Hardest profession to master?

[Genesis.5169]

Mesmer and thief, both an insanely squishy and are burst classes which means if you make a mistake and your burst is dodged you need to fall back which in general requires 2 cds, minimal internal CD's to save themselves and your as tanky as a wet toilet paper. Weaver come in just below them but they have amazing internal CD and normal CD's that can save them from there mistakes, how ever there dps rotation to kill targets requires a bit of finesse as you need to maintain you barrier and damage at the same time.

 

 

 

Every other class is extremely forgiving.

Edited July 30, 2021 by Genesis.5169

[Unknown.6851]

Probably Mesmer, revenant or thief, at least it used to be. 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Double Bearbow Core Ranger is the hardest spec to master

[Quadox.7834]

Play power rev, engi, mes, and fresh air ele, and choose the one you enjoy most

[Myror.7521]

Out of my perspective the hardest classes actually in this meta are: 

Warrior

Mesmer

Ele

 

Meanwhile the easier ones are:

Guardian

Necro

Thief

 

The rest of professions are solid. Means not too bad but also not too good.

[Eddbopkins.2630]

people say fa ele is hard, but i honestly cant play anything else other then fa ele as my most efficient and effecitve class to play. But iv been playing fa ele since year 1 core ele and played it since its evolution so fa is easy for me and i cant wait for what eod will bring to fa, i hope quickness with its off hand weapon. as far as toughest class i feel nothing in this game is all that tough if you have enough practice with it.

with that being said i feel, thf, mes, and ele,would be the toughest. mostly because of their low hp. and lack of defenses.

Edited August 1, 2021 by Eddbopkins.2630

[Myror.7521]

@Eddbopkins.2630 I would say yes but actually no. Thief got no defence weapons boons etc BUT it got insane amount of blinds stealth and dodges plus teleports. That made it extremly forgiven in the whole meta actually. So yea in theory mes ele thief are the thoughest classes but actually they arent since they got like tons of defence mechanics (not boons or blocks of course)

[Raiden The Beast.3016]

Just bc of the unique play it is teef since to be god u need to play ur class extremly good to burst and position ur self, read the map the enemy and ur team all time during the match if not ur team plays a 4vs5 ... no other class has such a big gap between garbo and god 

[Widmo.3186]

Either teef or ele, both in slightly different terms of being "hardest to master". But top ceiling of mechanical skills can be shown on bigger amount of classes than those two, thats for sure. As the opposite you can have...for example necro. Just spam everything and see world burn.

[Arheundel.6451]

On 7/30/2021 at 3:53 PM, Genesis.5169 said:

Mesmer and thief, both an insanely squishy and are burst classes which means if you make a mistake and your burst is dodged you need to fall back which in general requires 2 cds, minimal internal CD's to save themselves and your as tanky as a wet toilet paper. Weaver come in just below them but they have amazing internal CD and normal CD's that can save them from there mistakes, how ever there dps rotation to kill targets requires a bit of finesse as you need to maintain you barrier and damage at the same time.

 

 

 

Every other class is extremely forgiving.

What amazing internal CD lol? You don't get sword evades on every weaver build and likewise you don't automatically get Obsidian Flesh unless you equip focus. If you start including weapon like they'd be extension of the class itself then Mesmer and Thief are virtually unkillable...far from being "squishy" . Thief with the greatest stealth access in the game + shadow step/return and you'd need a potato playing it to see a thief dieing, then Mesmer have stealth utilities, skill and access to distortion  regardless of the weapon/elite used, that's "free" invulnerability on a lower CD than obsidian flesh for which eles give up damage and mobility.

 

Mesmer and Thief squishy....you are not squshy when you can play to meta level with an amulet devoid of toughness and healing power you are squishy when by default can't play without a toughness/healing/vitality amulet

 

People seem to think ele gets Obsidian flesh and sword evades by default for playing ele

[Genesis.5169]

23 minutes ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

What amazing internal CD lol? You don't get sword evades on every weaver build and likewise you don't automatically get Obsidian Flesh unless you equip focus. If you start including weapon like they'd be extension of the class itself then Mesmer and Thief are virtually unkillable...far from being "squishy" . Thief with the greatest stealth access in the game + shadow step/return and you'd need a potato playing it to see a thief dieing, then Mesmer have stealth utilities, skill and access to distortion  regardless of the weapon/elite used, that's "free" invulnerability on a lower CD than obsidian flesh for which eles give up damage and mobility.

 

Mesmer and Thief squishy....you are not squshy when you can play to meta level with an amulet devoid of toughness and healing power you are squishy when by default can't play without a toughness/healing/vitality amulet

 

People seem to think ele gets Obsidian flesh and sword evades by default for playing ele

 

If water/fire.

You have burning cleanse and 1.1k barrier shield on dodge, an another 5k from lesser stone resonance in weaver, you can cleanse conditions swaping to water every ten seconds and cleansing fire to burn enemies and cleanse 3 conditions on your and everyone around you.

 

If fire/earth

You have internal condition cleanse 3 conditions, armor of earth with is stability and protection, stability on earth swap or endurance regen when your cc'd and chance's are you'll run stone heart but you can run diamond skin if you want, also you still have your barrier on dodge it's a little weaker since you have less healing power maybe down to like 800 per dodge and 4k total on resonance.

 

If Water/Earth

You have armor of earth 10 stability 6s of protection, earthen blessing endurance when your cc'd or rock solid stability attuning to earth, and now you can definitely take diamond skin because you can heal with water with soothing mist, you also have the aforementioned water stuff like cleansing burning on dodge and condition removal on water attunement.

 

Keep in mind attunements are a 4 second cd.

I'm talking about weavers i can go into tempest and core if you'd like.

 

Thief's have blind and stealth if you reveal them or they reveal them selves and i condi clear blind that's it you have to use an active cd to leave and that's usually 2 move's a smoke field and a combo to go invis you can blind again or use your evasive ult but again those are active cds.

 

As a mesmer the only good internal cd you have is invis when you hit a certain threshold which isn't a save because you can still be cleaved you need to supplement it with a movement tool like blink or jaunt, every other saving tool like decoy and shatters are active cds.

 

Also i have no problems with internal cooldowns in trait trees, before some one conflates this with internal cooldowns are bad.

[Arheundel.6451]

19 minutes ago, Genesis.5169 said:

 

If water/fire.

You have burning cleanse and 1.1k barrier shield on dodge, an another 5k from lesser stone resonance in weaver, you can cleanse conditions swaping to water every ten seconds and cleansing fire to burn enemies and cleanse 3 conditions on your and everyone around you.

 

If fire/earth

You have internal condition cleanse 3 conditions, armor of earth with is stability and protection, stability on earth swap or endurance regen when your cc'd and chance's are you'll run stone heart but you can run diamond skin if you want, also you still have your barrier on dodge it's a little weaker since you have less healing power maybe down to like 800 per dodge and 4k total on resonance.

 

If Water/Earth

You have armor of earth 10 stability 6s of protection, earthen blessing endurance when your cc'd or rock solid stability attuning to earth, and now you can definitely take diamond skin because you can heal with water with soothing mist, you also have the aforementioned water stuff like cleansing burning on dodge and condition removal on water attunement.

 

Keep in mind attunements are a 4 second cd.

I'm talking about weavers i can go into tempest and core if you'd like.

 

Thief's have blind and stealth if you reveal them or they reveal them selves and i condi clear blind that's it you have to use an active cd to leave and that's usually 2 move's a smoke field and a combo to go invis you can blind again or use your evasive ult but again those are active cds.

 

As a mesmer the only good internal cd you have is invis when you hit a certain threshold which isn't a save because you can still be cleaved you need to supplement it with a movement tool like blink or jaunt, every other saving tool like decoy and shatters are active cds.

 

Also i have no problems with internal cooldowns in trait trees, before some one conflates this with internal cooldowns are bad.

It's clear you never played an ele ever....you just randomly read traits off wiki and :

 

1) You give people traits number with stats investment, Invigorating strike is 600...not 1.2k

2) Other traits you mention are on a 60s-70s-300s ICD....

3) Diamond skin works on being hit...it's not free clear

 

You are extremely confused and just talking from an extremely biased point of view.......4s attunement and then you mention stone skin?.....you really don't know how weaver works do you?  you wouldn't mention traits like stone skin otherwise...

 

 

[Genesis.5169]

57 minutes ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

It's clear you never played an ele ever....you just randomly read traits off wiki and :

 

1) You give people traits number with stats investment, Invigorating strike is 600...not 1.2k

2) Other traits you mention are on a 60s-70s-300s ICD....

3) Diamond skin works on being hit...it's not free clear

 

You are extremely confused and just talking from an extremely biased point of view.......4s attunement and then you mention stone skin?.....you really don't know how weaver works do you?  you wouldn't mention traits like stone skin otherwise...

 

 

 

In 3v3s and 2v2 where cooldown reset every round ICDs only need to pop once.

https://ibb.co/nm9VS8z

1,275 is you spend 1 bar.

https://ibb.co/ct2WVYh

2.5k When you spend both bars.

 

Also i gave traits with stat investments why wouldn't I?

Why would you not supplement your traits with stats?

I even specified that your barrier will be lower without water.

 

Clip key is shift + windows key + S and my dodge button is shift i didnt spend to bars its just hard to clip and not press have shift already held down.

Edited July 31, 2021 by Genesis.5169
Added a second photo so its not confused if i'm using both my edurance bars.

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

1 hour ago, Genesis.5169 said:

 

If water/fire.

You have burning cleanse and 1.1k barrier shield on dodge, an another 5k from lesser stone resonance in weaver, you can cleanse conditions swaping to water every ten seconds and cleansing fire to burn enemies and cleanse 3 conditions on your and everyone around you.

 

If fire/earth

You have internal condition cleanse 3 conditions, armor of earth with is stability and protection, stability on earth swap or endurance regen when your cc'd and chance's are you'll run stone heart but you can run diamond skin if you want, also you still have your barrier on dodge it's a little weaker since you have less healing power maybe down to like 800 per dodge and 4k total on resonance.

 

If Water/Earth

You have armor of earth 10 stability 6s of protection, earthen blessing endurance when your cc'd or rock solid stability attuning to earth, and now you can definitely take diamond skin because you can heal with water with soothing mist, you also have the aforementioned water stuff like cleansing burning on dodge and condition removal on water attunement.

 

Keep in mind attunements are a 4 second cd.

I'm talking about weavers i can go into tempest and core if you'd like.

 

Thief's have blind and stealth if you reveal them or they reveal them selves and i condi clear blind that's it you have to use an active cd to leave and that's usually 2 move's a smoke field and a combo to go invis you can blind again or use your evasive ult but again those are active cds.

 

As a mesmer the only good internal cd you have is invis when you hit a certain threshold which isn't a save because you can still be cleaved you need to supplement it with a movement tool like blink or jaunt, every other saving tool like decoy and shatters are active cds.

 

Also i have no problems with internal cooldowns in trait trees, before some one conflates this with internal cooldowns are bad.

Yes, most of your listed things are worthless and useless most of the time or have very specific conditions to even work. Burning Fire is self cleanse...

4 second cooldown is to switch attuments, but to get all skills from 1 attument you need 8 seconds minimum.

[Genesis.5169]

1 minute ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

Yes, most of your listed things are worthless and useless most of the time or have very specific conditions to even work. Burning Fire is self cleanse...

4 second cooldown is to switch attuments, but to get all skills from 1 attument you need 8 seconds minimum.

 

Sure but they exist unlike mesmers and theives if you get snared or stunned you have a couple of free outs before you have to use your bar or if you did use your bar and your on CD and you get cc'd you have an internal out to save you. I did say they are the 3rd most difficult to play.

[anjo.6143]

On 7/30/2021 at 10:55 AM, Arheundel.6451 said:

90% of GW2 forum citizen: "the hardest is the one I play...."

 

1) Taking the bias out of the way: the easiest professions are those that can naturally be played without prior knowledge of gear, traits and enemy, thus : Necromancer , of all classes it requires the least amount of input from a new player.
2) Professions with access to defensive mechanics that require no specific setup, traits, gear to be used.These mechanics are available for "free" regardless of what weapon or utility you use: Mesmer, Guardian

3) The following have access to forms of sustain that do not necessitate any investment in healing power and can easily become tanky/bruiser regardless of the stats used: Ranger - Thief - Warrior -Engineer -Revenant 

4) Lastly the hardest profession in GW2 , requires healing power , vitality investement to be viable at bare min, virtually unplayable without heavy stat investment in vitality or toughness. For the last couple of years , the viability of this class has been linked to focus , playing without focus requires a level of skill and commitment in this game that is unheard from other professions.

 

 

 

Thief sustain without investment? 

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

In general:

 

Ele hardest to master, followed by Thief. Both of these classes require situational awareness and/or understanding of multiple skills and their synergies. their playstyle often needs to adapt based on their opponent and will often revolve around what the opponent does. I almost always respect eles, especially weavers not running sword mainhand, for their ability to manage all of their cooldowns in a way that gets them a win. I respect thieves too, because bad ones are quickly sniffed out and killed. You have to bring a certain level of mastery to that class if you arent just camping stealth to be effective. Ele has the weaknesses of mesmer and thief, without access to stealth. 

 

Under that you have Mesmer and Engineer as a tie, with engineer being slightly more difficult. As a whole, you require slightly more awareness of your skills and situations in combat as engineer compared to Mesmer. Mesmer has the same situational awareness need as thief, but is slightly more insulated and more forgiving vs everything that is not thief.

 

Then you have ranger, warrior, and revenant. These classes are more forgiving to play than the above and have a more straightforward path to mastery because  a lot of their mitigation is built in and doesnt hyperfixate on reacting specifically to the opponent like mesmer, thief, ele and in a few cases engie do. You can eat a burst and be fine on these classes. On the ones above you likely will die for not being ahead of that.

 

Then, under that you have Necro and Guardian. Defenses for these classes are naturally high and in many cases generate automatically. their playstyles usually revolve wide casts or damage that is dealt automatically, and their rescue resources are forgiving. You can eat multiple bursts on these classes and still be able to reset the fight/mechanics will often mitigate bursts for you. 

 

All of the above being said, This tier list can easily be thrown out the window based on how cheesy you decide to play. Weapons and build, more than class profession, determine how easy or hard the mastery path is.

 

Staff mirage is not harder than hammer guardian.

Juggernaut engie is not harder than axe/shield warrior.

Auramancer isn't harder than oneshot chronomancer.

Deadeye isn't harder than Reaper. 

 

It's what you choose to play on that class that determines how long it will take you to master it. There is a skilled necro/guardian playing something fancy for every unskilled mesmer/engie/thief playing a carry build. 

Edited August 1, 2021 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Genesis.5169]

FA ele mains laughing into oblivion with all that difficulty.

XD

Also

https://ibb.co/M79B79W

I play the top 3 hardest classes in the game on the regular, and the hardest version of guardian.

No ele is hard as Thief and Mesmer coming to think about it, it might even easier then engineer.

Edited August 1, 2021 by Genesis.5169
Clarity and additional info.

[Arheundel.6451]

1 hour ago, Genesis.5169 said:

FA ele mains laughing into oblivion with all that difficulty.

XD

Also

https://ibb.co/M79B79W

I play the top 3 hardest classes in the game on the regular, and the hardest version of guardian.

No ele is hard as Thief and Mesmer coming to think about it, it might even easier then engineer.

You keep saying that...show us a video of you playing without focus and healing power and in a open arena 😂😂😂😂. C'mon pro player! Ele so easy but all you can brag about is bunker gameplay, everything becomes easier when you slap a healing amulet with double defensive line, we should try that with thief and see how "hard is to play"...oh wait ....thief and mesmer are not gated by stats like ele, a class limited to the same off hand to get any reasonable sustain option....considered easy...🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

Hmm oh wait I want to see a video of you playing ele without focus and healing power and instead use a marauder amulet! 

 

NO FOCUS! C'mon pro player! Show us the video! 

Edited August 1, 2021 by Arheundel.6451

[Genesis.5169]

2 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

You keep saying that...show us a video of you playing without focus and healing power and in a open arena 😂😂😂😂. C'mon pro player! Ele so easy but all you can brag about is bunker gameplay, everything becomes easier when you slap a healing amulet with double defensive line, we should try that with thief and see how "hard is to play"...oh wait ....thief and mesmer are not gated by stats like ele, a class limited to the same off hand to get any reasonable sustain option....considered easy...🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

Hmm oh wait I want to see a video of you playing ele without focus and healing power and instead use a marauder amulet! 

 

NO FOCUS! C'mon pro player! Show us the video! 

 

Sage and Avatar ponders in the distance.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

On 8/1/2021 at 7:52 AM, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

In general:

 

Ele hardest to master, followed by Thief. Both of these classes require situational awareness and/or understanding of multiple skills and their synergies. their playstyle often needs to adapt based on their opponent and will often revolve around what the opponent does. I almost always respect eles, especially weavers not running sword mainhand, for their ability to manage all of their cooldowns in a way that gets them a win. I respect thieves too, because bad ones are quickly sniffed out and killed. You have to bring a certain level of mastery to that class if you arent just camping stealth to be effective. Ele has the weaknesses of mesmer and thief, without access to stealth. 

 

Under that you have Mesmer and Engineer as a tie, with engineer being slightly more difficult. As a whole, you require slightly more awareness of your skills and situations in combat as engineer compared to Mesmer. Mesmer has the same situational awareness need as thief, but is slightly more insulated and more forgiving vs everything that is not thief.

 

Then you have ranger, warrior, and revenant. These classes are more forgiving to play than the above and have a more straightforward path to mastery because  a lot of their mitigation is built in and doesnt hyperfixate on reacting specifically to the opponent like mesmer, thief, ele and in a few cases engie do. You can eat a burst and be fine on these classes. On the ones above you likely will die for not being ahead of that.

 

Then, under that you have Necro and Guardian. Defenses for these classes are naturally high and in many cases generate automatically. their playstyles usually revolve wide casts or damage that is dealt automatically, and their rescue resources are forgiving. You can eat multiple bursts on these classes and still be able to reset the fight/mechanics will often mitigate bursts for you. 

 

All of the above being said, This tier list can easily be thrown out the window based on how cheesy you decide to play. Weapons and build, more than class profession, determine how easy or hard the mastery path is.

 

Staff mirage is not harder than hammer guardian.

Juggernaut engie is not harder than axe/shield warrior.

Auramancer isn't harder than oneshot chronomancer.

Deadeye isn't harder than Reaper. 

 

It's what you choose to play on that class that determines how long it will take you to master it. There is a skilled necro/guardian playing something fancy for every unskilled mesmer/engie/thief playing a carry build. 

This is fairly accurate. I'd also add that within 
- ranger, revenant and warrior

- guardian and necromancer

there are some differences between telegraphs and tells, which via the account of affecting counterplay adds to or subtracts from the learning curve / difficulty. Considering how much tankier these classes are by comparison, it has a cumulative effect on the gameplay.

Feb 2020 patch furthered this cumulation, which made each of these classes more difficult to balance - which is one of the reasons warrior is "in the dumpster" to an extent, and necromancer effectively controls the meta.

Edited August 2, 2021 by NorthernRedStar.3054

[Caedmon.6798]

On 8/1/2021 at 6:52 AM, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

In general:

 

Ele hardest to master, followed by Thief. Both of these classes require situational awareness and/or understanding of multiple skills and their synergies. their playstyle often needs to adapt based on their opponent and will often revolve around what the opponent does. I almost always respect eles, especially weavers not running sword mainhand, for their ability to manage all of their cooldowns in a way that gets them a win. I respect thieves too, because bad ones are quickly sniffed out and killed. You have to bring a certain level of mastery to that class if you arent just camping stealth to be effective. Ele has the weaknesses of mesmer and thief, without access to stealth. 

 

Under that you have Mesmer and Engineer as a tie, with engineer being slightly more difficult. As a whole, you require slightly more awareness of your skills and situations in combat as engineer compared to Mesmer. Mesmer has the same situational awareness need as thief, but is slightly more insulated and more forgiving vs everything that is not thief.

 

Then you have ranger, warrior, and revenant. These classes are more forgiving to play than the above and have a more straightforward path to mastery because  a lot of their mitigation is built in and doesnt hyperfixate on reacting specifically to the opponent like mesmer, thief, ele and in a few cases engie do. You can eat a burst and be fine on these classes. On the ones above you likely will die for not being ahead of that.

 

Then, under that you have Necro and Guardian. Defenses for these classes are naturally high and in many cases generate automatically. their playstyles usually revolve wide casts or damage that is dealt automatically, and their rescue resources are forgiving. You can eat multiple bursts on these classes and still be able to reset the fight/mechanics will often mitigate bursts for you. 

 

All of the above being said, This tier list can easily be thrown out the window based on how cheesy you decide to play. Weapons and build, more than class profession, determine how easy or hard the mastery path is.

 

Staff mirage is not harder than hammer guardian.

Juggernaut engie is not harder than axe/shield warrior.

Auramancer isn't harder than oneshot chronomancer.

Deadeye isn't harder than Reaper. 

 

It's what you choose to play on that class that determines how long it will take you to master it. There is a skilled necro/guardian playing something fancy for every unskilled mesmer/engie/thief playing a carry build. 

For thieves its dodge or stealth. On De they are still restricted to 2 dodges,one extra if you pop agi sigil which is a util use. Using stealth properly meaning,using dodges to gain stealth - Mark with Sa or using a util requires more as spamming dodge on DD. DE Rely on stealth for multiple factors,staying at distance,denying a burst,repositioning. If they arent able to do this well,they die in 3 hits. Lots of people pretend De has no skill,but i hardly see any proper De players around myself,dont count the ones that are able to port out and run. De's that manage init,stealth gain well while applying proper pressure in the meanwhile and getting their target in outmanned fights is something that isnt easy to master.

Edited August 4, 2021 by Caedmon.6798

[Stand The Wall.6987]

what you guys talking about. the ele support/ bunker spec is easy as hell to play, even easier after damage nerfs.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

On 7/30/2021 at 2:55 PM, Arheundel.6451 said:

90% of GW2 forum citizen: "the hardest is the one I play...."

 

 

Yet, you too are saying the one you play it's the hardest. 

[Cynz.9437]

We are all very biased here so here is my also biased answer:

i would say thief and mesmer (i mean non-mirage here; would probably add rev to the list but most of the time that class was just soooo overloaded for the sake of sales that it made any encounter a joke). Not necessary due to class mechanics itself (it can be practiced on a golem or macroed, yes rangers, i am looking at you) however due to role.

Roaming involves more than few dodges, you need good map awareness, make quick decision where to move, who to attack, who to sacrifice, when to disengage etc. while also not being allowed to hold the point. It is also a role that requires heavily on team doing OKeish, it is really hard to carry as roamer if not a single person on your team can hold a point for a bit. The games i found the most stressful were always either vs top players (because they know how to coordinate and shut down roamer quickly) or in lower brackets (see placements) because i have to play roamer, bunker, bruiser all in one despite my class not designed for it simply because people don't know how to rotate and don't know their class well. The gap between good roamer and bad roamer is HUGE. I have played this game basically since launch (with some breaks) and i still can't claim that i am really good roamer (just good enough to get in plat) and there are players that are miles better than me. Watching good roamer gameplay is almost like looking at art.

 

I know many will hate me for it but rest of the classes or rather their designated roles are, imo, more straight forward and require less micro management (on average). I have played necro and engi as team fighters/node holders in the past and it was just was way more relaxed (and forgiving) in comparison.

Edited August 4, 2021 by Cynz.9437