Is Soulbeast the new DH? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Is Soulbeast the new DH?

witcher.3197witcher.3197 Member ✭✭✭✭

A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

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Comments

  • Cyric.7813Cyric.7813 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    cooldown already.. these themes are almost boring

  • bOTEB.1573bOTEB.1573 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I keep saying this. SLB is extremely easy to deal with if you avoid his 3 skills. Yes he can deal good burst damage but this is the only viable thing in this spec. And when someone can avoid it, either by LOS, dodge, block, interupt, stun, daze, knockdown, the SLB is super easy target. Good players deal with it super easy which makes it a l2p issue, and only this. Until ANET buff the dmg sustain of SLB, it won't find good spot in competitive matches.

    Wishlist:
    Everything that kills me should be nerfed
    Remove all time gates - I play more than some people yet I receive the same rewards per day/week (PvP/WvW tickets etc)
    ANET developments/events and everything else should be in a schedule with the time I play

  • Tayga.3192Tayga.3192 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    To be honest, any ranger using longbow can be easily dealt with by not letting them kite all day. If anything, other ranger weapons are too strong (except offhand dagger and shortbow), especially greatsword. Pets still need their passive cc removed. Compensate by buffing core pets.

  • DanAlcedo.3281DanAlcedo.3281 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    Its doesnt matter where it is OP.
    If it is a problem then it needs to be fixed.

    „Get good“ does not solve the problem because even if a person climbs the ladder, the number of people in each devision stays the same.

    The highest number of players are in silver/gold.
    This will never change.

    A problem there effects the highest number of players and therefor has highest priority of fixing.

  • shortly: Soulbeast outclass DH as a roamer.
    I won´t go too deep at the materia, cause it would take a lot of time. but here a little input:

    DH is good at:

    • "Zoning" (means controll the position of players esp if they got no stabi)
    • it has the second strongest duell build (the best still FB if you dont play him full support)
    • he has normally all his defences that can be used for his team too (if not get fokused). means at least little more support then most roamers

    His buildoptions are (that are efficiency enough):

    • burst
    • full trap (works till p1. Most players over p1 can handle that)
    • Full tank/duellist

    Soulbeast is good at:

    • unblock (what btw. means aegis get´s lost without any effects, like heal after block and so on^^)
    • he is one of the best roamers for duo point (cause his burst, mobillity, duell potential, sustain are at all high. For a 3 Point roamer, he has not enouth support options for his team, esp for helping on downstate fights, disengages)

    his Buildoptions are (that are efficiency enough):

    • roamer (basic lb builds)
    • burst (axe for teamfights or more yolo lb)
    • hybrid
    • full duellist

    thats why Soulbeast outclass DH on:

    • roaming
    • duelling vs most classes (if DH dont play a full duell build, but then he is slow and has less impact at the match)

    DH has only a better 1v1 situation against mesmers, cause of "Test of Faith" + "Spear of Justice" with his standard roam build.

    So, burst gets outclassed by soulbeast and tank/duellist by FB (or faster duellists cause you need to be the better rotader then) and the yolo-trapper by DE, FA-ele, Powermes if we look at pvp... on wvw, well you got the easiest afk farm build :)

    Maybe someday he will be used on teamfights, cause if a necro corrupt boons and dh hold enermies on your aoes, this gona hurt...

  • beatthedown.2651beatthedown.2651 Member ✭✭✭

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    Soulbeast is quite okay, even in high tier. But the Sic em build ppl are complaining about isn't even that good.

  • @DanAlcedo.3281 said:
    Its doesnt matter where it is OP.
    If it is a problem then it needs to be fixed.

    „Get good“ does not solve the problem because even if a person climbs the ladder, the number of people in each devision stays the same.

    The highest number of players are in silver/gold.
    This will never change.

    A problem there effects the highest number of players and therefor has highest priority of fixing.

    So the game should be balanced around the least competitive part of the community? In a (supposedly) competitive game mode?

  • @DanAlcedo.3281 said:

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:

    @DanAlcedo.3281 said:
    Its doesnt matter where it is OP.
    If it is a problem then it needs to be fixed.

    „Get good“ does not solve the problem because even if a person climbs the ladder, the number of people in each devision stays the same.

    The highest number of players are in silver/gold.
    This will never change.

    A problem there effects the highest number of players and therefor has highest priority of fixing.

    So the game should be balanced around the least competitive part of the community? In a (supposedly) competitive game mode?

    Every gamemode needs to be first Fun and second competitive.

    The Fun part brings growth and the competitve part brings consistency.

    If the Gamemode is not Fun for the majority of players ( silver/gold) it will simply not grow.

    Getting new player in it has priority over everything else.

    What you want it making the gamemode better for people already playing it.

    What is ofc good but doing it only for them will kill the gamemode in the long run.

    Like, I agree with your sentiment, 'course it should be fun. I have an issue with strong builds if they're very unintuitive to play with/against aswell, and while it may seem paradoxical, I just don't think you should balance around the lower levels of competition just because at that skill level they need less skill-dependant ways of dealing with an un-enjoyable mechanic/group of mechanics.

  • Vithzerai.3291Vithzerai.3291 Member ✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:
    So the game should be balanced around the least competitive part of the community? In a (supposedly) competitive game mode?

    it should be balanced around balance. one shots aren't balanced.

    Cmon, don't be flippant, it's not a one-shot. (And if it ever is there are prerequisites that have to be met for it to be even remotely close to a one-shot, and it's not just pressing 2 buttons like everyone would have you believe.)
    Mesmer's have a more prominent 'One-shot' potential, and they sure as hell don't need a nerf. Anytime I've been one-shotted by a Mesmer, it's been 100% my own issue, I wasn't aware enough, I didn't manage my cooldowns well enough, or they simply waited for the right opportunity. Why is Soulbeast any different.
    I'm starting to get a little irate with this argument of "You have to use your resources to stop the Soulbeast burst and that's unfair." As opposed to the fact that you don't when a warrior rushes you down, or any other dps class for that matter? If you're complaining that without a stunbreak/endurance for a dodge or stab that a Soulbeast can tear you apart in a couple of seconds, so can a Rev/Necro/Thief - etc. I suspect the issue is most people don't like the distance a Ranger can do it from, but almost every other class has access to ports, so their 'functional' distance is probably about the same.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:
    Cmon, don't be flippant, it's not a one-shot.

    you are either unaware or purposely being deceptive of the situation. there are one shots from stealth, and one shots from 2k range.

    you don't know till you know, ya know.

  • Vithzerai.3291Vithzerai.3291 Member ✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:
    Cmon, don't be flippant, it's not a one-shot.

    you are either unaware or purposely being deceptive of the situation. there are one shots from stealth, and one shots from 2k range.

    What is the one-shot you're perceiving, -exactly-? And in what scenario?

  • kin korn karn.9023kin korn karn.9023 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:
    Cmon, don't be flippant, it's not a one-shot.

    you are either unaware or purposely being deceptive of the situation. there are one shots from stealth, and one shots from 2k range.

    What is the one-shot you're perceiving, -exactly-? And in what scenario?

    I think he's talking about a meme glass cannon variant (there are screenshots in one of these threads) and pretending that's the meta.

  • Erzian.5218Erzian.5218 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:
    I have an issue with strong builds if they're very unintuitive to play with/against aswell, and while it may seem paradoxical, I just don't think you should balance around the lower levels of competition just because at that skill level they need less skill-dependant ways of dealing with an un-enjoyable mechanic/group of mechanics.

    You shouldn't balance around mediocre players but you should design around them if that makes sense. If certain classes/mechanics are very unfun at the level where the majority of players is at, then something should be changed (e.g. dh, turret engi and other "pet builds"). However, other aspects should be brought up so that the specialization stays viable at higher levels (which is where they often fail, e.g. dh).

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    This is absolutely false. Soul beast is fully viable at higher ranks, with multiple viable setups. As other notes there are several soul beast players in the top 100, and it does see play in AT as well (but not as popular).

    And regardless the design that allows damage of 30k in under 3 secs needs to go.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @kin korn karn.9023 said:
    I think he's talking about a meme glass cannon variant (there are screenshots in one of these threads) and pretending that's the meta.

    no, i'm not pretending that's the meta, i'm also not pretending anything like that is acceptable.

    you don't know till you know, ya know.

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    Interesting.
    That's the same excuse defense Mirage mains made.

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:
    I'm starting to get a little irate with this argument of "You have to use your resources to stop the Soulbeast burst and that's unfair."

    Interesting.
    That's the same excuse defense Warrior mains made when Zerker got reworked.

    Don't mind me. Just-

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:

    Cmon, don't be flippant, it's not a one-shot. (And if it ever is there are prerequisites that have to be met for it to be even remotely close to a one-shot, and it's not just pressing 2 buttons like everyone would have you believe.)

    coughs in deadeye main

    If it does significant amounts of potentially untelegraphed damage, or allows you to outheal focused dps indefinitely without having to disengage from a point, it needs to go apparently. Powermes burst next.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • EnderzShadow.2506EnderzShadow.2506 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    @dronte.3416 said:

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    Quite a few people play soulbeast in top100 EU.. Obviously for AT-s, it's less efficient

    what do you mean by 'quite a few'?

    There are a 'number' of highly skilled Rangers in top tier play.
    But they do not have N E A R L Y the representation other classes have because they aren't facerolly spam classes
    a part of the meta.

    Come on over to the Ranger forums if you'd like a civil conversation

    @otto.5684 said:

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    This is absolutely false. Soul beast is fully viable at higher ranks, with multiple viable setups. As other notes there are several soul beast players in the top 100, and it does see play in AT as well (but not as popular).

    And regardless the design that allows damage of 30k in under 3 secs needs to go.

    There are all kinds of 'cheese' in this game. And most of it is meta. Most of it, no one talks about.
    Dinna fasch yerself. It's a shame you and 'Ben' aren't besties.
    You could convince him to buff mesmer, warrior, necro, scrapper and nerf Soulbeast so you can really ham it up in silver.

    mhm, ok, sure, whatever you say, no after you, I insist, no really, please, be my guest,

  • Megametzler.5729Megametzler.5729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    First: Sic' em! soulbeast is not OP indeed. It's kind of viable, like ele builds, but it gets hardcountered by some very dominant classes currently.

    Also, the problem is not the Sic' em! burst. It is the burst from extreme range and high mobility to disengage. The same was kind of valid for DE: You saw the burst, you dodged it, turned around - and the enemy is 1200+ far away (or stealthing for 10 seconds). Now there are some classes who can deal with this (thief, rev, mesmers) using ports, being quick and stuff. Others have basically no means to punish someone who just completely failed their burst. I am mainly speaking as an ele player here.

    This is why ranged burst is kind of problematic. Power mesmers, revs and thieves usually have to go into close combat for a full burst. Other classes have a medium range like FA ele. And then there are some classes who can fail their burst, turn around and literally walk away.

    That is not OP - especially not in times of the aforementioned strong counters -, but it is extremely frustrating for certain classes and compositions. This is why the build can work in ranked, but certainly not in mATs.

    I want to mention though: In times of insane AoE pressure (Scourge, Spellbreaker, Yolosmith), burst from close up has become a magnitude more risky than during core and even HoT. This is why thief has such a hard time, for example, getting eaten by randomly spammed AoEs. And it can make ranged burst necessary - it is a kind of powercreep, high close range AoE needs ranged burst as a means of applying burst at all. They should change both, or certain specs will counter others so hard they become unplayable (the condition/cleansing powercreep is exactly the same issue).

  • Solori.6025Solori.6025 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:

    @DanAlcedo.3281 said:

    @Vithzerai.3291 said:

    @DanAlcedo.3281 said:
    Its doesnt matter where it is OP.
    If it is a problem then it needs to be fixed.

    „Get good“ does not solve the problem because even if a person climbs the ladder, the number of people in each devision stays the same.

    The highest number of players are in silver/gold.
    This will never change.

    A problem there effects the highest number of players and therefor has highest priority of fixing.

    So the game should be balanced around the least competitive part of the community? In a (supposedly) competitive game mode?

    Every gamemode needs to be first Fun and second competitive.

    The Fun part brings growth and the competitve part brings consistency.

    If the Gamemode is not Fun for the majority of players ( silver/gold) it will simply not grow.

    Getting new player in it has priority over everything else.

    What you want it making the gamemode better for people already playing it.

    What is ofc good but doing it only for them will kill the gamemode in the long run.

    Like, I agree with your sentiment, 'course it should be fun. I have an issue with strong builds if they're very unintuitive to play with/against aswell, and while it may seem paradoxical, I just don't think you should balance around the lower levels of competition just because at that skill level they need less skill-dependant ways of dealing with an un-enjoyable mechanic/group of mechanics.

    ...Thats the way the community wants things balanced though. As was seen by a year worth of nerf threads for mesmer. That's how Anet has been balancing, and I dont see them stopping because people want them to think about their choices or admit they made a mistake and revise those.

    Tingle my stingleberry

  • KelyNeli.4516KelyNeli.4516 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 20, 2019

    @bOTEB.1573 said:
    I keep saying this. SLB is extremely easy to deal with if you avoid his 3 skills. Yes he can deal good burst damage but this is the only viable thing in this spec. And when someone can avoid it, either by LOS, dodge, block, interupt, stun, daze, knockdown, the SLB is super easy target. Good players deal with it super easy which makes it a l2p issue, and only this. Until ANET buff the dmg sustain of SLB, it won't find good spot in competitive matches.

    Replace SLB with Berserker, and "3 skills" with "1 skill"
    The difference is, the second one got nerfed back into the oblivion and garbage state few weeks after the rework, and other one did not.

  • bOTEB.1573bOTEB.1573 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:

    @bOTEB.1573 said:
    I keep saying this. SLB is extremely easy to deal with if you avoid his 3 skills. Yes he can deal good burst damage but this is the only viable thing in this spec. And when someone can avoid it, either by LOS, dodge, block, interupt, stun, daze, knockdown, the SLB is super easy target. Good players deal with it super easy which makes it a l2p issue, and only this. Until ANET buff the dmg sustain of SLB, it won't find good spot in competitive matches.

    Replace SLB with Berserker, and "3 skills" with "1 skill"
    The difference is, the second one got nerfed back into the oblivion and garbage state few weeks after the rework, and other one did not.

    20% dmg nerf of a skill that was dealing 3 times more dmg than the SLB. Still, berserker deals far too much dmg

    Wishlist:
    Everything that kills me should be nerfed
    Remove all time gates - I play more than some people yet I receive the same rewards per day/week (PvP/WvW tickets etc)
    ANET developments/events and everything else should be in a schedule with the time I play

  • KelyNeli.4516KelyNeli.4516 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    @bOTEB.1573 said:

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:

    @bOTEB.1573 said:
    I keep saying this. SLB is extremely easy to deal with if you avoid his 3 skills. Yes he can deal good burst damage but this is the only viable thing in this spec. And when someone can avoid it, either by LOS, dodge, block, interupt, stun, daze, knockdown, the SLB is super easy target. Good players deal with it super easy which makes it a l2p issue, and only this. Until ANET buff the dmg sustain of SLB, it won't find good spot in competitive matches.

    Replace SLB with Berserker, and "3 skills" with "1 skill"
    The difference is, the second one got nerfed back into the oblivion and garbage state few weeks after the rework, and other one did not.

    20% dmg nerf of a skill that was dealing 3 times more dmg than the SLB. Still, berserker deals far too much dmg

    Too much damage if you use only awsd keys and click spells with mouse button.
    Soulbeast preparing his burst could cast spells into the air and burst down someone from the range dealing about 20-30 k damage in one second.
    Berserker loses 21% if he will miss berserker mode activation damage by not being in melee range during activation, and basically any class with TP and stun break could make his burst absolutely useless and once they dodge it berserker is a sitting duck without anything else, casting signet, berserker mode and arc divider takes 2.25 seconds, where it is way harder to dodge soul beast arrows burst, and even if you do somehow survive it, he could still burst you down with something else.
    You could dig a hole with a stick, but shovel is better at it, deal with it.

  • mrauls.6519mrauls.6519 Member ✭✭✭

    Buff DH please

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    Buff DH please

    please don't

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

  • bladezero.9470bladezero.9470 Member ✭✭✭

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    Buff DH please

    Please do! DH is fully meme tier now.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    So like Mirage 2 nerfs ago?

    Take a guess where this is headed. Can't say I feel sorry for anyone on the spvp boards. What goes around comes around, and excessive whining with subsequent nerfs will affect every class.

    Just seems to be the engineers, rangers and warriors turn once again. Don't worry, once those classes are nerfed, the complaints will move on to the next fotm class and the cycle continues.

  • praqtos.9035praqtos.9035 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Cyninja.2954 said:

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    So like Mirage 2 nerfs ago?

    Take a guess where this is headed. Can't say I feel sorry for anyone on the spvp boards. What goes around comes around, and excessive whining with subsequent nerfs will affect every class.

    Just seems to be the engineers, rangers and warriors turn once again. Don't worry, once those classes are nerfed, the complaints will move on to the next fotm class and the cycle continues.

    Warrior/engi avoid getting deserved nerfs for how long ? In fact they buff holo last 2 patches, seems like the most favorite Anet child with all this attention/buffs all around

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    most favorite Anet child

    Hey.

    Hey.

    How about let's not use "anet's favorite child" for everything that happens to be strong at the moment. Every class in this game, with the exception of mesmer, has spent significant time in E tier, with their builds fully unviable for pvp play of any kind. Further, the two class specs you mentioned just climbed out of the unviable pit.

    That's mesmer's title, thank ye. We can punt that title around when/if they sink below B tier competitively.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @bladezero.9470 said:

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    Buff DH please

    Please do! DH is fully meme tier

    If it’s the bow that gets buffed that would be nice.

  • praqtos.9035praqtos.9035 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    most favorite Anet child

    Hey.

    Hey.

    How about let's not use "anet's favorite child" for everything that happens to be strong at the moment. Every class in this game, with the exception of mesmer, has spent significant time in E tier, with their builds fully unviable for pvp play of any kind. Further, the two class specs you mentioned just climbed out of the unviable pit.

    As if they ever been in UNVIABLE PIT

    That's mesmer's title, thank ye. We can punt that title around when/if they sink below B tier competitively.

    Highly doubt you can call something "favorite child" after seeing over 70% nerfs all around unless you are memeing

  • coro.3176coro.3176 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @viquing.8254 said:

    @bOTEB.1573 said:
    I keep saying this. SLB is extremely easy to deal with if you avoid his 3 skills. Yes he can deal good burst damage but this is the only viable thing in this spec. And when someone can avoid it, either by LOS, dodge, block, interupt, stun, daze, knockdown, the SLB is super easy target. Good players deal with it super easy which makes it a l2p issue, and only this. Until ANET buff the dmg sustain of SLB, it won't find good spot in competitive matches.

    Sorry but : only dodge or immune work as a counter :

    • 50% LoS work because he can teleport with smoke skill. And have a good superspeed uptime during burst.
    • Block didn't work because unblocable.
    • Stun,daze, knock didn't work because stab.
    • Stealth didn't work because reveal.

    Not even saying that you eat CC during his burst.
    Not saying it's op or not but there is very few ways to counter a soulbeast burst.

    You need to burn 2 dodges or a hard invuln. If you try anything else, there's a decent chance you're dead before you realize you picked the wrong option.

    • As noted, LoS is very situational, and a lot of times you'll be in the middle of a point with nothing around and by the time you make it to a corner to LoS, you'll be dead.
    • You can see SotP activate and the stability on their bar, so you know not to try an interrupt then, but you can't see Shared Anguish. If you haven't seen them use it already, you just have to assume it's up. Thus, you can't rely on hard CC.
    • You can see some of the unblockable effects, but only if you were watching/targeting the SB the whole time, and if you were, you probably have enough time to (double) dodge the burst. More often, the pew pew comes from outside your field of vision so you react with a reflexive block or projectile bubble only to find out the burst had one of SB's 2 short-cooldown unblockables on it. You can't tell from the attacks alone. You have to just assume it's unblockable.
    • Can't rely on stealth obviously because of Sic Em
  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    As if they ever been in UNVIABLE PIT

    Yeah. Berserker and Scrapper were both unviable for significant periods of time.

    Highly doubt you can call something "favorite child" after seeing over 70% nerfs all around unless you are memeing

    Sure can, every denomination of Mes specialization is still viable even -after- the nerfs. It surely wasn't a 70% nerf all around, but if you can hit a class that hard over time and it can still do its matchups properly, it was heavily overtuned. It's only recently that Arenanet seems to be considering "maybe don't bust mesmer or its specs" as a balance recourse.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • praqtos.9035praqtos.9035 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    As if they ever been in UNVIABLE PIT

    Yeah. Berserker and Scrapper were both unviable for significant periods of time.

    Does it mean class itself was unviable and had no options? Ele was like that, these 2 are not

    Highly doubt you can call something "favorite child" after seeing over 70% nerfs all around unless you are memeing

    Sure can, every denomination of Mes specialization is still viable even -after- the nerfs. It surely wasn't a 70% nerf all around, but if you can hit a class that hard over time and it can still do its matchups properly, it was heavily overtuned. It's only recently that Arenanet seems to be considering "maybe don't bust mesmer or its specs" as a balance recourse.

    What matchups ? Doesnt matter what spec you do play on mesmer you are literally worse than any class at any job you spec for. Even at forum all "reee mesmer" threads doesnt exist anymore. Just as thier presence at ranked/AT's
    Indeed 75% cd increase was on ambush for mirage, and like over 200% icd increase on the mirror, and 67% on axe ambush. Blind trait was just deleted(only god know why)
    Otherwise its solid 50% at A LOT of stuff, including core weapons ((((If you want to talk about it either privately or drop it, as thread is not about it))))

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 21, 2019

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    Does it mean class itself was unviable and had no options? Ele was like that, these 2 are not

    That's not what I said. Spellbreaker and Holo both need tuning, but the other specs underneath those classes were significantly underpowered. All I'm saying is that those classes have had enough hits over time to be disqualified as 'favored'.

    Even at forum all "reee mesmer" threads doesnt exist anymore-

    Because they recently got balanced. That doesn't mean they became unviable.

    That being said-

    ((((If you want to talk about it either privately or drop it, as thread is not about it))))

    It was a joke moreso than a serious jab or an invitation to discussion. As you said, this is about SB~

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • praqtos.9035praqtos.9035 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    Does it mean class itself was unviable and had no options? Ele was like that, these 2 are not

    That's not what I said. Spellbreaker and Holo both need tuning, but the other specs underneath those classes were significantly underpowered. All I'm saying is that those classes have had enough hits over time to be disqualified as 'favored'.

    "Their specs were made worse to sell the coming expansion but still always had an overtuned spec,thus, disqualify them from being favored".

    Even at forum all "reee mesmer" threads doesnt exist anymore-

    Because they recently got balanced. That doesn't mean they became unviable.

    Not sure if joking

    ((((If you want to talk about it either privately or drop it, as thread is not about it))))

    It was a joke

    Thats what I think about your posts ¯_(ツ)_/¯

  • @praqtos.9035 said:
    Not sure if joking

    Not actually joking on this one.

    @praqtos.9035 said:
    That's what I think about your posts ¯_(ツ)_/¯

    Thank you, Thank you. I'll be here all week, remember to smash that like button and follow me on the twitter.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • Solori.6025Solori.6025 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Cyninja.2954 said:

    @witcher.3197 said:
    A trivial thing that nobody plays at high tier games, but all the silver 2 players are flooding the forums crying for it to be nerfed.

    So like Mirage 2 nerfs ago?

    Take a guess where this is headed. Can't say I feel sorry for anyone on the spvp boards. What goes around comes around, and excessive whining with subsequent nerfs will affect every class.

    Just seems to be the engineers, rangers and warriors turn once again. Don't worry, once those classes are nerfed, the complaints will move on to the next fotm class and the cycle continues.

    Careful. You might come across as " bitter" and " wanting everyone else to suffer"

    Tingle my stingleberry

  • Engal.6359Engal.6359 Member ✭✭

    I started playing soul beast last week (I'm plat 1/2) and have been loving it. That said, it's far from "OP". Yes, there are cheesy 1shot builds, but that is literally every class in the game. If that's your rational for it needing nerfs, then so does rifle war, hammer guard, herald (tho rev is actually OP), daredevil, core thief, dead eye, rifle engi, FA ele, power mesmer, reaper, do I really need to elaborate? Yes WWP + sic 'em zerker ranger is cheesy AF but that's not unique and not a problem. I don't get the calls for nerfed to all the "OP soulbeasts" that are ruining ranked. If there is such a build, I would love to know what it is xD. I'm not even a ranger main, but this is dumb.

  • rbbthole.9074rbbthole.9074 Member ✭✭

    @xp eke xp.6724 said:

    DH is good at:

    • it has the second strongest duell build (the best still FB if you dont play him full support)

    Tell me what kind of heavy drugs allowed you to see in DH and FB the two strongest duellers in the game. I'm a main thief, a class that has always been countered by guardians. Let me tell you something, I'll prefer to face a guardian instead of an holo/scrapper, sb/druid or a brawler weaver, any day. I spend most of my time in WvW and Spvp duelling, and guardians(any build) are far from being a threat as big as the spec I mentioned.

  • xp eke xp.6724xp eke xp.6724 Member ✭✭
    edited May 22, 2019

    he can block, blind and dodge all dmg you can bring and otherwise he has countinual dmg with his symboles. Even with unblock bulky dhs/fb have enought options to reduse your dmg and heal them completely back and then he still didnt kite.

    here the dh build*.
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQRApd8en8cCFdiVDBeDB8Dhl6hCrGCip4KA2hYQe+z//H-jpwCBAw+DWZAA

    • never have condis,
    • always protect if needed
    • he can blind or block singlehit burst
    • f-skill reset
    • pasive heal from: dodges, symbols, regeneration, aegis

    now on FB (but most of you should allready know how hard it is to kill the support guard):

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQRApd3ensAD1BjVDBeDB8Dhl6B7KAsDiB7l0XaNF7BEEmCA-jpwCBAw+DWZAA
    thats the valor build*

    • the points dh had
    • more heal
    • more dmg

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQRApd3ensAD1Bj97AeDB8DhF+BLrClh2QYBgZQRY/iGSPpA-jpQNABAs/A3lBAA
    and the virtues build*

    • shorter uptime for f-skills
    • les selfheal options

    *there are still options to change in the builds like playing with rune of divinity, using zepter or sword and more.

    i also saw some FB playing with gostweapons for more onpoint dmg and that works too.

    DH and FB just got completely countered by DE cause his deaths jugment was unblockable, so warriors and mesmers had a better duell against that and close the same fight situations against all others (means they win or survive the 1v1s).

    But now:

    • you could use them like that, without being outclassed by them
    • FB still has also the unice option to be played as support/ change his build to full support
    • that duellbuilds are slow maprotaders, that can survive for that a -2 situation onpoint, if they kite also -3

    @rbbthole.9074
    just cause noone plays theyr class well enouth it doesnt mean i didnt do my homeworks ... oh and dont do drugs!

    btw. can it be that you perfer that classes, cause they have less trouble if they use the blocks wrong? Cause if the DH/FB don´t know how to play around unblock, those matches gets less anoying for your S/D thief.

  • rbbthole.9074rbbthole.9074 Member ✭✭

    @xp eke xp.6724 said:
    he can block, blind and dodge all dmg you can bring and otherwise he has countinual dmg with his symboles. Even with unblock bulky dhs/fb have enought options to reduse your dmg and heal them completely back and then he still didnt kite.

    Cmon man even thieves can block, blind and bring all the dmg they can bring... That's a mediocre statement to which all classes can relate.

    @xp eke xp.6724 said:
    i also saw some FB playing with gostweapons for more onpoint dmg and that works too.

    I've saw the build you linked, nothing spectacular tbh. A mender/scrapper setup won't give you enough dps to pierce, alone, a scrapper/druid/bunker soulbeast/bunker weaver's defense.
    But the last statement was the thing that got me the most. If you are losing a 1v1 vs a guardian with spirit weapons we cannot talk. I'm clearly on a different league.

    @xp eke xp.6724 said:
    just cause noone plays theyr class well enouth it doesnt mean i didnt do my homeworks

    Are you claiming to know the guardian better than anyone? LMAO lemme give you an adivice, do your homework better.

    Ps: I never thought that one day I would find myself on the guardians side.

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