StraightPath.3972 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 (edited) Before I'm labeled a tyrant and a commie (which I'm anything but, quite the opposite), let me make my case to you. Why do you think reaction emotes exist in the first place? Is it to express yourself, your feelings, your support or disaproval for a post? My short answer - hell no. They are there so the forum does not get flooded with 100 similar posts saying "+1" or "me too", or "love this". A simple heart with a number of how many times it was clicked saves space and reader's sanity. However there's a catch to this system - it only works with positive reactions. "Thank you", "Love it", "Had a good laugh" - none of these require elaboration. A short pat on the back with .gif ending. Negative reactions are a whole different beast. Disagreeing with something means contesting it and with that - the need to elaborate. And emoji for that is a terrible solution as it's basically a "fling a kitten anonymously" button. It's disrespectful, confusing (as it provides no proper information on what is the point on contention), and allows trolls to hide behind a wall of silence. Therefore i propose we remove the confused emoji all together. If someone has something to say about another user's post - let them come out and say it. If they lack the gall or intelligence to make a proper response - let them be silent instead. Edited June 10 by StraightPath.3972 3 3 43 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotride.2187 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 What about the laughing one? 5 3 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 I'm afraid this topic has...been there, done that. An official response has been, "emojis are here to stay". 🤷♂️ 3 1 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dami.5046 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 I do posts on purpose to get a few oO. They are cute. 1 2 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danikat.8537 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 I think having a 'disagree' reaction can serve a similar purpose to the positive ones: it gives people who have nothing to contribute except disagreeing a way to feel like they've done that without cluttering up the topic with useless comments. (Importantly this only works as long as it is just an icon, not a 'down vote' button that could be used to hide unpopular opinions, I'd be completely against that function if I thought Anet was ever likely to consider it.) I agree that it's not helpful at all for feedback. 'Agree' works because if someone pushes the button and doesn't post you can reasonably assume they agree completely and unconditionally with absolutely everything that was said. But even if you reverse that and assume someone who pushes a 'disagree' button disagrees completely with everything you said what are you supposed to do with that information? There's almost no situation where it's useful without more context - why do they disagree? What's wrong with the idea/statement/opinion etc.? We had a disagree button (or thumbs down or unhelpful or something) for a while and I tried looking at my posts which got that reaction to work out why. Even comparing the ratio of positive and negative reactions and feedback from people who had managed to put it into words I couldn't work out what the 'disagree's' were for. A lot of them weren't even on suggestions or answers to questions, and one was on a post which just said "Wow, I love this" which was especially odd - were they telling me I was wrong about my own opinion? So I think the only practical thing to do is ignore negative reactions on your posts (I take it further and ignore all of them entirely), but I think it's worth keeping the button for those who want to show their opinion but aren't ready to join the conversation yet. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kharmin.7683 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 Awww someone's feelings got hurt over a little ol' icon on the internet? Please. 4 3 9 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doggie.3184 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 They should change it to a confused looking Charr face 1 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sobx.1758 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 Spoiler alert! 1 2 3 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 Here's the official response, in case anyone was wondering: 1 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkK.7368 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 (edited) If you remove the negative reaction, the community will agree and treat some of the other reactions as the new negative. It happened before. There was no dislike, so people turned "confused" into dislike. If you remove it, maybe "sad" turns into dislike. You can keep removing emojis until no one left remains. Censorship is never the solution. Specially because it turns the other way too. Remove positive ones. If someone has to agree to something, write it. Don't hide behind an emoji and become a dumb blind sheep following the "like" trend. PD: I "Confuse" your post, sir. Have a good day, thanks for the chat Edited June 10 by DarkK.7368 4 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squee.7829 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 People will just do the Facebook thing and use the laugh emoji. Then we get to figure out if it's a "I think this was a funny thing I like" emoji or a "I disagree and am laughing condescendingly" emoji. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrimm.5624 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 2 hours ago, StraightPath.3972 said: Before I'm labeled a tyrant and a commie (which I'm anything but, quite the opposite), let me make my case to you. Why do you think reaction emotes exist in the first place? Is it to express yourself, your feelings, your support or disaproval for a post? My short answer - hell no. They are there so the forum does not get flooded with 100 similar posts saying "+1" or "me too", or "love this". A simple heart with a number of how many times it was clicked saves space and reader's sanity. However there's a catch to this system - it only works with positive reactions. "Thank you", "Love it", "Had a good laugh" - none of these require elaboration. A short pat on the back with .gif ending. Negative reactions are a whole different beast. Disagreeing with something means contesting it and with that - the need to elaborate. And emoji for that is a terrible solution as it's basically a "fling a kitten anonymously" button. It's disrespectful, confusing (as it provides no proper information on what is the point on contention), and allows trolls to hide behind a wall of silence. Therefore i propose we remove the confused emoji all together. If someone has something to say about another user's post - let them come out and say it. If they lack the gall or intelligence to make a proper response - let them be silent instead. Have to disagree. Yes we can all hope for a reply versus an emoji but its just like the like or fav ones. It's a way of saying I don't quite think so but am ok that you feel that. That's not a matter of a poster not having gall, its more of a I don't agree but can see you feel this way. All posters have opinions, just sometimes it's not a bad thing to let a player state theirs. Now if they are asking for changes that would other players, I would hope they would provide more detail so points can be refined. But no, just having only positive and none that convey the opposite wouldn't make sense in my opinion. If anything remove them all if need be since even positives ones can misrepresent actual pointed replies on ideas that are liked as well. I would say people might add a like where in reality they like part of it but not the rest but they don't want to divert/delude the idea being posted so like will do instead. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NitricRose.1863 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 (edited) I wish the emotes would go away. Confused: Does the responder find the post confusing, or do they think the poster is confused? Or is the responder just trolling? Similarly for most of the other emotes. I have had people go look for other old posts I made, and post reactions to them, because they don't like something I posted (bizarre behaviour to say the least). These emotes have meaning for the responder, and not for the poster. I find them incredibly useless. Edited June 10 by NitricRose.1863 typo 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magmi.6723 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 2 hours ago, Zeivu.3615 said: I don't think that it should be removed. Just give us an emojii that is just pissed off looking and be done with it. Intellitectual honestly is just better, but the Anet mods are really soft and hate it when you tell people what they really need to hear, so in many cases, a reply is more of a liability. Ironically I’d actually like this emoji. Not because I think the confused emojis bad, but because it’s used for multiple definitions. The reaction isn’t as readable as others. because the lack of a proper downvote means players have adapted another emoji to represent this. allow a proper downvote. So players can actually evaluate based on clear emoji reactions, 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 Well for me instead of dogpiling the OP with another negative post I disagree with OP and do a heart or thanks on the best refuter post in said thread. Seem to work well for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trejgon.9367 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 3 hours ago, StraightPath.3972 said: They are there so the forum does not get flooded with 100 similar posts saying "+1" or "me too", or "love this". According to this logic we should have a proper downvote to avoid forums being flooded with hundreds of "-1", "it's stupid" or "hate this". Actually a proper downvote emote would also help distinguish between people expressing genuine confusion from ones flat out finding it extremely disagreeable. 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchonWing.9480 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 (edited) 4 hours ago, StraightPath.3972 said: Before I'm labeled a tyrant and a commie (which I'm anything but, quite the opposite), let me make my case to you. Alright let's stop it right there. This is what I would a label a weak post, a post is already doomed before it starts. Why would you preface a post telling us your post will already get a negative response? If you have so little faith in your post, then nobody else will have any either. You're giving yourself a negative reaction, and so people will follow in kind. You're saying "You're going to disagree with me anyways, so don't even bother reading" . So the rest isn't really necessary. The main problem is that you're so worried about other people having different opinions than you, that it will always color your posts, silly emojis or not. Accept that there will always be disagreement, because otherwise there is no point in discussion already, and be willing to stand behind what you believe in. That doesn't mean you're not willing to change your mind, but rather you do sincerely say what you believe it. Have some pride in what you do and we won't have a problem. Also in forum settings you can disable notifications just for emojis, or just altogether. Finally, personally I think we should change the confused emoji to the condition icon ingame. Edited June 10 by ArchonWing.9480 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HnRkLnXqZ.1870 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 On the old board, we had a positive-only system. There was a helpful-reaction, that was mostly granted to posts that contained useful information. However, around the last year of the Vanilla forums, there was a shift in community behavior. We had a drastic increase in offensive and humiliating posts. Mostly because there was no dislike-reaction, people just stacked the 'helpful' reaction on those posts. The current system is far from being perfect, but it had an impact on the way people write here. A positive impact. As people can now openly show their discontent anonymously, there is no longer a need to push aggressive texts, for the sole purpose of saying 'no'. In addition, they have drastically improved forum-moderation, which was barely noticeable on the old board. The current moderation-team has a strict set of rules and takes care of violations quickly. The confused reaction is the lesser evil anyway. It is no downvote or an angry-smiley. Confused just means 'purpose of the post unclear for the person who reacted'. We, who are used to the boards, interpret it differently. But a random person, who googled something about GW2 and was forwarded to this board, might not be very impressed by this reaction. They read the suggested text and judge for themselves ^^. While we are at this lovely topic again, it is time for mini-poll. Please react to my post if you: 💙 prefer a positive-only reaction system prefer the reddit system with upvoting posts 😕 prefer a balanced-system with positive and negative reactions 🤣 don't care at all 🏆appreciate the good work of the moderation-team Thanks for your participation. ^^ 1 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danikat.8537 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 1 hour ago, NitricRose.1863 said: I wish the emotes would go away. Confused: Does the responder find the post confusing, or do they think the poster is confused? Or is the responder just trolling? Similarly for most of the other emotes. I have had people go look for other old posts I made, and post reactions to them, because they don't like something I posted (bizarre behaviour to say the least). These emotes have meaning for the responder, and not for the poster. I find them incredibly useless. The irony of that is the forum has a ranking system, it's just (mostly) hidden and I'm pretty sure it counts any reaction as increasing the recipients rank, so if Anet ever decided to make it visible that approach would completely backfire. I doubt they would turn it on though. There's a lot of functions Invision forums have which Anet choose not to use, and personally I don't think ranking systems add anything useful to the vast majority of forums. (The one I've seen where it was useful was a role-playing forum where ranks were manually assigned to show the users experience with role-playing and specific interests.) I think it'd be especially a bad idea on this forum, because there is a way to find it buried in the forum's menus and if it was enabled I think the rankings would make some people genuinely confused and angry and I suspect a lot of it is because of this - if people spam your posts with reactions it boosts your reputation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teknomancer.4895 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 If the emojis aren't going anywhere, that's fine. But that doesn't necessarily mean it has to be permanently limited to the existing set of options. I'd really just prefer they add a simple 👍 and 👎 to the reaction options we already have. Obviously the icons already exist. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrimm.5624 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 7 minutes ago, Teknomancer.4895 said: If the emojis aren't going anywhere, that's fine. But that doesn't necessarily mean it has to be permanently limited to the existing set of options. I'd really just prefer they add a simple 👍 and 👎 to the reaction options we already have. Obviously the icons already exist. Am I mis-remembering but I think this version did have an up/down option but it was removed closely after launch after some discussions about negative impacts on posts. I think the emojis were the middle ground. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeivu.3615 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 Just now, TheGrimm.5624 said: Am I mis-remembering but I think this version did have an up/down option but it was removed closely after launch after some discussions about negative impacts on posts. I think the emojis were the middle ground. I think the old forums had them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gendalfs.7521 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 Nah reactions can stay, just show user names who reacted. If one troll react to every thread with confused, then we can at least take that and move on. 2 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vavume.8065 Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 5 hours ago, StraightPath.3972 said: And emoji for that is a terrible solution as it's basically a "fling a kitten anonymously" button. It's disrespectful, confusing (as it provides no proper information on what is the point on contention), and allows trolls to hide behind a wall of silence. I would like to see them remove the anonymity, I bet 90% of the confused emoji would stop if it displayed their name. 1 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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