So, do you think Aurene will return in Episode 6: War Eternal? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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So, do you think Aurene will return in Episode 6: War Eternal?

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  • SnowHawk.3615SnowHawk.3615 Member ✭✭✭
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    its pretty transparent she gonna be like the unicorn and resurrect herself. i mean, otherwise their was no point to introduce her in the first place and get to know her only to kill her off in a very predictable way. i mean she was too lovable from the start it was a given that she was gonna die at some point.

  • Swagg.9236Swagg.9236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Leave dead the mistake.

  • flog.3485flog.3485 Member ✭✭✭
    No, she's dead and gone

    No need to resurrect aurene, we have caithe essentially replacing her as a minion.
    I will also go further and say that aurene never truly died in the same way that Mordremoth truly died once we sacrificed Trahearne because Mordremoths’ spirit was still present even though we killed him within his mind.

    All in all, we just need to make sure that Caithe never dies to ensure that Aurene is never truly gone.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    @flog.3485 said:
    No need to resurrect aurene, we have caithe essentially replacing her as a minion.
    I will also go further and say that aurene never truly died in the same way that Mordremoth truly died once we sacrificed Trahearne because Mordremoths’ spirit was still present even though we killed him within his mind.

    All in all, we just need to make sure that Caithe never dies to ensure that Aurene is never truly gone.

    If the guild chat was sincere, the devs originally planned on killing both Aurene and Caithe off in this episode but decided it would reduce the impact of Aurene's death to kill Caithe as well.

    So to me, that implies that Caithe wasn't really intended to portray that large of a role in the story moving forward. Whether they changed their minds and rewrote it so that she would be, or have plans to kill Caithe in a later episode, perhaps one involving the resurrection of Aurene, who knows.

    I would have thought Caithe's requiem story would divulge a little more detail about what Aurene told her her purpose was that she was so 'humbled' by, but they could be saving that for the actual episode. I would assume there is a reason they are saving hers for last though, so we may find out in the next couple weeks what happened during their little mindshare moment.

  • Urud.4925Urud.4925 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 15, 2019

    Can we say at least that for now the dragon family is reunited in the Mists? I'm not very familiar with that place. At least now in death, Glint, Vlast and Aurene can stay together, right? The poor siblings didn't even know each other.
    So even if she won't come back, I'm quite happy for her. They suffered enough, for us. Hmm, wait, Kralkatorrik is also in the Mists :/

    EDIT: what if we could fight Kralkatorrik in the Mists? Recently it seems there are more souls there than in Tyria.

  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    I do not know how long it will take, but I do think that Aurene needs to come back. On a meta-textual level, killing her off has been a major story buzzkill for a number of players I have talked with. As in they are not interested in playing a story where Aurene remains dead. I do suspect that they would quit the game if that remained the case. Fighting on behalf of cuteness is a strong motivator for many, and it should not be underestimated as a factor in how people engage with this game's story.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    A lot of people lose interest when their favorite character gets killed off or otherwise removed from the story. However, generally speaking, bringing that character back just to fulfill a certain size of audience at the cost of narration and the finality of removing a character via death, tends to hurt more than help.

    So if they bring back Aurene, I hope it won't just be because people love her. I'd rather they try to make a new means to captivating those people losing interest.

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  • Sir Vincent III.1286Sir Vincent III.1286 Member ✭✭✭✭
    No, she's dead and gone

    One thing is certain. Every future Aurene look at saw herself dead. She's just a marketing scheme that didn't really work.

    In the beginning...there was Tarnished Coast...

  • MithranArkanere.8957MithranArkanere.8957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    My guess is that she ascended because of her fight with the dragon, and transcended her physical form.

    Maybe the skyscale is her 'legacy' in some way.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    My guess is that she ascended because of her fight with the dragon, and transcended her physical form.

    Maybe the skyscale is her 'legacy' in some way.

    I guess another potential is that she did somehow mind meld into Caithe, and now Caithe can act as a vessel until we plant Aurene into a skyscale? I don't know. lol Was kind of hoping for another teaser of somekind today, to provide a bit more speculation. But oh well. Maybe next Tuesday.

  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    @cptaylor.2670 said:
    I guess another potential is that she did somehow mind meld into Caithe, and now Caithe can act as a vessel until we plant Aurene into a skyscale? I don't know. lol Was kind of hoping for another teaser of somekind today, to provide a bit more speculation. But oh well. Maybe next Tuesday.

    If they were originally planning on killing Caithe in Ep. 5, then that possibility seems less likely as part of the pre-planned LWS4 arc.

  • MithranArkanere.8957MithranArkanere.8957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    My guess is that she ascended because of her fight with the dragon, and transcended her physical form.

    Maybe the skyscale is her 'legacy' in some way.

    I guess another potential is that she did somehow mind meld into Caithe, and now Caithe can act as a vessel until we plant Aurene into a skyscale? I don't know. lol Was kind of hoping for another teaser of somekind today, to provide a bit more speculation. But oh well. Maybe next Tuesday.

    Caithe said that she could no longer feel her.

    When Mordremoth hid inside Trahearne he could still feel the dragon inside him. Whatever is left from Aurene doesn't seem to be in her remains, inside Caithe or anywhere else in the physical plane.

    That limits it mostly to her being sent to mists, being absorbed by Kralkatorrik, merging with the Commander and the commander being unable to feel it, or fading into nothingness.

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    My guess is that she ascended because of her fight with the dragon, and transcended her physical form.

    Maybe the skyscale is her 'legacy' in some way.

    I guess another potential is that she did somehow mind meld into Caithe, and now Caithe can act as a vessel until we plant Aurene into a skyscale? I don't know. lol Was kind of hoping for another teaser of somekind today, to provide a bit more speculation. But oh well. Maybe next Tuesday.

    Caithe said that she could no longer feel her.

    When Mordremoth hid inside Trahearne he could still feel the dragon inside him. Whatever is left from Aurene doesn't seem to be in her remains, inside Caithe or anywhere else in the physical plane.

    That limits it mostly to her being sent to mists, being absorbed by Kralkatorrik, merging with the Commander and the commander being unable to feel it, or fading into nothingness.

    Maybe because Trahearne was Mordremoth creation?
    While Caithe and Aurine just had tiny moment, Caithe couldn't even explain properly what she feels.
    There is one question left if Aurine is dead, what happened to her energy?

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  • ThatOddOne.4387ThatOddOne.4387 Member ✭✭✭
    No, she's dead and gone

    Eaten by Kralkatorrik.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    @phs.6089 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    My guess is that she ascended because of her fight with the dragon, and transcended her physical form.

    Maybe the skyscale is her 'legacy' in some way.

    I guess another potential is that she did somehow mind meld into Caithe, and now Caithe can act as a vessel until we plant Aurene into a skyscale? I don't know. lol Was kind of hoping for another teaser of somekind today, to provide a bit more speculation. But oh well. Maybe next Tuesday.

    Caithe said that she could no longer feel her.

    When Mordremoth hid inside Trahearne he could still feel the dragon inside him. Whatever is left from Aurene doesn't seem to be in her remains, inside Caithe or anywhere else in the physical plane.

    That limits it mostly to her being sent to mists, being absorbed by Kralkatorrik, merging with the Commander and the commander being unable to feel it, or fading into nothingness.

    Maybe because Trahearne was Mordremoth creation?
    While Caithe and Aurine just had tiny moment, Caithe couldn't even explain properly what she feels.
    There is one question left if Aurine is dead, what happened to her energy?

    Given that joko had a small magic bubble burst, I don’t recall seeing that with Aurene. But they conveniently structured the scene to not show that. So, it could go either way at this point. Given that Aurene had to chomp down on Joko to unbind and devour his magic, I would assume Kralk would have had to do the same with Aurene which we didn’t see happen in this episode. So he didn’t need to for whatever reason, or it’s still there and will just slowly drip out over time assuming that the vessel for it is completely dead.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @phs.6089 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    My guess is that she ascended because of her fight with the dragon, and transcended her physical form.

    Maybe the skyscale is her 'legacy' in some way.

    I guess another potential is that she did somehow mind meld into Caithe, and now Caithe can act as a vessel until we plant Aurene into a skyscale? I don't know. lol Was kind of hoping for another teaser of somekind today, to provide a bit more speculation. But oh well. Maybe next Tuesday.

    Caithe said that she could no longer feel her.

    When Mordremoth hid inside Trahearne he could still feel the dragon inside him. Whatever is left from Aurene doesn't seem to be in her remains, inside Caithe or anywhere else in the physical plane.

    That limits it mostly to her being sent to mists, being absorbed by Kralkatorrik, merging with the Commander and the commander being unable to feel it, or fading into nothingness.

    Maybe because Trahearne was Mordremoth creation?
    While Caithe and Aurine just had tiny moment, Caithe couldn't even explain properly what she feels.
    There is one question left if Aurine is dead, what happened to her energy?

    Given that joko had a small magic bubble burst, I don’t recall seeing that with Aurene. But they conveniently structured the scene to not show that. So, it could go either way at this point. Given that Aurene had to chomp down on Joko to unbind and devour his magic, I would assume Kralk would have had to do the same with Aurene which we didn’t see happen in this episode. So he didn’t need to for whatever reason, or it’s still there and will just slowly drip out over time assuming that the vessel for it is completely dead.

    Hmmm, a bite probably isn't necessary - after all, Kralk didn't bite Balthazar, Zhaitan, or Mordremoth (corpse or living). The magic just needs to be freed and accessible. With Joko, the bite would be necessary to unbind the spell that kept Joko immortal; without immortality, Aurene's magic would be free reign to take without physical contact.

    And per Zafirah's requiem, it seems Aurene's body is without any magic:

    "My god is dead. Aurene, gone. The warmth of Balthazar's spirit is now just cold, lifeless crystal. Kralkatorrik took her from me, just as his Brand will soon take this world."

    I'd assume that "the warmth of Balthazar's spirit" is a reference to the felling that Zafirah had of recognizing Balthazar's power within Aurene. Which means Balthazar's power is no longer in Aurene - safe to say, the rest of her magic is gone too.

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  • dodgerrule.8739dodgerrule.8739 Member ✭✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    She’s not dead she’s channeling magic to make it seem like she is dead via illusions while disguising herself as Kralkatorrik energy

  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    After a few offhand comments and phrasing in the Skyscale teaser, I think that Aurene is dead dead and not likely to return.

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭✭

    My question would be why new GS has such a name and why teaser they keep showing sylvari? Plenty of room to speculate but I'll juts wait for episode to be out.

    "There is always a lighthouse, there's always a man, there's always a city."

  • Fenella.2634Fenella.2634 Member ✭✭✭

    @phs.6089 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    Caithe said that she could no longer feel her.

    When Mordremoth hid inside Trahearne he could still feel the dragon inside him. Whatever is left from Aurene doesn't seem to be in her remains, inside Caithe or anywhere else in the physical plane.

    That limits it mostly to her being sent to mists, being absorbed by Kralkatorrik, merging with the Commander and the commander being unable to feel it, or fading into nothingness.

    Maybe because Trahearne was Mordremoth creation?

    I think Trahearne is a bad example. He was severely traumatized and extremely exhausted. This could have been a hallucination, really. (Well, except for the fact that he happened to be right, apparently. But still. Trauma.)
    On the other hand, all the other Sylvari - Caithe, Canach, the PC in some cases - did not hear Mordremoth anymore. So that connection was not there for all his minions.
    Also, remember the one ex-mordrem sylvari at last year's Festival of the Four Winds: He could still hear Mordremoth's voice, even after he was clearly defeated.

    So... Personally, I don't really take Trahearne's or Caithe's connection or lack thereof too seriously. Their impressions can be really unreliable.

  • derd.6413derd.6413 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    @Fenella.2634 said:
    Also, remember the one ex-mordrem sylvari at last year's Festival of the Four Winds: He could still hear Mordremoth's voice, even after he was clearly defeated.

    pretty sure that was more PTSD related

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  • Fenella.2634Fenella.2634 Member ✭✭✭

    @derd.6413 said:

    @Fenella.2634 said:
    Also, remember the one ex-mordrem sylvari at last year's Festival of the Four Winds: He could still hear Mordremoth's voice, even after he was clearly defeated.

    pretty sure that was more PTSD related

    Exactly. And that's why I also doubt Trahearne. Except, well, we saw he was right.
    However, Mordremoth's minions in general could never tell really reliably if he was still around or not. So I also doubt Caithe concerning Aurene. The storytelling could go either way from here, no matter what Caithe said.

  • Xovian.8572Xovian.8572 Member ✭✭
    edited May 4, 2019
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    The only thing i don't get from other players here is the whole "Aurene was dying over and over" that occurred in Aurene's vision/prophecy.
    That did not seem to be a loop of endless death to me, but merely different scenarios that were tried, all resulting in the same.

    -Tried by herself = failed
    -Tried with commander and friends = failed
    -Tried with Pact* aid from the ground = failed
    -Tried with Pact* aid from the sky = failed.

    All the failures shown were slightly different, but each failed and had the same final result, her death.
    So i do not think those visions were of her dying over and over, but simply the various scenarios she played out, all with the same result.
    Besides, to me, it would make more sense and is the reason for her being dispirited the way she was, cause she could see no way to over come no matter what her and the commander did.

    And at this point, her vision did indeed come true. Since we don't know what Glint told her, we don't know if there is some other plan in motion that is meant for this to "help" in some way or get things moving in the right direction.

    Edit: Pact* = not just the Pact, but all allies or various combinations there of.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 4, 2019
    Other (please explain below)

    @phs.6089 said:
    My question would be why new GS has such a name and why teaser they keep showing sylvari? Plenty of room to speculate but I'll juts wait for episode to be out.

    There's only two sylvari, technically. They used the same sylvari to show off every Mist Shard armor, which felt a bit weird. Same face, skin color, skin texture, eye color, etc. Then there was the male sylvari who showed off the greatsword, and a female human who rode the Skyscale.

    Other than those three special-made characters, they just showed some Olmakhan NPCs in the background.

    So I doubt the constant showing of sylvari matters for much.

    @Fenella.2634 said:

    @derd.6413 said:

    @Fenella.2634 said:
    Also, remember the one ex-mordrem sylvari at last year's Festival of the Four Winds: He could still hear Mordremoth's voice, even after he was clearly defeated.

    pretty sure that was more PTSD related

    Exactly. And that's why I also doubt Trahearne. Except, well, we saw he was right.
    However, Mordremoth's minions in general could never tell really reliably if he was still around or not. So I also doubt Caithe concerning Aurene. The storytelling could go either way from here, no matter what Caithe said.

    I dunno. It's one thing for PTSD to make someone think someone's still around, and another thing for someone to not feel someone else's presence in their mind at all. Like you said, most sylvari like Canach and Caithe didn't feel Mordremoth after his death, and they were right.

    While there is a margin of error for Caithe, empirical evidence would suggest that "feeling the lack of" is more reliable than "feeling the abundance of".

    On top of that, we have Zafirah's Requiem which restates that Aurene's magic is gone, and her body is a lifeless corpse, while she wept and contemplated beside it for gods know how long. If Aurene had a presence, Zafirah would also be able to sense it just as she sensed Balthazar's magic in the sword and Aurene, be it in the corpse or Caithe or something else so long as said "something else" was near Zafirah.

    @Xovian.8572 said:
    The only thing i don't get from other players here is the whole "Aurene was dying over and over" that occurred in Aurene's vision/prophecy.
    That did not seem to be a loop of endless death to me, but merely different scenarios that were tried, all resulting in the same.

    It wasn't a loop of endless deaths. People are just hoping for some 'alternative interpretation' that prophecies in myth and fiction tend to so thoroughly enjoy exploiting in an attempt to explain how Aurene can come back to life and the most direct alternative interpretation they can fathom is endless looping deaths.

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  • Nayaru.4716Nayaru.4716 Member ✭✭
    edited May 5, 2019
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    Ok so I just came back to the game after a year and I gotta say Episode 4 really pressed lots of epic buttons for me. Loved it. And having just finished "All or Nothing" I gotta say Aurene dying like that has broken my heart.

    But I'll live, as I think Aurene will, again.

    Just some theory work here and I don't know if I want to theorize exactly how it will happen but there's some important points to make.

    1) We gotta stop killing elder dragons or Tyria is screwed even if Kralky doesn't screw it.
    2) Aurene was supposed to take the place of Kralkatorrik.
    3) When an Elder dragon dies it's magic is absorbed (or adopted, unsure of correct terminology) by a surviving (the nearest?) Elder Dragon.
    4) "War Eternal" as a title for an episode might be quite telling. I am reminded of the scene in Jahai Bluffs with the endless battle between the Charr and the Orrians - so is this title a reference to the endless battles going on in the mists - also referenced by Rytlock in the mini-story. Suggesting we're going into the mists for this episode.
    5) Aurene absorbed some Balth energy and ate a powerful Lich - I theorise it's possible that although her body is dead that these energies reside with her in some form in the mists and could influence how dying or being in the mists works for her, although no idea why she'd keep, for example, balth's energy when even he didn't when he died.
    6) Glint's working her magic in the mists and might be able to pull strings for others that she can't pull for herself - ie sending Eir and Snaff through to deliver a message rather than coming through herself (maybe I missed a detail that explained why she didn't come through herself, I'm a little sleep deprived after being so engrossed in this).
    7) What are the other options? We destroy the remaining dragons before they destroy us, ruining the magical balance and causing whatever catastrophe that's going to bring, or we let the elder dragons destroy everything ... which either way seems like the end of Tyria or at least most of Tyrians. TL;DR: We need a dragon to be the elder dragon(s).

    So, Aurene's gotta come back and I guess this must have been suggested before buuuuuuuuuuuuuuut...

    Ultimately. She's going to take the place of ALL the Elder Dragons while having grown with Tyrians/mortals in her life so she won't feel compelled to be as destructive as the original Elder dragons and won't be confrontational with the Gods when they're safe enough to return. Maybe. Or maybe she's the main destructive force of GW3. chuckles

    Mainly I just needed to vent this because I'm still heart broken that she died. I thought it was very beautifully done and I very much enjoyed the story getting to this point.

    But also: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

  • Adamixos.6785Adamixos.6785 Member ✭✭
    edited May 5, 2019

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    I do however, feel that the death was a "necessity for the plan" that the Commander wasn't told about, and we'll learn this as part of the climax for Episode 6.

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  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

    Interesting spot!

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  • ThatOddOne.4387ThatOddOne.4387 Member ✭✭✭
    No, she's dead and gone

    Yeah, I've noticed that too. Still crossing my fingers for some kind of intervention from the Gods, tbh.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

    A different ascension I would assume. Since the gods didn’t know about the elder dragons, we can assume them at they weren’t required for their originally ascension unless they just became elder dragons by some anomaly. Probably a separate form of ascension for dragons that attunes them to the eternal alchemy similar to the way humans become gods or whatever.

  • ThatOddOne.4387ThatOddOne.4387 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 5, 2019
    No, she's dead and gone

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

    A different ascension I would assume. Since the gods didn’t know about the elder dragons, we can assume them at they weren’t required for their originally ascension unless they just became elder dragons by some anomaly. Probably a separate form of ascension for dragons that attunes them to the eternal alchemy similar to the way humans become gods or whatever.

    The Gods did know about the Elder Dragons, and Glint did seem to believe that the Gods had plans (With the Forgotten) that she was not privy to, in relation to the Elder Dragon situation.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

    You're assuming that the ascension that Glint mentioned is the same as Ascension via Augury Rock.

    But then again, there's also comments suggesting that Ascension had nothing to do with the Six Gods, but Glint and dragons. Which isn't unreasonable to believe, after all Weh no Su was also a form of Ascension and it was unrelated to the gods but rather to Celestials.

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

    A different ascension I would assume. Since the gods didn’t know about the elder dragons, we can assume them at they weren’t required for their originally ascension unless they just became elder dragons by some anomaly. Probably a separate form of ascension for dragons that attunes them to the eternal alchemy similar to the way humans become gods or whatever.

    Minor correction: the Six didn't know about the Elder Dragons upon arrival on Tyria. But they did learn of the Elder Dragons eventually, and fairly early on - one of the Priory's leading sources of knowledge on the Elder Dragons post-Personal Story is the Tome of the Five True Gods (presumably the book recovered in Forgotten path - if that tome wasn't Fire of the Gods), which is a tome written when humanity was still new on Tyria (unclear if continent or world).

    That said, we know that the Elder Dragons predate the Six Gods, so their becoming Elder Dragons (if not born/created as such) wouldn't be tied to the Six.

    Similarly, we know of another form of Ascension completely unrelated to the Six Gods (Weh no Su) as mentioned above.

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  • ChronoPinoyX.7923ChronoPinoyX.7923 Member ✭✭✭

    They'll bring her back, all that character building has to go somewhere. Question right now is when.

    They'll either bring her back in War Eternal which is what most of us are expecting a la absorbing Kralkatorrik's power when it dies, or they can proceed with the next LWS Season which works toward Aurene's resurrection and ascension to Elder Dragon.

  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    Given further reflection, Echo Glint's unseen sidebar with Aurene about Ascension is incredibly odd in the context of Path of Fire's background lore. Scattered throughout the PoF zones, particularly in the lore book collections and Elon Riverlands Augury Rock event chain, we are repeatedly told that Ascension became impossible due to the absence of the Six Gods. No gods? No Ascension. So why would Echo Glint even need to tell Aurene anything about Ascension?

    You're assuming that the ascension that Glint mentioned is the same as Ascension via Augury Rock.

    But then again, there's also comments suggesting that Ascension had nothing to do with the Six Gods, but Glint and dragons. Which isn't unreasonable to believe, after all Weh no Su was also a form of Ascension and it was unrelated to the gods but rather to Celestials.

    True that I am making this assumption, though I am not sure what connections Ascension has to the dragons apart from Glint. Most of what we have heard about Ascension seems to indicate that it is no longer possibly due to the absence of the gods, which we hear from multiple sources and scholars. And it would seem odd that Glint would talk about any other form of Ascension than the form she has the greatest amount of lore connections to. It's not as if Glint told Aurene, "Aurene come with me so I can tell you about Weh no Su."

    I'm not sure if I would call Weh no Su just another form of Ascension. Weh no Su was really just a game mechanic meant to unlock the Realm of the Gods for characters playing the Factions campaign similar to how players of Nightfall just had to complete the Hunted! quest. This was necessary since Factions and Nightfall could be played as standalone games. I guess finding Sunspear Sanctuary is the same as Ascension? Thankfully Aurene did that too. ;)

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 6, 2019

    @Genesis.8572 said:

    I'm not sure if I would call Weh no Su just another form of Ascension. Weh no Su was really just a game mechanic meant to unlock the Realm of the Gods for characters playing the Factions campaign similar to how players of Nightfall just had to complete the Hunted! quest. This was necessary since Factions and Nightfall could be played as standalone games. I guess finding Sunspear Sanctuary is the same as Ascension? Thankfully Aurene did that too. ;)

    I agree with your other point, but Weh no Su was referred to as Ascension in places ("...one of the first Canthan heroes to become Closer to the Stars [what in Tyria is referred to as 'ascension']...") and it has the same principle effect of allowing our characters to see otherwise invisible entities with Mists connections. Regardless of whether they actually are the same thing or not, and I have my doubts, there are more parallels between them than just arbitrary gating of Underworld content.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • Aaralyna.3104Aaralyna.3104 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If not mistaken both Glint and Vlast shattered into crystals when they died. Aurene didn't shatter into crystals. Her body remains spiked on some branded spikes. Only because of this I think she will be back in some way.

  • ChronoPinoyX.7923ChronoPinoyX.7923 Member ✭✭✭

    @Genesis.8572 said:
    I'm not sure if I would call Weh no Su just another form of Ascension. Weh no Su was really just a game mechanic meant to unlock the Realm of the Gods for characters playing the Factions campaign similar to how players of Nightfall just had to complete the Hunted! quest. This was necessary since Factions and Nightfall could be played as standalone games. I guess finding Sunspear Sanctuary is the same as Ascension?

    Ascension and Weh No Su had importance in the narrative whereas Hunted! was indeed just built for mechanical reasons. Ascension and Weh no Su allowed one to see beings which were normally unseen, meaning they fit the narrative in both scenarios of being able to see the unseen. And each one was achieved by fulfilling trials which would otherwise be impossible for one who hasn't prepared for the trials. They also both have connections in regards to The Mists outside of content gating which was the Gift of True Sight. True Sight basically allows anyone to see beings that phase in between realities. Both Mursaat and Shiro (who was an Envoy of the Mists) phased in and out of reality (Mursaats went into this so called "half-world", might be Edge of the Mists, and Shiro phased between reality and The Mists) and was considered unseen until either Ascension or Weh no Su was achieved. It also allowed them passage to The Mists without a need for a portal between realities as the avatar of the Gods gave them that passage, something a normal person wouldn't be given (hence why Temple of the Ages outpost is accessible but you couldn't go to FOW or Underworld unless you were Ascended/Weh no Su).

    As for Nightfall, Nightfall followed a story of a hero that didn't need to Ascend in any way, shape or form so ANet had to build that system for the sake of content gating without fitting narrative, hence Hunted! becoming the mission to allow Ascension content. In terms of Nightfall narrative, the Ascension was outright removed because the hero didn't need the Gift of True Sight nor did they access The Mists via the Avatars. Instead, they accessed The Mists via a portal between realities (the same way the Commander did in order to speak to Kormir and lure Kralkatorrik) meaning Ascension is basically negated in terms of usage. Alongside this, they became "pseudo ascended" during the Gates of Madness since they were blessed by The Gods via their Avatar (Lyssa's muse outright says "The Divinity is within you. And so we give you our blessing."). And if they were from Tyria/Cantha in origin, they were already Ascended to begin with so regardless of what happens during Nightfall, Ascension was not needed in the narrative.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    @Aaralyna.3104 said:
    If not mistaken both Glint and Vlast shattered into crystals when they died. Aurene didn't shatter into crystals. Her body remains spiked on some branded spikes. Only because of this I think she will be back in some way.

    Glint did not shatter. Her corpse was even showcased in the beginning of her lair (where we found Aurene) in All or Nothing.

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  • Rico.6873Rico.6873 Member ✭✭✭
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    Her soul is in Krak now
    And she will blast his mind into SPACE!
    AND RULE THE WORLD WITH US AS HER JESTER!!!
    LAUGHS EVILLY

  • Thornwolf.9721Thornwolf.9721 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection
    1. I believe she needed to "Die" to grow so to speak; Her form perhaps was at a limit and within the mist between the semi-god magic and the lich within her Im sure she will reform and shares the immortality of joko. Perhaps even this was needed to make her immune to Kralk's branding and makes her almost the foil to his entire plan; Which might of been what glint shared. "The secrets to ascending"
    • She has another sibling in the deep roads with the dwarves fighting destroyers; It's very possible this sibling is alive and felt her death and as it was already the same size as her brother who was killed by balth at that time 250 years ago Im sure he/she is massive now. This could be one who intended on taking down Primodius and taking his place but turns to kralk to avenge their family; As now it might be that this one is the last and feels that it falls to them to take down grand-papi.
    1. She doesn't come back and we find an alternative route; Could be that the gods step in and come back to help us as now this is an inter-dimensional issue and they find a way to fix this mess before it goes further. (Most unlikely but still there.)
    • We Find a way to make Kralk go to sleep, and just call it good because why not?
    1. She comes back, via Some unknown reason or logic in lore we don't know. Truthfully we don't know what happens when a dragon dies and aurene is not like her mother she is far further along and tied to tyria. We don't know if she is for sure dead either she might be in some other state of being where she is distant from us, sealed if you will in the branded stuff impaling her and left there. Could be taimi finds this somehow and we go into the mists to find out how to save her; We destroy glint's soul and thus make something capable of it and release her and she absorbs the last of her mother finally growing into her own and becoming truly powerful.
    • We use the infinity stones.
  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    @Thornwolf.9721 said:

    • She has another sibling in the deep roads with the dwarves fighting destroyers; It's very possible this sibling is alive and felt her death and as it was already the same size as her brother who was killed by balth at that time 250 years ago Im sure he/she is massive now. This could be one who intended on taking down Primodius and taking his place but turns to kralk to avenge their family; As now it might be that this one is the last and feels that it falls to them to take down grand-papi.

    If you're talking about the Baby Dragon from the Glint's Challenge in GW1, that was Vlast. Only two of Glint's eggs ever hatched - Vlast and Aurene - and Aurene's egg was the last egg intact.

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  • Ranael.6423Ranael.6423 Member ✭✭
    Other (please explain below)

    I am puzzled by the fact that Kralk did not brand Aurene... she would have been a very strong ally for him. Also something that I do not understand correctly: Aurene and Kralk share the same "crystalline vibration" and using branded crystals to kill her, means he used his own weakness...which should have killed him.

    Right now I wonder if Aurene could not have become a "parasite" in Kralk. Her last shot could have been a way to "transfer" into the Elder dragon and once this latter will be weak enough, she will gain control of it, "Blue-branded" from the inside. She has some mind abilities (maybe more than Kralk since she was one of the first target of Mordremoth's lost power) which could help her and some unknown magic from Joko that Kralk did not touch yet which are death related.
    What if her mind would be in Kralk's broken/half-branded eye waiting the right time to invade the host?

  • Zalani.9827Zalani.9827 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 9, 2019
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    I like the idea of Aurene returning,but not fully alive. She returns to take kralks place so that the magic doesnt blow everything up but needs to return to the mists as it needs fixing after the damage kralk did. Unless she somehow gets a new body she’s effectively dead to Tyria with the state the old one is in.
    I mean we are seeing ghosts popping up and now branded areas of the mists in world events ripping into tyria, bad stuff is happening there. Not to mention the mists is important for Tyria, it needs to be protected too.

    Mostly just theory crafting for fun,but I do want to see Aurenes story conclude finally. It has been running for years now and I think a completely new story arc would be good for us.

    Jadis Narnia, Sylvari Ranger of [VoS]

    Praise Joko!

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 9, 2019
    Other (please explain below)

    @Ranael.6423 said:
    Also something that I do not understand correctly: Aurene and Kralk share the same "crystalline vibration" and using branded crystals to kill her, means he used his own weakness...which should have killed him.

    By that argument, the moment he ever corrupts something he would be killing himself. The main thing is that he's not affecting himself with his branding. On top of that, it being a weakness does not make it immediately fatal by mere proximity, nor does it make it the sole way to be killed.

    The unique weaknesses - for Zhaitan and Mordremoth at least - have been methods of making them vulnerable, not killing them outright.

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  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The new trailer is out by the way. Episode drops next week

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • EdwinLi.1284EdwinLi.1284 Member ✭✭✭

    I think this will be a Yes and No answer.

    Yes, I expect ehr to return now we see the trailer but as a Ghost Dragon like her mother Glint for the final battle against Kralk since she learned that the only way for her to be strong enough is to die and become a Ghost Dragon.

    No, I do not expect her to stay after this episode as this will be her final moment since as a Ghost Dragon she has to return to the Mist but the story ends with us knowing that Aurene can be with her Family in the Mist after she finally complete her mission to kill Kralk and we say our final goodbye.

  • Tails.9372Tails.9372 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, I think we will have a full resurrection

    "Joko magic"

  • Blocki.4931Blocki.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Absolute mad lads

    I rather choose death.

  • Stalkingwolf.6035Stalkingwolf.6035 Member ✭✭✭
    Sorta (will come back but stuck in the Mists / will be a ghost / etc)

    thats too easy.

    He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well they completely disrespected their own story and lore in one foul swoop in the first instance. I genuinely believed they wouldn't go this route since it flew in the face of logic. An entire episode rendered meaningless in less than 2 minutes.

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .