Bow - the privileged weapon

[Gamadorn.2670]

@bethekey.8314 said:Projectiles have a maximum range. Most projectiles disappear at their maximum range. Bows keep going well beyond their maximum range.

As a result, shortbow, categorized as a mid-range weapon, actually has a massive range greater than 1200. Its stated range is 900.

Why are bows not bound by the same rules as other weapons?

Where on the doll did a ranger touch you with a short bow :astonished:

[Bazsi.2734]

2012 will never end. Or maybe it did, along with the world... and we're all dead. Stuck in 2012. What is this thread? If they haven't fixed these in 8+ years, what makes you think they care to fix it now?

[Eugchriss.2046]

@Gamadorn.2670 said:

@bethekey.8314 said:Projectiles have a maximum range. Most projectiles disappear at their maximum range. Bows keep going well beyond their maximum range.

As a result, shortbow, categorized as a mid-range weapon, actually has a massive range greater than 1200. Its stated range is 900.

Why are bows not bound by the same rules as other weapons?

Where on the doll did a ranger touch you with a short bow :astonished:lmao. Ranger's sb is the most broken of all bows. Barely any cast time, definitively no animations and a machine gun AA. The actual question is how can't you hit someone with that weapon.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

lol, are there any arcing homing projectiles? that would be the creme de la creme. miss that rampage 10k boulder toss, not arcing but probably the most juicy homing.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:lol, are there any arcing homing projectiles? that would be the creme de la creme. miss that rampage 10k boulder toss, not arcing but probably the most juicy homing.

I was meaning by arcing that anet seemed to pick and chose certain projectiles that don't just disappear at max range mid are but fall hence to me is the reason why shooting a lb from a wall gets the player more range than from lv ground. Theirs no actual projectiles termed arcing projectiles obviously lol.

[Widmo.3186]

Projectiles in gw2, am I right?https://streamable.com/8ysl5r

[bethekey.8314]

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:@bethekey.8314@Leonidrex.5649@"CutesySylveon.8290"

Say it yourselves this time. Fill in the blanks:

"Just _"

[Abyssisis.3971]

@Eugchriss.2046 said:

@Gamadorn.2670 said:

@bethekey.8314 said:Projectiles have a maximum range. Most projectiles disappear at their maximum range. Bows keep going well beyond their maximum range.

As a result, shortbow, categorized as a mid-range weapon, actually has a massive range greater than 1200. Its stated range is 900.

Why are bows not bound by the same rules as other weapons?

Where on the doll did a ranger touch you with a short bow :astonished:lmao. Ranger's sb is the most broken of all bows. Barely any cast time, definitively no animations and a machine gun AA. The actual question is how can't you hit someone with that weapon.

Very low damage tho. Would be an issue if it had rev shortbow damage with rangers shortbow attack speed.. ?

[Shao.7236]

@bethekey.8314 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:@bethekey.8314@Leonidrex.5649@"CutesySylveon.8290"

Say it yourselves this time. Fill in the blanks:

"Just

_"

It's interpolation jank, I don't know what your ping is, neither theirs, but the rifle velocity of deadeye is above the average which causes that stuff to happen a lot, unfortunately even normal stuff like Lich tends to track.

It all depends on people ping, if someone with 300 ping hits you on their screen, you're guaranteed to get the projectile going around the obstacle even if already behind it.

Technically having a bad ping has it's advantages as it delays evade frames also, compared the good ping who still has to wait for info to come in. The only good thing low ping does is being able to react properly at bursts.

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

@"bethekey.8314" said:

Wait a minute, the famous "just LoS lol, it's l2p issue" doesn't work? What is this sorcerery? You must be L Y I N G! /s

[Leonidrex.5649]

Lets be real here, the LoS excuse is proper fucking bullshit for good 30% of projectile attacks.I got SO FUCKING MANY KILLS on lb when it curved around corner to hit people it stopped being funny and became pathetic.Rampage rock, rangers lb, lich for autos are the ones that come to mind with their bullshit.Lich for is the worst as the proj just flies straight and then does 90 degree turn around corners sometimes.The only things that actually "respect" LoS are beam attacks and those get randomly fucked by random pebbles on the floor.Anyone that played GS mesmer will tell you that auto sometimes gets LoS for absolutely no fucking reason.And the best thing is? I fought ranger, we both stood still, I was auto-attacking on gs I got " LoS " but he was hitting me just fine. Even reflected his arrows and they all landed fine, but all my skills? " los " " los " . Proper bullshit.

[Bazsi.2734]

@"Leonidrex.5649" said:Lets be real here, the LoS excuse is proper kitten kitten for good 30% of projectile attacks.I got SO kitten MANY KILLS on lb when it curved around corner to hit people it stopped being funny and became pathetic.Rampage rock, rangers lb, lich for autos are the ones that come to mind with their kitten.Lich for is the worst as the proj just flies straight and then does 90 degree turn around corners sometimes.The only things that actually "respect" LoS are beam attacks and those get randomly kitten by random pebbles on the floor.Anyone that played GS mesmer will tell you that auto sometimes gets LoS for absolutely no kitten reason.And the best thing is? I fought ranger, we both stood still, I was auto-attacking on gs I got " LoS " but he was hitting me just fine. Even reflected his arrows and they all landed fine, but all my skills? " los " " los " . Proper kitten.

Yeah thats bad, but have you ever Shadowstepped/portaled away to max range and still get hit by a projectile attack? Those are the really juicy kills which makes me wish I could permarecord my gameplay. I mean who says renegade shortbow range is bad, I sevenshot someone on mid who's now dead on far!

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@"Leonidrex.5649" said:Lets be real here, the LoS excuse is proper kitten kitten for good 30% of projectile attacks.I got SO kitten MANY KILLS on lb when it curved around corner to hit people it stopped being funny and became pathetic.Rampage rock, rangers lb, lich for autos are the ones that come to mind with their kitten.Lich for is the worst as the proj just flies straight and then does 90 degree turn around corners sometimes.The only things that actually "respect" LoS are beam attacks and those get randomly kitten by random pebbles on the floor.Anyone that played GS mesmer will tell you that auto sometimes gets LoS for absolutely no kitten reason.And the best thing is? I fought ranger, we both stood still, I was auto-attacking on gs I got " LoS " but he was hitting me just fine. Even reflected his arrows and they all landed fine, but all my skills? " los " " los " . Proper kitten.

Yeah thats bad, but have you ever Shadowstepped/portaled away to max range and still get hit by a projectile attack? Those are the really juicy kills which makes me wish I could permarecord my gameplay. I mean who says renegade shortbow range is bad, I sevenshot someone on mid who's now dead on far!

bruh, I legit blinked away from warrior, and his bullscharge still connected AFTER blink to not only crit me for 8k but also knock me down.Projectiles are no different, this are hella bugged

[K THEN.5162]

The projectile buffer can get so bad that longbow range can even exceed the range of even sic em

[pukish.5784]

according to JRPGGun = cool, trickyLongbow = strong

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@"K THEN.5162" said:The projectile buffer can get so bad that longbow range can even exceed the range of even sic em

Sic Em is 2000 range. You're gaining +500 range by standing on higher elevation with a longbow.

Every modern game with bow casting works this way. I don't know why it surprises people in Guild Wars 2.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@Shao.7236 said:

@bethekey.8314 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:@bethekey.8314@Leonidrex.5649@"CutesySylveon.8290"

Say it yourselves this time. Fill in the blanks:

"Just

_"

It's interpolation jank, I don't know what your ping is, neither theirs, but the rifle velocity of deadeye is above the average which causes that stuff to happen a lot, unfortunately even normal stuff like Lich tends to track.

It all depends on people ping, if someone with 300 ping hits you on their screen, you're guaranteed to get the projectile going around the obstacle even if already behind it.

Technically having a bad ping has it's advantages as it delays evade frames also, compared the good ping who still has to wait for info to come in. The only good thing low ping does is being able to react properly at bursts.

I have normally 70 ping on NA servers and I never see things like this happen.

However, when I once tried to play EU servers, I had 250 - 350 ping on average and I seen things like this happening often, as well as things like a Spellbreaker begin a Bull's Charge and then seemingly teleport instantly without a gap close animation and be on top of me.

W/e is going on in that video is not an LOS issue. It's an issue with lag.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@"Trevor Boyer.6524" nope, I see this shit while having ~30pingrapid-fire someone when they run towards LoS, ALWAYS 1-3 extra arrows will land that are " bullshit "And as far as I can tell bull/dash bug comes from warrior having desync/lags, sometimes they fly through the sky, sometimes they run in place and teleport, and sometimes they run the wrong way and suddenly are on top of you, shrug

[LionZero.3479]

Shao is correct this game was never build for consistency just for numbers #desyncwars

Gw1 fully server sided pvp respected a players input and position unlike the desync this game offers cause of client sided position/evade frame forwarding to server, low ping indeed at times feels like a liability and actually at times punishes proper position and timing play instead of rewarding it. (least in wvwvw this is often the case don't play spvp to comment on how bad it is there)

Building pvp on such foundations will obviously never lead to serious competition poor mode design, balance and terrain bugs aside.If Anet ever does design a Gw3 in the future it better have fully server sided pvp again.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"K THEN.5162" said:The projectile buffer can get so bad that longbow range can even exceed the range of even sic em

Sic Em is 2000 range. You're gaining +500 range by standing on higher elevation with a longbow.

Every modern game with bow casting works this way. I don't know why it surprises people in Guild Wars 2.

https://imgur.com/gallery/Rrxkb2othis is how bullshit ranger LB is, shot me from about ~2000 range, despite being on a LOWER ground.he was so far away he couldnt even touch me with the edge of barrage, from the caster to the edge of the circle, barrage has ~1860yes somehow their 1500 range arrow shot PAST it, while flying UP.This entire " arcing " lie that people keep repeating like a mantra needs to stop, its not because of elevation that arrows go that far, they are just broken and thats it.

[Rezzet.3614]

this should be fixed or all ranged weapons should be given the extra 300-500 range , what isnt equal is advantage.ranger lb is the biggest offender because rangers gain up to 50% damage based on how far they hit from , maybe remove the bonus after arrow travels past the 1500 rangepersonally i think projectiles should have fixed travel distance.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"K THEN.5162" said:The projectile buffer can get so bad that longbow range can even exceed the range of even sic em

Sic Em is 2000 range. You're gaining +500 range by standing on higher elevation with a longbow.

Every modern game with bow casting works this way. I don't know why it surprises people in Guild Wars 2.

https://imgur.com/gallery/Rrxkb2o

this is how kitten ranger LB is, shot me from about ~2000 range, despite being on a LOWER ground.he was so far away he couldnt even touch me with the edge of barrage, from the caster to the edge of the circle, barrage has ~1860yes somehow their 1500 range arrow shot PAST it, while flying UP.This entire " arcing " lie that people keep repeating like a mantra needs to stop, its not because of elevation that arrows go that far, they are just broken and thats it.

Ok man, just being honest, this screen proves absolutely nothing. Few things:

1. You're standing there at full health.
2. You don't even have a Ranger targeted for us to see.
3. There aren't even damage records in your combat log.
4. All I see is a Smokescale at mid, not a Ranger.
5. We have no idea where the Ranger is actually at.
6. Maybe you also were unaware of where the Ranger was actually at.

Coming from a veteran Ranger main, there a few things you should also be aware of in conjunction with your claim here:

1. He can't utilize Barrage's full 1500 cast range if he can't target the ground you are standing on up the hill. In other words, his Barrage cast was likely shorter than the maximum range as he tried to aim it at the ledge of the hill to hit you. So using Barrage as an example here isn't a good example at all.
2. I still don't see a Ranger anywhere in your screen, nor do I see a RED team Ranger icon on your mini map. I don't know from where you got hit with a LB auto 1, but it clearly was not from a Ranger standing at mid. At least this screen indicates the Ranger is not visibly on your screen at all.
3. If the Ranger was somehow hiding somewhere under that ledge and obstructed by the hill, there is absolutely no way he could hit you with the LB auto 1 unless you or the Ranger were seriously desynched and standing in positions which are not reflected correctly on the screen. I know this because I have played Ranger for 9 years and 20,000 games. If he could hit you with a LB auto without either of you being desynched, the only possible way past that ledge obstruction, would be if the Ranger was visibly on your screen across the other side of mid. I see no Ranger in your screen.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"K THEN.5162" said:The projectile buffer can get so bad that longbow range can even exceed the range of even sic em

Sic Em is 2000 range. You're gaining +500 range by standing on higher elevation with a longbow.

Every modern game with bow casting works this way. I don't know why it surprises people in Guild Wars 2.

https://imgur.com/gallery/Rrxkb2o

this is how kitten ranger LB is, shot me from about ~2000 range, despite being on a LOWER ground.he was so far away he couldnt even touch me with the edge of barrage, from the caster to the edge of the circle, barrage has ~1860yes somehow their 1500 range arrow shot PAST it, while flying UP.This entire " arcing " lie that people keep repeating like a mantra needs to stop, its not because of elevation that arrows go that far, they are just broken and thats it.

Ok man, just being honest, this screen proves absolutely nothing. Few things:

1. You're standing there at full health.
2. You don't even have a Ranger targeted for us to see.
3. There aren't even damage records in your combat log.
4. All I see is a Smokescale at mid, not a Ranger.
5. We have no idea where the Ranger is actually at.
6. Maybe you also were unaware of where the Ranger was actually at.

Coming from a veteran Ranger main, there a few things you should also be aware of in conjunction with your claim here:

1. He can't utilize Barrage's full 1500 cast range if he can't target the ground you are standing on up the hill. In other words, his Barrage cast was likely shorter than the maximum range as he tried to aim it at the ledge of the hill to hit you. So using Barrage as an example here isn't a good example at all.
2. I still don't see a Ranger anywhere in your screen, nor do I see a RED team Ranger icon on your mini map. I don't know from where you got hit with a LB auto 1, but it clearly was not from a Ranger standing at mid. At least this screen indicates the Ranger is not visibly on your screen at all.
3. If the Ranger was somehow hiding somewhere under that ledge and obstructed by the hill, there is absolutely no way he could hit you with the LB auto 1 unless you or the Ranger were seriously desynched and standing in positions which are not reflected correctly on the screen. I know this because I have played Ranger for 9 years and 20,000 games. If he could hit you with a LB auto without either of you being desynched, the only possible way past that ledge obstruction, would be if the Ranger was visibly on your screen across the other side of mid. I see no Ranger in your screen.

how can you miss the ranger?he is next to the stairs on that edge of a cliff thingy, left side of the point.you can also see him on the minimap, with the clusterduck of all other characterson the screen nr 2, I even took the screenshot the MOMENT I got hit with his LB auto-attackDont pay attention to the first screen, it was just a way to gauge the distance more or less

EDITI also have him targeted btw

EDIT v2as someone that started playing ranger1 you CAN utilize barrage at max range through and around terrain as it can be cast on higher or lower ground AND it bypasses LoS, so you can cast it through walls2,3 explained with the screenshot nr 2

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"K THEN.5162" said:The projectile buffer can get so bad that longbow range can even exceed the range of even sic em

Sic Em is 2000 range. You're gaining +500 range by standing on higher elevation with a longbow.

Every modern game with bow casting works this way. I don't know why it surprises people in Guild Wars 2.

https://imgur.com/gallery/Rrxkb2o

this is how kitten ranger LB is, shot me from about ~2000 range, despite being on a LOWER ground.he was so far away he couldnt even touch me with the edge of barrage, from the caster to the edge of the circle, barrage has ~1860yes somehow their 1500 range arrow shot PAST it, while flying UP.This entire " arcing " lie that people keep repeating like a mantra needs to stop, its not because of elevation that arrows go that far, they are just broken and thats it.

Ok man, just being honest, this screen proves absolutely nothing. Few things:

1. You're standing there at full health.
2. You don't even have a Ranger targeted for us to see.
3. There aren't even damage records in your combat log.
4. All I see is a Smokescale at mid, not a Ranger.
5. We have no idea where the Ranger is actually at.
6. Maybe you also were unaware of where the Ranger was actually at.

Coming from a veteran Ranger main, there a few things you should also be aware of in conjunction with your claim here:

1. He can't utilize Barrage's full 1500 cast range if he can't target the ground you are standing on up the hill. In other words, his Barrage cast was likely shorter than the maximum range as he tried to aim it at the ledge of the hill to hit you. So using Barrage as an example here isn't a good example at all.
2. I still don't see a Ranger anywhere in your screen, nor do I see a RED team Ranger icon on your mini map. I don't know from where you got hit with a LB auto 1, but it clearly was not from a Ranger standing at mid. At least this screen indicates the Ranger is not visibly on your screen at all.
3. If the Ranger was somehow hiding somewhere under that ledge and obstructed by the hill, there is absolutely no way he could hit you with the LB auto 1 unless you or the Ranger were seriously desynched and standing in positions which are not reflected correctly on the screen. I know this because I have played Ranger for 9 years and 20,000 games. If he could hit you with a LB auto without either of you being desynched, the only possible way past that ledge obstruction, would be if the Ranger was visibly on your screen across the other side of mid. I see no Ranger in your screen.

how can you miss the ranger?he is next to the stairs on that edge of a cliff thingy, left side of the point.you can also see him on the minimap, with the clusterduck of all other characterson the screen nr 2, I even took the screenshot the MOMENT I got hit with his LB auto-attackDont pay attention to the first screen, it was just a way to gauge the distance more or less

EDITI also have him targeted btw

EDIT v2as someone that started playing ranger1 you CAN utilize barrage at max range through and around terrain as it can be cast on higher or lower ground AND it bypasses LoS, so you can cast it through walls2,3 explained with the screenshot nr 2

Oh I see. I didn't notice the other 2 screens.

Dude that's normal LB range. He miscast his Barrage, if he had moved it further in, he could have easily hit you from that position.

Also consider that when you are trying to test range with your Mes GS 3, you are aiming down diagonally from elevation which is also eating range. That Ranger is on the same elevation as you and in a straight line.

There are some visual anomalies in GW2 I've noticed, concerning visual graphical span and actual range that the game is calculating.

For example, haven't you ever noticed in WvW in the Alpine Borderlands specifically, that there are ledges which appear to be shorter drops than others but when you go off it, it will full 100% fall damage and kill you. But then there are other ledges which seem taller that you can drop from and survive. This same thing happens in some spots with ranged projectiles I've noticed.

But for the sake of testing, I'll go in game and do this myself. Now I'm curious.

[Lucentfir.7430]

@"LionZero.3479" said:Shao is correct this game was never build for consistency just for numbers #desyncwars

Gw1 fully server sided pvp respected a players input and position unlike the desync this game offers cause of client sided position/evade frame forwarding to server, low ping indeed at times feels like a liability and actually at times punishes proper position and timing play instead of rewarding it. (least in wvwvw this is often the case don't play spvp to comment on how bad it is there)

Building pvp on such foundations will obviously never lead to serious competition poor mode design, balance and terrain bugs aside.If Anet ever does design a Gw3 in the future it better have fully server sided pvp again.

Let me share with you a tale of desync/lag, in form of a WvW video. I still think GW2 has the best feeling combat on the MMORPG market for skilled combat, safe to say if any other MMO replicates this system and handles the game Gw2 loses it's last niche outside of horizontal progression.