Rune of Evasion 6th+Weaver + Woven stride+Cleansing water=Permanent/full condi cleanse on evasion

[Nebilim.5127]

Just need to dodge/evade into any aoe or attack for that. Also permanent swiftness/regeneration. When can we see 5sec IC on cleansing water or Woven stride?

[Zero.3871]

5 sec ICD will come when woven stride became a necro trait.

[Emberheart.8426]

Not happening because every trait and rune that triggered on evade had a CD before mirage and evasion runes were redesigned. These runes are inherently broken even without trait interactions because you can sometimes get minutes of swiftness or multiple stacks of torments off one dodge. They need a CD to keep them in line with all the other effects on evade. However, if Anet make the mistake of nerfing woven stride or cleansing water, then ele is officially dead in PvP and WvW roaming.

[Nebilim.5127]

@Ganathar.4956 said:Not happening because every trait and rune that triggered on evade had a CD before mirage and evasion runes were redesigned. These runes are inherently broken even without trait interactions because you can sometimes get minutes of swiftness or multiple stacks of torments off one dodge. They need a CD to keep them in line with all the other effects on evade. However, if Anet make the mistake of nerfing woven stride or cleansing water, then ele is officially dead in PvP and WvW roaming.

Ah, very good point here, but i'm sure they will compensate woven stride by buffing the regen/swiftness by a few seconds too, and while the torment rune have a similar effect, this one is the only one to interact with a trait to make so strong, so it should be the most surgical precision decision as well.

[Tommo Chocolate.5870]

I don't see any need for a cooldown because you can't dodge indefinitely - the endurance requirement for dodging plays the role of a cooldown already.

Also, compare this with Elusive Mind, which doesn't have a cooldown.

[misterman.1530]

Yup. But somehow this means to "fix" this broken rune, Anet will decide to nerf Necros again - for reasons.

[Emberheart.8426]

@"Tommo Chocolate.5870" said:I don't see any need for a cooldown because you can't dodge indefinitely - the endurance requirement for dodging plays the role of a cooldown already.

Also, compare this with Elusive Mind, which doesn't have a cooldown.

Evading is not the same as dodging. Elusive mind triggers whenever you press your dodge key. Mirage and evasion runes trigger for every single attack you evade. If 3 players attack you at the same time during one of your dodges, you get 3x the effect. Same if you get hit by quick multi-hit effects like rapid fire. This is what makes it broken.

@Nebilim.5127 said:

@Ganathar.4956 said:Not happening because every trait and rune that triggered on evade had a CD before mirage and evasion runes were redesigned. These runes are inherently broken even without trait interactions because you can sometimes get minutes of swiftness or multiple stacks of torments off one dodge. They need a CD to keep them in line with all the other effects on evade. However, if Anet make the mistake of nerfing woven stride or cleansing water, then ele is officially dead in PvP and WvW roaming.

Ah, very good point here, but i'm sure they will compensate woven stride by buffing the regen/swiftness by a few seconds too, and while the torment rune have a similar effect, this one is the only one to interact with a trait to make so strong, so it should be the most surgical precision decision as well.

Yeah because that's going to make up for the nerf to ele's condi cleanse. Okay, I know that you are kidding, but I worry that the devs might take you seriously :p

[Nebilim.5127]

@Nebilim.5127 said:

@Ganathar.4956 said:Not happening because every trait and rune that triggered on evade had a CD before mirage and evasion runes were redesigned. These runes are inherently broken even without trait interactions because you can sometimes get minutes of swiftness or multiple stacks of torments off one dodge. They need a CD to keep them in line with all the other effects on evade. However, if Anet make the mistake of nerfing woven stride or cleansing water, then ele is officially dead in PvP and WvW roaming.

Ah, very good point here, but i'm sure they will compensate woven stride by buffing the regen/swiftness by a few seconds too, and while the torment rune have a similar effect, this one is the only one to interact with a trait to make so strong, so it should be the most surgical precision decision as well.

Yeah because that's going to make up for the nerf to ele's condi cleanse. Okay, I know that you are kidding, but I worry that the devs might take you seriously :p

Oh no no, it isn't a joke whatsoever. It is all very Real. Touch it, feel it, hear it, SMELL IT.

[Emberheart.8426]

@Nebilim.5127 said:

@Nebilim.5127 said:

@Ganathar.4956 said:Not happening because every trait and rune that triggered on evade had a CD before mirage and evasion runes were redesigned. These runes are inherently broken even without trait interactions because you can sometimes get minutes of swiftness or multiple stacks of torments off one dodge. They need a CD to keep them in line with all the other effects on evade. However, if Anet make the mistake of nerfing woven stride or cleansing water, then ele is officially dead in PvP and WvW roaming.

Ah, very good point here, but i'm sure they will compensate woven stride by buffing the regen/swiftness by a few seconds too, and while the torment rune have a similar effect, this one is the only one to interact with a trait to make so strong, so it should be the most surgical precision decision as well.

Yeah because that's going to make up for the nerf to ele's condi cleanse. Okay, I know that you are kidding, but I worry that the devs might take you seriously :p

Oh no no, it isn't a joke whatsoever. It is all very

Real

. Touch it, feel it, hear it, SMELL IT FIRELINA.

It obviously is a joke though. And those runes would remain broken even with trait nerfs. They don't need a trait interaction to be broken, the interaction only serves to make the evasion rune even more of an issue. With the sanctuary rune, the trait interaction was the thing that was primarily broken, not the rune. Not that it matters too much though, because nerfing abrasive grit like that was probably a misstep.

[Nath Forge Tempete.1645]

Well ... is the meta that condi oriented ? i don't feel like it ... since most of the time I drop the water trait line for arcane or else XD so not like it would matter anyway ? Let's think about this =3

[Lahmia.2193]

But can't you see Rune of Evasion is an important part of many other profession builds and not op for them. Clearly this is a problem with weaver and they need to nerf weaver because of it.

(this is sarcasm before anyone takes me seriously).

[Funky.4861]

@Ganathar: the dev acknowledged that the change to the rune was the primary offender, not the trait. They stuck a plaster on the problem instead of solving it.

To quote Irenio: We immediately thought about putting an internal cooldown (ICD) on the rune. After all, the change to the rune is what enabled this unwanted behavior. This would have been the easiest and fastest fix....We’ll be keeping an eye on it and watching for reasonable options that promote healthier, skillful gameplay for everyone.

So yeah, icd coming to weaver trait :)

[Blocki.4931]

Still nowhere near as bad as the necro abuse. Stop throwing reason out of the window just because it's your class.

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Nebilim.5127" said:Just need to dodge/evade into any aoe or attack for that. Also permanent swiftness/regeneration. When can we see 5sec IC on cleansing water or Woven stride?

Never. That's an Ele trait, not a Necro one.

[Nebilim.5127]

@"Blocki.4931" said:Still nowhere near as bad as the necro abuse. Stop throwing reason out of the window just because it's your class.

Using a knife is nowhere as bad as gun in a fist fight, but that's fine, because it isn't as bad. Great reasoning there too buddy.

Oh no this is totally fine.

[Lahmia.2193]

@Blocki.4931 said:Still nowhere near as bad as the necro abuse. Stop throwing reason out of the window just because it's your class.

Throwing reason out the window was anet introducing a rune that they clearly hadn't fully tested.

[eldrjth.7384]

@Nebilim.5127 said:

That accent is too thick had to close video in 5s.

[TexZero.7910]

@"Blocki.4931" said:Still nowhere near as bad as the necro abuse. Stop throwing reason out of the window just because it's your class.

1) it's not my class2) the only ones being irational are yourself and the devs for thinking this "fix" is logical.

Also, this showcases some very real design bias. If it's okay for ele, then the same should be fine for necro. Both interactions are equally as unhealthy for the game so to argue that ele shouldn't get the same treatment is the real irrational choice by your logic.

[Khisanth.2948]

The necro interaction with sanctuary basically had a 0.5s CD. If you can evade at the same rate you are basically untouchable anyway.

[The Bassist.5410]

Stay tuned for more, folks. This is just getting started.

@"Nebilim.5127" said:Using a knife is nowhere as bad as gun in a fist fight, but that's fine, because it isn't as bad. Great reasoning there too buddy.

Oh no this is totally fine.

Very amusing video. Thanks for posting it.

[darksome.1697]

Great video showing off the interesting Immune To Conditions/Perma Swiftness & Regen Weaver build I've met so many times in PVP lately.

Looking forward to the immediate "WTFOPLOL" nerf to ele traits that this rune interacts with. It took less than 24hrs for Anet to nerf necros after rune of Sanctuary was introduced, let's see how long it takes for the ele trait nerf.

[Undertow.2389]

I think the rune nerf here is far more appropriate. Sanctuary runes didn't make any class but scourge OP, the base effect itself is fine. These runes though, give any class effectively permanent swiftness and regeneration, when every single other "on dodge" trait or rune in the game (pre rework) has an internal cooldown of at least 1 second for a good reason (so they don't scale obscenely with the number off attacks you evade in one dodge).

Doesn't mean the abrasive grit nerf was good; I think it was stupid consequence of lack of foresight on Anet's part that shouldn't have happened. But if you read their explanation of why, it makes sense as the "least bad" course of action to take to quickly remedy the problem. In the case of evasion runes, there's no downside to putting a cooldown on the rune. You control when you dodge and you'd always get a static value of return, unlike what would happen if Runes of Sanctuary had a cooldown and someone else gave you a puny heal right before you cast your big heal.

[Aslakh.3072]

These runes are way weaker than sanctuary runes on 26/27 classes so they any nerf to them would ruin them for everybody else. By the same logic that abrasive grit got the internal cooldown, so should the weaver trait. That said, neither trait should be nerfed.@Undertow.2389 These only give regeneration on weaver not on other proffesions.

[Jski.6180]

Weaver balance by name in the main general forms i will take it well till this gets banish to the shadow realm "ele forms."

This is on a different level then the scorge trait and Rune of Sanctuary with the ideal that anet wanted this rune set to not be limited by a random heal triggering its effect with a weak heal making it in effect a worthless rune set. As far as i know no one can make you evade on command its only the player who can trigger this effect. So it well wight in the logic of making an icd on the swiftness application.

Now if it dose go back to the old 1 sec cd on reg clear back in the day it would destroy most if not all ele builds (not to say i am comply agned this ideal the class is a joke as is often not acting like a mages at all and it NEEDS a massive rework that may only come from a massive drop in population use.) As going after Woven stride i am all for it as well if you make it give 66% swiftness effect like the rune set because +20% is nothing (makes it 40% meaning a rune set and a wvw buff is just as strong or stronger then a GM trait on weaver and that just sad.)

It dose need fix it comply stops a type of game play BUT its not enofe to be class defining. At best your just a bunker vs condi that cant kill any thing but your never dieing vs condi. Ele over all is on death door as a class and the lack of any real dev. talk about it at any level is more then enofe to show no one is working on it. I loved the part where ele was bugged for weeks and anet did not notes because there just ppl who do not play it enofe to see it or the lack of any real ele devs.

So ya nerf this and may be ele over all lets stop ppl from playing this class so we can get anet to look at it with a real critical eye for once.