Returning Player Remembering Why They Quit

[lezbefriends.7516]

The gw major selling point has always been “sub-free.” You’re asking to change the menu at the risk of losing all the loyal customers you’ve accumulated throughout the year.

Edited May 29, 2022 by lezbefriends.7516

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

9 hours ago, Malthurius.6870 said:

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1. They do put entirely too many pretty things in the Gem store and not distribute some of it into the game as collections of drops. The game's hype could benefit from thematic mounts dropping in metas (actual 0.2% drop rate people can actually see somewhat regularly).

 

2. Templates are outrageously overpriced considering what they are. Build Storage is laughable.

 

3. Black lion chests are actually the thing that is fine. Aside from not seeing the real drop rates.

[Gerebos.1065]

They should take a look to Warframe monetization ways. Okay now tencent bought it kitten but before the ways the Warframe developers implemented the ways of getting things was balanced good. There were rare things ,common things but you were able to get everything for free just by playing or paying. 

Edited May 30, 2022 by Amnariel.3659
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[Ultramex.1506]

Pffft here i am recalling times i spent real money with only 2 hands for the past 7 years, and that include paying for expasions. I have many QoL items now

"for the low price of 15$ a month" Oh lord! My side is in orbit, i could play gw2 for 1 year without paying a dime and still get gemstore items, not quickly nor easily but cheaply.

Though i will admit, build templates and mount skins lootbox can burn in hell.

 

[Tukaram.8256]

11 hours ago, Malthurius.6870 said:

Then what about my middle grounds? Surely you wouldn't disagree that it would be better if you could obtain these cosmetics, skins, or maybe even bag slots via achievements, collections, or specific content *in addition* to the cash shop, no? If grinding gold is an acceptable option to you, then making them obtainable via specific tasks should be palatable as well.

and don't tell me you guys actually are okay with the state of build templates.

I have only paid for the original game and the expansions. I do buy the 'deluxe' or whatever the highest one is, because I want to support the game.  Everything in the gem store is optional, and I 'need' very little of it.  I have bought some shared inventory slots,  and that is about it. Oh, before an expansion I like to buy their 'expansion prepare kit' (with the gems left over from the last expansion). I do not, and most likely will not, buy skins.   If skins are available in the game, I might use some, but rarely do.  Whatever I have unlocked while exploring is more than enough for me. 

I paid like $70 for EoD, and if I paid the same for the core and the other 2 expansions - that is a whopping $2 a month over the last 10 years.  IF I wanted any of the gem store items I could easily budget a little into gem money (or convert gold).  As for the game costs, gems, gold... I got no problems. 

Builds?  I have never used one of the templates for build or equipment, so yes I am fine with it. 

[Crono.4197]

Ugh, another "Guild Wars 2 isn't like my favorite MMO, it means it's bad!!!!" post. Don't we have enough of these already?

I've been playing the game since 2013 and I haven't spent a single dime on it, other than the expansions themselves. Everything else I obtained through in-game gold.

If this game or Guild Wars 1 even, since I played that one too, were subscription games, I wouldn't be playing this franchise. I always hated subscription games because they make me feel like the clock is ticking and I must play 24/7 because if I don't, I'm wasting the money I paid. I'm pretty sure that most of the people playing this franchise feel the same. Whenever someone says what's good about Guild Wars, the "no subscription fee" and "being able to use gold to obtain shop items" reasons are some of the first ones mentioned.

I think you just don't like the game and you're trying to find excuses for it because you like getting everything instantly. And that's fine, not every game is made for everyone. Good luck with FFXIV or whatever you wanna play next.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Crono.4197

[Sarius.9285]

10 hours ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

I might be hard-pressed to spend $15/year on the game (not counting expansions). 

so be happy that there's no sub and you can play without spending anything 

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

27 minutes ago, Sarius.9285 said:

so be happy that there's no sub and you can play without spending anything 

Responding to:  Most people aren't like you and probably spend more than 15$ a month on the game, otherwise Anet wouldn't be able to pay their developers, would they?

Wondering where might you find me stating I am not happy with the game, or the revenue model?  Very strange post.  😕

Edited May 29, 2022 by Inculpatus cedo.9234
more info

[god fragment.5716]

If you want to complain about exploitation for real money, look at the retainer system in FFXIV. A retainer is basicaly an extra inventory the same size as your characters and it's the only way you can use the AH. They also function as gatherers, that you can send on a quest for a few hours to get extra its. However you are limited to how much stuff a single retainer can put on the AH (i think its about 20 items). You get one retainer for free and can rent additional ones for around 2€ per month. So, if you want extra bank storage and sell more items on AH, your subscription fee goes up.

[Obtena.7952]

18 hours ago, Malthurius.6870 said:

I've been playing FFXIV since I quit, and almost every new mount, armor, weapon, furniture, or otherwise is obtainable in game with very little cash shop promotion. I'm not a fan of a cash shop in addition to a sub-fee *at all*, and despite how good of a job FFXIV does at developing rewards in game, the fact that anything is only obtainable in their store is pretty garbage and anti-consumer.

I want to make something clear; this isn't a "I hate GW2 because they have a cash shop" this is "I wish GW2 was better, and the cash shop is actively making the game worse for the sake of profit".

Let me put it this way: when I pay a sub fee for FFXIV, I feel good about it because almost all of the game's development is towards the content that 15$ pays for.

When I pay for anything in GW2 (minimum 10$) I feel like I'm getting ripped off and exploited for money.

You seem to have ignored the fact that you can convert earned ingame gold to gems to get ANY item you want from the GS.

That kind of thing, if it exists, is VERY rare in MMOs and is EXTREMELY and UNNECESSARILY GENEROUS

But sure, complaint about how exploitive Anet's business model is ... 🙄Sounds to me like your problem here is that GW2 isn't a sub, not that it has a cash stop. Not a valid complaint. 

 

Edited May 29, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[TheQuickFox.3826]

Most upgrades should have been account-wide. Like build and equipment slots and templates.

[Mik.3401]

These are valid points and i agree this is what drives me away as well, currently practically gave up not even bothered about the zhaitan skins.

Some may say these issues are not bad because many mmos have them and you can grind money to get gems. I think the problem is that  - the mmo genre is past its glorious days because of increased monetisation and grinding money to exchange for cash shop currency is just not very immersive.

I expect most to not agree with me, but as another player since beta + GW1 player I feel disappointed. I guess the game caters to different generation now, if that works well then it’s good for them. I just hoped for some items and achievements requiring skill as opposed to grind or gems.  But this era is long gone I guess.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Mik.3401

[SlayerXX.7138]

16 hours ago, Malthurius.6870 said:

But this is contradictory to Gehenna's point of "this is how Anet make money". Most people aren't like you and probably spend more than 15$ a month on the game, otherwise Anet wouldn't be able to pay their developers, would they?

Most people are in fact like him. That's why you feel ripped of. If the make money of a player it is way more then the sub fee and in a short time(damm you guardian shrine jackal). A ton of player don't pay a dime. Whales keep the game afloat. The free to play Player are just assets to fill the world.

 

I do agree with the build  templates as they seem highly overpriced and I would like to know how much Anet Actually sells. If you have a bunch of legendarys, character slots are cheaper then templates^^.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Albi.7250

[Erise.5614]

7 hours ago, Eloc Freidon.5692 said:

1. They do put entirely too many pretty things in the Gem store and not distribute some of it into the game as collections of drops. The game's hype could benefit from thematic mounts dropping in metas (actual 0.2% drop rate people can actually see somewhat regularly).

I would like to point out that the separation between gem shop content and in game content is an achievement and a very positive direction.

When in game rewards overlap with cash shop items then the in game rewards always get the short end of the stick. If you can get better stuff by playing the game then no one buys anything from the cash shop. And the relevant aspect is how much money is spent. Not whether it is technically possible to spend money.

I really like that they added secondary stuff (like gliders and mounts) that are gems only while leaving other content (infusions and auras) to gameplay only. One could complain that they like other things much better but the fact that such a separation exists at all is very nice. I much rather know for sure that this kind of content is cash / gems only. Rather than extremely convoluted systems where you can buy your way around rewards and therefore skip playing time. The separation leads to a much more gameplay focused reward structure. 

Edited May 29, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Sobx.1758]

18 hours ago, Malthurius.6870 said:

2. Build templates are a sin; a blemish, a pestilent blight. For anyone who engages in at least 2 game modes, this is almost nothing, in fact, it's worse than nothing. Spec templates should just be free. I'm more accepting of armor templates because they function as additional storage for armor items which was a big hog of space before. In fact, just remove Spec templates entirely and just make build loadouts character based instead of account wide, and give all the slots for free.

The worst thing that build templates did is that it took away the split of your character's build loadout between PvE and PvP. You have to go through the trouble of switching your build whenever you switch modes, or use one of your precious slots to get a sliver of the convenience you had before this feature was implemented. What's worse is that it muddies the PvP culture: people are more likely to just run their PvE build than engage in building something for PvP, and what's worse about that is that the player is also likely to run into an annoying disjoint if any of their traits or skills are balanced differently. This system is actively bad for getting new players into PvP. As a middle ground, can we at least have separate templates for PvE, PvP, and WvW.

What do you mean "use one of your prevcious slots to get a sliver of the convenience you had before"?

Before you had no choice, you simply had one -invisible- template bound to pve, one to wvw and one to pvp. Now you can use those same 3 templates, except you can see them and in case you don't want to play another mode, you can use one of those templates as a spare for the mode you'd rather play. It didn't somehow "take away that convenience", since you never had the option to redistribute x mode template if you didn't want to play it anyways. Now you do.

Quote

3. Black Lion Chests and skins from tickets are kitten for the same reason mounts are. It's actually the exact same issue as mounts except a little more tolerable due to the skins being purchasable via gold (but the mounts can also be bought with gold because gold and gems are exchangeable currencies). Why aren't these hundreds of skins obtainable in some way in game? Greed is the answer. They're so predatory to the right mindset too.

If having a strongly limited number of skins available through chests is a reason for you to quit the game then good luck looking for your perfect non-sub mmorpg.

 

12 hours ago, Dante.1508 said:

• The lack of rewards in owpve is totally crap. "you don't need it" isn't an argument.

Writing "lack of rewards in owpve" is extremely far from being the truth.

12 hours ago, Dante.1508 said:

• The difficulty of the content wears me down.

Then play the easier content you have access to.

12 hours ago, Dante.1508 said:

• The over use of meta trains in owpve drives me away.

You don't need to participate in meta trains, so if you dislike those then... just don't join/follow them.

12 hours ago, Dante.1508 said:

• The gems to gold conversion is bs... way too low.

Seeing how many things people get from gold -> gem conversion... Not really.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[kharmin.7683]

2 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

What do you mean "use one of your prevcious slots to get a sliver of the convenience you had before"?

Before you had no choice, you simply had one -invisible- template bound to pve, one to wvw and one to pvp. Now you can use those same 3 templates, except you can see them and in case you don't want to play another mode, you can use one of those templates as a spare for the mode you'd rather play. It didn't somehow "take away that convenience", since you never had the option to redistribute x mode template if you didn't want to play it anyways. Now you do.

 

Probably referring to ARC templates.  A lot of posters on the forum who used them seem to feel cheated by Anet's implementation.

[Mik.3401]

51 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

What do you mean "use one of your prevcious slots to get a sliver of the convenience you had before"?

Before you had no choice, you simply had one -invisible- template bound to pve, one to wvw and one to pvp. Now you can use those same 3 templates, except you can see them and in case you don't want to play another mode, you can use one of those templates as a spare for the mode you'd rather play. It didn't somehow "take away that convenience", since you never had the option to redistribute x mode template if you didn't want to play it anyways. Now you do.

If having a strongly limited number of skins available through chests is a reason for you to quit the game then good luck looking for your perfect non-sub mmorpg.

 

Writing "lack of rewards in owpve" is extremely far from being the truth.

Then play the easier content you have access to.

You don't need to participate in meta trains, so if you dislike those then... just don't join/follow them.

Seeing how many things people get from gold -> gem conversion... Not really.

Wow defending 3 build templates, I can’t. It’s meant to be unlimited if they cared about creativity of players and convenience , not just money and gemstore. 

[Ashen.2907]

The majority of the skins in GW2 are available in game rather than in the gemstore. The exception being mount skins.

The minority that are in the gemstore are still earnable by playing the game.

So, 100% of the "rewards" in gw2 are available to be earned by playing the game....and that is predatory. Right. Sure it is.

[Sobx.1758]

1 hour ago, Mik.3401 said:

Wow defending 3 build templates, I can’t. It’s meant to be unlimited if they cared about creativity of players and convenience , not just money and gemstore. 

It's not "defending 3 build templates", it's responding directly to the misconception OP included in one of his complaints. On the other hand, your "woah I just can't!" doesn't respond to anything I said, so if you think anything I wrote there is false, then try responding again, this time directly to what you've quoted, preferably keeping in mind the context of what OP complained about.

"it's meant to be unlimited" is not factual, it's nothing more than your wish. And while you're free to have that wish, it still doesn't respond to what was quoted in your or mine post.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Blockhead Magee.3092]

Never heard of anyone quitting over the cash shop.   Since its all speculation, I can't image it being a percentage of the player base that Anet is going to change how they do things.

[Sarius.9285]

8 hours ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

Responding to:  Most people aren't like you and probably spend more than 15$ a month on the game, otherwise Anet wouldn't be able to pay their developers, would they?

Wondering where might you find me stating I am not happy with the game, or the revenue model?  Very strange post.  😕

your entire post? If that's the reason you quit you are obviously not happy with it, right?

[Mik.3401]

1 hour ago, Sobx.1758 said:

It's not "defending 3 build templates", it's responding directly to the misconception OP included in one of his complaints. On the other hand, your "woah I just can't!" doesn't respond to anything I said, so if you think anything I wrote there is false, then try responding again, this time directly to what you've quoted, preferably keeping in mind the context of what OP complained about.

"it's meant to be unlimited" is not factual, it's nothing more than your wish. And while you're free to have that wish, it still doesn't respond to what was quoted in your or mine post.

Okay okay you are right and the context of your message was perfectly precise unlike mine.  Just GW1 had unlimited templates which was fun and GW2 has 3 + more to buy with cash which is re.kitten and that’s it. Disclaimer: this comment I make now has little linkage to your original post!

[Ashen.2907]

11 minutes ago, Mik.3401 said:

Okay okay you are right and the context of your message was perfectly precise unlike mine.  Just GW1 had unlimited templates which was fun and GW2 has 3 + more to buy with cash which is re.kitten and that’s it. Disclaimer: this comment I make now has little linkage to your original post!

The original business plan for GW1 was that players would be expected to buy a new full priced game every six months....and they had a (limited) cash shop. GW2 calls for an expansion purchase every two+ years, and allows everything in the cash shop to be acquired through game play.

So, if GW1 had succeeded in its original plan, in the time one might be expected to buy a single expansion in GW2 one would be buying four iterations of GW1. While at the same time needing to use real money to access desired cash shop items.

GW2 is the better buy.

 

And I say this as someone who thinks that GW1 was the better game.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Ashen.2907

[Mik.3401]

21 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said:

The original business plan for GW1 was that players would be expected to buy a new full priced game every six months....and they had a (limited) cash shop. GW2 calls for an expansion purchase every two+ years, and allows everything in the cash shop to be acquired through game play.

So, if GW1 had succeeded in its original plan, in the time one might be expected to buy a single expansion in GW2 one would be buying four iterations of GW1. While at the same time needing to use real money to access desired cash shop items.

GW2 is the better buy.

 

And I say this as someone who thinks that GW1 was the better game.

I do get the reasoning, but GW1 had nice endgame and GW2 has weak endgame. This makes it unfortunate the latter requires grinding money to buy cash shop tokens. 
high five though GW1 rocked!

[SlateSloan.3654]

23 hours ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

Most MMOs these days have subs + a cash shop on top of it. What's special here is that GW2 doesn't actually charge a sub. 

I've played SWTOR for years. They have a sub system (F2P is very limited). Over 90% of cosmetics come from the cash shop and you cannot exchange in game currency for their cash shop currency.

GW2 has tons of skins that are obtainable in game via rewards and achievements and indeed you can trade gold for gems.

As far as I'm concerned GW2 is one of the least egregious MMOs out there.

In SWTOR you cannot buy shop currency with ingame currency that is correct.

but you can sell shop items you acquired on the ingame trading post so you can actually buy shop items with ingame currency there. Why didnt you mention this? Can you sell shop items on the trading post in gw2?

A fair system would be if anet would get rid of „account bound“.

why cant i sell any item i once bought on the ingame trading post?

If i put an shop item back on the ingame trading post the system should check what the gem price is and set the equivalent gold price automatically.

 

 

Edited May 29, 2022 by SlateSloan.3654