Bias Aside, What is the Absolute Strongest Class in PvP Right Now?

[Crab Fear.8623]

Most useful, strongest against the most match ups, team strong, ect.

Not in relation to your favorite, but in relation to everything.

If you want to make a few in a list rate them 1-8 based on how many classes they can beat in 1 v 1.

 

Why?

I'm going to play that next season, of course.

[Downstate.4697]

Harb

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

Toss up between: Harb / Temp / Vind / Specter

Willbender feels kind of balanced after the F2 nerf.

[Rider.6024]

for 2's its SA specter

 

well see how conquest pans out but a decent specter with SA can take on anything now

[Crab Fear.8623]

13 minutes ago, Rider.6024 said:

for 2's its SA specter

 

well see how conquest pans out but a decent specter with SA can take on anything now

what is the SA specter build?

[Lysico.4906]

Harbinger.    
willy 

spectre

 

 

[Khalisto.5780]

Hyper carries were always a mix of A or A+ dueling and mobility with S team fight presence

 

Prolly harb fits this role better for ranked although i dunno if id rate  as A mobility

 

Of all classes that comes to my mind wb, hb, spec and vindi

 

Harb is the most annoying to play against

 

I can see some niche picks like virtuoso and untamed, but more in a case if  you already play those classes

[Stand The Wall.6987]

harbinger cuz the perma quickness + fury aoe share... who the kitten thought that was a good idea. so clueless and no fix in sight.

[Avatar.3568]

vindi, and if they gonna nerf harb vindi will get even stronger

[Terrorhuz.4695]

Currently vindicator is borderline unkillable. It doesn't have the same OOOOMPH factor of a harbinger, but when you have a vindicator in opponent team, you have to take into account you will kill everything else and hope he goes away, or play a super tanky build to waste his and your time on some endless 1v1 far away from everyone else.

[Khalisto.5780]

29 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

Currently vindicator is borderline unkillable. It doesn't have the same OOOOMPH factor of a harbinger, but when you have a vindicator in opponent team, you have to take into account you will kill everything else and hope he goes away, or play a super tanky build to waste his and your time on some endless 1v1 far away from everyone else.

Yes, nerfing dps is always a indirect buff to bunker builds

 

Since all matches have gold players they wont ignore the vindi camping their home. I can still see vindi winning 1v2 and losing games. I played a lot of bunker builds and it happens, i still think that a build that runs around and it's useful everywhere it goes is more valuable.

 

Something like oh imma go lose this duel, lemme me disengage and go elsewhere kill ppl in 5 secs. I'll comeback soon with a 3v1 

[Shadow Dragon.1469]

lol bias aside? people can't get over their bias history proves this time and time again in literally anything especially a competitive game anyone i ever talk to always proves this as well so im lookin at this topic with a huge side eye.

 

well actually i havent read anyones post just the title haha.

[Zagerus.8675]

If we had to pick just one for Ranked, Tempest. There are dependencies of course, but a Tempest nestled in between decent players has huge carry potential because of: aurashare, reflects, and relatively decent power dmg mitigation uptime. It's not an easy build to play but it has a lot of tools to punish aggressive/spammy playstyles and is what I would play all season if I was forced to choose* just one.

Edited July 10, 2022 by Zagerus.8675

[Guirssane.7082]

Don't forget the 2 best supports :

Core Guard and tempest

[Buran.3796]

On 7/9/2022 at 11:06 PM, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

Currently vindicator is borderline unkillable. It doesn't have the same OOOOMPH factor of a harbinger, but when you have a vindicator in opponent team, you have to take into account you will kill everything else and hope he goes away, or play a super tanky build to waste his and your time on some endless 1v1 far away from everyone else.

    Vindicator is extreeeeeemely hard to play, to the point that maybe there's 20-30 players in the world able to make it work; in Conquest most of the Vindi players just melt.

    In 2 vs 2  I've only seen one Vindicator in 47 matches, which sugests that playing a mele character with a single evade (heavily nerfed) and limited cleanses is not very successful in the current meta (Harb, Willy, Specter and Virtuoso are played mainly as condi builds at the moement.

   Maybe Sikiekï is unkillable, but that is far from being transfered to the general population: you see tons of Harbs and Willies, Virtuosos are certainly becoming more popular, but Revs are on decline: their new spec is an aberration which doesn't fit at any game mode.

[oscuro.9720]

100% biased opinion; warrior.

[Salt Mode.3780]

clearly everyone is wrong its 100% mesmer!

[semak.7481]

2 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

lots of irrelevant noise

Werent you the one who were spamming since beta that vindi will never see any play and will be unviable af on EoD launch sayin how bad it is and oneshots on gs is too easy to dodge and keep crying that its a dead class? 

Spoiler

I mean, if that was you, then you are either trying to intentionally downplay how strong vindi is or just so insanely bad that cant even realize how OP it was (you didnt have to be a genius to see how broken vindi was and would be) and still is.

 

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

3 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

    In 2 vs 2  I've only seen one Vindicator in 47 matches,

2v2 completely different than 5v5 conquest.

Bunker Vindicator is broken as hell in 5v5 conquest. It's the first class in many years that can be truly identified as a Bunker. It can very reliably stall 1v2s for extremely long amounts of time even against strong players and in most situations not die.

Reason why it isn't used in 2v2 is because it doesn't have the kind of DPS or DPS assist it needs to be successful. In 2v2 it doesn't matter if you can bunk because of poison gas timer. People just kite you until timer and then when you can't heal and can't DPS, the DPS builds chew you up and you lose.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Shao.7236]

Being bunker does not qualify as strongest. I see too much of it being mentioned and that's incredibly annoying.

Right now the most problematic;

Most Specter load outs are incredibly bloated and hardly has any downtime, you're always at the advantage no matter what you do plus the fact that shroud bar is bugged which can mislead people. Blindness has been buffed on Thief and it really shows since, if Resistance would see a buff across the classes maybe it would be less of a problem but otherwise Specter is quite literally easy mode with all the utility soft cc/blind it constantly can put out with ease, without constant clears or projectile denial, you can't survive for long and their mobility without a reliable range weapon makes them unkillable in the right hands no matter how many times you outplay them.

Harbinger has too much spam of everything, hardly any setup required and weakness is really generous. Core Necro has quite a lot of effort to go out of it's way to be effective, while I do understand that Harbinger is more "glass", the balancing act is not quite there yet. Again it's really the same thing has Specter, if you don't have constant clear against Harbinger or Projectile Denial, you're 90% certain to lose.

The least problematic;

People say Vindicator unkillable when they're bunker and can't achieve anything else while anything else is quite balanced and able. I'd still nerf the Daze damage to be like all other CC in the game, that's about it.

Willbender might have a bit of movement creep but it has otherwise been more balanced than anything else introduced.

Bladesworn is carried by overbuffed core stuff that works well with it also seems to ignore Weakness somehow with bursts n stuff, idk I always get deleted in 5 seconds if I'm not wary even while they have debuffs. That ranged attack that gets spammed on blade could also get it's damage reduced a bit or be only 1 charge cuz it can drop people fairly easily.

Mechanist idk what the issue is, I don't struggle that much against them nor do I really see what their skills/traits do in practice, they're not giving me much of a hard time.

Catalyst seems to have a lot of co-efficient buffs that makes them hit really hard but I guess that's fine for how squishy you have to be. Shock Aura and such are more of the rampant issue with Elementalist in generaly rn, I'd make it daze rather than stun.

Virtuoso I hardly have anything to say, it's strong but also counterable, I'm more concerned by all the Aegis that it gets which feels kinda toxic overtime but that's probably just where it's strong points should remain anyway.

Untamed needs better visuals for those skills, the teleport is also whack, could use a telegraph. Feels more like a beefy Ranger otherwise.

[Buran.3796]

9 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

2v2 completely different than 5v5 conquest.

Bunker Vindicator is broken as hell in 5v5 conquest. It's the first class in many years that can be truly identified as a Bunker. It can very reliably stall 1v2s for extremely long amounts of time even against strong players and in most situations not die.

Reason why it isn't used in 2v2 is because it doesn't have the kind of DPS or DPS assist it needs to be successful.

   So acording to you Vindi is bunker, but doesn't work in 2 v 2 (which favours bunkers),  and lacks dps (but Vindi players are using zerk stats at MATs), and is "the first classin years that can be truly identified as bunker", yet you had to open a thread moaning about Tempest (not beacause their support but due their self sustain vs pew pew builds).

   Dude, you can have the pie or eat it, but not both at once... I restate: Vindi is garbage and scarcely used even in ranked, where most of players are moving to run Harbs for ez ranged kills while staying at 27K HP. Yes, Drazeh's Vindi's will kick your kittens, but that's mostly due the skill gap, and he will do the same running a core Warror.

   As I said, I'm fine with any Vindi nerf from past of future anyway: didn't touch mine in the last 2 months.

[Goldilock.2584]

Its willy harb sup and de

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

1 hour ago, Buran.3796 said:

So acording to you Vindi is bunker, but doesn't work in 2 v 2 (which favours bunkers),

Vindicator can definitely stat to be a Bunker.

2v2s DO NOT favor Bunkers. They favor bruisers that support each other. Bunkers have selfish sustain and what happens is the Bunker is ignored while the other partner is focused, that guy dies, and then the Bunker is alone and usually dies. Even if the Bunker can survive the 1v2 he won't have the DPS to actually win the 1v2 and when the timer goes off and the gas comes out, the Bunker loses ALL those stats dedicated to sustain and then he gets chewed up by DPS.

2v2s favors Bruisers that synergize each other my dude. If you played the game at all you would know this.

1 hour ago, Buran.3796 said:

 and lacks dps (but Vindi players are using zerk stats at MATs),

Yes, we are talking about two different builds here. You can run DPS or Bunker on Vindicator.

You must not be very into the scene if you haven't heard streamers talking about Bunker Vindicators.

1 hour ago, Buran.3796 said:

"the first classin years that can be truly identified as bunker"

It is. Other builds can only 1v1 side node duel or try overly ridiculously hard to survive 1v2s. Bunker Vindicator can easily & routinely survive 1v2s while holding a node. We haven't seen anything like this since old HoT Druids & Scrappers.

1 hour ago, Buran.3796 said:

yet you had to open a thread moaning about Tempest (not beacause their support but due their self sustain vs pew pew builds)

Yup. It's overperforming. Doesn't matter what class you play, Tempest is overperforming. Right now in 2v2s Tempest is most certainly anyone's first pick as a partner in a duo. It was seriously over-buffed.

1 hour ago, Buran.3796 said:

Dude, you can have the pie or eat it, but not both at once...

What? lol

Now I'm just not sure if you're trolling or not.

2 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

I restate: Vindi is garbage and scarcely used

Now I think you're trolling.

 

[Crab Fear.8623]

I found a build, I think it is quiet salty

[Vinny.7260]

Definitely Harbinger is the most 'required' spec in a team right now to win. If you don't have a Harb and they do? You lose.

Specter is also up there for a required spec in a team. Issue is that Specter tends to be harder to play compared to Harbinger so you don't see as many of them.

Willbender is also up there but less so since the F2 nerf. It's the highest burst damage spec right now.

Harb/Specter/WillB/Support/X

Tempest support tends to be more common right now since most of the condition damage is on the sidenodes rather than teamfights. Supp Guardian has fallen out of favor slowly but surely due to the rise of high pressure and Willbender providing identical things. (They both provide AoE cleanse, AoE stability- which are the main benefits of the support.) Tempest provides Projectile Hate,  and constant Protection.

Vindicator is good for the extra spot with its roamer boon dodge build or sidenoder bruiser build.

Catalyst can also fill a spot with D/D Fire being pretty high sustain once gotten down. D/F Air can fill the spot for team fights with less cleanse but more damage. Hammer Catalyst is more meme material but can have some plays as a sidenoder or Bell fights in RotC.