct part of the meta)? Because if someone tries to skip the escorts and just attempt to jump into soo won fight then I'd say they don't try to participate in a full meta. Pretty sure nowadays I'm not joining DE maps 30-45 minutes before the meta starts and if there's an issue with finding more squads near the start of the map, it's probably more about the attitude of the players (who at that point think they need to either ramm into someone else's map or there's no reason to start their own) than the event itself.

 

Edit: currently it's ~3 minutes to DE meta start and there's a meta taxi with 40 people in it on lfg. I won't be checking how it goes since I've already done it today.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Sobx.1758
typo

[PookieDaWombat.6209]

To put it plainly, if you're going onto these maps hoping to find and do meta events "organically" you're going to be disappointed.  Only way you're finding organized groups to do the metas is through LFG or a guild that is setting out to do them.  Sadly, the idea that players will simply be around and will mobilize for these things anymore is a pipe dream.

[idpersona.3810]

43 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Ok, although in relation to what I was responding to as well:  "EoD metas/maps" =/= "DE meta/map", so if someone was attempting to apply DE meta ruleset -whatever it subjectively is, whether correct or not- onto EoD maps/metas in general... they're mostly just wrong (from my repeated experience).

This is mostly the point I was trying to make. DE needs to considered separately from the other EoD maps. I just quoted you since that part applied to my response as well.

Though your experience (with the possibility of getting in 3 minutes before) differs from every time I checked in on DE while I was on vacation. Not disagreeing. Just noting that withing 30 minutes I never managed to find a group that was even remotely promising.

And I do think it's fair to nail down what people mean by the meta. In my mind I start it from the escorts.



 

[Silent.6137]

3 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

In HoT, if i get to map 5 minutes before event, it's usually early enough to get enough people to be succesful. Some metas i have started with maybe 15-20 people, with more people joining late, andit was still completely fine. In EoD however, you either start searching for LFG 45 to 30 mins early, or your chances of doing the meta drop to bottom level. And you are not very likely to organize it ad-hoc at the last moment either.

I'd say that this is a massive difference.

Yes, you can certainly get to HoT meta jusr before or even after they have started and be successful. Although, there are often times when you'll be unable to join meta maps listed on LFG for TD, AB or DS if you try to join late. And without a few tags to anchor, those on the map will usually not join, as they're too busy spamming "join" on LFG.

But as mentioned above, it's only DE maps that requires you to be early. Definitely not the other 3 EoD maps. I've tagged all EoD maps and there are always players who joined at the last minute or even after meta has started in all the latter 3 maps. Especially Gang War meta in Echovald where you'll usually start with 10 or less sometimes and then get a huge influx of players who had just finished NKC meta. And haven't fail any of them even once yet.

We all know DE requires some basic organizations and require players to get at least 5 stacks of DE Contributors before the meta starts. That alone will usually take 20 mins (15 mins + 5 mins pre-meta group-up where there's no events) or 30 mins if squad wants the 5% Enhancement (25 mins +5 mins).  Add in the smaller map cap, 30 to 45 mins before meta starts is not unreasonable. It's not as if doing the pre-events is a waste of time. The drops are very good in comparisons to any maps at all. Far better than most. You would farm events at those maps, so why not at DE?

And yes, that's a big difference. However, considering the loots you get between DE and HoT metas, that is a huge difference as well.

Honestly, I truly don't understand why people would join early, get the 5 stacks and then afk to wait for the meta to start. Whether the LFG squad I'm joining formed 45 mins or 1 hour before meta, I'll always join at least 1 hour before start to farm the map - do at least 10 events for the 20% outgoing damage, visit the mini dungeon which will take less than 5 mins, farm the 60 daily limit of pure jade, do a circuit for the shrine guardian chests and jade tech chests (for the Jade Runestones - usually get about 7 to 10), plus mine the quartz crystals. All those will take about an hour. Time that I can use to farm another map or DE with its better loots.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Silent.6137

[Silent.6137]

30 minutes ago, idpersona.3810 said:

Just noting that withing 30 minutes I never managed to find a group that was even remotely promising.
And I do think it's fair to nail down what people mean by the meta. In my mind I start it from the escorts.

When farming DE map, and I see players asking if its a meta map or see a few trying to start up a group with that little time left, I'd always advise them to look for a LFG group a little earlier.

The meta should include Escorts, not just the main fight. Failing the Escort portion, the meta will fail as well.

[SnackParty.3178]

I do like to vibe in Seitung Province, when in chill mode. Favor, random scrap gear, and sometimes one of those ley balls for like 50s, vendor trash. Not super fast loots, but good enough for relaxing. New Kaineng, that map is a big no. Needs way more ziplines, and seems to be built around making getting around, stupid tedious. Especially the lab event, where part of it is actually getting to that point, on time. Add a couple more waypoints, and again, Ziplines, and it may be a good map to chill in. Echovald, epic battles on every inch of walking. Nope. Dragon's End, I like that map enough for chill time. 

[otto.5684]

I find myself asking the same question. I like the new maps, except Echovald. I think the issue is that the events are boring and there is not enough population, by default. 

[Razor.6392]

Dunno, I didn't buy the expansion because it seemed like a bad product. Maybe a lot of other people thought the same.

[Doctor Hide.6345]

2 hours ago, Razor.6392 said:

Dunno, I didn't buy the expansion because it seemed like a bad product. Maybe a lot of other people thought the same.

 

It's not that. EoD outsold PoF for sales, so it is one of the highest sold expansions for them if not the highest. The issue is more the design of the metas there. As for not buying EoD, you are missing out on some of the best specs the game has, so that is more a your loss thing than anything else.

[Dev.1984]

2 hours ago, Razor.6392 said:

Dunno, I didn't buy the expansion because it seemed like a bad product. Maybe a lot of other people thought the same.

If you compare it with the other part of the game, yes, EoD is disappointing IMO.  I bought it and i regret it, because i dont like it at all and i just stop playing on EoD  maps without even finish them.

[Razor.6392]

1 hour ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

 

It's not that. EoD outsold PoF for sales, so it is one of the highest sold expansions for them if not the highest. The issue is more the design of the metas there. As for not buying EoD, you are missing out on some of the best specs the game has, so that is more a your loss thing than anything else.

Yeah I guess all those are very smart people. You see higher numbers clearly means something is good, right?

The expansion that introduced no wvw or pvp content at all, not even a new map. A set of legendaries that all look alike. More failed ele specs, from what I hear even the maps are garbage, with extremely easy hero challenges and no replay value.

I'm happy saving my money.

[Ashford.8540]

To put it into very simple terms, the EoD maps are empty in general because all the metas have trash rewards so there is no incentive to stay in the EoD maps, but that's just an issue in general with gw2 since it always has a problem with making meaningful endgame content given it's horizontal nature, maybe ask for a balance of vertical and horizontal if they make a GW3.

[Doctor Hide.6345]

3 minutes ago, Razor.6392 said:

Yeah I guess all those are very smart people. You see higher numbers clearly means something is good, right?

The expansion that introduced no wvw or pvp content at all, not even a new map. A set of legendaries that all look alike. More failed ele specs, from what I hear even the maps are garbage, with extremely easy hero challenges and no replay value.

I'm happy saving my money.

 

More to game than just the things you mentioned, but whatever floats you boat. I currently love the expansion with all the stuff it brought. But I am going to stop here before I take this thread even more off topic.

[Izzy.2951]

Performance, EoD maps perform much worst than any other map despite having lower player cap and less npcs. And some doesnt have that many asset compared to other maps (except new kaineng)

[HowlKamui.5120]

Get a commander tag. 

When I wanna do a meta in EoD like Aetherblade Assault, I just tag up 10-15 minutes before, put it in LFG, and we always end up completing it. I don't even have to talk or anything. For the blackout I just split the squad into two groups for the two labs.

In general, I've been able to do all the meta events I want because I can just tag up for it and people are usually game. (Except for the scarlet briar related metas in Eye of the North. No one seems to want to do that).

[Cynder.2509]

2 hours ago, HowlKamui.5120 said:

Get a commander tag. 

When I wanna do a meta in EoD like Aetherblade Assault, I just tag up 10-15 minutes before, put it in LFG, and we always end up completing it. I don't even have to talk or anything. For the blackout I just split the squad into two groups for the two labs.

In general, I've been able to do all the meta events I want because I can just tag up for it and people are usually game. (Except for the scarlet briar related metas in Eye of the North. No one seems to want to do that).

I do have that already but I don't want to lead something like this. My experiences are more into leading raids. Also I have extreme social anxiety and I feel like people are constantly judging me. 
Also it's frustrating when people don't know what to do and what CC or other basic stuff is. Very frustrating if a meta fails because of this and then everyone insulting you because it failed. It's too much stress 

Also I'm currently only needing one Kaineng meta event and one in Dragon's End (doesn't need to succeed) for a collection. That's why I focused on it recently. I should also maybe check in during evenings or daytime as the lfg in general is very empty at the times when I played. 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Cynder.2509

[HowlKamui.5120]

1 hour ago, Cynder.2509 said:

I do have that already but I don't want to lead something like this. My experiences are more into leading raids. Also I have extreme social anxiety and I feel like people are constantly judging me. 
Also it's frustrating when people don't know what to do and what CC or other basic stuff is. Very frustrating if a meta fails because of this and then everyone insulting you because it failed. It's too much stress 

Also I'm currently only needing one Kaineng meta event and one in Dragon's End (doesn't need to succeed) for a collection. That's why I focused on it recently. I should also maybe check in during evenings or daytime as the lfg in general is very empty at the times when I played. 

Again, for EoD metas except for the last one, you never have to even chat. If you want, you can say "taxi" in your LFG so people won't expect any commanding from you. Not that they need it.

[Luthan.5236]

The metas are boring and the summoning stones as bait in the Dragon's End ... dropped a lot on price. (Probably also because of the ability to get one additional one per day from the meta.) Also the maps look less interesting than the other expansion maps or season maps - imo. I liked the jungle. Liked desert less. And I looked forward to Cantha. But never really liked the jade sea and echovald. The island had potential ... but when they announced the jade tech stuff ... expactations already were lower. The technological stuff is just ugly - some chinese-looking (which is beautiful) architecture every now and then can't save this.

Edit: But yes: There are still - at least in EU - a lot of people doing the meta. Even without joining a squad it usually is done. At least in Seitung and Echovald I see this often. Kaineng ... not too often there. According to the statuette prices it is done less.

Edited January 11, 2023 by Luthan.5236

[Hesione.9412]

I'm generally tagging up for the Fort Aspenwood event in Echovald. This event is really annoying because

1. it overlaps with the Seitung meta, which is much more popular. If people finish Seitung and come over to Echovald in the hopes of finishing off the FA meta, it's already failed due to not enough players. It's pretty much me, other people chasing the two lamps, and people trying to get the tapestry.

2. there are lots of mobs and they hit hard. The event does not downscale if there are only a few players there. 

3. It *bugs out*, repeatedly. Just see the thread in the Bugs section of the forums. 

4. The rewards are super bad. No ambergris, no jade runestone, no summoning stones, just random stuff you can get anywhere else.

Edited January 11, 2023 by Hesione.9412
Anet censored my acronym.

[Astralporing.1957]

12 hours ago, Silent.6137 said:

The meta should include Escorts, not just the main fight. Failing the Escort portion, the meta will fail as well.

When talking about having to be 30 minutes early i do mean 30 minutes before escorts. Most succesful groups form that early (or even earlier), and trying to get in 5 to 10 minutes before escorts start is usually way too late. There are groups that form around escort start or shortly before, but those groups usually don't even show in LFG - they are formed through discords, guild channels, and/or on different maps, and are being kept intentionally below radar.

[Astralporing.1957]

9 hours ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

It's not that. EoD outsold PoF for sales, so it is one of the highest sold expansions for them if not the highest.

Of course, most of the EoD sales happened before people had a chance to actually see the expansion, so it doesn't really tell us all that much.

[Silent.6137]

6 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

When talking about having to be 30 minutes early i do mean 30 minutes before escorts. Most succesful groups form that early (or even earlier), and trying to get in 5 to 10 minutes before escorts start is usually way too late. There are groups that form around escort start or shortly before, but those groups usually don't even show in LFG - they are formed through discords, guild channels, and/or on different maps, and are being kept intentionally below radar.

Wasn't disputing you at all. That comment that you quoted was in reference to another chain totally unrelated to your comment.

I highly doubt any such groups exist that form around Escort starts and are kept off radar. You need about 20 to 30 mins for everyone to get 5 stacks. Without that, the group will not get the 20% outgoing damage and be able to loot all the major chests.

[Astralporing.1957]

20 minutes ago, Silent.6137 said:

I highly doubt any such groups exist that form around Escort starts and are kept off radar. You need about 20 to 30 mins for everyone to get 5 stacks. Without that, the group will not get the 20% outgoing damage and be able to loot all the major chests.

I've been in such groups. They usually assume that people will get 5 stacks at some other time, if they want full loot, and damage is generally not a problem for them anyway.