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Remove Character Swap In Ranked


Chilli.2976

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We've all done it, for example - queuing as a Druid to force a high possibility to have a Druid on the enemy team, then swapping character at the last second to either counter that class or the team composition.

The other thing I've seen, is "top players" duo queuing as double Necromancer to force either one or two on the enemy team then swapping to double Revenant to counter and steamroll the game.In a way this is kind of match manipulation as you're abusing how the matching making works.

Simple resolution, the class you queue as, is the class you play and are not allowed to swap once in the game.

Also double stacking classes should not be allowed to queue, unless ArenaNet fixes their algorithm.

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We've all done it, for example - queuing as a Druid to force a high possibility to have a Druid on the enemy team, then swapping character at the last second to either counter that class or the team comp position.Nothing stops the enemy team's Druid from changing as well if they believe their team comp's not gonna work out.Nothing's stopping the team from adjusting rotations and strategy to swaps either if a situation arises beyond a lack of interest in adapting, too. Idk about you, but if I Q as one thing and see that my opponents have 2 or 3 specs that may hard counter what I'm playing, I'd rather change and potentially counter (or at least not get countered as hard) than to just have a game decided the moment we ended up matched.

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@"steki.1478" said:I never understood why character swapping is ok, but changing the build is not. One of the reasons I found pvp obnoxious compared to wvw.

it would be nice to swap out some skills when you in respawn out of combat. but some say "this is the way its always been".....

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@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@"steki.1478" said:I never understood why character swapping is ok, but changing the build is not. One of the reasons I found pvp obnoxious compared to wvw.

it would be nice to swap out some skills when you in respawn out of combat. but some say "this is the way its always been".....

I honestly don't see why it's not possible to change the build inside base. Swapping utilities which are on cooldown is I think shared even among elite spec skills.

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@steki.1478 said:I never understood why character swapping is ok, but changing the build is not. One of the reasons I found pvp obnoxious compared to wvw.I feel the same way. It's a bit odd that I can't change my skills off cooldown in attempt to adapt to my opponent's strategy.Yet swapping to another class entirely is okay.

~ Kovu

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To anet:

1) If a player's build contains missing traits, do not let them queue

2) Assign each trait a type of category point. Categories possible: support, sustain, damage-> 2a) Assign each amulet, sigil, rune category points for support, sustain, or damage; amulets grant the most points (quantity unknown, Anet will decide)-> 2b) Assign each weapon category points for support, sustain, or damage-> 2c) Assign each utility category points for support, sustain, or damage including elite; healing skill can be split into support/sustain or just sustainFyi: some items (traits, weapons, etc) may be split into multiple categories

Weapons, utilities and amulets generate the most category points followed by traits then rune and sigil

3) Tally the category with the most points (e.g. most support points; this player is now a support player and will be counted one for the duration of the queue and game)

4) Add a warning before queueing stating the player can not make changes to their build during queue and in-game

5) Matchmaker takes into account the player and their category, and also all points in other categories. The game is balanced around categories so teams are not lopsided and running too many of the same roles

Profit

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@Euthymias.7984 said:Nothing stops the enemy team's Druid from changing as well if they believe their team comp's not gonna work out.Nothing's stopping the team from adjusting rotations and strategy to swaps either if a situation arises beyond a lack of interest in adapting, too. Idk about you, but if I Q as one thing and see that my opponents have 2 or 3 specs that may hard counter what I'm playing, I'd rather change and potentially counter (or at least not get countered as hard) than to just have a game decided the moment we ended up matched.

It's so scuffed though to the point where it's hard to tell if it was intended or not in the first place. Without an SSD people end up slowly swapping back and forth in a sort of weird game of rock paper scissors, and then there's the people who get really sweaty over it, who usually end up leaving their team down a player when the match starts.

Like people have said, just being able to swap build would be good enough. The matchmaker is exclusively good at mirroring team comps, so it really only creates more issues that people are able to swap characters and abuse that.

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So much misinformation in this thread.

  1. The classes/specs on your team have next to no influence on the enemy team's composition. The only tiny way it affects anything is that the matchmaker has an every so slight preference to not duplicate professions on a team. So you if you queue as a necro, another necro in the queue is slightly more likely to end up being your opponent than your teammate.

  2. You can change spec in ranked during the ready up period. You cannot change character or spec once the count-down has started in ranked. ATs allow character swapping during play (which should be fixed).

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@Exedore.6320 said:So much misinformation in this thread.

  1. The classes/specs on your team have next to no influence on the enemy team's composition. The only tiny way it affects anything is that the matchmaker has an every so slight preference to not duplicate professions on a team. So you if you queue as a necro, another necro in the queue is slightly more likely to end up being your opponent than your teammate.

  2. You can change spec in ranked during the ready up period. You cannot change character or spec once the count-down has started in ranked. ATs allow character swapping during play (which should be fixed).

This is false, Whenever me and a friend duo'd both as Revenants we kept getting double rev in the enemy team aswel. The moment we stopped doing that we'd never get double revenant in the enemy team anymore.

The MM definitely mimicks your comp and tries to make the exact comp for the enemy team

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@steki.1478 said:

@steki.1478 said:I never understood why character swapping is ok, but changing the build is not. One of the reasons I found pvp obnoxious compared to wvw.

it would be nice to swap out some skills when you in respawn out of combat. but some say "this is the way its always been".....

I honestly don't see why it's not possible to change the build inside base. Swapping utilities which are on cooldown is I think shared even among elite spec skills.

You can change your build before the match starts, but you should not be allowed to adjust your build while the game is running. It's time based and every second counts, some people might spend 2 minutes adjusting their build and by then you are 3 capped.

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@Chilli.2976 said:

@steki.1478 said:I never understood why character swapping is ok, but changing the build is not. One of the reasons I found pvp obnoxious compared to wvw.

it would be nice to swap out some skills when you in respawn out of combat. but some say "this is the way its always been".....

I honestly don't see why it's not possible to change the build inside base. Swapping utilities which are on cooldown is I think shared even among elite spec skills.

You can change your build before the match starts, but you should not be allowed to adjust your build while the game is running. It's time based and every second counts, some people might spend 2 minutes adjusting their build and by then you are 3 capped.

You can do it while being dead. Besides, it's another reason to focus on build templates.

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I haven't done gw2 pvp yet but from past experience in other games it sounds like the gw2 queue isn't anonymous and should be. Lock in your character when your queue, load into a pre-fight area where you can adjust your build to compliment your teammates, door opens and fight.

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since you dont seem to know about this or just dont remember...

arenanet did a poll on profession locking in arena queue in 2017. since they switched the forums, unfortunately the old posts about this are gone. but i found a video about this on youtube, perhaps you want to check it out https://invidio.us/watch?v=u_2PoMHhbWQas the video suggests, there was not just the poll but also quite some thought put into it at that time. anyway, players voted for leaving the system as is (means swapping is allowed and should stay) with 53%. thats what the guildnews article says about it (german): https://guildnews.de/update-arenanet-umfrage-klassenwechsel-sperre-im-pvp/if i remember correctly, people were very much afraid of skyhigh queue times. they wanted quantity over quality, so there you have it.

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what I dont understand is Why are we allowed to Swap During At's but Not during Rank when a game has started ? I'm sure it's the same for Monthly? However this whole swapping back and forth in rank is pretty freaking dumb.

I que as a necro expecting to play against other necros......nope doesn't work like that they'll just swap off necro to play Rev/SoulBeast or Holo. Forcing me to swap so I don't go against double Holo or Double Rev.

I currently Stop caring if I lose rating at this point and decided Just to play necro no matter what the outcome is.

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@Snellibee.2761 said:

@"Exedore.6320" said:So much misinformation in this thread.
  1. The classes/specs on your team have next to no influence on the enemy team's composition. The only tiny way it affects anything is that the matchmaker has an every so slight preference to not duplicate professions on a team. So you if you queue as a necro, another necro in the queue is slightly more likely to end up being your opponent than your teammate.
  2. You can change spec in ranked during the ready up period. You cannot change character or spec once the count-down has started in ranked. ATs allow character swapping during play (which should be fixed).

This is false, Whenever me and a friend duo'd both as Revenants we kept getting double rev in the enemy team aswel. The moment we stopped doing that we'd never get double revenant in the enemy team anymore.

The MM definitely mimicks your comp and tries to make the exact comp for the enemy team

Yepp, you are right. It is probably not forced, but somewhat preferred by the matchmaker, see: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm

adjust score by profession countsfor profession in allProfessions:

roster has none of these professions

if roster.count(profession) == 0:continue

(...)

favor matching professions between teams

if team.count(profession) < otherTeam.count(profession):score += config.professions.matching

We don't know exactly how this score works though. It also unlikely you can change the other team's composition - except by forcing fewer of your classes in your own team. That necro thing is totally possible, that druid thing only when it comes to preventing him on your own team. Might be he meant that.

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I have 32 toons and swap all the time..

I swap from Celestial Tempest to Mender Tempest if we have no support.I swap from Menders Tempest to marauder Tempest if our team is too bunkeryI swap from Marauder Temp to Celestial Temp if our team lacks side noders...

... and so on.

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