Is it just me, or does the new fractal boss have WAY too much health?

[Linken.6345]

2 hours ago, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

that's the average damage of a t1 pug group, and you shouldn't expect more because they're beginner fractals. i did this with a group on the first tier just to learn it, and while the whole party was doing 5-8k, i was doing 17k, and it still took over five minutes just for this one boss.

And that is a problem how?

Me and my friends 3 maned t1 fractal on 2 alts and 1 main, 18k main 8k alt core necro and 3k alt druid.

It did not take excessive anumnt of time.

That 1 main is like 3 normal t1 dps

Edited June 29, 2023 by Linken.6345

[Efar.8153]

.

Edited June 29, 2023 by Efar.8153

[The Boz.2038]

4 hours ago, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

and it still took over five minutes just for this one boss.

OVER FIVE MINUTES!?
HOW DARE THEY!?

[Cuks.8241]

I only did it on t1 with random pugs and it seemed quite a fast fractal. We also missed pretty much all the mechanics in t1 so it seemed forgiving boss but we one shot it so Ill learn them in harder tiers. 

I dont like all the jumping parts. To many special abilities for little effect. Compare it to SO Nova Launch, one fast ability that is fun and does it all. 

 

[HnRkLnXqZ.1870]

We did it last night with a guild-group. No instructions, no video guide, nothing. Tier 2 with half-broken builds, thanks to the balance team. Learning and understanding the mechanics took a while. We did not focus on peak-performance. The HP pool did feel very large. But when we finally took it down, we had most of the mechanics learned. We probably still miss a couple of things, but we managed to make it through as a team, without leaving anyone behind.

The more you know about the fractal and its mechanics, the boss mechanics in particular, the better it will work. And so the HP pool will get smaller with every new run. New stuff is always difficult to learn. Take your time and do not be too harsh on yourselves. 

Opposite to the others in here, I really enjoyed the bundle/travel stuff. I actually intend to enter it solo on T1 and explore the cave. The mechanics look quite broken and exploitable. I think your guide-writers should have the first skip ready by monday next week.

[Firebeard.1746]

On 6/28/2023 at 4:21 AM, Fueki.4753 said:

He definitely has far too much health. I played in on Tier 2 today and it was a horrendous slog to get it over with. It wasn't even a fun fight. If he's going to survive anyway, the fight should have ended at 66% or at least at 50%.

Nothing else in that fractal was fun either. The traversal stuff was just boring and tedious. The abilities having charges instead of being unlimited didn't exactly help either.

Yikes. This is exactly what everyone complained about with Sunqua. Why?! Why did they do that AGAIN. Meep. I'm fine with a longer or tougher boss fight but I don't want a long pre boss phase if that's the case. 

Edited June 29, 2023 by Firebeard.1746

[Katary.7096]

Compared to most other fractal bosses I was left with the feeling that they made the new boss's health pool quite large. But then I remembered that the people who built this content likely also worked on the EoD strikes and those bosses had a substantial amount of health as well, even on normal mode. Seems to be the new standard for current year GW2 content design. Whatever, overall the boss fight is okay.

[anbujackson.9564]

Besides the large hp pool even in t1 (i duoed it with a friend) I think my main issue is the player requirement during the pre boss stuff.

Like why the hell do you need 4 players exactly? We literally had to go t1 only because its the only tier where you only need two players. Not gonna lie I was super salty when we went in blind in 100 duo and had to reset immediately after. 

Edited June 29, 2023 by anbujackson.9564

[Shadowmoon.7986]

The only thing i really dislike is the grapple hook gimmick. Everything else seems fine. 

[ArchonWing.9480]

Haven't done this fractal yet but...

Are we really dunking on t1/t2 players for not doing damage?  If they did damage, they wouldn't be in t1 for long. T1 Difficulty should be relative to the other t1 fractals, not against you. Your average t4 player can solo many t1 fractals so it's like having different conversations.

Also are the fights taking a long time because it's an hp sponge? Because other people told me there are mechanics if not done properly would prolong the fight.

It'd be really nice if people had some actual hp numbers though.

Edited July 1, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

22 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Haven't done this fractal yet but...

Are we really dunking on t1/t2 players for not doing damage? 

You can deal over 20k DPS with simple and cheap builds without doing anything special on pretty much any profession. 

People are dunking on people for bringing junk into the fight and being upset they are not dealing damage.

[Nephalem.8921]

1 hour ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Haven't done this fractal yet but...

Are we really dunking on t1/t2 players for not doing damage?  If they did damage, they wouldn't be in t1 for long. T1 Difficulty should be relative to the other t1 fractals, not against you. Your average t4 player can solo many t1 fractals so it's like having different conversations.

Also are the fights taking a long time because it's an hp sponge? Because other people told me there are mechanics if not done properly would prolong the fight.

It'd be really nice if people had some actual hp numbers though.

5k dps per player would result in a 12min fight. there needs to be somewhere some hint in the game that you are supposed to do more damage than that. Currently its t3 but why not 25 which is the end of t1 tier?

Also 10k dps per player which is really not hard even with selfmade ow builds would already make it one of the faster fractals. It has 18m hp in t1 afaik. 

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

it was finally a daily in tier 4 today, and it was rough.

 

after three groups and two hours of effort, i gave up on it because by the time the boss gets to the 10% mark, everyone is  exhausted and can't keep doing mechanics. its not that the boss has too much health, its that he has too much health and the fight is almost entirely mechanics non-stop with no real burn phases.

 

i swear every single time we were done with numbers it was already spread mechanic a few seconds later.

 

i have a feeling most groups successfully clearing this have really high persistent damage. the lfg tonight shows groups looking only for condition builds and kicking power which means i'm probably right; they're carrying the fight but doing damage while doing mechanics with condi.

Edited July 2, 2023 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[Linken.6345]

16 minutes ago, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

it was finally a daily in tier 4 today, and it was awful.

 

after three groups and two hours of effort, i gave up on it because by the time the boss gets to the 10% mark, everyone is  exhausted and can't keep doing mechanics. its not that the boss has too much health, its that he has too much health and the fight is almost entirely mechanics non-stop with no real burn phases.

 

i swear every single time we were done with numbers it was already spread mechanic a few seconds later.

 

i have a feeling most groups successfully clearing this have really high persistent damage. the lfg tonight shows groups looking only for condition builds and kicking power which means i'm probably right; they're carrying the fight but doing damage while doing mechanics with condi.

 

honestly, i normally get annoyed at other players for complaining about their time being wasted, but in this case i have to agree: this fractal is a waste of my time and is probably better skipped.

it is a ranged damage fight so condi virtiuso is great but really anything with a range damage can do it power or condi.

[Kaenaydar.5631]

2 hours ago, Linken.6345 said:

it is a ranged damage fight so condi virtiuso is great but really anything with a range damage can do it power or condi.

I went there on my power untamed she can normally hold her own in fractals but that fractal after 2 hrs was too much. Anet should just move its current set up to cm and make the boss less spongy.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Kaenaydar.5631
was responding to wrong person

[Kaenaydar.5631]

3 hours ago, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

it was finally a daily in tier 4 today, and it was awful.

 

after three groups and two hours of effort, i gave up on it because by the time the boss gets to the 10% mark, everyone is  exhausted and can't keep doing mechanics. its not that the boss has too much health, its that he has too much health and the fight is almost entirely mechanics non-stop with no real burn phases.

 

i swear every single time we were done with numbers it was already spread mechanic a few seconds later.

 

i have a feeling most groups successfully clearing this have really high persistent damage. the lfg tonight shows groups looking only for condition builds and kicking power which means i'm probably right; they're carrying the fight but doing damage while doing mechanics with condi.

 

honestly, i normally get annoyed at other players for complaining about their time being wasted, but in this case i have to agree: this fractal is a waste of my time and is probably better skipped.

I went there on my power untamed she can normally hold her own in fractals but that fractal after 2 hrs was too much. Anet should just move its current set up to cm and make the boss less spongy.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Kaenaydar.5631

[Noodle Ant.1605]

assuming my arcdps didnt break, i counted the final boss in t4 to have at least 25m hp, where ~27m is most probable

Edited July 2, 2023 by Noodle Ant.1605

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

1 hour ago, Noodle Ant.1605 said:

assuming my arcdps didnt break, i counted the final boss in t4 to have at least 25m hp, where ~27m is most probable

oh, so only around ten minutes fighting him with an average group dps of 10k per player. /s

 

i took a closer look at my logs and i figured out what makes him feel so tanky: something is going on with his toughness. i do about half the damage on him that i do on old tom, and was barely able to break 16k even wailing on him in melee 24/7 with reaper, keeping a slight distance so we could drop the axes in-place and sidestep them.

 

the average power damage of my party was always low, even with multiple groups.

 

i switched to my condi soulbeast who benches ~10k less than my reaper on the golem, as its mostly just a flavor build. i ended up doing about the same damage on the boss throughout the fight compared to my highly optimised power reaper despite the massive desparity in my benchmark performance.

 

so the preference for conditions has to do with more than just the passive damage uptime; it seems that arenanet simply multiplied both his toughness and vitality after copy & pasting from another boss.

Edited July 2, 2023 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[Kaenaydar.5631]

15 minutes ago, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

oh, so only around ten minutes fighting him with an average group dps of 10k per player. /s

 

i took a closer look at my logs and i figured out what makes him feel so tanky: something is going on with his toughness. i do about half the damage on him that i do on old tom, and was barely able to break 16k even wailing on him in melee 24/7 with reaper, keeping a slight distance so we could drop the axes in-place and sidestep them.

 

the average power damage of my party was always low, even with multiple groups.

 

i switched to my condi soulbeast who benches ~10k less than my reaper on the golem, as its mostly just a flavor build. i ended up doing about the same damage on the boss throughout the fight compared to my highly optimised power reaper despite the massive desparity in my benchmark performance.

 

so the preference for conditions has to do with more than just the passive damage uptime; it seems that arenanet simply multiplied both his toughness and vitality after copy & pasting from another boss.

Explains why my untamed that can rip through t4s np have issues with him shes a full power build. She is likely losing damage and dps because his buffs. Given on golem She does around 26k dps with her hammer. Even in raids and strikes she does enough dmg to do ok so no shock about that. What was anet thinking giving us a boss like that to where we power builds are having difficulty killing.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Kaenaydar.5631

[Kaenaydar.5631]

I ran it on t2 wasnt too bad but the boss does seem unnaturally tough. I wonder if the fractal buffs had to do with how tough that fight is. Every skill last night he did was one shotting my untamed. Shes full zerker but even so that isnt that normal.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Kaenaydar.5631

[Hotride.2187]

On T4 it didn't seem to be worse than sunqua in terms of HP. Disappointing that there is no phase checkpoint, just like sunqua, but what can you do.

[Joraan Adenard.2061]

WHY does Anet keep designing HP sponge bosses ? Increasing the health pool does NOT make a fight harder, just more tedious and overall LESS fun. Add fun, challenging mechanics instead, NOT more HP.

Gyala Delve final boss is a slog and is incredibly tedious to fight, and probable one of the worst designed fight in the game because of it. PLEASE DONT make this a standard from now on.

Also : WHY do we need 4 players to complete the puzzle ? As a daily, if you get only 2 players that suck at jumping puzzles, the fractal becomes impossible to complete. You can't carry, you can't skip. It will just be an incredibly frustrating daily.

It feels like Anet just doesn't know how to design fun encounters anymore.

[oCynder.5136]

It seems like it has a lot of health but it's just something similar to sunqua. I had a group that cleared it quickly didn't feel like it was 30 minutes long, barely close to 8 minutes long. I had groups that took more than 30 minutes long because of players not understanding mechanics or just taking too long on jumping puzzles. The boss itself for a few of my pulls only took ~3 minutes.

Any ranged, preferably Condi is just strictly better here like Virtuoso, Mechanist, etc. It seems like a sponge because of how much you have to do with spreading out so you aren't getting the necessary boons from stacking and everything. Power DPS can work but that requires extensive knowledge from all players and know how to properly stack and spread out and regroup quickly.

My only issue with a certain mechanic is to find the almost impossible shadowy thingy (from seeing the golden tether briefly) to collect it and then kill the aspect. That is very difficult to see. You would also think that if you CC it would stop the aspect but it doesn't. I'm not sure what the intention for that for heal supports to do there after CCing and supposed to deal damage to their personal aspect.

 

12 minutes ago, Joraan Adenard.2061 said:

WHY does Anet keep designing HP sponge bosses ? Increasing the health pool does NOT make a fight harder, just more tedious and overall LESS fun. Add fun, challenging mechanics instead, NOT more HP.

Gyala Delve final boss is a slog and is incredibly tedious to fight, and probable one of the worst designed fight in the game because of it. PLEASE DONT make this a standard from now on.

Also : WHY do we need 4 players to complete the puzzle ? As a daily, if you get only 2 players that suck at jumping puzzles, the fractal becomes impossible to complete. You can't carry, you can't skip. It will just be an incredibly frustrating daily.

It feels like Anet just doesn't know how to design fun encounters anymore.

It's because of how much power creep there is in the game. Their only solution is to increase the HP making them spongey which is just ... bad.

The jumping puzzle isn't bad but I don't like how the grappling hook works in this game. 50% of the time you shoot it out and it doesn't pull you correctly so you overshoot. Also, I can't press SAK again just to stow the bundle which gets me every time.

 

[Jay.5128]

Did it today seemed fine to me just don't seem stack all in one spot and you have to do mechanics  TBH I am all for the fight takes like 8 min for me.

My guess people way to use to older bosses and power creep so when bring something online new strikes might feel out place but currently id say just about right with other new fights.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Jay.5128

[Myror.7521]

Well the boss itself got a dmg reduction buff under His hp bar so there must be a mechanics how to get rid off it but I got by no means any idea what you need to do since the whole mechanics all feel complete random.