Why are their still 30-40% useless skills/weapon skills in the game?

[Hrafn.7638]

Some skills that are literally never used except4 by a new player for a day before he gets something new.

 

For example

- Rampage - Warrior

- arcane shield

- all the race skills

- like 3-4 weapons/class

- everything Spellbreaker

 

 

[Diovid.9506]

The race skills are useless by design. You don't want a situation where only Charr Warriors can reach the highest dps out of all Warriors meaning all other Warriors get shunned by pugs.  

[Danikat.8537]

Racial skills are intentionally weaker than profession skills because Anet wants race to be a purely personal choice. They don't want build guides saying you need a specific race for the best builds, or players being rejected from groups because they've got the 'wrong' race for their profession/build.

They can be useful for low level characters who don't have many options, especially since they don't cost hero points so it's a good option if you're saving points for specialisations or unlocking specific skills. They can also be fun for situations where it doesn't really matter if you haven't got the best build. My asura guardian often uses the golem elite because guardian elites are pretty dull and dropping a golem on your enemy is much more fun.

But I don't think bringing them up to the same level as profession skills would be a good idea, because no matter how carefully balanced they are some people will work out that some are better than other options and then insist on those. That would be especially annoying when you consider that we don't have race change (and Anet have said it's not possible) so you either have to make an entirely new character or get stuck with an inferior choice.

[TexZero.7910]

uh...not sure why you've listed spell breaker and rampage when both of those are very much used. Maybe not used in PvE but certainly used in WvW and PvP.

[Mik.3401]

Im sensing a vibe that you are a new player yourself given the skills you listed

[kharmin.7683]

Strangely enough, I was running the svarnir boss at the north end of Wayfarer Foothills only yesterday when another player transmuted into a norn wolf and fought the battle that way.  Granted, not the most difficult champion, but at least one player enjoys using a racial skill.

[Khisanth.2948]

3 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Strangely enough, I was running the svarnir boss at the north end of Wayfarer Foothills only yesterday when another player transmuted into a norn wolf and fought the battle that way.  Granted, not the most difficult champion, but at least one player enjoys using a racial skill.

That skill is also useful in Thaumanova reactor fractal 🙂

[ugrakarma.9416]

Nerf everything philosophy + every class can fill everyrole.

What everyone think will happen: With everything being "equal" ppl will use more varietys of builds and skills choices, become "pro player" that like play-piano and bizarre hybrids. We will see warrior dancing like ballerina using a magic wand and doing lots of damage, because "hes so pro, so expert" "omg this game doesn't have roles neither holy trinity" "i can be a smiling bee shoting nuclear missiles".

What really happen: Ppl will stuck with "less worse" options and actually the less worse is everything boonstacking/boonspammer and a few skills that still are good by a few margin.

it's a problem with not seeing entropy, and romanticizing minimalism, not understanding that "less of something" leads to "less of other things". so u really never reach the goal of expanding more options by reducing skill stuff.

 

Edited March 23, 2022 by ugrakarma.9416

[jcH.7109]

1 hour ago, Hrafn.7638 said:

- arcane shield

I’m guessing you don’t play pvp. Arcane shield is quite good on Sc/F Fresh Air Weaver in pvp.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

Everything Spellbreaker is useless?

 

Also they addressed that they will update weapons and skills that have useless qualities in future balances.

[DeanBB.4268]

There will always be a "best" so what is Anet supposed to do? Other than make every skill 1 equal, skill 2, etc. Even then, if say sword's overall attack chain was .01sec faster than axe, it would be best and the axe skills shunned.

I'm not advocating worthless skills or traits, just pointing out that no matter what the meta will exist.

[Ellye.9123]

Because not every player is focused on being top tier performance.

Rampage might not be a great skill for PvE, but if a player likes the idea of hulking out and becoming a giant temporarily, it fits that fantasy well enough.

Of course, we don't want skills to be completely useless - but simply being "less good" than some other skill is flat out inevitable. As long as the skills are different, one of them will always be better.

Obsessing over balance leads to boring skills.

Edited March 23, 2022 by Ellye.9123

[Astralporing.1957]

8 hours ago, Diovid.9506 said:

The race skills are useless by design. You don't want a situation where only Charr Warriors can reach the highest dps out of all Warriors meaning all other Warriors get shunned by pugs.  

Sure, not being racially-locked is a great thing. On the other hand, skills that are completely useless should not exist, because as they are they only serve to confuse new players.

So, perhaps, if racially-locked skills are a problem, maybe just create a way to make them available to other races as well (perhaps through some kind of core game racial masteries).

26 minutes ago, Ellye.9123 said:

Obsessing over balance leads to boring skills.

And not caring about balance leads to the 10x effectiveness gaps between top and average players we have to deal with in this game.

[Lord Krilik.3692]

The blog post yesterday said they will do quarterly balance changes which will involve updates to skill sets. This might be small tweaks to large functional changes to skills and weapons. these changes are on the way.

[Mithrilos.8036]

10 hours ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Strangely enough, I was running the svarnir boss at the north end of Wayfarer Foothills only yesterday when another player transmuted into a norn wolf and fought the battle that way.  Granted, not the most difficult champion, but at least one player enjoys using a racial skill.

 

This is what I want to see tbh. Player being "true" to the lore of the game. Norn transforms. Charr cry for their Legions etc etc thats cool 🙂

Edit : I do think some of the racial skill got a cooldown way too big, for something that should be less powerful, at least makes it more usable, because you choosed to use it for the lore and fun beind it. that 240sec cooldown Son....

Edited March 24, 2022 by Mithrilos.8036

[yudrasil.9378]

There is a 1 shot build that requires the norn racial skill in WvW. The stealth+ charge is literally 28k+ worth of damage (I had protection buff).

Arcane shield pretty useful for core class and catalyst, since lack of movement. I think there is also a roaming build used for it.

I think rampage is super used in PvP and WvW? ( I don't know, I only run heal spellbreaker...which reminds me, Spellbreaker super important in big and small scale WvW/GvG anything that is group content fighting)

 

I mean I get what you are saying in general. But I think this is pretty close to the most balance game while having so many different ways of doing stuff on. And at some point, it is about including as many classes as possible to all content, rather than havign an important use for each and every skill in the game. I really do not think that would be possible

[DanAlcedo.3281]

Spellbreaker is Meta in Wvw and a really nice Openworld builds. 

 

[Antycypator.9874]

There are not useless, they just don't seem to be worth using in PvE, because they have long cooldown and/or weak effect e.g. stealth for 2 seconds on 72s CD, or corrupt one boon into one stack of torment.

But Arcane Shield isn't bad. It's one of the skills worth carrying even in PvE for extra survivability and break stun.

[Astralporing.1957]

7 hours ago, Lord Krilik.3692 said:

The blog post yesterday said they will do quarterly balance changes which will involve updates to skill sets. This might be small tweaks to large functional changes to skills and weapons. these changes are on the way.

Forgive me for being a sceptic, but i've heard those kinds of promises many times before.They usually start with a wave of changes, sometimes follow with a second one, then invariably run out of steam and forget about it, leaving the stuff that got broken in those first waves unfixed for months or sometimes years.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

17 hours ago, Hrafn.7638 said:

Some skills that are literally never used except4 by a new player for a day before he gets something new.

 

For example

- Rampage - Warrior

- arcane shield

- all the race skills

- like 3-4 weapons/class

- everything Spellbreaker

 

 

The first two skills you listed are some of the most commonly used skills in the game.

[Lord of the Fire.6870]

17 hours ago, Hrafn.7638 said:

Some skills that are literally never used except4 by a new player for a day before he gets something new.

 

For example

- Rampage - Warrior

- arcane shield

- all the race skills

- like 3-4 weapons/class

- everything Spellbreaker

 

 

Arcane Shield is not useless as Tempest you can use it to go melee with the Zerg in WvW

[kharmin.7683]

8 hours ago, Mithrilos.8036 said:

 

This is what I want to see tbh. Player being "true" to the lore of the game. Norn transforms. Charr cry for their Legions etc etc thats cool 🙂

Edit : I do think some of the racial skill got a cooldown way too big, for something that should be less powerful, at least makes it more usable, because you choosed to use it for the lore and fun beind it. that 240sec cooldown Son....

Agreed.  As a very casual player, most of my toons are norn and I would probably use transforms on some of them if it weren't for the ridiculous (my opinion) cool down.  The skills are mostly nerfed already.  Why have such an extended CD?

[DeanBB.4268]

I made "Golemancer Glinda" specifically to be a mechanist with the golem runes and one of the asura elite golems, plus a golem mini. I can swap out the elite if needed for the supply drop. So far it's worked fine for what I do, but of course that is mostly the mechanist.

Only complaint? Gets hard to see with those big boys punching on the enemies. 🤔

[Linken.6345]

19 hours ago, yudrasil.9378 said:

There is a 1 shot build that requires the norn racial skill in WvW. The stealth+ charge is literally 28k+ worth of damage (I had protection buff).

Arcane shield pretty useful for core class and catalyst, since lack of movement. I think there is also a roaming build used for it.

I think rampage is super used in PvP and WvW? ( I don't know, I only run heal spellbreaker...which reminds me, Spellbreaker super important in big and small scale WvW/GvG anything that is group content fighting)

 

I mean I get what you are saying in general. But I think this is pretty close to the most balance game while having so many different ways of doing stuff on. And at some point, it is about including as many classes as possible to all content, rather than havign an important use for each and every skill in the game. I really do not think that would be possible

I guess you mean this one

 

[Svarty.8019]

On 3/23/2022 at 3:46 PM, Hrafn.7638 said:

Some skills that are literally never used except4 by a new player for a day before he gets something new.

 

It's because of cooldowns. Anet don't want players to use them so they put them on ridiculous cooldowns.  There are loads that would be very popular but never saw any use ever. Stupid.