Do you believe the devs are so disconnected with ele community to make ANOTHER melee spec?

[Obtena.7952]

7 minutes ago, Srolo.5208 said:

You need to learn some social nuance because you're taking every comment to the extreme literal definition. 

No social nuance needed ... people are using the false premise they speak for EVERYONE to complain about Anet not fulfilling their individual wants. 

The fact is that Anet can't cater to individuals with an MMO that serves millions of players, so right of the bat these threads are nonsensical. 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Srolo.5208]

2 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No social nuance needed ... people are using the false premise they speak for EVERYONE to complain about Anet not fulfilling their individual wants. 

The fact is that Anet can't cater to individuals with an MMO that serves millions of players, so right of the bat these threads are nonsensical. 

Obviously they're not when the forum is currently in an uproar over ANOTHER melee spec. But go ahead and keep your head in the sand. There's a point in time, like it or not, when the devs DON'T actually know what's best. There's plenty of other now dead MMO's to be used as examples.

[Sigerk.2897]

5 minutes ago, Srolo.5208 said:

You need to learn some social nuance because you're taking every comment to the extreme literal definition. You're doing it for one of two reasons, and one is medical. The other is just because you're an kitten. Obviously there's going to be outliers that want something that the vast majority do not, but just because a handful of people compared to the overwhelming majority want something doesn't mean that they should be the ones catered to, to turn the argument back on you. 

The biggest issue we have is that hammer could have been a much needed refreshing weapon for ele. Instead, we get more melee. This wouldn't be the issue that it is if our current TWO choices for range weren't nearly dumpster tier. If staff and scepter were inline with the current version of the game it'd be much less of an issue, but as it stands, we're screwed out of any GOOD ranged weapons and there doesn't seem to be any hope for a fix. 

I don't PvE. If hammer works in whatever yall do for PvE fantastic. Great. I'm sick of being forced to use an outdated clunky weapon like staff that can't keep up in WvW because of all of the slow cast times, cast times that require me to be stationary for extended periods of time or they get canceled, and delay on damage from those skills.

 

Your first paragraph is just rude, and jumping to conclusions. Talk about nuance...

 

Your next two paragraphs are fine, you explain well why you disagree, and have good points. I don't see why you have to bring up someone's supposed medical condition, and call them a kitten to boot.

[Obtena.7952]

8 minutes ago, Srolo.5208 said:

Obviously they're not when the forum is currently in an uproar over ANOTHER melee spec. 

That's absurd and sensational ... the second someone doesn't like something they complain about it, even if their complaint is based on the ridiculous idea that Anet should do what THEY want, under the guise that what THEY want is the same as what EVERYONE wants. 

No, I'm not an kitten ... I just know the game isn't about what I want. I also know it's not about what any other individual wants. I also don't go around pretending like what I want is what's right for the game and everyone while making baseless accusations against Anet to justify that false sense of authority. 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[ButterPeanut.9746]

5 minutes ago, Roda.7468 said:

 

The obvious bias / straight up GRUDGE against ranged players is the only reason I haven't commited myself more to the game and its high end content.

 

The core game systems limit ranged gameplay, especially from a PvE perspective. The sheer amount of benefits you lose from being alone at ranged and not in your group with all of the boons effectively makes the "ranged DPS" playstyle in PvE purposefully not existent in this game. 

 

This isn't a new thing, it's always how the PvE in this game has been. 

[Zeph.5927]

Elementalist used to be my main back at release (and was my main all throughout GW1). It is so sad and demoralizing to see how Anet has treated this class and butchered it over the years. It’s like they don’t even know what to do with it anymore.

It looks like deleting my Elementalist after PoF released was still a good decision. Still no reason to consider touching one.

Edited September 16, 2021 by Zeph.5927

[draxynnic.3719]

10 minutes ago, Tempest.8479 said:

Just thought I'd post in this thread as well to break up some of the negativity, but according to this press release, it looks like hammer has some mid-range capabilities as well. For those that haven't seen it:

 

“Catalysts were casters from a bygone era, working to protect Cantha and the throne from enemy threats. They wielded intricate apparatuses called spheres that were used as conduits to channel their immense power. This technology has been revitalized once again—with a couple of improvements! Catalysts imbue ancient magics into their jade tech spheres, calling upon imagery from all over Tyria to concentrate into a powerful burst of elemental energy. The catalyst is primarily a damage dealer that is adept at controlling areas of the battlefield. After building up elemental energy through combat, it can be expended to deploy and maintain the Jade Sphere, creating an area of power that bolsters allies and damages enemies. Wielding a hammer, the catalyst gains access to a mix of midrange and close-range abilities, allowing it to adapt to the situation at hand.”

That's interesting. Probably could have been shown better in the video, and it depends on just what they define as 'mid-range' (it's usually 900ish, which would be sufficient) as well as whether any of the midrange skills are autoattacks, but that does at least suggest more potential than the video does.

[Stallic.2397]

This is just lazy. Another melee spec doesn't change the way Ele is played. Elite Specs were supposed to switch things up. Change the status quo. Melee Hammer forces Ele to have the same problems they always had. Low Armor, low health, in the heat of battle. Forced to spec into defensive trait lines just to survive long enough to cause an effect. 

 

Trading out Hammer for Scepter or Staff isn't what the community wanted either. Those core weapons have been played for almost a decade at this point. Where's the variety!?

 

20 new skills for mid-range of long-range would have been creative and game-changing. Melee hammer sounds like just another dagger or sword or tempest spec. Even if it's a strong bruiser spec, it'll still be weaver 2.0 instead of having it's own identity. 

[Roda.7468]

5 minutes ago, ButterPeanut.9746 said:

 

The core game systems limit ranged gameplay, especially from a PvE perspective. The sheer amount of benefits you lose from being alone at ranged and not in your group with all of the boons effectively makes the "ranged DPS" playstyle in PvE purposefully not existent in this game. 

 

This isn't a new thing, it's always how the PvE in this game has been. 

Correct this is a thing I've said in my post.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

5 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No social nuance needed ... people are using the false premise they speak for EVERYONE to complain about Anet not fulfilling their individual wants. 

The fact is that Anet can't cater to individuals with an MMO that serves millions of players, so right of the bat these threads are nonsensical. 

 

You should understand in debates we use generalities as a anner of speaking, to wrap up a majority of people, OR a majority party, a majority idea, etc. We could add "Not all ###" "Not all men" "Not all elementalist" "Not all frenchs were invading Russia" "Not all englishs wanted brexit" because yes it seems some people can't make the nuance themself,  but it seems so obvious we don't.

 

Because yes, even if not a majority of players wanted a ranged option it was the majority wish anyway; others players just didn't care, or didn't want to chose, don't play elementalist...

But I already know you will be like "Source ? Anet this, Anet that ... " I don't even know why I comment.

[Tempest.8479]

2 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

That's interesting. Probably could have been shown better in the video, and it depends on just what they define as 'mid-range' (it's usually 900ish, which would be sufficient) as well as whether any of the midrange skills are autoattacks, but that does at least suggest more potential than the video does.

If you look around the :30 sec mark of the trailer, it also looks like you can fire the augments from wells at range. I think we might be underestimating the ranged potential of the spec.

[Obtena.7952]

5 minutes ago, Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:

 

You should understand in debates we use generalities as a anner of speaking, to wrap up a majority of people, OR a majority party, a majority idea, etc. We could add "Not all ###" "Not all men" "Not all elementalist" "Not all frenchs were invading Russia" "Not all englishs wanted brexit" because yes it seems some people can't make the nuance themself,  but it seems so obvious we don't.

 

Because yes, even if not a majority of players wanted a ranged option it was the majority wish anyway; others players just didn't care, or didn't want to chose, don't play elementalist...

But I already know you will be like "Source ? Anet this, Anet that ... " I don't even know why I comment.

Yeah I got that, but that doesn't change my point ... Anet can't cater to what everyone wants so of course that means some people don't like it. That's not a reason to claim EVERYONE wants the same thing and Anet isn't delivering it and Anet is NOT disconnected from players just because someone didn't get something they wanted. 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

1 minute ago, Tempest.8479 said:

If you look around the :30 sec mark of the trailer, it also looks like you can fire the augments from wells at range. I think we might be underestimating the ranged potential of the spec.

 

 

We also have some leaps apparantly; plus yeah we could hope from a two handed weapon, on elementalist some range option.

[Touchme.1097]

You can either wait until Anet wastes all the melee weapon implementations to the Elementalist profession and cross your fingers to get a decent ranged E spec or you can quit playing this profession right now. Your choice matters.

I already did mine, my Elementalist is collecting dust until something interesting is released.

Edited September 16, 2021 by Touchme.1097

[Vissarion.6509]

6 minutes ago, Touchme.1097 said:

You can either wait until Anet wastes all the melee weapon implementations to the Elementalist profession and cross your fingers to get a decent ranged E spec or you can quit playing this profession right now. Your choice matters.

I already did mine, my Elementalist is collecting dust until something interesting is released.

So true, I am playing necro and revenant a lot the last couple of years, i've not touched ele for a long while, and even when i go and play some chill open world with ele i just regret it afterwards which i could be playing a more fun and enjoyable class.

 

Quote

 

The core game systems limit ranged gameplay, especially from a PvE perspective. The sheer amount of benefits you lose from being alone at ranged and not in your group with all of the boons effectively makes the "ranged DPS" playstyle in PvE purposefully not existent in this game. 

This isn't a new thing, it's always how the PvE in this game has been. 

 

There's more than raids/strikes and fractals in this game. Open World/metas, PvP and WvW are like 80% of the content and you really want (or need) ranged for those gamemodes.

Edited September 16, 2021 by Vissarion.6509

[Winterwrenn.9160]

2 hours ago, Ragnarox.9601 said:

at least you get usefull hammer (guardian main here) and our willie is really garbage compared to this new elites.

Hey, at least your willie is very fast!  But, then again.....nobody wants a super fast willy.   LOL

Edited September 16, 2021 by Winterwrenn.9160

[Arheundel.6451]

1 hour ago, Mik.3401 said:

Could you elaborate please? Do you imply weaver sword is as weak as thief sword?

It's far less fluid than a core d/d, less reactionary and more based on static rotations against which you can only hope a fool would fail against...that's about it. Tipically very clanky to use unless somebody is willingly to memorize specific patterns of attack for given scenario, something the majority doesn't like doing.....nobody pays you to memorize attacks sequences for specific siituations, especially after being used to the reactionary gameplay of d/d ele which is much more fluid and intuitive than sword

[Tempest.8479]

4 minutes ago, Vissarion.6509 said:

So true, I am playing necro and revenant a lot the last couple of years, i've not touched ele for a long while, and even when i go and play some chill open world with ele i just regret it afterwards which i could be playing a more fun and enjoyable class.

So might have an unpopular opinion, certainly in this thread from what I've read, but I think Weaver's playstyle is easily the most enjoyable elite spec in the game, both mechanically and aesthetically. So much so that even if Catalyst proves to be a good spec, I don't think I'll be switching my main spec from Weaver. That being said, I can recognize some of the deficiencies in it's design, namely around the tradeoff between damage and survivability.

 

I think with the new info that Catalyst might be more than just close range and could have the potential to be a bit more supportive, with some refinements to Weaver traits/skills eles could get to a good place.

[EpicName.4523]

It is very a reasonable addition to include a new spec that plays very differently...

 

However, it is not reasonable to add THIRD melee spec to a profession based on a ranged caster archetype while having NO GOOD RANGED option for it.  

[Merrex.5384]

I totally agree with you they don't even care what we want at all. Cloth caster with lowest health in the game gets another Melee weapon with no range at all . We don't need more melee weapons !!!!!!

[Arheundel.6451]

30 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Yeah I got that, but that doesn't change my point ... Anet can't cater to what everyone wants so of course that means some people don't like it. That's not a reason to claim EVERYONE wants the same thing and Anet isn't delivering it and Anet is NOT disconnected from players just because someone didn't get something they wanted. 

Everybody and his dog was asking for a ranged elite! Where the hell do you see people celebrating on another mele elite? The whole ele community wanted a ranged spec!

[montecristo.1324]

As main ele switched to guard long time ago I'm really glad that soon New World go live

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

Overall I'm very disappointed, looks like 4 more years of Tempest and Core, staff and scepter to be Wizard like.

[fuzzyp.6295]

3 minutes ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

Everybody and his dog was asking for a ranged elite! Where the hell do you see people celebrating on another mele elite? The whole ele community wanted a ranged spec!

Right here. I am so pumped for this elite spec, it really looks like its going to be the control oriented bruiser spec I've been hoping for since after HoT. I would have preferred Mace to Hammer, but still this spec looks fantastic and I can't wait.

There are plenty of us who are happy, excited and curious about Catalyst will play. I sympathize with players who wanted new range specs, but I'm glad ANet looks to be addressing the biggest complaint Eles have had for years, making a class that doesn't need to give up all of its damage just to stay alive.

Besides, who knows, is possible that the mechanics of the new class will breathe new life into Staff and Scepter as well. It's not out of the question.

[Obtena.7952]

12 minutes ago, EpicName.4523 said:

It is very a reasonable addition to include a new spec that plays very differently...

 

However, it is not reasonable to add THIRD melee spec to a profession based on a ranged caster archetype while having NO GOOD RANGED option for it.  

Actually is it is reasonable ... because Anet decides what they are basing the specs on, not what players believe it should be based on. 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Obtena.7952