Anet, The longer you stall the adjustments to DE meta the worse it will get

[Ithilwen.1529]

I got a lucky run and completed this meta once before the most recent changes.

 

The fight has gotten significantly easier after the most recent changes. We got hosed last night, but that was  our fault.

[Cyninja.2954]

GW2efficiency stats for Dragon Pacifier (achievement granted upon successfully completing the final meta the first time): 13,352 of 354,896 (3.762%) completed.

 

Up by around 500 since checking 4 hours ago (12,779 back then, 3.6%).

 

So in the last 2 meta cycles, around 10 maps finished successfully (if we assume around 50 players per map meta). More in fact if we assume that some are repeat players which will NOT unlock the achievement again given it is already unlocked.

 

Seems players are successful in completing the meta after all.

Edited March 8, 2022 by Cyninja.2954

[Shogen.5071]

Just now, yoni.7015 said:

Maybe some of them are alts and it’s faster to just get the hero points for your ninth character by joining a hp train? I wouldn’t directly assume that they are unable to do it otherwise. 

not really, most hp trains take forever people fall behind and for anyone that isnt really the commander its kinda a kitten show if you arnt familiar with the path, I never liked zanders trains specially cause while they were fast and i could keep up i always felt bad for like the massive amount of people that got lost along the way and even with my slow trains people get lost and while i try to give everyone enough time to catch up and re do hp for ticks there are always people that miss out either due to skill gaps mastery gaps or understanding of the maps , pathing and overall layout

 

when im solo running hot maps i can get it done in just less then 45 minutes, but if im following a hp train it take more then an hour to get to the final hp, its not faster to run with 50 man squads unless your scaling down the hero points and 90% of the time when you want to do it that way people dont listen and scale it up making the champion fights unnecessarily longer and thats made even worse by those people that think its funny to bring level 20 character to the train to mooch some levels effectively taking space up for those that would make the run faster

 

 

[Pinkeh.4207]

Can't sell turtle skins to players that can't get the mount. When those players quit in frustration, it doesn't matter anymore. That ship has sailed!

Edited March 8, 2022 by Pinkeh.4207

[KeoLegend.5132]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

This is what happens when people rush out to rip through new content in 1 week. Don't be like that. 

There isn't ACTUALLY a problem with the meta or it's difficulty. The 'problem' (and even this is debatable) is that the turtle is locked behind the meta and the RNG associated.  Personally I don't see the issue with that, at least nothing massive; somehow it's unreasonable that you need to do content to get something in an MMO all the sudden and it's a problem if you can't get it immediately. WEIRD

 

There is a BIG PROBLEM with it.

I tried 5 times. Failed in all of them. Even dealing good DPS, it was like 10 person carrying 40, that IF we would get 50 on plat, most of time is like 45 or less. Also you get nothing from failing. This is just plain wrong.

I don't mind doing a not-hard META for 2 hours and winning

I don't mind getting wiped 25 times in a row on a raid

 

What i do mind is an activity that is both HARD and LONG. I can't stand one or another, but not BOTH

[Obtena.7952]

13 minutes ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

There is a BIG PROBLEM with it.

I tried 5 times. Failed in all of them. Even dealing good DPS, it was like 10 person carrying 40, that IF we would get 50 on plat, most of time is like 45 or less. Also you get nothing from failing. This is just plain wrong.

I don't mind doing a not-hard META for 2 hours and winning

I don't mind getting wiped 25 times in a row on a raid

 

What i do mind is an activity that is both HARD and LONG. I can't stand one or another, but not BOTH

Well, what you can or can't stand has nothing to do with how the game works so ?

I mean, you failed 5/5? Not a problem ... People also failed hard on other metas when they were released as well. 

AGAIN, do NOT go out a week after content is released and try to rip through it if you are NOT willing to fail it ... ALOT, ESPECIALLY on the meta content.  

Edited March 8, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Tekoneiric.6817]

2 hours ago, yoni.7015 said:

It is one week after the expansion came out. I am sure they have a lot of work right now. They are not bad people that want us to suffer. Better they take their time to do it properly. 

They could temporally extend the time for the event while they work on a long term fix for the mess. A couple of minutes would have made the difference on a couple of runs I was in. Limiting the circle phase to once per event might help. Adding Mesmer portals to go from the main platforms to the side ones during that phase might help speed player movement there.

[Imba.9451]

16 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Well, what you can or can't stand has nothing to do with how the game works so ?

I mean, you failed 5/5? Not a problem ... People also failed hard on other metas when they were released as well. 

AGAIN, do NOT go out a week after content is released and try to rip through it if you are NOT willing to fail it ... ALOT, ESPECIALLY on the meta content.  

That comment does not adress the fundamental flaws in this encounters design that are the cause for the person you are responding to complaining about the meta.

And those reasons have been discussed to death by now.

[Peterson.5172]

53 minutes ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

GW2efficiency stats for Dragon Pacifier (achievement granted upon successfully completing the final meta the first time): 13,352 of 354,896 (3.762%) completed.

 

Up by around 500 since checking 4 hours ago (12,779 back then, 3.6%).

 

So in the last 2 meta cycles, around 10 maps finished successfully (if we assume around 50 players per map meta). More in fact if we assume that some are repeat players which will NOT unlock the achievement again given it is already unlocked.

 

Seems players are successful in completing the meta after all.

it's hard to say how representative gw2efficiency is. Just using it (linking API) probably puts you in the top 50/40/30/20% of players in the game.

[Valzacard.1028]

I like how people complain about the meta design and blame anet when 90% of the reason this meta fails is because people can't even manage a few thousand dps.

[Peterson.5172]

Just now, Valzacard.1028 said:

I like how people complain about the meta design and blame anet when 90% of the reason this meta fails is because people can't even manage a few thousand dps.

chances are, if someone is complaining on the forums (shows they are willing to look outside the game, possibly search for guides, builds etc.), their dps is probably higher than average, it's the other 49 people they are complaing about

[Imba.9451]

Just now, Valzacard.1028 said:

I like how people complain about the meta design and blame anet when 90% of the reason this meta fails is because people can't even manage a few thousand dps.

Maybe Anet should provide a better way to check your dmg then, so players can actually reflect on their performance. An easy, and accesible way that get's inroduced ingame, so casuals actually know it exists.

[Desh.7028]

1 hour ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

GW2efficiency stats for Dragon Pacifier (achievement granted upon successfully completing the final meta the first time): 13,352 of 354,896 (3.762%) completed.

 

Seems players are successful in completing the meta after all.

 

gw2efficiency is already a filter of the player base only counting players who use it which makes them at least casual+ in the GW2 world.

 

No one saying it can't be beaten. The mechanics are actually really transparent and easy. The hoops required to jump through and the difficulty mainly coming from being a 50 man raid on an open world map with some significant RNG added to the encounter (provably up to 5 min variance) is the issue.

 

8 minutes ago, Peterson.5172 said:

chances are, if someone is complaining on the forums (shows they are willing to look outside the game, possibly search for guides, builds etc.), their dps is probably higher than average, it's the other 49 people they are complaing about

 

You'll can easily fail despite playing flawlessly because 50 man is not about your dps specifically.

"Git gud" is not an argument here because I can't make 49 others suddenly learn to play their characters optimally no matter how much I'd try. Not just that, you can be really kitten at the game and beat it by joining a group abusing map mechanics to turn it into a de-facto instanced run and manage to get carried.

[Drakth.1875]

49 minutes ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

There is a BIG PROBLEM with it.

I tried 5 times. Failed in all of them. Even dealing good DPS, it was like 10 person carrying 40, that IF we would get 50 on plat, most of time is like 45 or less. Also you get nothing from failing. This is just plain wrong.

I don't mind doing a not-hard META for 2 hours and winning

I don't mind getting wiped 25 times in a row on a raid

 

What i do mind is an activity that is both HARD and LONG. I can't stand one or another, but not BOTH

I've already lost count of how many times the group i was in failed, and thats when the commander not vanish in the middle of the event.

[PepeLePewPew.2107]

Just commenting on casual vs. hardcore.

 

I'm not even in the game, but on this general topic:  I remember when I first started using damage meters and cookie cutter specs in my first mmo and how it decreased my enjoyment of the game.  I was "better" at group play and it allowed me to raid, but this sort of focus made the game feel more like a chore.  In GW2, I play extreme casual and have never used a damage meter nor do I raid.  I personally find this 1000 times more enjoyable as a leisure activity.  After all, it's all meaningless numbers that get adjusted in order to increase the players' sense of accomplishment (mmo design redux).  For those who like raid level content, min-maxing and checking meters can be meaningless fun (nothing at all wrong with that), but for non-raiders it's just meaningless.

 

Both types of players exist in GW2, and in most open world events we can all play together joyfully!  Afterwards, you go raid and I'll pick some flowers.  What's wrong with that?

 

[Teratus.2859]

3 hours ago, yoni.7015 said:

I am pretty sure they are not ignoring it and working on it. But you should give them time to do it properly. This whole meta debate really brings out the ugliness of some parts of the community. It’s funny how casuals always say that the raiding community would be so toxic and rude but reading all this from self proclaimed casuals … 

Not just from casuals, i've seen plenty of raiders in these discussions too and the more toxic elements from both communities is present.

I've seen some people try to paint this as a "hardcore vs casual" division but it absolutely isn't that.
There are both hardcore and casual players calling for nerfs and there are both hardcore and casual players who are against nerfing the event as well.

[jamesg.7128]

I haven't tried the meta yet but I just noticed this in the update notes just now -

 

• 1. Fixed a bug in which the final boss of the Battle for the Jade Sea meta-event was performing its bite attack more often than intended, including potentially chaining multiple bite sequences in a row.
• 2. Fixed a rare issue in the final encounter of the Battle of the Jade Sea meta-event.
•  

I don't know what the "rare issue" was but maybe that bite bug fix will help.

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, Imba.9451 said:

That comment does not adress the fundamental flaws in this encounters design that are the cause for the person you are responding to complaining about the meta.

And those reasons have been discussed to death by now.

Actually, my comment is applicable no matter what the issue is. Whether it's a design or a capability thing, what I said is STILL relevant here. If people want to rush in 1 week after the content is released, then it's hardly reasonable to complain they can't do it and fail lots. That's not even limited to software. The 'first edition' is always going to have the most problems. 

I mean, for fun, I joined ONCE last week and we got to 1% ... so this isn't a matter of not being able to complete the content. It's definitely something that could be done, even before they were making changes to it. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Islyn.8019]

1 hour ago, Peterson.5172 said:

it's hard to say how representative gw2efficiency is. Just using it (linking API) probably puts you in the top 50/40/30/20% of players in the game.

Except it’s still under 4% of attempts. It’s not counting the people not using gw2e, and4% is 4%.

 

Now add in all the people who don’t use it; that % of success would surely be even lower.

Anecdotally, I’d guess nose experienced people use gw2e, based on how many times I’ve had it suggested to me. 

[LucianDK.8615]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

Actually, my comment is applicable no matter what the issue is. Whether it's a design or a capability thing, what I said is STILL relevant here. If people want to rush in 1 week after the content is released, then it's hardly reasonable to complain they can't do it and fail lots. That's not even limited to software. The 'first edition' is always going to have the most problems. 

Though it was the promise of the turtle that really drew out the hordes on challenging content, that might be above their skill. But bugs didnt make it easy either. Hopefully it starts to improve, both with the bug gone and people beginning to get used to DE.

[Obtena.7952]

4 minutes ago, LucianDK.8615 said:

Though it was the promise of the turtle that really drew out the hordes on challenging content, that might be above their skill. But bugs didnt make it easy either. Hopefully it starts to improve, both with the bug gone and people beginning to get used to DE.

I have no doubt the bugs are getting fixed. I mean, I know people are trying to show DE is exceptional as a meta event. It's not ... and that's why success rates WILL increase on it over time, just like EVERY other meta in this game. That's also why I don't think it's that big a deal to lock turtle behind it. 

The funny part is that DE actually REALLY similar to DS in concept/layout (and yes, even difficulty if you think about how hard DS was for people after it was released) ... but you tell someone that and they are spitting teeth. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[arron.3294]

its been just over a WEEK how are they stalling LET people learn the meta 

[Izzy.2951]

I just completed the Dragon End Meta in my 3rd try, with an organized group (so around 5-6 hours i guess). And it felt really good, also the post-event. And its like the 1st time i feel i got a PRESTIGUE reward, even tho the mount is kinda useless. Griffon or even masterys behind triple trouble are more useful and also locked behind an event that no1 does (im still missing 2 heads).

Good Job Arenanet! loved the meta!

Edited March 9, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[LucianDK.8615]

24 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I have no doubt the bugs are getting fixed. I mean, I know people are trying to show DE is exceptional as a meta event. It's not ... and that's why success rates WILL increase on it over time, just like EVERY other meta in this game. That's also why I don't think it's that big a deal to lock turtle behind it. 

The funny part is that DE actually REALLY similar to DS in concept/layout (and yes, even difficulty if you think about how hard DS was for people after it was released) ... but you tell someone that and they are spitting teeth. 

 

Yet people still manage to fail the 3x blighting trees events. Needing it spoonfed what to do, to keep running. Not ganging up on an invulnerable boss. Not running past preserver spots, etc.

[LucianDK.8615]

20 minutes ago, arron.3294 said:

its been just over a WEEK how are they stalling LET people learn the meta 

Just players wanting to have the mount right here and now. Just like the qqers when the skyscale came out, and proclaiming that collecting 250 of each ls4 map meta was cruel and unjust punishment.