Rune effects that didn't get Relics

[nicoper.3215]

Rune of Vampirism: +10% Maximum Health; restore 10% of your health upon killing a foe.
Neither of these effects are, as far as I know, anywhere to be found in the new relic system, which is a massive disappointment.

[RaveOnYou.2819]

they totally screwed this relic thing. we lost most of the rune effects and triggering effect on heal and utility skills are just lazy designs. as ele player on wvw, ow i use signet heal for its passive healing and fgs 90 sec cooldown. my relic options decrease instantly to a few. 

[Gendalfs.7521]

13 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

To be fair, they sold us a rework of the rune system that could have been really good but at release it look like they just failed with disappointing relic effects and runesets that still gatekeep useful effects behind poor stats choice.

• Why exactly did they make the poor choice to keep the passive 25% movement speed on the runeset instead of puting it on the relic? If there is 1 effect that deserved to be put on the relic it's the passive movement speed increase.
• Why couldn't they use the opportunity to replace all those "% boon duration" and "% condition duration" by concentration and expertise? It's been 8 years already that concentration and expertise have been introduced in the game to replace such effect and despite 2 runes rework they have yet to make the change!
• Why do we still have so many runesets after this rune/relic rework? There is at least 70% of those runesets that nobody ever used and, amongst last 30%, 20% were only used for their 6th rune effect. Will we end up with 90% useless runesets only existing for the sake of providing an illusion of choice?
• If the person who designed Relic of astral ward is a developper, the game database is going to be a serious mess! Who in it's right mind would think that it's smart to ask the player to use a signet in order to gain a "signet" that will be consumed to create an effect upon using a signet?
• What is this relic of firework for exactly? I mean, yeah, elementalists are probably the only one that can get the most out of this thing while thief have absolutely no possibility to ever use it. Why even create this?
• Why are there so many relic that are tied to utility skill category that only a minority of profession have access to? Cantrip? Mantra? Trap? Stance?... etc. Seriously? Did you really dedicate relics to skill sets that only 2-3 professions have access to?
• Even the bad design of dropped consumable bundles manage to force it's way into the relics... I'm baffled.

To me, the rune part of the rework is a waste of an opportunity to clean a big mess while the relic part is poor for build diversity as a big part of the relics effect favor the few over the mass.

Now imagine they dont read forums at all. Soo many good ideas just left flying in void.

Developers, pls respond if im wrong!

Tnx

[coro.3176]

13 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

If the person who designed Relic of astral ward is a developper, the game database is going to be a serious mess! Who in it's right mind would think that it's smart to ask the player to use a signet in order to gain a "signet" that will be consumed to create an effect upon using a signet?

Yo dawg, I herd you like signets, so I put a signet in your signets so you can signet the next time you signet.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Trapper Rune stealth is probably gone for the same reason Ancient Seeds is--devs died too much to it and deem it 'unfun'.  

And yeah, no idea what going on with Astral Ward rune.  It's like boxes in boxes but even dumber somehow...

[Head Kracker.4790]

Bit miffed that Fireworks passive 25% movement is gone. I played specifically during that event for those runes since they fit my core (not dragon or any other elite spec) guardian. I really dont mind the relic system but give me all the bonus not just the one that vanilla.

[otto.5684]

14 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

To be fair, they sold us a rework of the rune system that could have been really good but at release it look like they just failed with disappointing relic effects and runesets that still gatekeep useful effects behind poor stats choice.

• Why exactly did they make the poor choice to keep the passive 25% movement speed on the runeset instead of puting it on the relic? If there is 1 effect that deserved to be put on the relic it's the passive movement speed increase.
• Why couldn't they use the opportunity to replace all those "% boon duration" and "% condition duration" by concentration and expertise? It's been 8 years already that concentration and expertise have been introduced in the game to replace such effect and despite 2 runes rework they have yet to make the change!
• Why do we still have so many runesets after this rune/relic rework? There is at least 70% of those runesets that nobody ever used and, amongst last 30%, 20% were only used for their 6th rune effect. Will we end up with 90% useless runesets only existing for the sake of providing an illusion of choice?
• If the person who designed Relic of astral ward is a developper, the game database is going to be a serious mess! Who in it's right mind would think that it's smart to ask the player to use a signet in order to gain a "signet" that will be consumed to create an effect upon using a signet?
• What is this relic of firework for exactly? I mean, yeah, elementalists are probably the only one that can get the most out of this thing while thief have absolutely no possibility to ever use it. Why even create this?
• Why are there so many relic that are tied to utility skill category that only a minority of profession have access to? Cantrip? Mantra? Trap? Stance?... etc. Seriously? Did you really dedicate relics to skill sets that only 2-3 professions have access to?
• Even the bad design of dropped consumable bundles manage to force it's way into the relics... I'm baffled.

To me, the rune part of the rework is a waste of an opportunity to clean a big mess while the relic part is poor for build diversity as a big part of the relics effect favor the few over the mass.

I want to quote for emphasis. The rune/relic change is baffling.

[Leo G.4501]

16 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

{quote broken up for clarity}

"Why exactly did they make the poor choice to keep the passive 25% movement speed on the runeset instead of puting it on the relic?" I could see this as a balanced take to limit the amount of speedy movement without swiftness/super speed. I don't have a huge problem with this but I see your point.

"Why couldn't they use the opportunity to replace all those "% boon duration" and "% condition duration" by concentration and expertise?" I see this as an opportunity to specialize. Rather than stats that just build toward capping all boon duration or all condi duration, you can have a specific effect be 'ultra boosted'.  That and it probably plays into one of the other points you have about diversifying the runes.

"Why do we still have so many runesets after this rune/relic rework?" Definitely agree. The main thing that is going to get these runes to be functionally different is that specific '+x boon duration' part of the rune set, but even then, this is a weak means of diversifying stuff.  I'd almost say just wrap that effect into the relics too (meaning you get a relic that boost x boon/condi duration + it's final effect) and condense a lot of these sets.

"If the person who designed Relic of astral ward is a developper, the game database is going to be a serious mess! Who in it's right mind would think that it's smart to ask the player to use a signet in order to gain a "signet" that will be consumed to create an effect upon using a signet?" I have no idea what that means lol. If it is actually that confusing, yeah, I foresee some future...adjustments.

"What is this relic of firework for exactly?" What? That 'use a skill with a 20sec cooldown or more and blah blah blah' thing? I have no idea what the devs were thinking making these convoluted sets. This isn't all that diverse, just busy work.

"Why are there so many relic that are tied to utility skill category that only a minority of profession have access to?" I was thinking the exact same thing! I don't see a huge issue having relics that trigger off of certain utilities, but it should ALSO have some other effect that isn't reliant on specific utilities. It further limits the goals of diversity, which funnily enough, I didn't have a huge issue with when the runes behaved like they did before. Because the rune sets weren't particularly about diversity but specialization...you know, cost-benefit/build choice and all. But if the goal is to be diverse, this flies in the face of that.

"Even the bad design of dropped consumable bundles manage to force it's way into the relics... I'm baffled." Well, I heard that alot of the new relics are crazy. I only had time to log in to check dailies so didn't get to look into everything. I figure the stinkers are supposed to contrast the crazy new shinies you're supposed to want and spend cash to get.

I'm with you tho. I didn't like the cut of the jib of this expansion from the beginning but we'll see how things change over time and with the addition of the new weapons...

Edited August 24, 2023 by Leo G.4501

[Leo G.4501]

16 hours ago, JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

People ask for that kind of design btw and that's why, you get it...the reason you will see any kind of sterilization of ideas is because people are so kitten concerned about game balance...and well that is what happens and its not like I didn't sit here and didn't try to fight over this talk about balance over and over and over again. But history always repeats, and people will never learn.

What you linked to is countering a suggestion of a rune (now relic) that would change all projected fields into water fields as an example. There is limiting a rune buff to having to use certain utilities/skills and then there is tacking on a huge alteration of the games' mechanics with a single piece of gear. There's being concerned with balanced and then not giving a kitten about balance.  You're in the latter with that post when you could be somewhere in between.  How about a sigil that swaps the element of the next combo field into [insert whatever for that specific sigil] for then next 9sec when weapon swapping to that sigil (15sec icd?)? That seems far more balanced than just making all your fields into water fields or fire fields or whatever.

Still, relics that can only be useful to certain professions that are using certain skills feels far too limiting.

Quote

Mind you, that the linked thread...this is not just one person, it's practically everyone that didn't actually think on it for more than 30 minutes about the topic. But here we are what were people expecting when every single thread was but what about the balance all the relics will be so op... then why wouldn't you get sterilized, weak, unimaginative relic effects.

It was either get reduced sterilized relics now or get OP relics for several months then have the rug pulled from under you as they nerf them into the dirt.

My personal stance: I hate having stuff monumentally changed/removed or replaced with an inferior version. I much prefer playing an underdog that eventually gets some buffs that still plays the same but better.

Edited August 24, 2023 by Leo G.4501

[Kal Durak.2830]

On 9/1/2023 at 11:33 AM, AreohCobing.5092 said:

What is the status on my missing golem (rune) and missing vampire rune <-- VAMP health suction? 

Anet, you took these from me and I would like them back.

I did not buy the expansion so you could steal what I already had. Poor form Anet.

And give that guy back his Golem too!

 

On 8/23/2023 at 8:28 PM, nicoper.3215 said:

Rune of Vampirism: +10% Maximum Health; restore 10% of your health upon killing a foe.
Neither of these effects are, as far as I know, anywhere to be found in the new relic system, which is a massive disappointment.

Massive is right.

[StraySheep.5284]

When I saw that there was no Relic of Vampirism and the bonuses were deleted from the 6th rune slot, I took a day off from work to try and find replacements and none worked. I proceeded to uninstall GW2 shortly afterward after literally playing the game for thousands of hours. The Secrets of the Obscure expansion did not address this and thus did not buy that expansion. Literally won't pay a single cent until they invent a Relic that adds the bonuses back.

[Every day pon.5386]

YARR!! WHERE BE ME TRUSTY F1RST MATE & PRIVATEER PARROT?! SHE FLEW OUT TO THE SEA 1 EVE & BEEN GONE SINCE THE AUGUST WINDS!

[Sansar.1302]

Relics are a big fail.

[Zzik.5873]

If they dont put back the golem Im not buying any stuff from them.

[Leo G.4501]

*opens forums to peep inside*

Are relics winning, son?

[MithranArkanere.8957]

The ones I want back the most are the ones that summon allies for the RP value.

[Aeolus.3615]

On 8/22/2023 at 6:11 PM, coro.3176 said:

List them here!

1. Rune of Sanctuary - Gain a barrier with health equal to 10% of any heals you receive. (gone, as far as I can tell. No relics do this)
2. Rune of the Trapper. - Staple build-around rune for Ranger and DH
3. All the summon runes - well, that should clean up combat a bit

Rune of sanctuary would be far to strong asa relic with the changes of the new weapons now that theres a weapon that aplies aoe barrier with autos and the same class can heal.

Edited December 14, 2023 by Aeolus.3615

[Yasai.3549]

Relics were gonna be such a big w : IF they just decoupled effects from 6 set bonus as everyone was expecting. 
Turns out, they didn't and now it's meh. It's cool but not fun to experiment with anymore. Anyone here misses Dolyak my old friend?

Edited December 15, 2023 by Yasai.3549

[Sansar.1302]

On 12/15/2023 at 3:00 AM, Yasai.3549 said:

Relics were gonna be such a big w : IF they just decoupled effects from 6 set bonus as everyone was expecting. 
Turns out, they didn't and now it's meh. It's cool but not fun to experiment with anymore. Anyone here misses Dolyak my old friend?

They made the game alot less fun.

And yes i miss Dolyak on my open world sustain character.

[Mell.4873]

We can only hope they recreate some of the relic effects with each mini content drop. We did get some interesting relic this cycle especially in WvW like Relic of the Demon Empress. 

Maybe after SOS they will add a few more to the core game but it doesn't seem likely. 

[starlinvf.1358]

One I never realized I'd miss is "grant nearby allies 5 stacks of Might, Fury, and Swiftness for 10 seconds after entering combat. (Cooldown: 20 Seconds)"

My main reaper build got all its fury from this, so I didn't need to knock around with Prec too much.  

 

[jason.1083]

10 hours ago, starlinvf.1358 said:

One I never realized I'd miss is "grant nearby allies 5 stacks of Might, Fury, and Swiftness for 10 seconds after entering combat. (Cooldown: 20 Seconds)"

My main reaper build got all its fury from this, so I didn't need to knock around with Prec too much.  

 

That's Rune of the Pack, and that did get a decent substitute, Relic of the Midnight King :Grant 3 Might (9sec) and Fury (5sec) to nearby allies when you disable an enemy (CD 1sec).

If your build/rotation includes some CC the Relic will actually be better than the Rune.

Edited December 28, 2023 by jason.1083

[otto.5684]

10 hours ago, jason.1083 said:

That's Rune of the Pack, and that did get a decent substitute, Relic of the Midnight King :Grant 3 Might (9sec) and Fury (5sec) to nearby allies when you disable an enemy (CD 1sec).

If your build/rotation includes some CC the Relic will actually be better than the Rune.

This is kinda of the heart of the issue. Not all builds have access to CC or would want to use CC in the start of the rotation. Some classes have no 30 sec CD elite utilities, and so they on. There is a reason why most of the proc type effects where “in combat” or “on attack.”

I am still really annoyed they changed fire works 6th effect to some garbage. It was an easy way for many classes to obtain boons in OW. And there are a ton of other examples. It is to the point it seems the main goal of the update was to annoy players. 

[jason.1083]

45 minutes ago, otto.5684 said:

This is kinda of the heart of the issue. Not all builds have access to CC or would want to use CC in the start of the rotation. Some classes have no 30 sec CD elite utilities, and so they on. There is a reason why most of the proc type effects where “in combat” or “on attack.”

I am still really annoyed they changed fire works 6th effect to some garbage. It was an easy way for many classes to obtain boons in OW. And there are a ton of other examples. It is to the point it seems the main goal of the update was to annoy players. 

The goal apparently was to reinforce active gameplay and cut down on passive procs of traits/effects. I get that some people want builds that don't require even a full rotation to be played effectively. But if that's what Anet is going for, we have to adapt to it. 

Plus I was mainly pointing out that there was at least a substitute to Rune of the Pack, just in case they didn't know. I used to use that rune as well (and I still do for it's other buffs), and I suppose I got lucky since my build synergizes quite well with Relic of the Midnight King already, so it's a buff from my perspective.

Edited December 28, 2023 by jason.1083

[Zzik.5873]

Dont remember if I already comment on this post or not. Probably, but in case, they didnt give us the Golem yet.
So yeah, bring back the golem from the golemancer rune.